Lotsgoingon Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 I don't see an obvious strategy for you. You could go the patient route and hope she opens up later. Or you might wanna walk if you feel you're being jerked around. I think you do want to raise this issue, and the earlier wording above seems good. To me it is a red flag that she's letting you kiss her face and then withdraws from the mouth kiss without telling you why. Why isn't she talking? As I read your post, I'm hearing lots of fun, which of course is great, but something sounds surfacy about your dates. Does this woman really open up to you? Has she shared any really vulnerable stuff? You guys are two months in. People start sharing some of the serious stuff or hints of the serious stuff by then. Often they have sex by two months. And even if people go slow on sex, at two months they typically have made plain what they want out of this relationship. Has she expressed her hopes for this relationship? Have you guys had the commitment conversation? You should NOT assume that all the fun times mean that she is on a path towards commitment unless she has specifically said so. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Wiseman2 Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 (edited) 14 hours ago, petrolheadno1 said: How do you word it in a non-needy and non-confrontational way? It's only been 4 dates. Try to be patient. It does sound like she's more demure than what you're used to and that may be culturally related. Like any other dating situation, you're enjoying yourself and there's clearly an attraction and rapport. I would also refrain from talking about the foot fetish/pedicure thing for now. Try to take one step at a time considering she's shy or reserved. Save that for when you're more established. Confronting her about French kissing could be a huge turn off, so try to relax and play it by ear. You're clearly not friendzoned, so focus on alleviating any insecurities regarding the pace of intimacy. Edited February 21, 2023 by Wiseman2 Link to post Share on other sites
Acacia98 Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 14 hours ago, petrolheadno1 said: No on that day I actually was constantly spraying mouth freshener spray because of a toothache. No I have easily secured french kisses with other women int he past easily, so Im comfortable with it and absolutely love it. You asked how you could ask her about her preferences regarding French-kissing without seeming confrontational or needy. @Mrin was simply giving you an example of how you could do that. Even if you know you don't have terrible breath, you could ask about your breath. Alternatively, you could tweak things a bit and leave that out. Whatever makes sense to you at that moment. The point is to start a conversation that will encourage her to talk about what she prefers. The idea of painting her nails may or may not be a good idea. Some women, including me, have no desire whatsoever to do that. In fact, it would be a turn off if a guy tried to make me do it. I have no idea whether she'd feel that way too. But I think you have to make a conscious effort to figure out what she likes and what she's like by talking to her and paying attention to her responses. People are different. So our advice here could completely miss the mark. Your best bet is to talk to her. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
JTSW Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 So let me get this straight, you only want to kiss with tongue? Not everyone likes to use tongue ya know and it sounds to me like she's one of them. Trying to go in tongue first can be off-putting. What's wrong with starting off with a closed mouth kiss? Link to post Share on other sites
Alpacalia Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 My father is from Bahrain, believe me when I say he was strict. So culture certainly may play a part in it. That's understandable. Depending on her culture and background, it's possible that she may be more reserved in showing affection. Be patient with her, focus on building your connection through activities and conversations you two enjoy, and try to read her body language and gauge her comfort level. Otherwise. That sounds like a great plan! To word it in a non-needy and non-confrontational way, why not try asking her if she would like you to paint her nails for her as a surprise? You could tell her that it would bring back her childhood days and emphasize that it's her choice. It may be a nice way to show her your affection and build the bond between you two. Good luck! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Lotsgoingon Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 Whatever you do, OP, come back and update us. Link to post Share on other sites
spiderowl Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 On 2/20/2023 at 7:32 PM, petrolheadno1 said: It would be strange for someone to not like french kissing, how would you initiate foreplay during sex? I don't think it's strange. I don't like French kissing unless it is with someone I love and have a good relationship with. If someone tries it early on, I see it as them testing me to see if I am up for sex with them soon when we have not really established an emotional connection. I don't know if it's just me, but I am getting the feeling you have no emotional involvement with this woman. You are talking about steps to take, stages, and how soon you have been able to take those steps before. She is an individual and has her own likes/dislikes. If she happens to dislike French kissing, then maybe you are better off with someone else. You don't seem very attached to her anyway. You are talking about triggering hormones and other steps as if she is a machine. Maybe she is sensing you are not emotionally engaged yet? With regard to the foot thing, it would be weird if a guy suggested this early in a relationship. In fact, I would go so far as to say something about liking feet to see how she reacts - some women, like me, don't want to get involved with someone with a fetish. A fetish is not about her; it's about you. A relationship is not just about getting your needs met, but she has needs too. Have you considered what her needs might be? I doubt she has mentioned wanting to have her feet painted - that has come entirely from you. You might both be able to meet each others' needs, with time, if she is in agreement, but if you try steering her into what you want, be prepared for her to decide it's not for her. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author petrolheadno1 Posted February 21, 2023 Author Share Posted February 21, 2023 33 minutes ago, spiderowl said: I don't think it's strange. I don't like French kissing unless it is with someone I love and have a good relationship with. If someone tries it early on, I see it as them testing me to see if I am up for sex with them soon when we have not really established an emotional connection. I don't know if it's just me, but I am getting the feeling you have no emotional involvement with this woman. You are talking about steps to take, stages, and how soon you have been able to take those steps before. She is an individual and has her own likes/dislikes. If she happens to dislike French kissing, then maybe you are better off with someone else. You don't seem very attached to her anyway. You are talking about triggering hormones and other steps as if she is a machine. Maybe she is sensing you are not emotionally engaged yet? With regard to the foot thing, it would be weird if a guy suggested this early in a relationship. In fact, I would go so far as to say something about liking feet to see how she reacts - some women, like me, don't want to get involved with someone with a fetish. A fetish is not about her; it's about you. A relationship is not just about getting your needs met, but she has needs too. Have you considered what her needs might be? I doubt she has mentioned wanting to have her feet painted - that has come entirely from you. You might both be able to meet each others' needs, with time, if she is in agreement, but if you try steering her into what you want, be prepared for her to decide it's not for her. Ok I will wait it out. About the feet thing I wasn't planning about telling her when I next see her. I was planning when I went on her day trip to take a manicure set and paint her HAND fingernails as I asked her in a previous conversation that if she likes nail polish on her hands so she said she used to paint them when she was a child but can't now as she plays the flute. So when I see her I will ask her "Are you planning to play the flute soon?", if she says no I will whip out a manicure set I have with a base coat, a few colours to pick and a top coat and ask her if "I can paint her nails for her." And remember its her hands not feet. Link to post Share on other sites
Lotsgoingon Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 Like your creativity bro, but look, you are the prize--if this thing is going to work it's because you are a prize without doing all this extensive, ultra-creative planning. You want it to work between you and her and nothing. What are your interests? You really want to focus on your own interests and pursue dates there. That's more likely to give you feedback on whether you guys are compatible. She gets to see you in YOUR element. That's key. Let her see you deeply engaged in something YOU like to do. Even if she doesn't like it, she gets to see your passion and learns a lot about you. I mean, I appreciate your effort, but you are not someone's entertainer. Getting a relationship started doesn't require such perfect planning. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author petrolheadno1 Posted February 21, 2023 Author Share Posted February 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, Lotsgoingon said: Like your creativity bro, but look, you are the prize--if this thing is going to work it's because you are a prize without doing all this extensive, ultra-creative planning. You want it to work between you and her and nothing. What are your interests? You really want to focus on your own interests and pursue dates there. That's more likely to give you feedback on whether you guys are compatible. She gets to see you in YOUR element. That's key. Let her see you deeply engaged in something YOU like to do. Even if she doesn't like it, she gets to see your passion and learns a lot about you. I mean, I appreciate your effort, but you are not someone's entertainer. Getting a relationship started doesn't require such perfect planning. Are you referring to the creativity in terms of the nail painting thing and remember on her HANDS Link to post Share on other sites
Alpacalia Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 If she's okay with you painting her fingernails, will you let her put makeup on you? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author petrolheadno1 Posted February 21, 2023 Author Share Posted February 21, 2023 1 minute ago, Alpacalia said: If she's okay with you painting her fingernails, will you let her put makeup on you? Loooool funny enough I had that done to me as a drunken forfeit lol. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Els Posted February 22, 2023 Share Posted February 22, 2023 If this girl is a traditional Chinese and lived in Hong Kong for most of her life, I'd say that a (hand) manicure is much more likely to happen with her at this stage than sex or french kissing. Link to post Share on other sites
Alpacalia Posted February 22, 2023 Share Posted February 22, 2023 13 hours ago, petrolheadno1 said: Loooool funny enough I had that done to me as a drunken forfeit lol. Hopefully pictures were taken, yes? I gave my guy a facial once. After exfoliating his lips, I applied lip balm. He likes to brush and style my hair. Winner winner chicken dinner! Painting her fingernails is a nice idea, do you really want to paint her nails or are you trying to catch a Frenchie? Link to post Share on other sites
Author petrolheadno1 Posted February 22, 2023 Author Share Posted February 22, 2023 1 hour ago, Alpacalia said: Hopefully pictures were taken, yes? I gave my guy a facial once. After exfoliating his lips, I applied lip balm. He likes to brush and style my hair. Winner winner chicken dinner! Painting her fingernails is a nice idea, do you really want to paint her nails or are you trying to catch a Frenchie? No I like women who paint their finger nails, it looks really cool. It is going to be done outside near the beach and its 11 degrees celsius lol. I will leave the frenchie for now. I will work with what I have got, i.e hand holding, kiss her on her face, nose, butterfly kiss, hold forehead to forehead, eye gazing and stoke her face and hair. Im sure there is some sensation of oxytocin and serotonin flowing through her body so its still beneficial. Also we have a 90 minute train ride so I will take my laptop and watch something so I will cuddle up to her as on previous dates when we sit next each other when I put my arm around her, she leans onto me lol. At least Im not in the friend-zone. Link to post Share on other sites
justwhoiam Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 Some of the things I read sound odd. I mean, of course we're all different and to each their own. But here's some comments. 1. Maybe she rejected French kissing because she had bad breath or thought so? No one thought about it. Maybe she experienced trauma. But I agree with other people, why don't you feel comfortable asking? 2. You've been planning day trips, but did you ask her to be your girlfriend?? I don't French kiss casually, and I'd probably need to know where I stand before making out. So you need to have that talk. 3. She only used to have her nails painted when she was a child. Weird for a 37-year-old woman in a first world country. I know nail paint is frowned upon in some countries for some jobs (e.g. McDonald's rules), so you literally have to remove it before showing up for work. But for an instrument? That should only have to do with the length of the nails, and obviously you can paint nails even when they are very short. 4. A male date painting her nails? Weird. Boyfriend doing that is OK, as there's a different level of complicity. Otherwise, I'd see it as a feminine task. Not very manly. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Gaeta Posted February 27, 2023 Share Posted February 27, 2023 On 2/20/2023 at 3:46 PM, petrolheadno1 said: she has like over 10 teddy bears and plays and sleeps with them she is 37 lol That sounds familiar to me, is she the doctor who's aunt lives with her? Only 4 dates since December? That's like 1 date a month. Why putting so much importance on French kissing after 4 dates. You know you're dealing with someone traditional. Link to post Share on other sites
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