Why would a woman buy a drink for a ugly dude?

[Thelambofdeth]

27 minutes ago, mark clemson said:

Okay. I respectfully disagree with you, but that's fine you're entitled to your opinion. I do believe it's over-analyzing as in my view wanting a partner who's reasonably financially stable is NOT the same thing as want one who's actually rich specifically in order to also be rich.

Consider this - if you dress nice regularly and a woman shows interest, with your view it will ALWAYS mean she is a gold digger.

 

I mean it's a bar...financial stability shouldn't be a preliminary metric for initial physical attraction lol. I don't go scoping for the woman there who looks like she makes the most $. And sure, but if you're ONLY getting approached or complimented bc of your attire well...what else could you assume? 

 

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You say you want a relationship, but this way you are always going to reject a potential GF. And if you dress shabbily, and are not good looking as you say, women will likely reasonably assume the worst and only one ready to "scrape the bottom of the barrel" will show interest. That isn't likely to be a woman you're overly attracted to and she will probably have substantial issues of her own.

There's a huge difference between how I dress and "shabbily". Tbh I'd rather a "bottom scraper" show genuine interest than some woman who's only interest in me is my fashion sense or "assume the worst" if I'm not dressed to the 9s. She's likely be very shallow and not actually interested in me, anyway.

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So either way your mindset AND your social anxiety fux your plans (of having a relationship).

So IMO you probably do need help from a therapist to get you to a place where (as others have pointed out) you aren't self-sabotaging with this mindset.

 

Not really. All I'm seeking is a average-decent looking woman with a modicum of mutual compatibility who's sole interest in me isn't my expensive attire. Not looking for some gorgeous bombshell that requires confidence, $$$ and charm to obtain. If I was setting that bar up there, then yeah, I would likely need professional guidance.

 

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Actually IMO meet-ups can be a great way to meet potential dates, as there tends to be a certain % of single folks there who are potentially open to dating. But you have to be in a headspace where YOU are ready to accept them, too.

Funny, bc I've heard they're a pretty bad way to get dates...at least these days, as that's frowned up. That they're usually full of men all fixated on the only one or two women there, and that most have contingencies set in place disparaging fraternization to prevent women from feeling  preyed on and so men don't just join for the potential women there. IDk maybe if you live in LA or NY where there's just so many people there you might actually run into open, single women....that's or you're just good-looking and the standard rules don't apply to you lol.

[mark clemson]

36 minutes ago, Thelambofdeth said:

Not really. All I'm seeking is a average-decent looking woman with a modicum of mutual compatibility who's sole interest in me isn't my expensive attire.

See, that's the thing - that's probably exactly what you had. But you threw it away over assumptions. That's why you need to "silence your brain" a bit as has been suggested above. If you're going to start interactions assuming the worst, you'll never get anywhere.

 

36 minutes ago, Thelambofdeth said:

Funny, bc I've heard they're a pretty bad way to get dates...at least these days, as that's frowned up. That they're usually full of men all fixated on the only one or two women there

That wasn't my experience at all, but yes if you're in MD then I'm in a very different part of the country (West Coast) and so things might be different here. If you have the greater DC metro area or even Annapolis, Baltimore, or a VA city within striking distance you might have better luck. If it's rural MD, well - yeah, the pickings are going to be slimmer as they say.

Edited January 5, 2023 by mark clemson
added 4th sentence

[Thelambofdeth]

19 minutes ago, mark clemson said:

See, that's the thing - that's probably exactly what you had. But you threw it away over assumptions. That's why you need to "silence your brain" a bit as has been suggested above. If you're going to start interactions assuming the worst, you'll never get anywhere.

Not really, bc she was quite pretty apparently(I couldn't look at her, but my friend said so a few times and was way to upset to lie) and when telling the bartender who she was referring to, specifically mentioned "the guy in the scarf" harping on an aspect of my clothes...so no, not at all what I was looking for. Pre-emptive negative assumptions are like my defining characteristic, especially in regards to women.

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That wasn't my experience at all, but yes if you're in MD then I'm in a very different part of the country (West Coast) and so things might be different here. If you have the greater DC metro area or even Annapolis, Baltimore, or a VA city within striking distance you might have better luck. If it's rural MD, well - yeah, the pickings are going to be slimmer as they say.

Might? Lol yes, you're fortunate bc I'm sure things are very, very different here. I live least of the Harbor in the city, and I'd imagine most of the meet-ups would be filled to the brim with sausage or mostly empty. I'd assume most of the women that go to those things are already shacked up and not looking to meet people and just focus on whatever the theme of the group is, or the ones open to meeting people would be just as shallow as people at the clubs and bars.

[Weezy1973]

22 hours ago, Thelambofdeth said:

 I don't think I need therapy to get over my social angst and over analyzing, but I certainty need something...

I would highly recommend cognitive behavioral therapy. It certainly helped me with severe social anxiety. I was also diagnosed with agoraphobia which is the fear of feeling anxious, so was essentially avoiding everything. I was diagnosed about 15 years ago, went to therapy for less than a year, now happily married, pursuing a dream career, have much of my life in order. It was vital.

 

But the thing is, it doesn’t really cure your anxiety. You just need to learn to do things even though you’re feeling anxious. A very similar situation happened to me when I was young. A woman came up to me in a bar and said her friend thought I was cute and I should go talk to her. Couldn’t do it. Social anxiety is a real thing. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by Weezy1973

[ShyViolet]

4 hours ago, Thelambofdeth said:

People constantly tell me I'm not ugly, but if that were the case, I'd be approached more often. 

You're not being approached more often because of your negative attitude.  A negative, defeatist attitude is one of the biggest turn-offs.  

Let's say, even if you were ugly.  We can't see what you look like so we don't know.  Ugly people get boyfriends and girlfriends too.  People who are not conventionally attractive also date.  It's all about personality and attitude.  Hell, I have dated "ugly" guys because I valued their personality.  But with your self-sabotaging and negative attitude, you are deflecting all chances of getting close to anyone.

4 hours ago, Thelambofdeth said:

I don't think therapy is the key, especially not a female therapist, bc she really wouldn't understand where I'm coming from. Hell, most male therapists likely wouldn't relate at all, and I'd mostly just be patronized.

You seem determined to cling to your twisted ways of thinking and reject the idea of getting professional help to work on this.  So what's your plan then, just keep repeating these patterns forever and being miserable?

If you refuse to work on yourself and get help, then don't complain when things go badly.

Edited January 5, 2023 by ShyViolet

[Thelambofdeth]

53 minutes ago, Weezy1973 said:

I would highly recommend cognitive behavioral therapy. It certainly helped me with severe social anxiety. I was also diagnosed with agoraphobia which is the fear of feeling anxious, so was essentially avoiding everything. I was diagnosed about 15 years ago, went to therapy for less than a year, now happily married, pursuing a dream career, have much of my life in order. It was vital.

 

But the thing is, it doesn’t really cure your anxiety. You just need to learn to do things even though you’re feeling anxious. A very similar situation happened to me when I was young. A woman came up to me in a bar and said her friend thought I was cute and I should go talk to her. Couldn’t do it. Social anxiety is a real thing. 

I'm legitimately glad it helped you out, bc if anyone knows how all-encompassing severe SA can be, it's me, but I think this may be very anecdotal, bc if that's all it took, everyone would get CBT.

 

Yep, SA is a hell of a thing...if that happened to me, I'd just assume if was a prank lol.

 

[Weezy1973]

10 minutes ago, Thelambofdeth said:

I think this may be very anecdotal, bc if that's all it took, everyone would get CBT.

Yeah it is anecdotal. And admittedly I lucked out in a way because the first psychologist I went to “spoke my language” so to speak. She was very expensive but my company benefits covered a lot of cost. And I was very motivated to get better. As I said it got to the point where I was agoraphobic and starting to fall into depression as well, and I was never prone to depression despite the severe anxiety. Strong internal locus of control which I think protects against depression to a certain extent. 
 

But yes absolutely social anxiety disorder is extremely debilitating. I remember driving to a first date once feeling like I was going to poop my pants, heart racing, stomach churning. I mean the disorder part is your body reacts to something fairly benign (like talking to a woman at a bar) as if it’s a life and death situation. But honestly, what do you have to lose by trying therapy? Nothing has worked so far right?

[Thelambofdeth]

1 hour ago, ShyViolet said:

You're not being approached more often because of your negative attitude.  A negative, defeatist attitude is one of the biggest turn-offs.  

Let's say, even if you were ugly.  We can't see what you look like so we don't know.  Ugly people get boyfriends and girlfriends too.  People who are not conventionally attractive also date.  It's all about personality and attitude.  Hell, I have dated "ugly" guys because I valued their personality.  But with your self-sabotaging and negative attitude, you are deflecting all chances of getting close to anyone.

I think it has much more to do with my face vs my attitude. People in general will usually approach someone they find attractive...if they're attractive, regardless of their disposition. Especially in a shallow place like a bar where no one cares, people are drunk, and it's dark...

Ummm...it's also about your bank account and your social status. Sure less attractive people find mates, but they usually find a a way(s) to compensate for their lack of looks. I'm glad you managed to look past the looks of those guys but many women don't...bc simply, they don't have to.(not a sexist thing, as I'm sure very attractive men operate the exact same way) With OLD, SM, and the lot, it gives them a breadth of options and moreover tons of attention and validation....more than ever. So that bolters their standards. I'm not saying my attitude couldn't use adjusting, but it's also just being logical and recognizing how skewed things are with the current times. It's either a tidal wave or a draught for most people...I want to be very clear, that I am NOT blaming women in any way, and they don't owe me anything, but I simply can't ignore the effect OLD, and SM and the sort has had on trying to attract women with how dauntingly high it's placed the bar, bc it directly affects me.

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You seem determined to cling to your twisted ways of thinking and reject the idea of getting professional help to work on this.  So what's your plan then, just keep repeating these patterns forever and being miserable?

If you refuse to work on yourself and get help, then don't complain when things go badly.

IDK what the plan is...I thought if I kept going out or received some goodwill from women, things would change....but I've went out a ton, and haven't gotten nearly enough goodwill so nothing really has. Maybe I need to try different places. And I'm always trying to work on myself, but I don't really believe a therapist with no frame of reference who cannot relate to me will be that much of a help.

[Thelambofdeth]

21 minutes ago, Weezy1973 said:

Yeah it is anecdotal. And admittedly I lucked out in a way because the first psychologist I went to “spoke my language” so to speak. She was very expensive but my company benefits covered a lot of cost. And I was very motivated to get better. As I said it got to the point where I was agoraphobic and starting to fall into depression as well, and I was never prone to depression despite the severe anxiety. Strong internal locus of control which I think protects against depression to a certain extent. 
 

So anecdotal, expensive and lucky...yeah. Are you really not getting my skepticism here? lol. My SA and low-esteem already gives me bought of depression tbh. But that comes directly from not being able to get a woman.

 

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But yes absolutely social anxiety disorder is extremely debilitating. I remember driving to a first date once feeling like I was going to poop my pants, heart racing, stomach churning. I mean the disorder part is your body reacts to something fairly benign (like talking to a woman at a bar) as if it’s a life and death situation. But honestly, what do you have to lose by trying therapy? Nothing has worked so far right?

Money? Time? Feeling even worse because now this method that worked for so many other people did work for you? No, nothing has worked so far, but this just seems like trying to put out a fire out by throwing petrol on it. I don't have deep-seated, embedded trauma I need to discover and unwrap...I just can't get what I want for reasons I can't really change. I mean what could they really do? Prescribe me addictive meds I refuse to take? Challenge me to do something I haven't before? Try to get me to look at my issue from an alternative angle, etc. By osmosis, I've practically heard it all before.

 

[Wiseman2]

3 minutes ago, Thelambofdeth said:

. But that comes directly from not being able to get a woman.

A nice woman bought you a drink and you rejected her for unknown reasons. So perhaps you wanted it that way?

[Thelambofdeth]

3 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

A nice woman bought you a drink and you rejected her for unknown reasons. So perhaps you wanted it that way?

You're assuming she was nice. If a guy buys a woman a drink it doesn't automatically deem him nice. She could've been a horrible person. And the reasons aren't unknown...it's because the situation didn't seem logical to me, and I was protecting myself from disappointment via anxiety...I think.

 

And, no, I can certainly confirm that's not how I wanted it.