Gut feeling

[Artelius]

Hi.

I have been dating the same lady for 5 years and before proposing to her but one little thing still exists in the back of my mind.

A few years ago I had a colleague/friend who was a real womanizer and seemed to sleep with so many peoples wives. He had his own wife but openly cheated. He always managed to get everyone''s girlfriends/wives phone number and he was a total nightmare in terms of boundaries especially around women. I don't know much about narcissism/psychopathy etc but he was definitely the most difficult person I've ever encountered and he was definitely messed up, especially regarding women. This man has since died in a car accident (RIP).

Two years, I had to go to the far east for work. I was gone for 12 months. My gut tells me he slept with my girlfriend while I was gone. I have no proof. Just my gut instinct which Ive always trusted and used to make decisions in life. I have said nothing to my partner. How can I know if my gut feeling is right or wrong? If she did cheat I don't want to continue the relationship.

[stillafool]

Why are you blaming your deceased friend because women wanted to have sex with him?  Doesn't sound like he forced any of them.  They were the ones with poor boundaries if they can't say no to a player.  Since your friend is deceased the only person who knows that answer is your gf.  Why are you afraid to ask her?  It's doubtful she'll tell you the truth at this point.

[Artelius]

"It's doubtful she'll tell you the truth at this point". This is the reason I'm not asking her.

[glows]

Are you sure you’re not projecting your own guilt for being away for 12 months? 

She could have slept with anyone if she is a cheater or unfaithful. 

[Alpacalia]

If your gut has held you in good stead in the past, there is every reason to respect its message.

Sometimes the head will talk you out of believing situations because it results in a more pleasant outcome. At the end of the day, all you're doing is fooling yourself.

When you ask her outright and are not satisfied with her response, then you will either snoop around (which is a sincere invasion of her privacy) or second-guess everything she says or does.

As hurtful as it is to be cheated on, it is worse if the person cheats on you and then denies it, because that just adds to the confusion in your head and makes it even worse.

The devil is in the details that just don't add up. If we are talking about someone close to us, sometimes we fool ourselves if we do not listen and observe.

[Artelius]

Just now, Alpacalia said:

If your gut has held you in good stead in the past, there is every reason to respect its message.

Sometimes the head will talk you out of believing situations because it results in a more pleasant outcome. At the end of the day, all you're doing is fooling yourself.

When you ask her outright and are not satisfied with her response, then you will either snoop around (which is a sincere invasion of her privacy) or second-guess everything she says or does.

As hurtful as it is to be cheated on, it is worse if the person cheats on you and then denies it, because that just adds to the confusion in your head and makes it even worse.

The devil is in the details that just don't add up. If we are talking about someone close to us, sometimes we fool ourselves if we do not listen and observe.

"Sometimes the head will talk you out of believing situations ". Yes, I agree. That gut instinct is all I rely on anymore mostly. Not letting myself ruminate and just going with the gut hasn't failed me. It saves time and energy and has had great accuracy for me in life and work decisions. Thank you.

[Artelius]

12 minutes ago, glows said:

Are you sure you’re not projecting your own guilt for being away for 12 months? 

Yes, I'm sure. I have no guilt about taking on that work assignment overseas.

[glows]

This all boils down to whether you trust your partner and it doesn’t seem you do. Why stay with her this long if you had any doubt? It’s a fairly strong accusation. Break it off if you don’t trust her. 

[Artelius]

6 minutes ago, glows said:

Why stay with her this long if you had any doubt?

I'm usually so busy, I never had time to doubt. The last few months as I move to get serious, something in the back of my mind is gnawing at me saying hang on.

[mark clemson]

3 hours ago, Artelius said:

 How can I know if my gut feeling is right or wrong? If she did cheat I don't want to continue the relationship.

You can't know without some reasonable evidence, particularly if you aren't willing to simply ask and/or trust an answer. That leaves you in a difficult situation, unfortunately.

Possibly you could ask some of her friends if she has mentioned anything to them? This would be one way to potentially "check" although she might not appreciate you snooping, and if you find nothing there's a good chance you pissed her off over something that possibly never happened.

You could contact the deceased man's wife and ask if she knows who he was with during their look-the-other way marriage, and if so was your partner among them. I'd say this has a low, but real, probability of her being willing to talk and knowing. It might genuinely upset and annoy the widow, which is a reason not to do it, and if she knows your partner your "snooping" might again come back around to haunt you. Nonetheless it's a possible avenue.

Another view might be - if you don't trust her, don't marry her; if you marry her, then trust her. Not sure if that's possible in your specific case, but I believe it's generally a good philosophy.

Overall it's not an easy situation as there is only so much one can do here.

Edited December 22, 2022 by mark clemson

[Artelius]

2 minutes ago, mark clemson said:

You can't know without some reasonable evidence, particularly if you aren't willing to simply ask and/or trust an answer. That leaves you in a difficult situation, unfortunately.

Possibly you could ask some of her friends if she has mentioned anything to them? This would be one way to potentially "check" although she might not appreciate you snooping, and if you find nothing there's a good chance you pissed her off over something that possibly never happened.

You could contact the deceased man's wife and ask if she knows who he was with during their look-the-other way marriage, and if so was your partner among them. I'd say this has a low, but real, probability of her being willing to talk and knowing. It might genuinely upset and annoy her, which is a reason not to do it, and if she knows your partner your "snooping" might again come back around to haunt you. Nonetheless it's a possible avenue.

Another view might be - if you don't trust her, don't marry her; if you marry her, then trust her. Not sure if that's possible in your specific case, but I believe it's generally a good philosophy.

Overall it's not an easy situation as there is only so much one can do here.

Thanks Mark. Asking friends won't work as I know it would backfire straightaway. I would be painted as paranoid and crazy and I know they would have fun shaming me. Regarding the deceased wife, she never acknowledged his affairs and just carried on with a stiff upper lip and would never tolerate anyone criticizing her husband or marriage. Your third point is what I'm left facing. Unless this hunch goes away over the next 2-3 weeks, I believe I will end the relationship. If I'm wrong, so be it. I can live with that rather than the alternative.

[mark clemson]

That's too bad, but it is what it is. Maybe next go round you'll want to establish more trust and/or confirm a thing like this earlier on, so you don't end up in this situation.

I would point out that LTRs are, ultimately, a choice (to continue them or not). I suspect you'll want to reflect on the reasons for making the choices you have made throughout this.

[Wiseman2]

5 hours ago, Artelius said:

I have been dating the same lady for 5 years and before proposing....

Reflect how much cold feet could have to do with this "gut feeling". The guy may have been a womanizer, but that doesn't mean your GF was interested in or had anything to do with him.

[Artelius]

I can understand why it would look like cold feet Wiseman. But, I dont believe it is. I cannot marry her with this doubt in my mind. Writing my concern out here has helped to clarify that for myself. If a friend had this problem and asked my advice, I'd probably advise he doesn't marry.

[Alpacalia]

8 hours ago, Artelius said:

"Sometimes the head will talk you out of believing situations ". Yes, I agree. That gut instinct is all I rely on anymore mostly. Not letting myself ruminate and just going with the gut hasn't failed me. It saves time and energy and has had great accuracy for me in life and work decisions. Thank you.

Right. That's why some people are better suited for certain careers than others. I am an ISFJ so I tend to rely on my "senses" a lot.

The suspicion you have that she's cheating tells you something even if she isn't.

Something is not right in your relationship. 

Clearly there are several things that are not negotiable in a healthy partnership, and trust is one of them. It is clearly absent in this case.

[Artelius]

5 minutes ago, Alpacalia said:

I am an ISFJ

Being an ISFJ you will understand some peoples need for absolute and total 100% percent trust in anyone they let near them . I'm like that. If the trust level drops to 99%, it's no good.

The relationship is really great. But this is a problem that just isn't going away unfortunately. Thanks for your reply .

[Coasting1991]

Will you break up with her because you can't have this doubt in your head, or because you have some sort of evidence to back up your gut feeling? 

[Artelius]

1 minute ago, Coasting1991 said:

Will you break up with her because you can't have this doubt in your head, or because you have some sort of evidence to back up your gut feeling? 

I have no evidence. Of significance is the gut feeling i have that something happened while I was away. As stated above, my gut feeling has saved me a few times already in my life and has never let me down.

[Artelius]

5 hours ago, mark clemson said:

That's too bad, but it is what it is.

Exactly Mark. By walking away I lose a great amount. But, if my hunch is correct, staying with her would be a mistake for me. I would rather be alone, than be married to someone dishonest.

[basil67]

Ending it is the right decision.   If she's cheated, then she gets what she deserves.  If she hasn't cheated, she deserves nothing less than to have a partner who trusts her.  

[mark clemson]

2 hours ago, Artelius said:

... some peoples need for absolute and total 100% percent trust in anyone they let near them . I'm like that. If the trust level drops to 99%, it's no good.

The relationship is really great. But this is a problem that just isn't going away unfortunately.

Respectfully, you might consider whether any LTR with you isn't, essentially, a house of cards then?

If a partner can do absolutely nothing at all, but circumstances seem to implicate them even just a little bit and then you walk, how is that fair to a partner?

There are MANY circumstances in life that might "suggest some doubt" and trigger just a bit of suspicion on your part. Your post is, indeed an example of that (unless some actual evidence turns up).

This isn't something you need to address here (unless you wish to), but something you might reflect on. It seems quite unfair to any potential partner, and you might consider whether any relationship with you is essentially doomed from the start due to this. If you wish to have LT partners, would you perhaps benefit from therapy? You are you and perhaps don't see the need, but just a thought.

If the quote above was hyperbole, then perhaps I'm off here.

Edited December 23, 2022 by mark clemson

[NuevoYorko]

11 hours ago, Artelius said:

"It's doubtful she'll tell you the truth at this point". This is the reason I'm not asking her.

If you're not willing to let the possibilities of the past go, you have no choice but to break up with her.  You won't ask her, you won't believe her, and your friend is dead so you can't ask him.  

 

[glows]

6 hours ago, Artelius said:

I can understand why it would look like cold feet Wiseman. But, I dont believe it is. I cannot marry her with this doubt in my mind. Writing my concern out here has helped to clarify that for myself. If a friend had this problem and asked my advice, I'd probably advise he doesn't marry.

Then it’s likely a very, very good idea that you end the relationship and let her live her life and find someone else who does trust her. You owe yourself the same with someone you can trust. 

Avoid prolonging this. Do you live together? What are your living circumstances?

[Coasting1991]

I agree with others saying to end this. But I am curious/puzzled about your lack of trust given no evidence to the contrary. How often do you have gut feelings to end relationships (romantic, platonic, etc.)? 

[Artelius]

2 hours ago, Coasting1991 said:

How often do you have gut feelings to end relationships (romantic, platonic, etc.)? 

Never.