Do we have a chance together?

[Malifecent]

Hi

I have been looking on the internet for advice on this and came accross this forum which is making me slowly and sadly start to think I am waiting for something that is just not going to happen. The truth is if it can happen I honestly know it is worth some time....and frusturation.....and tears.

-This guy is separated....sort of. No rings, seperate bedrooms,no sex, no decent converstaion unless it is about their child. After years of trying to make it work, they are calling it quits, however they still share the same house(!!). He has been "separated" for a year.

-He says he is going to leave (yea yea I know). It has only been two months since he has told me this but so far nothing has really become of it.

-He loves me. He frequently tells me this as well as how much he misses me, and how someday soon he can't wait to be together for good. He calls me all the time (usually 3 times a day) just to talk. He also tell me that he is afraid that I will leave before he gets a chance to straighten his life out so we can be together, because he knows that being in my situation is not fun.

-Besides a couple of good mutual friends no one knows about us. He must be acting differently at home because his family including his (ex?) wife has asked if he is seeing someone to which he replies no.

-Oh yea it's long distance. But we have already discussed that until his life is officially straightened out I am not going anywhere. We see each other about twice a month, and I don't know if it makes a differance but we are having sex.

I know you guys have heard it all before but I love this guy so so much, and I know if we could be together it would be AMAZING and well worth the wait.

But my question is do we really have a chance? Also is this cheating on his part and am I the OW? At first I didn't think so but where his "separation" is kinda grey and fuzzy, I don't know.

Any advice would be great, thanks

[westernxer]

Based on what you've written, I would say your chances for happiness are slim and none.

[Hot Coco]

Yes, it's cheating. Yes, you're the OW.

 

When he MOVES OUT and divorces here it won't be cheating and you won't be the OW. Period. End of story. Any questions?

[Sami_D]

But my question is do we really have a chance? Also is this cheating on his part and am I the OW? At first I didn't think so but where his "separation" is kinda grey and fuzzy, I don't know.

Any advice would be great, thanks

 

Regarding the 'is it cheating?' and 'am I the OW?' questions... are they really relevant? I don't think so.

 

What is important, imo, is what you need to do to make sure you don't get caught up in a difficult, negative situation for you. My suggestion would be that you read all the posts on here, and on gloryb.com, and start looking for things that resonate with you in your situation. What isn't ringing true for you in what he says vs. what he does? Bear in mind that (again, my opinion) people's actual experience is far more useful than 'opinion'. Only you can really know, everyone else can only offer a perspective.

 

My personal feeling in reading your story so far is that if "he is afraid that I will leave before he gets a chance to straighten his life out so we can be together" he's not really showing any signs of that being the case. In fact, it sounds more like he's trying to keep you on tap while hedging his bets at home.

 

What is holding him back from moving out right now? Are there any children involved? How do you know about what his W (she still is his wife at the moment) is asking?

[Sami_D]

Based on what you've written, I would say your chances for happiness are slim and none.

 

Would you care to expand on your comments, or say from where they originate? Do you have personal experience in a situation similar to this, and if so, what was your role in that event?

 

Thanks.

[Hot Coco]

Regarding the 'is it cheating?' and 'am I the OW?' questions... are they really relevant? I don't think so.

 

What is important, imo, is what you need to do to make sure you don't get caught up in a difficult, negative situation for you. My suggestion would be that you read all the posts on here, and on gloryb.com, and start looking for things that resonate with you in your situation. What isn't ringing true for you in what he says vs. what he does? Bear in mind that (again, my opinion) people's actual experience is far more useful than 'opinion'. Only you can really know, everyone else can only offer a perspective.

 

My personal feeling in reading your story so far is that if "he is afraid that I will leave before he gets a chance to straighten his life out so we can be together" he's not really showing any signs of that being the case. In fact, it sounds more like he's trying to keep you on tap while hedging his bets at home.

 

What is holding him back from moving out right now? Are there any children involved? How do you know about what his W (she still is his wife at the moment) is asking?[/quote

 

Regarding the 'is it cheating?' and 'am I the OW?' questions... are they really relevant? I don't think so. But Sami, SHE thinks so or she wouldn't have asked the question. To some people it really IS relevant. A lot of people don't find the idea of being an OW tasteful. And they don't like the idea of going out with a cheater. So with all due respect, I think it's VERY relevant.

[Art_Critic]

Seperated = Still Married

 

Tell him that once the divorce is final then contact you..

 

Cheating is cheating.. Sorry Sami ..

 

They are still married until the judge says so and for your own emotional health don't get wrapped up in his drama.

He is a fluid situation that can change in a moments time and it only takes a phone call..

[Sami_D]

But Sami, SHE thinks so or she wouldn't have asked the question. To some people it really IS relevant. A lot of people don't find the idea of being an OW tasteful. And they don't like the idea of going out with a cheater. So with all due respect, I think it's VERY relevant.

 

Well, to some people, perhaps it is relevant. Is it relevant here? Maybe, I don't know. Would the OP behave differently if she saw herself as the OW? Would that matter in this situation? Perhaps if she could see herself as the OW she'd run a mile and THAT would make the difference.

 

I don't know about her, or her personal assessment of the situation, or how she might or might not view the comments she gets here. Which is why I cut to the chase.

 

It doesn't matter WHO or WHAT she is (by anyone's defintion)... all that matters is she doesn't get herself into a ****ty situation, and isn't taken for a ride.

 

Questions about definitions aren't relevant.

[Sami_D]

 

Cheating is cheating.. Sorry Sami ...

 

Well, I know that.

 

I am just questioning whether that is the over-riding important thing in this situation.

 

Personally, I think that people should leave aside definitions and condemnations and look at a particular set of events and see whether that's a GOOD or BAD situation for someone to get into.

 

Just my way of looking at things.

[Hot Coco]

Well, to some people, perhaps it is relevant. Is it relevant here? Maybe, I don't know. Would the OP behave differently if she saw herself as the OW? Would that matter in this situation? Perhaps if she could see herself as the OW she'd run a mile and THAT would make the difference.

 

I don't know about her, or her personal assessment of the situation, or how she might or might not view the comments she gets here. Which is why I cut to the chase.

 

It doesn't matter WHO or WHAT she is (by anyone's defintion)... all that matters is she doesn't get herself into a ****ty situation, and isn't taken for a ride.

 

Questions about definitions aren't relevant.

 

I'll say it again. It DOES matter since the OP asked. YOU may not think it's relevant but the OP asked if it's cheating on his part and is she the OW. It's pretty black and white. He IS cheating and she IS the OW. I was just answering the question that she asked. To HER it must be important since she asked. Other people don't want to be confused by the facts but she's obviously not one of those people since she asked the question.

 

I think I cut to the chase.

[Hot Coco]

Well, I know that.

 

I am just questioning whether that is the over-riding important thing in this situation.

 

Personally, I think that people should leave aside definitions and condemnations and look at a particular set of events and see whether that's a GOOD or BAD situation for someone to get into.

 

Just my way of looking at things.

 

It sounds like to the OP the fact that the MM is cheating IS of over-riding importance, as you say. I mean she asked that specific question. She obviously doesn't want to get into a situation with a man who is cheating. To HER, it sounds like that would be a BAD situation.

 

I respect your way of looking at things but not everyone looks at them (justifies them?) the same way. I sense that the OP is struggling with the moral aspects of this. And rightly so.

 

What happened to the OP anyway? It would be nice if we could hear more from her. We all shouldn't speak for her. I'm just trying to interpret and read between the lines of what she said.

[westernxer]

Personally, I think that people should leave aside definitions and condemnations and look at a particular set of events and see whether that's a GOOD or BAD situation for someone to get into.

 

Other than the fact he's lying to his wife and making half-assed promises, your situation is great.

[Sami_D]

YOU may not think it's relevant but the OP asked if it's cheating on his part and is she the OW. It's pretty black and white. He IS cheating and she IS the OW.

 

Well yes, she did ask. But she's also just generally asking for any kind of input. And I think that it doesn't matter, to the wider picture of 'will it work out', whether they can be put into those categories or not.

 

As I said before, I think the overwhelming questions are not about OW and MM, but rather how their R progresses. That doesn't (in my view) rely on any categorisation of him as 'a cheater' or her as an 'OW'.

[Hot Coco]

Other than the fact he's lying to his wife and making half-assed promises, your situation is great.

 

I know! I could try and try and STILL not be able to come up with one "good" thing about this situation!

[Sami_D]

She obviously doesn't want to get into a situation with a man who is cheating. To HER, it sounds like that would be a BAD situation.

 

Well yes, that is one way of looking at the OP. But I think I covered that earlier. I suppose we just need to wait on a response from the OP regarding how she feels about the situation in light of initial comments.

[Hot Coco]

Well yes, she did ask. But she's also just generally asking for any kind of input. And I think that it doesn't matter, to the wider picture of 'will it work out', whether they can be put into those categories or not.

 

As I said before, I think the overwhelming questions are not about OW and MM, but rather how their R progresses. That doesn't (in my view) rely on any categorisation of him as 'a cheater' or her as an 'OW'.

 

Sami, the point is that is YOUR view. You even said "my view." To some people, and she may be one of them, it's irrelevant whether it could work out or not work out if it STARTS out with her being an OW and him being a cheater. Now do you see? Nothing after that even matters if that's the foundation of this relationship. Doesn't sound like she wants that as the foundation to a relationship - whether it has the potential to succeed (not likely) or not.

[Sami_D]

Other than the fact he's lying to his wife and making half-assed promises, your situation is great.

 

My? Or the OPs? Her, I think you mean to say?

 

Well your response was slightly more informative than your first post on this thread. But I don't see that he was actually making promises to her. Where did you see that?

[Art_Critic]

Where did you see that?

All married men that are having affairs tell lies Sami and make promises.

 

 

There are NO exceptions.. 100 %

[Sami_D]

Doesn't sound like she wants that as the foundation to a relationship - whether it has the potential to succeed (not likely) or not.

 

Well no, in that reading of her initial questions, it doesn't 'sound like' she believes that to be any sound foundation of a relationship.

 

But... 1) is she right in that?

2) are you right that that's what she believes?

[Sami_D]

All married men that are having affairs tell lies Sami and make promises.

 

 

There are NO exceptions.. 100 %

 

 

They do?

 

Well that makes you wrong, then. Since my MM never made a single promise to me.

[Art_Critic]

They do?

 

Well that makes you wrong, then. Since my MM never made a single promise to me.

 

your incrediable.. The act of having an affair with another is a promise and a lie.. Therefore 100%

 

 

 

prom·ise ( P ) Pronunciation Key (prms)

n.

 

A declaration assuring that one will or will not do something; a vow.

Something promised.

Indication of something favorable to come; expectation: a promise of spring in the air.

Indication of future excellence or success: a player of great promise.

 

v. prom·ised, prom·is·ing, prom·is·es

v. tr.

To commit oneself by a promise to do or give; pledge: left but promised to return.

To afford a basis for expecting: thunderclouds that promise rain.

 

v. intr.

To make a declaration assuring that something will or will not be done.

To afford a basis for expectation: an enterprise that promises well.

[d'Arthez]

All married men that are having affairs tell lies Sami and make promises.

You could leave out the affair part. And it still would be true.

[Sloppy]

They do?

 

Well that makes you wrong, then. Since my MM never made a single promise to me.

He didn't make a promise to YOU (a direct one, anyways. actions speak lounder then words...), but he did lie to his W. That's still a lie. He's been lying to the person who is supposed to be the one closest to him...the woman he decided to marry.

[Ladyjane14]

-Besides a couple of good mutual friends no one knows about us. He must be acting differently at home because his family including his (ex?) wife has asked if he is seeing someone to which he replies no.

 

The crux of the problem is here. The relationship is SECRET. It's a shadow relationship; a fantasy in comparison to MM's real, daily life. Thus an emotional risk to Malifecent.

 

Unless he tells his wife, and unless you VERIFY his disclosure to her as factual....then, you're just rolling the dice.

 

Old Europe made a FANTASTIC point on another thread the other day. The summary of which is....that as long as he's lying to his wife, he's hedging his bets. He's leaving his foot in the door, just in case he changes his mind.

 

Most times MM will say that they don't want to get caught cheating before the divorce is final due to problems with settlement. They usually describe it as "being taken to the cleaners", all because their wife is vindictive .

 

But that doesn't explain why many keep their affairs on the down-low even in NO FAULT states, does it?

 

I do agree that "separated = married", but with the difficulties of financial transitioning, some people are bound to find creative alternatives to traditional separation. So, if EVERYONE is well informed with the actual facts, there's less likelihood of people getting their feelings hurt.

 

A good question for Malifecent would be, "What are the legal aspects of separation in order to file?" In some states, he can't even file for divorce as long as they're living in the marital home together. Just answering that particular question might tell you alot about his intentions.

[Hot Coco]

Well no, in that reading of her initial questions, it doesn't 'sound like' she believes that to be any sound foundation of a relationship.

 

But... 1) is she right in that?

2) are you right that that's what she believes?

 

1) is she right in that? Well, I don't think it's really a question of her being "right" or wrong in that. If that's not what she thinks is a good and sound foundation for a relationship for HER, then YES, she's right. We're not discussing whether it's right or wrong in general. Just right or wrong for her particular set of values.

 

2) I don't know if I'm right in that that's what she believes. That's why I said it would be good to hear from her. I'm only reading in between the lines that it IS what she believes. If this really sat well with her I think she wouldn't give a hoot whether he's cheating or not and whether she's the OW or not.