Old GF back in the picture

[Blind-Sided]

Hi All,

It's been a while since I've logged in.  The betrayal of my last GF and her cheating in a huge way was very hard on me. (I still have too many random thoughts, and hurts when it's quiet) The funny thing though is.... my exW actually took pity on me with this one. It felt nice to be able to talk to her again about "Life" a little.  She was the unexpected comfort in all of this. I know she is, or was here.... and if you read this... thanks.

Anyway, here's my new wrinkle in life. After the breakup with the last GF, and because of the pain she caused.... I started reaching out to all my old friends of the past.  Some were to simply say "Hi", and some were to tell them how I felt when friendships fell apart. It's been a great cleansing for my soul to release any animosity that I've held on it. But one of these people was a GF I had 26 years ago.  I found out she was recently divorced, and we started chatting.  I was "Kid Free" after Christmas, so I asked if she wanted me to visit. (I had a lot of miles since I was travelling for work before COVID, and the ticket was free)  She said yes, and I flew out.  A few weeks after I came home, she drove out, and stayed with me for 3 weeks.   During that time, we had a lot of fun.  She is a normal adult, and did normal adult stuff while staying here. She helped clean, did some laundry, and even split the cost of doing things.  (She would take turns buying dinner, and even some groceries while she was here)   She was also VERY nice to my kids.  She never had any of her own, but she is very "Motherly" in her demeanor.  At the end of those 3 weeks, I was ready to get my life back to normal, but she was very upset when I didn't want her to stay longer.   I explained that I had a bunch of projects I was working on, and while she was here, I have put them off.   

FYI.... I'm 51, she is 47. 

Roll the clock forward, and she has come out again.  She was here for 2 weeks just recently... and once I gain... it was fun, but she was upset when I didn't ask her to just stay.  

While she has a lot of positive thigs going for her.... there simply isn't a "Spark" for me.   I don't know if that's because I'm still very hurt from my last GF, or if it's because she is acting very clingy/needy... or if it's because we broke up once, and in the back of my head... we just aren't a match anymore. 

Obviously, I like her company, and the companionship.... but I'm just not feeling the GF thing. 

I guess the question here is.... am I being dumb?  Am I throwing away something good?  OR, is my gut telling me it's not right for the long term?

Thanks for any input you all may have. 

[Alpacalia]

It's a bit excessive to request a prolonged stay. Especially after already staying with you for two to three weeks.

Wanting space isn't a jerk thing, but by not expressing it, you show cowardice. I think the best way to deal with someone like this is to be firm and noncompromising.

Ultimately, it comes down to what you feel comfortable with and what kind of future you want for yourself. If you don't feel the spark, then it's probably not the right relationship for you.

Edited April 26, 2023 by Alpacalia

[Wiseman2]

3 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

Obviously, I like her company, and the companionship.... but I'm just not feeling the GF thing. 

Are you a plane ride apart? How viable is that and extended visits? 

Perhaps you were rebounding and reached out for comfort.  As long as you're straight up about being casual rather than looking for long term, see what she says.

[Blind-Sided]

Thanks for chiming in on this.  

6 hours ago, Alpacalia said:

It's a bit excessive to request a prolonged stay. Especially after already staying with you for two to three weeks.

Wanting space isn't a jerk thing, but by not expressing it, you show cowardice. I think the best way to deal with someone like this is to be firm and noncompromising.

Ultimately, it comes down to what you feel comfortable with and what kind of future you want for yourself. If you don't feel the spark, then it's probably not the right relationship for you.

You are right. The first time she was here... it was to see how things may progress.  It went from 2 weeks... to 3.... and then she tried to extend it to 4 weeks.  At that point, I basically put my foot down and said it was time to get back to "Normal Life".  She was upset and crying, but understood.   This last time was set as a 2 week visit. she had minor surgery and needed someone to help take care of the wounds. (on her back)  I took her sutures out on the middle of the second week.  She was planning on leaving that Saturday morning... but all of Friday, she was hinting about extending the visit... and I was having nothing to do with that.  Then she slept in on Sat morning... and after I made her breakfast... I offered to help her get ready to go.  At that point... she was starting to cry again. I really think she was hoping I would just say I wanted her to stay,  

I openly, and repeatedly expressed needing my space.  She just didn't want to hear it. 

Yep.... that's the thing.  I'm not supper fit or anything... but I still like my kayak, and to ride my bike, and I'm still healthy and active.  She's a little out of shape, and has a hard time just getting off the floor.  And I think this is part of it.  I've never had an issue with girls with a little size... but it may not be easy to do all the things I like to do with her.  

6 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

Are you a plane ride apart? How viable is that and extended visits? 

Perhaps you were rebounding and reached out for comfort.  As long as you're straight up about being casual rather than looking for long term, see what she says.

Sort of.... it's a 17hr drive.  She's down in TX, and I'm up in the north east.   She has made the drive twice now.  She will literally do it in one shot.  Leave at 3am, get to my place 8 PM.  There is no real issue with the extended visit, since she works remote.  I set her up on a desk with an extra monitor and keyboard.  Her "Work Phone" is digital, and works with the laptop she brings.  This is an up-side to her.  She makes very good money (insurance industry) and she has good medical insurance.  (Funny how that is something an older guy thinks about LOL)  And... my kids like her.  Oddly enough... the exW is ok with her too. (funny story here) 

You are right... it was a rebound of sorts.  Not so much as I was looking for a "Date"... but I was just visiting with an old friend.  But since we were already in a relationship way back when... it was VERY easy to be comfortable with each other. I think in her mind, it was just a restart to the relationship. I can't blame her... she is 47 and newly divorced, and is looking for someone.   FYI... neither of us can remember why we broke up.  It was nothing major... but we were living with each other... and I think we just got on each other's nerves. 

Yes... I have been VERY clear that I'm messed up from the last one, and I'm not looking to be in a real relationship right now.  This has come up several times.  I've told her I enjoy being around her, and having her company... but I'm not ready for it to be anything more than that. 

So... the story.... while she was here... my youngest daughter had a cheer demonstration.  my exW got us all tickets.  So when we got to the gym, we were lined up outside... and my exW was to my left, and my old GF was on the right... and we all talked like normal people.  It was a little strange for me at first... but since everyone was talking, and getting along... it was ok by the end of the afternoon.   

 

Thanks again to both of you. 

Edited April 26, 2023 by Blind-Sided

[Alvi]

1 hour ago, Blind-Sided said:

It went from 2 weeks... to 3.... and then she tried to extend it to 4 weeks.  At that point, I basically put my foot down and said it was time to get back to "Normal Life".  She was upset and crying, but understood.   This last time was set as a 2 week visit. she had minor surgery and needed someone to help take care of the wounds. (on her back)  I took her sutures out on the middle of the second week.  She was planning on leaving that Saturday morning... but all of Friday, she was hinting about extending the visit... and I was having nothing to do with that.  Then she slept in on Sat morning... and after I made her breakfast... I offered to help her get ready to go.  At that point... she was starting to cry again. I really think she was hoping I would just say I wanted her to stay,  

Oh, that is kind of weird. I would think this is a red flag, well, for me anyway. She sounds like a guest who comes to your house and refuses to leave. She certainty overstayed her welcome. I do agree that 4 weeks first visit is a bit (actually a lot) too much. Upset and crying? That is very melodramatic. She sounds very clingy. Why do you think it is so important for her to stay with someone, who is not even her BF at this point, for such an extended period of time? Does she has  hobbies, pets, plants, etc...? I assume that she has her own place and not a hobosexual (don't think that she is but you never know). 

 

1 hour ago, Blind-Sided said:

I think in her mind, it was just a restart to the relationship. I can't blame her... she is 47 and newly divorced, and is looking for someone. 

She is not wasting any time, is she. Does she understand that things need to happen gradually and naturally? I wonder if you are actually a rebound for her since she is recently divorced. That would explain her erratic behavior somewhat. You said you should come and visit and she wants to completely move in I gather. Something is off here. 

 

2 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

I have been VERY clear that I'm messed up from the last one, and I'm not looking to be in a real relationship right now.  This has come up several times.  I've told her I enjoy being around her, and having her company... but I'm not ready for it to be anything more than that. 

Well, if you are right and she is looking for a relationship, then what da heck is she doing with a guy who tells her that he is not looking for anything serious? And not only that, she also wants to stay with that guy for an indefinite amount of time. Strange, very strange. Do you think that she is actually listening to what you are telling her or she do you think that she wants to start a relationship with anyone as soon as possible.

I see two possibilities here:

1. She is going through a perimenopause or menopause. And with her hormones out of whack, she is not thinking clearly. That would explain crying and getting upset over you telling her to leave.
2. She is on a rebound from her divorce. Could explain why she wants to find another partner/husband as soon as possible. Perhaps she is trying to prove something to her ex or to herself. 

11 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

there simply isn't a "Spark" for me.

She is not allowing you to miss her for that spark to develop. Too much early on in a relationship is not always a good thing. There is simply too much of her in your space. I've been dating my BF for 7 month and I am nowhere ready to move in with him. Yes, we do see each other frequently and stay at each other's place over the weekend but there would be a firm no from me if he actually stayed at my place for 4 weeks straight. 

[ExpatInItaly]

You need to stop allowing her visit you, and you need to not visit her.

She is obviously seeing this very differently from you, and it's hurting her. It's weird that she just expects to stay for weeks on end, to be very clear. But you have got to stop letting her come. She is way too attached and you two aren't dating. It's time to stop playing house with her, as it's very obvious now that she wants more. 

She sounds very desperate for a comfortable relationship again after her divorce and is trying to make that happen here. But since you don't see her that way, you need to take a step way back from this friendship because it's giving her the wrong idea. 

[JTSW]

She's clearly hoping to rekindle your relationship.

If that's not what you want then you need to talk and explain to her that you don't see more than a friendship with her.

You are leading her on a little with the long visits and interactions with your kids.

[Blind-Sided]

Thanks again for chiming in. 

I know reading all of this myself... I would think she was totally mental.  But I guess I should expand on this a little. 

We were friends long ago.  She dated a friend of mine when she was 17 or so, and I was around 20.  After they broke up (He moved away) she continued to be part of the friend circle. She would go camping with us, and come to our parties, and just hang out on our normal weekends.  On her 20th birthday, I was there, and we connected, and started dating after that. (I was 24 or so) we were officially together for about 1.5 years after that birthday.  At the end of that, we lived together for 6 months or so.  When we broke up, I wound up moving to the east coast to finish school.  So, as you can see... we have a history that is more that just an old GF.  We were friends for a long time. FYI... my buddy who dated her before me thinks it's great that we reconnected now. (He's seen my FB stuff) 

11 hours ago, Alvi said:

Oh, that is kind of weird. I would think this is a red flag, well, for me anyway. She sounds like a guest who comes to your house and refuses to leave. She certainty overstayed her welcome. I do agree that 4 weeks first visit is a bit (actually a lot) too much. Upset and crying? That is very melodramatic. She sounds very clingy. Why do you think it is so important for her to stay with someone, who is not even her BF at this point, for such an extended period of time? Does she has  hobbies, pets, plants, etc...? I assume that she has her own place and not a hobosexual (don't think that she is but you never know). 

Yes... this would be very weird if it wasn't for the long history we had.  It's not that she refused to leave... she just wanted it to be more.  And yes... she has always been "Clingy".  Over the years... I would hear about what she was upto by some of our common friends who I've stayed in contact with. 

Yes... she has her own place, and a dog... but she's not happy.  She grew up in SoCal... and after her divorce, she moved to texas because some of the people she works with lives there, and she wanted a "Fresh start".   At this point, I think she is feeling alone after the move, and that just amplified her feelings when she was visiting. FYI... her one friend has been watching her dog. 

11 hours ago, Alvi said:

Well, if you are right and she is looking for a relationship, then what da heck is she doing with a guy who tells her that he is not looking for anything serious? And not only that, she also wants to stay with that guy for an indefinite amount of time. Strange, very strange. Do you think that she is actually listening to what you are telling her or she do you think that she wants to start a relationship with anyone as soon as possible.

I see two possibilities here:

1. She is going through a perimenopause or menopause. And with her hormones out of whack, she is not thinking clearly. That would explain crying and getting upset over you telling her to leave.
2. She is on a rebound from her divorce. Could explain why she wants to find another partner/husband as soon as possible. Perhaps she is trying to prove something to her ex or to herself. 

She is listening... but wants it to be different. On some levels I would like it to be different.  She has a lot to offer, and is nice to my kids... and is pretty enough.... but I don't know???

1) She is most certainly starting.  She has night sweats, and  has other indications of it.

2) Yep... it is a rebound of sorts.  She has been out of the marital house for 9 moths or so, and doesn't want to be alone.  On some level it's a rebound for me too.  I was deeply in love with my last GF who I was with for more than 2.5 years. She cheated, and it ripped me a part. This is something I've explained to  her.  I still have random thoughts of the last one, and even dreams about her. 

11 hours ago, Alvi said:

She is not allowing you to miss her for that spark to develop. Too much early on in a relationship is not always a good thing. There is simply too much of her in your space. I've been dating my BF for 7 month and I am nowhere ready to move in with him. Yes, we do see each other frequently and stay at each other's place over the weekend but there would be a firm no from me if he actually stayed at my place for 4 weeks straight. 

I think you are right with that.  The anticipation of seeing someone is what helps build that spark.  And... with my last GF... we would see each other every few days... and then she eventually spent the night... and that would make things exciting. 

 

[Blind-Sided]

5 hours ago, ExpatInItaly said:

You need to stop allowing her visit you, and you need to not visit her.

She is obviously seeing this very differently from you, and it's hurting her. It's weird that she just expects to stay for weeks on end, to be very clear. But you have got to stop letting her come. She is way too attached and you two aren't dating. It's time to stop playing house with her, as it's very obvious now that she wants more. 

She sounds very desperate for a comfortable relationship again after her divorce and is trying to make that happen here. But since you don't see her that way, you need to take a step way back from this friendship because it's giving her the wrong idea. 

Unfortunately... you are absolutely right.  But I really do enjoy the companionship. 

4 hours ago, JTSW said:

She's clearly hoping to rekindle your relationship.

You are leading her on a little with the long visits and interactions with your kids.

Yes she is. 

I think this is part of it also.  She never had any kids of her own... but she was with her husband for 12 years, and raised his daughter.  I think she misses the "Motherly" interactions.  I have 2 daughters, and she likes them both... and is very nice to them. 

Thanks for the input everyone. 

Edited April 27, 2023 by Blind-Sided

[mark clemson]

I think she wants something you just can't give her right now. It sounds to me like you're compatible in many important ways, but NOT in one very important way, which is that you don't feel a strong romantic connection to her (despite all the staying together).

Maybe you're not yet ready to move on from the last one? Maybe you've been there/done that with her and so there's little connection? As you've suggested...

Given everything you've said, and despite what she seems to want, it seems like unless something significantly changes for you WRT to the emotional aspect, you'd regret going forward with her into something more significant. You'd just end up breaking it off, or wanting to.

You could consider seeing a therapist to run all this by. If you're in an emotional state where it's difficult for you to "bond" with a new woman, possibly one could help you speed up recovery to the point where you're ready again a bit sooner? Just something to consider. It's also possible that for whatever subtle reason she's simply not quite right for you.

Edited April 27, 2023 by mark clemson

[ExpatInItaly]

7 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

this would be very weird if it wasn't for the long history we had

I still find her behaviour weird in spite of the long history. 

She is obviously not adjusting well to being alone after her marriage. I don't doubt she is very fond of you, but I also think she wants to stay longer because she is having serious difficulty going home to an empty house now. You getting her to leave reminds her she is indeed still a single woman, hence the tears and distress when she finally gets that it's time to go. Playing happy families with you and your kids soothes and distracts her, but it isn't healthy. It's not a long-term solution to actually healing from her divorce. (And the same is true for you, regarding all of this distracting you from your break-up)

I would be kind but firm that these visits can't continue and you need some space. You don't see her that way, neither of you is healed from your previous relationships, and using each other like crutches will quickly turn dysfunctional - in fact, that has already started. 

 

[Blind-Sided]

8 hours ago, mark clemson said:

I think she wants something you just can't give her right now. It sounds to me like you're compatible in many important ways, but NOT in one very important way, which is that you don't feel a strong romantic connection to her (despite all the staying together).

Yes... exactly. 

8 hours ago, mark clemson said:

Maybe you're not yet ready to move on from the last one? Maybe you've been there/done that with her and so there's little connection? As you've suggested...

I know you and I talked a bunch about the end of my last one. I uncovered so much weeks, and months after... it is truly a soap opera levels. The original break-up just kind of sucked, and it wasn't a big deal... but the more I uncovered, the worse it got. I found out she lied about things that she simply didn't have to.  She even lied to my family, and her own to cover things.  So, in that regard, it's making it hard to move on.

You are right about the "Been there-Done that" with her. I think that somewhere in the back of my head I'm thinking... we already broke up once.  Maybe that's holding me back. 

8 hours ago, mark clemson said:

You could consider seeing a therapist to run all this by. If you're in an emotional state where it's difficult for you to "bond" with a new woman, possibly one could help you speed up recovery to the point where you're ready again a bit sooner? Just something to consider. It's also possible that for whatever subtle reason she's simply not quite right for you.

I don't know how I really feel about a paid therapist. I have a bunch of female friends who love to listen to me, and support me.  AND... one of them is a PhD Psychotherapist.  She's great to hang out with.  LOL  The one thing in all of this... my old GF isn't really in love with being in TX... and wants to move closer.  I really wouldn't want her to move closer just to explore this, because if it doesn't work out... then I would feel guilty about her moving. 

5 hours ago, ExpatInItaly said:

I still find her behaviour weird in spite of the long history. 

She is obviously not adjusting well to being alone after her marriage. I don't doubt she is very fond of you, but I also think she wants to stay longer because she is having serious difficulty going home to an empty house now. You getting her to leave reminds her she is indeed still a single woman, hence the tears and distress when she finally gets that it's time to go. Playing happy families with you and your kids soothes and distracts her, but it isn't healthy. It's not a long-term solution to actually healing from her divorce. (And the same is true for you, regarding all of this distracting you from your break-up)

I would be kind but firm that these visits can't continue and you need some space. You don't see her that way, neither of you is healed from your previous relationships, and using each other like crutches will quickly turn dysfunctional - in fact, that has already started. 

 

You are right in the fact that she doesn't like to be alone, at home.  So that is a 2 fold deal.  She gets affection/companionship back... and isn't "Sleeping alone".  I tell her that her dog is a good sleeping companion, but she says it's not the same. I admit... when my kids aren't home... I don't like that the house is so quiet in the evenings. 

I actually said something along those lines.... I told her if she wanted to visit again, and she can't accept things as casual... then we should no longer be physical.  She said she was ok with it as "Open".... but I'm guessing deep down... she really isn't, and just wants more. 

Thanks again everyone. 

[ExpatInItaly]

3 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

She gets affection/companionship back... and isn't "Sleeping alone".  I tell her that her dog is a good sleeping companion, but she says it's not the same.

Blind, come on. You know that while dogs are great, it isn't anywhere near on the same level as sleeping next to a partner. 

3 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

She said she was ok with it as "Open".... but I'm guessing deep down... she really isn't, and just wants more.

Of course she does. These visits really shouldn't continue at all, with or without physical intimacy. It's sending her totally the wrong message and you have all the proof you need that she cannot handle a casual arrangement. Do the kind thing and put a definitive end to this. Anything else is unfair to her. 

[Wiseman2]

5 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

 she doesn't like to be alone, at home.  So that is a 2 fold deal.  She gets affection/companionship back... and isn't "Sleeping alone".  I tell her that her dog is a good sleeping companion, but she says it's not the same.

It seems like for now you both reconnected during a lonely post breakup time.

Sort of reaching out for mutual comfort without the headache of a new relationship, just sort of putting on those comfy old slippers to bridge the lonlinessss and heartaches. You're both just filling voids right now.

Maybe she's jumping ahead too much, but you have been honest that it's casual and temporary.

Try to discourage 'future talk" and emphasize that this is not viable in the long run. The problem with going back to exes as FWB is that sooner or later someone may get hurt.

[Blind-Sided]

5 hours ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Blind, come on. You know that while dogs are great, it isn't anywhere near on the same level as sleeping next to a partner. 

Of course she does. These visits really shouldn't continue at all, with or without physical intimacy. It's sending her totally the wrong message and you have all the proof you need that she cannot handle a casual arrangement. Do the kind thing and put a definitive end to this. Anything else is unfair to her. 

I know.... when I said it to her, it was a little "Tongue in Cheek".  

You are right... I really should just end the visits, but as you can imagine... I like having someone around too.  I guess that is the problem.  I really don't see this as a typical FWB situation. Let's face it, most FWB situations don't have the people involved acting like "Friends". When she is here... we do everything together like a normal couple. I like that feeling.  BUT... I just don't have the urge to say "I love you" to her for some reason.   I think I told my exW I loved her just a few weeks after officially being together... and I think I told my last GF I loved her in about the same time frame. (We were hanging out for a few months before getting together officially)  I guess it is time to have a real talk with her about everything. I know if I have that talk... I will also lose the friendship too. 

2 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

It seems like for now you both reconnected during a lonely post breakup time.

Sort of reaching out for mutual comfort without the headache of a new relationship, just sort of putting on those comfy old slippers to bridge the lonlinessss and heartaches. You're both just filling voids right now.

Maybe she's jumping ahead too much, but you have been honest that it's casual and temporary.

Try to discourage 'future talk" and emphasize that this is not viable in the long run. The problem with going back to exes as FWB is that sooner or later someone may get hurt.

I think that hits the nail on the head.... it's the old comfy slipper situation.   We broke up long ago because we were young, and I needed to move to finish school... and we just kind of aggravated each other towards the end of the relationship.  So, when we started talking again... it was like no time had even passed. (Because there was an actual friendship there before the relationship in the mid 90's) When I arrived in TX... we got lunch before even going to her house... and by the time we were done eating... it was like no time had even passed.  FYI... when I went out after Christmas, I wasn't sure what to expect.  I have a cousin who lives close to her... and I already knew I could stay there if the old GF didn't want me to spend the night.  OR... if she gave me a blanket to sleep on the couch... I would have been fine with that.  But as the night went on.... and we got tired... she asked... "do you still want the same side of the bed?" 

Thanks for talking with me on this.     

[ExpatInItaly]

8 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

I know if I have that talk... I will also lose the friendship too. 

What you have right now isn't exactly a real friendship anyway, OP. 

You're using each other as crutches. Sure, you may like each other well enough but you are both in this "friendship" for very different reasons. And it's on the way to becoming very unhealthy for you both. It's not as though you two had been great pals all these years. You weren't in each others' lives again until just a few months ago, if I understand correctly. And you two dove right into playing house, for some reason.

So what would you really be losing here if you stop communicating? A source of comfort during a hard time for you, and...? 

[Blind-Sided]

There's a (sort of) new part to this, and I just wanted to throw it out there for a little feedback.

She moved to Texas to get a fresh start after her D, but since she has no family there... she has been feeling lonely. She had said she should move closer to me after that first long visit, and I told her no since I didn't know what I was feeling. Something we talked about back then (Around February) is that if it didn't work out, then I would feel guilty for her moving again.  She said that it would be ok because she has started making friends here.  But then I had to remind her that all those friends were my friends. So... if we didn't work out... those friends may not be there after.  Not that they would be mean, and turn their back on her... but as an example that I told her... "I they have a BBQ, and asked me and my kids to come, you would probably not be invited.  OR, if we go to the local amusement park (Several of us have summer passes) she wouldn't be asked to come along."    They are nice people, but an actual friendship would probably be contingent. 

here's the new wrinkle. Her rental is a small second house on someone's property.  BUT... she was just informed that the owner is putting the property up on the market... so she will probably have to move in the next few months. We talked a little last night about it.   I think she was hoping I would just tell her to move here... but I didn't.  She told me her options were to move back to SoCal, and she would live with her brother for a while... or she could move closer to me.   I told her that I can't make that choice for her.  I guess if she moved closer... we could "Date" properly as she would have her own place... and we wouldn't see each other every day.   But if she moves back to SoCal... I think it would really end things. Sure... she could fly out, but that would get expensive quickly. (Tickets would be $500 or more)  At that distance... driving is no longer an option. (3000 miles or so) 

What do you all think? 

[Wiseman2]

2 minutes ago, Blind-Sided said:

.   I think she was hoping I would just tell her to move here... but I didn't.  She told me her options were to move back to SoCal, and she would live with her brother for a while... or she could move closer to me.  

Unfortunately it seems she's unstable financially and otherwise after her divorce and fishing around for someone to rescue or support her.

Make it crystal clear that she's not going to be moving in with you and crystal clear that if she relocated closer to you, there's no guarantees of anything.

 

[Blind-Sided]

58 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Unfortunately it seems she's unstable financially and otherwise after her divorce and fishing around for someone to rescue or support her.

Make it crystal clear that she's not going to be moving in with you and crystal clear that if she relocated closer to you, there's no guarantees of anything.

 

Thanks for chiming in.

She is fine financially.  She makes in the range of $85k. Her current rental is more than my mortgage. AND... I think that is sort of appealing to her.  The housing market hasn't gotten crazy where I live.  AND.... as you may know... SoCal houses are CRAZY !!  THe house we had when I was kid, (in Anaheim, near Disneyland) my folks paid $120k for, is now listed at $800k. (3br ranch 1/4 acre) Because of that... she knows she can't buy anything in the LA area. 

Yes... absolutely... she would know that it would be her own place, and there is no guarantees with a relationship. 

[ExpatInItaly]

4 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

She told me her options were to move back to SoCal, and she would live with her brother for a while... or she could move closer to me

Sorry, but this is a crock. She is being manipulative here, as I see it. 

Why? I find it exceedingly unlikely that these are her only two options for a new home. There is a whole country for her to choose from. She is purposefully presenting you with "either you let me move near you or I'm moving to other side of the country!" in hopes it will make you panic and tell her to move closer to you. 

4 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

if she moved closer... we could "Date" properly as she would have her own place.

But you're not even into her like that. 

3 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

she would know that it would be her own place, and there is no guarantees with a relationship

But I guarantee you she would not actually see it this way. She is lonely and desperate, OP.  She's not thinking rationally. So while she might say she gets that you can't promise a relationship,  she will do everything in her power to have a relationship with you. Mark my words. This is a woman who can't handl being sent home after over-staying her welcome. She is not going to take it gracefully if she moves closer to you and you don't become her boyfriend. 

Personally, I think you need to find your backbone. You can't stop her from moving near you, but I would advise you tell her more than "I can't promise you anything." I would tell her very plainly that it's not a good idea and you can't support her in that. Anything less would send her mixed messages and be unfair to her. She's too fragile for this. 

[Blind-Sided]

18 hours ago, ExpatInItaly said:

1) Why? I find it exceedingly unlikely that these are her only two options for a new home. ...

2) But you're not even into her like that. 

3 )Personally, I think you need to find your backbone. You can't stop her from moving near you, but I would advise you tell her more than "I can't promise you anything." I would tell her very plainly that it's not a good idea and you can't support her in that. Anything less would send her mixed messages and be unfair to her. She's too fragile for this. 

First.... thanks again for talking to me. 

1) It's not her only two options... it's just the two that have come up.  basically... move back home where there is family, or be around me and my friends. 

2) This is really the problem.  I'm not 100% sure how I feel.  She is nice... she is kind to my kids... she is a good companion, and she has a pretty face, and a lovely smile.  BUT... she is moody (part of the problem 27 years ago) she is a little heavy, and that interferes with physical activities that I like to do.  I personally like a girl with a little meat on her... but when it is enough to cause issues... It's something that has really been in my head looking at my future. I'm 51... so it's not like I want to "Date" just for the sake of dating.  And, while there is a lot of good... it just feels like I may be settling for a sake of a relationship. 

3) I have plenty of backbone.  When I had proof that my last GF was cheating, and she came to my house, showered, and was laying naked in my room.... I told her we needed to talk first, and after I hit her with what I knew... I told her to leave. But I do understand what you are saying.

We had a talk last night. She didn't like it.  To boil it down, I told her I just wasn't feeling the spark. She was upset.  She asked why I kept wanting her to come visit.  I told her that I enjoyed her company... but I did tell her that the reason she was allowed to come out this last time is because she asked "Please" since she had no one to help with her wounds.  She then said that I "Just need to open my heart again since I was hurt so bad by my last GF."  On that point, I agreed... but I told her it's not something I can just make happen. (We talked about a few girls that I was introduced to after my D that the same thing happed.  Several were very pretty, and one was even a lawyer.)  She then said that several of my female friends have told her to just move here, and I may come around.  I told her I may... but then I told her what happens if I don't get real feelings, and then sees me with someone else?   I then told her I can't stop her from moving here. I also told her that some of these feelings are because I feel pressured into feeling something and having to make a choice. 

Anyway... I'm not sure what will actually happen, but I think she is just going to move back close to family.  I didn't sleep well last night because I feel like I've hurt a friend. 

Thanks again.

[ExpatInItaly]

4 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

It's not her only two options... it's just the two that have come up

That is precisely my point. She has plenty of options, but she presented only two to try to emotionally blackmail you into getting her to come closer to you. 

4 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

She then said that several of my female friends have told her to just move here, and I may come around.

I don't buy that. I have a very hard time envisioning rational, mature adults encouraging her to basically push herself onto you. This is her grapsing at "ammo" to try to convince you this is a good idea. If she actually has people endorsing this idea, well, they are just as despeate and short-sighted as she is.

4 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

I didn't sleep well last night because I feel like I've hurt a friend.

But she doesn't seem to feel bad about putting you into this position. There would be no hurt feelings if she weren't being so unreasonable about all of this, and trying to paint you into a corner. So while I understand it doesn't feel good to say no to someone you care about, she also has accountablity in placing unrealistic expectations on this whole situation. 

4 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

I think she is just going to move back close to family

That would be best. Her moving closer to you is likely to end very poorly. You don't need that, and neither does she. What she needs is  a good therapist and real healing. 

[Alpacalia]

It's good that you told her you aren't feeling "the spark."

You know this woman is way more into you then you are her.

Cut her loose.

For both your sakes.

4 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

We had a talk last night. She didn't like it.  To boil it down, I told her I just wasn't feeling the spark. She was upset.  She asked why I kept wanting her to come visit.  I told her that I enjoyed her company... but I did tell her that the reason she was allowed to come out this last time is because she asked "Please" since she had no one to help with her wounds.  She then said that I "Just need to open my heart again since I was hurt so bad by my last GF."  On that point, I agreed... but I told her it's not something I can just make happen. (We talked about a few girls that I was introduced to after my D that the same thing happed.  Several were very pretty, and one was even a lawyer.)  She then said that several of my female friends have told her to just move here, and I may come around.  I told her I may... but then I told her what happens if I don't get real feelings, and then sees me with someone else?   I then told her I can't stop her from moving here. I also told her that some of these feelings are because I feel pressured into feeling something and having to make a choice. 

 

[IrinaM]

 

On 4/30/2023 at 8:10 AM, Blind-Sided said:

but I did tell her that the reason she was allowed to come out this last time

**shudder**

any woman who is willing to drive these ridiculous hours for a man who says she is "allowed" to come out has no self esteem. Please consider what is the kind and morally correct thing to do. She wants a relationship and you are obviously not willing to settle for her- she's overweight and therefore not enough fun. I get the impression you are trying to convince yourself it's more complicated than that.

All this talk about the past and other tangential connections is not really anything. It seems like in the planning of a divorced-dad-childfree-holiday-season you sent out some facebook messages and emails and got a bite. This woman is in a desperate season of her life for reasons unrelated to you and that shouldn't be taken personally or seriously. The fact that you've had numerous unproductive "talks" about how you don't want a commitment and that you have told her that you want nothing serious "repeatedly" does not mean she is being persistent; it means you are being vague and open-ended, leaving possibilities and hope. Telling her to come visit you at your home which entails her driving for hours, and allow sparks to develop naturally, and you may want a commitment at some point in the future, although you can't be certain, but you don't now, because you've been hurt, -- to a woman who is desperate, has low self-esteem, no romantic prospects, she will take that as a green light to continue courting you and auditioning to be your girlfriend and asking you if you're ready to commit yet every few days. (if you haven't figured that out yet) There really isn't a way to have a woman come stay in your house for a month at a time without giving her the wrong impression.

I get the feeling you will continue this pattern with this woman because it is the path of least resistance. Eventually she will get resentful and lash out and hurt you, just like the last one.

[Blind-Sided]

2 hours ago, IrinaM said:

I get the feeling you will continue this pattern with this woman because it is the path of least resistance. Eventually she will get resentful and lash out and hurt you, just like the last one.

While I agree with the majority of what you said.... this feels a little hurtful and personal.  The last one didn't hurt me because I was not wanting to commit to her.  We were in a full, loving, committed relationship. (+2.5 years) Unfortunately, the last one had some issues, and was not being faithful. (that's a hard stop for me, even if she is crying and telling me she loves me)  I knew her for a very long time, and was friends with her folks.  I knew she had a tendency of having a BF and random "Side guys" when she was younger... but I figured after her divorce, and being older, she was no long that way. (So I also have some self blame for allowing myself to be in a relationship with her) We went about 2 years without an issue, but when she finally moved into her own place... and she had some time alone... she fell back into her old ways. (I could feel something was up all last summer) Just for an FYI... i found out about the first guy because he posted about her being his GF on facebook !!!!! (A buddy found it and showed it to me) But then when I came out about it... another guy reached out to me saying they dated for a few months during the summer. (Her cousin thought she was single since her D and introduced them)  Then... over several months... I would find out about more lies, and even a third guy !   AND... my cousin worked with her, and as we talked I discovered he would go shopping and what-not with her (as friends) but she would tell him I was busy with my kids, and as we talked, we both realized that it was weeks/weekends that I didn't even have my kids.  The level of hurt, and distrust she caused was epic, and at "Soap-Opera" levels... and is something I hope no one in the world should have to deal with.  It was so bad... even my exW took pity on me. 

Also as an FYI... all my contacts were not just to old GF's. They were mostly to old friends (guys)  But since this particular girl was in the friend circle... I reached out... not even knowing she was D.  Heck... on her facebook page, the newest picture was with her (now ex) husband, and step daughter in Hawaii. Her FB had her still living in SoCal, but when we finally talked... she told me she was in tx. 

I really am not trying to mislead her.... I'm truly not.  But as you have pointed out... she is looking at any opening as a greenlight, regardless if I'm telling her otherwise. 

So... I've recently learned a new word.... Situationship.  It's a relationship that is situational. I really think that's what it is for me.  

But... thanks for chiming in.  I do appreciate it. 

Edited May 2, 2023 by Blind-Sided