How can a 40 year old who hasn't been in a relationship before not let that get in the way of dating?

[flaxcapacitor]

Hi, so I'm 40 and have never been in a genuine relationship before. I did have a sort of relationship once, it was my first relationship at 27 and also the woman I lost my virginity to, but that ended over a decade ago and it was clear that she was with for what I could do for her (mostly she just needed somewhere to live so she could visit the UK), but not for me as a person, it was a very fraught relationship which ended horribly after less than two years. Since then nothing, I've been on one or two dates, mostly off tinder and had a brief friend with benefits (we only slept together twice).

I know people can tell I'm inexperienced, it's not really something you can easily hide and especially if I did ever end up dating it would be extra difficult to hide my past. Not sure if it would be decietful to try and hide my past anyway.

I don't really have much to offer in a relationship, when I say I'm unattractive I don't just mean physically. I don't have any real talents that might make me an interesting person, I'm not very creative and I'm not very charismatic, but also I'm not physically attractive in any way either so there's that. I do have some qualities which make it easy for me to find friends, I'm not claiming to be the worst human ever to exist, but I have no qualities which get the blood pumping, things which might make a woman excited about spending time with me. This is why it has been so difficult for me to find love, especially when I was younger but even if women's standards are lower at my age, my history is probably as much the reason as my qualities.

Women will assume (and fairly too) that I would lack emotional maturity if they did date me, that I come with baggage and that I wouldn't be good in bed; not to mention the pressure they might feel from being a middle-aged man's first proper relationship.

I don't want this to turn into a misogynistic rant, which unlucky-in-love guys are generally known for so I'll make it clear that firstly, I own the fact I am responsible for who I am and for my qualities and if women don't find me attractive that's none of my business, I don't expect women to be attracted to me or think that women who find me unattractive are shallow. I also know that being unappealing to the appropriate gender(s) isn't a problem only straight cis men experience and there will be many other people who might be in a similar situation. I accept myself for who I am, even if I'm not especially pleased about it. I do still try to improve myself, I hope that my charisma can somehow improve just because I am quite outgoing and talk to people a lot; that I can find a way to make the best of the body and face I have (I am quite fashion conscious though I sometimes feel self-conscious over the fact that I don't just dress down like I think people would expect a guy who looks like me to do) and that I can learn and improve on what meagre talents I do have to the point where I might actually be an interesting person (and also just because it would be nice to be good at something and be able to be proud of the things I have created).

Secondly, in this hypothetical situation (I'm hanging on to hope that one day I'll meet a girl who for whatever reason thinks I'm all that) I'm sure I'll feel quite anxious. I've waited 40 years (and counting) to have a chance at a relationship, if it does ever happen it might be my one and only ever chance and if and when that comes then I'll have to keep my head, which I'm not confident I'll be able to do. I do worry that I'm doomed to die alone because I'll mess it up even if I do meet someone.

So yeah there's nothing on the horizon at the moment but if there ever is I don't want to blow it, either through being too anxious or just because of my lack of experience. Does anyone have any experience of being, or of dating someone similar to me? How did it go? Is there anything I can do so that my lack of experience isn't a problem?

[Weezy1973]

So main point is the your “level” of overall attractiveness is far less important than your lack of confidence / low self worth. People at all levels of attractiveness get into relationships. It’s not a secret club for beautiful people. 
 

What’s stopping you is your low self worth and lack of confidence. Due to this you likely have a low threshold for handling rejection. You already feel terrible about yourself so if you ask a woman out and she declines you have a hard time believing you can handle that. 
 

The real answer is that you have to do things differently if you want different results. So as long as you stay in your comfort zone - and I suspect if you respond, you will be fighting to stay in your comfort zone - you won’t move forward with this part of your life.

[mark clemson]

I'm sure it's easier said than done, but it sounds like you have to "not worry about it" in the sense that you don't let it interfere.

It's normal to be a bit nervous on dates, so you seeming nervous probably would be let slide. They get nervous too.

You probably don't want to gush about how this is your first relationship, etc. Actually it's clearly NOT your first, since you had one before. The fact the person had some ulterior motives on top of it doesn't mean it's also wasn't a real relationship. That sort of thing happens all the time, for better or worse.

In the early days of dating you don't have to reveal a lot. "I've dated and I've had my share of struggles, like most people" is accurate and true, and will probably be enough and be well understood, since plenty of people have "struggles" dating.

Strongly consider reading "A Billion Wicked Thoughts" - specifically the parts on female attraction and see if you can convert any of the ideas there to changes that will make you more attractive. While men go for "bodies" for women many of the things that attract are more subtle and "psychological" in nature - talent, confidence, mannerisms/body language, etc. A little bit of work on grooming/haircut can have an outsized impact that helps quite a bit as well.

One woman has already slept with you, so you certainly can't be "all bad". And IMO many women become more willing to settle for less-than-perfect but "pretty good" as they get older and wiser.

Edited April 27, 2023 by mark clemson

[Coily]

Being in a very similar spot to yourself I can definitely commiserate.

So to start with a baseline from other forums, and I think you are encountering this yourself; there is an unfortunate amount of emphasis placed on dating experience. Unfortunately too many think in terms of relationships just being stepping stones, rather than people can find each other and have only one meaningful relationship. Though I would also remind you that some people with too much dating experience sink in their standards in relationships, and scrape the bottom just to feel validated by anyone else.

That said don't let what foolish others think of the importance of experience stop you from seeking a goal of a relationship. To Hades with the naysayers.

For myself, I have been fortunate to have a lot of interests, talents, blah blah blah; but those really didn't help me in finding a date. The only thing I got out of that was something to talk about, and that's the trick. The biggest hurdles for myself are that the women in my dating area just aren't my cup of tea (nor me theirs) and getting into a good banter routine.

On a positive note, I know a few guys who met the woman of their dreams late in life and had even less experience than yourself. it's possible, and they met their wives in unconventional ways. One was a land surveyor who met his future wife while marking property lines, and she asked him out. So there is always hope (or so I tell myself.)

Best of luck!

[flaxcapacitor]

9 hours ago, Weezy1973 said:

So main point is the your “level” of overall attractiveness is far less important than your lack of confidence / low self worth. People at all levels of attractiveness get into relationships. It’s not a secret club for beautiful people. 
 

What’s stopping you is your low self worth and lack of confidence. Due to this you likely have a low threshold for handling rejection. You already feel terrible about yourself so if you ask a woman out and she declines you have a hard time believing you can handle that. 
 

The real answer is that you have to do things differently if you want different results. So as long as you stay in your comfort zone - and I suspect if you respond, you will be fighting to stay in your comfort zone - you won’t move forward with this part of your life.

I don't think that physical appearance alone keeps me single, or that I'm uniquely ugly or boring, but if I'm being totally honest then I'd have to admit I'm below average in all respects.

I'm sure there are still a handful of women out there who will still be attracted to me, but there won't be very many and in my life so far I've never met such a woman. Maybe I still will but I am worried that by this point my lack of experience is a red flag that will put even these women off.

As for handling rejection. I don't know if I'm necessarily doing the right thing, some guys can be very persistent and you do meet couples from time to time who have the old story of how she didn't like him when they first met but he kept asking her out and now she's glad she changed her mind. I can't see myself being like that though, when a girl tells me she's not interested in me then that's the last she'll hear from me on the matter. I don't really feel comfortable chasing and 'not taking no for an answer'.

[ZA Dater]

I think the key here is to try and not let your lack of experience define you but that is a lot easier said than done. What may help you is to decide what characteristics in a person you find attractive and then see how those align to your own personality. What type of person do you find attractive?

Its a very tough situation to be in and its also a very tough situation to be positive about.

I agree with others that confidence is important but again its easy to say but challenging in practice. 

 

[Els]

On 4/28/2023 at 1:36 AM, flaxcapacitor said:

So yeah there's nothing on the horizon at the moment but if there ever is I don't want to blow it, either through being too anxious or just because of my lack of experience. Does anyone have any experience of being, or of dating someone similar to me? How did it go? Is there anything I can do so that my lack of experience isn't a problem?

Have you talked to a therapist about this? It sounds like there may be some underlying anxiety issues here, that you could perhaps work on. It's very common to be a bit nervous about doing something for the first time, but if you are having constant anxious thoughts the whole time, then that is something that cognitive behavioural therapy might be able to help with.

I'm also not sure why you think you haven't been in a relationship. If a relationship must have been a good one in order to count as a relationship, then the number of "relationships" in the world would be quite small. If you went into it while viewing it as a real relationship (as opposed to, say, explicitly seeking a mail order bride or something), then even if it turns out that she was a user, it was still a "real relationship", IMO. It was just a shitty relationship with a shitty person - but most of us count those, because we grew and learned from them.

Edited May 3, 2023 by Els

[flaxcapacitor]

3 hours ago, Els said:

I'm also not sure why you think you haven't been in a relationship. If a relationship must have been a good one in order to count as a relationship, then the number of "relationships" in the world would be quite small. If you went into it while viewing it as a real relationship (as opposed to, say, explicitly seeking a mail order bride or something), then even if it turns out that she was a user, it was still a "real relationship", IMO. It was just a shitty relationship with a shitty person - but most of us count those, because we grew and learned from them.

 

On 4/27/2023 at 5:53 PM, mark clemson said:

One woman has already slept with you, so you certainly can't be "all bad". And IMO many women become more willing to settle for less-than-perfect but "pretty good" as they get older and wiser.

 

A couple of people have asked and I usually don't like admitting to why I don't really see it as a genuine relationship because I'm embarassed at my own role in it, but I can answer this.

We met online and at first just chatted as friends. She was from the US and I'm from the UK. Then she told me she was applying for an opportunity to study abroad and wanted to apply to a university in my city so we could meet up. She asked if I was interested in her and only knowing her as a seemingly nice person as well as having never had a woman show interest in me I said yes. From then on it was a long distance relationship. However she then dropped the bombshell that she wasn't going to be able to do the study abroad and acted devastated. She suggested that she come over anyway but would need to move in with me. I allowed all this to happen and even ended up paying for her flights. At this point I felt there were red flags but didn't want to end the only relationship I'd ever had.

Once she was in the UK she acted as though it was just a holiday for her, she wanted me to take her away to visit all the parts of the UK she wanted and had no consideration at all for the fact that I had a job and limited finances. I paid for everything and she got a free six-month holiday. She became angry if ever I said I couldn't take weeks off work to travel or couldn't afford to go all the places she wanted, and accused me of ruining her dreams of travel and standing in the way of her spontaneous carefree lifestyle. Whenever we did go away together things would become fraught as she expected me to entertain her and keep giving her new things to do. Saying that she'd travelled all this way to be with me and I wasn't appreciating that.

After her visa expired and she moved back to the US, I planned to go over and spend time with her. I quit my job, handed in the notice on my flat and flew over. However once in America she didn't show much interest in me at all. She had her own social life there and rarely wanted me to join her on her nights out and trips away. For a lot of the time I was just minding her flat, and her cat while she lived it up, still paying for more of her lifestyle than she did and acting as taxi driver, picking her up after she'd gone out and gotten drunk. She acted like I was more of a burden than anything else and after only a couple of months things had regressed to the point that I was sleeping on her sofa as she didn't want me in her bed with her. I also found out she was cheating on me. All in all she probably slept with more people besides me than she did me.

As soon as I returned to the UK, broke, jobless and homeless, she ended the relationship and immediately started going out with one of the guys she'd been sleeping with.

I felt ashamed of how easily used I was. Still do.

[mark clemson]

Ah, I see. I guess you have a point then. Although it's nice to treat women well, some very much do exploit men's interest, which is why "simping" is warned against. It does sound like she saw someone she could exploit in this way in you, and went ahead and did so, unfortunately.

Despite all that it was still a relationship, just an extremely one-sided one. There are certainly relationships and even long term couples like this out there, although in your case it was clearly exploitative. I actually know a man who's married and the situation is somewhat like this, although not quite as bad. But similar. So, it happens.

Hopefully if/when you end up in a longer-term relationship you can find someone who's nicer than this, rather than a "user". Part of it will be drawing boundaries around what you will/won't do for the other person, but best is to (putatively) find someone who isn't like this in the first place, as then it's not a worry.