What Now?

[Tristram]

I think she's absolutely terrified to completely come clean with you. Fear of hurting you more, fear of losing everything. Maybe she's waiting for a guarantee that you will allow her to tell you the truth 100% so she can feel safe that you won't just walk out on her as she comes clean.

 

You were absolutly right. I decided today she would have to take a polygraph or else as this all was weighing my mind to heavily. She decided to confess to doing it intentionally and that they talked about doing it again and how easy it would be. She does remember all of it and told me everything I asked her. It is pathetic that I had to force it all out of her this way though. So this makes the millionth time she has lied to me. I am ready to toss in the towel as I dont know what else to do, how can anyone ever trust someone that continues to lie to them.

[Delectable]

Another Lie....Tris

 

This breaks my heart. LEAVE NOW

[whichwayisup]

Ok, but HAS she cheated since you found out and have been trying to work it out? Remember in Dazed's thread, there's a part where she confesses things bit by bit...As she remembered etc...This MIGHT be the case of your wife. Not saying END IT NOW like the above poster, I don't think you should because it seems recently she has realized afew things - What she could and may lose forever. You.

 

GO to marriage counselling, talk, cry, scream - Get past this hurtful bit of hearing the details. Maybe once she comes clean 100% that way, together each of you can work through the mess.

[Grinning Maniac]

Tris,

 

Dump this bitch. Now. Leave.

 

Didn't I tell you she was still lying man?? I smell bull**** like wolves smell blood. Don't put up with this. She respects you about as much as a stray dog. Kick this woman to the curb. You're never going to be able to trust her again. She doesn't even DESERVE your trust, nor your love.

 

She was low-down enough to come onto a public forum and manipulate people here to her advantage. How sick is that?

 

PS: I'm sorry, but TrisWife... "Get some help, you nutty ho."

[Kenyth]

Of course she lied! Did you guys honestly think she was going to give him all the sordid details when he's obviously on the edge and she doesn't want a divorce? It's all about damage control when you're desperate.

 

People know exactly what they're doing when they have affairs and if they stay in contact and send each other dirty messages, they've done it more than once together. They've done it in places you'll find appalling, and in ways you'll find appalling. They do it for completely selfish reasons. They do not have a great deal of respect for you. Otherwise, it wouldn't have happened. If you can't handle this truth, which you don't have to, then for cripes sake leave! You don't have to stay after this mess!

 

On the other hand, if you want to stay with her, then forget this quest for knowledge! At least keep it confined to the marriage counselors office.

 

What you have to do in any case is quit playing this self-destructive game! It will do nothing but cause prolonged agony for everyone involved. Is that what you want? To go into depression because you can't stop dwelling on this 24/7? It's going to wind up driving you crazy. Nothing good can come of this. Make a decision here man and stick to it!

[Milo]

Seriously, WWIU, what will counseling do for him now? Not much if you ask me. Sort of like Lord Chamberlain talking to the Germans just prior to WWII - a waste of time.

[whichwayisup]

My point really is, if Trist can honestly walk away knowing he tried his best to make it work with no regrets (like, if only I had given her more time to come clean with me, or work through MC and given her a chance to make it up to me) then he should talk to a lawyer and completely end it, get a divorce. I just believe there is some hope. I have read the posts by his wife and I do think she's being sincere. OFCOURSE she is hoping he'll read her words... She probably hopes he'll see her efforts. Just as she is probably reading his posts and trying to get inside his head.

 

I don't know what the outcome will be, but as long as there is love between them, it's worth it to try to work it out. Even if it fails, atleast the efforts were made.

[Trimmer]

She decided to confess to doing it intentionally and that they talked about doing it again and how easy it would be. She does remember all of it and told me everything I asked her. It is pathetic that I had to force it all out of her this way though. So this makes the millionth time she has lied to me.

 

Doesn't this make the first time she has told you the truth?

 

Tristram, at the moment it sounds like you are really a "glass half empty" person. Is there anything your wife could possibly do that would be received by you as a positive development? It is starting to sound like the only possible way you could perceive a good outcome is for someone to go back in a time machine and change the past. Nothing else can possibly be good enough.

 

You're living in the real world, Tristram. What happened can't be changed but your future can. You shouldn't be expected to just "get over it" immediately, however, if you can't even see the possibility of getting over it, can't find the slightest desire to get over it, can't see the act of her finally telling you the truth as an act of telling the truth, then you are just spiraling in for a crash landing.

 

If you can find some hope somewhere in all of this, then by all means, nurture it. But I'll echo those above in saying, if you don't have any reason to stick around other than to continue to punish and dominate her, the really, why are you staying around?

 

Incidentally, for however horrible a person she may be to have cheated on you, if she has any self-respect, she will eventually see that no matter what she does - whether trying a new thing sexually, or telling the truth about her affair, or anything else - nothing has any positive effect on you, so she'll leave on her own. Is that what you are shooting for? Punishing her so much that she'll leave, and then you can tell yourself that she left you, instead of you having to make the decision yourself?

[Grinning Maniac]

Hm, it's been awhile. I wonder if he had to buy a shovel and some quick lime.

[Kenyth]

You shouldn't be expected to just "get over it" immediately, however, if you can't even see the possibility of getting over it, can't find the slightest desire to get over it, can't see the act of her finally telling you the truth as an act of telling the truth, then you are just spiraling in for a crash landing.

 

 

My point exactly. If he doesn't quit this he might decide he DOES need a shovel and some quick-lime.

[cranium]

Trimmer,

 

God you're great!

 

If I wasn't married..........and hetero.....

[Mz. Pixie]

Cranium.

[Trimmer]

< speechless, for any number of reasons!!! >

 

 

(And it takes a lot to render me speechless... )

[Tristram]

Ok, but HAS she cheated since you found out and have been trying to work it out?

 

Not that I am aware of. And I have been monitering her.

 

Remember in Dazed's thread, there's a part where she confesses things bit by bit...As she remembered etc...This MIGHT be the case of your wife.

 

No, she remembered. She was scared of what might happen if she told me. Things were fairly calm and she did not want to upset me further, as she says.

 

it seems recently she has realized afew things - What she could and may lose forever. You.

 

I have taken that into consideration and know it is true. She has proven that she is willing to go to extremes to keep me. She says she knew she loved me, but was to scared to open up to me completely. And now she has that she realizes how much more she does love me. She seems like a giddy little school girl experiencing romantic love for the first time.

 

GO to marriage counselling, talk, cry, scream - Get past this hurtful bit of hearing the details. Maybe once she comes clean 100% that way, together each of you can work through the mess.

 

I will state that I truly feel she is telling me the truth now. I did not feel this way about everything she told me before. Some way I just knew she was lying before. I am calm now that I know the truth, although it still hurts inside knowing that she did all of that to me. We are going to go back to counselling.

 

We have sat down and discussed things. She explained to me exactly what she was feeling and why she did the things she did. She is truly sorry for doing all of it and will do anything to make this work. She knows now how much she loves me and is not willing to give me up. I told her I believed it was all futile as all she continued to lie about all of it and I dont know if I will ever be able to trust her again. I also told her I wasnt even sure how I feel about her anymore. She said she understood and she is going to do whatever she has to to regain my love and trust. I told her I did not know if it was worth it anymore and that we should seperate. All the time and energy that I would have to put into this could be put into another relationship. She begged and pleaded with me for hours not to leave her. And me being flawed as I am gave in. But as a show of good faith,I had her write out a confession of everything. I will also have a post-nuptual agreement done up that would severly cripple her in court if she should ever do this again. I also informed her I will be done if she lies again about the smallest thing, I don't care what it is. Basically I am done playing games. So we will see what time brings.

[Mz. Pixie]

Tristam,

 

I have mad respect for you but I'd be insulted if my husband asked me to sign a post nuptual agreement. If you truly believe her, her word will be enough for you.

[Yikes]

Hey there...

 

I've been loosely following this thread for a while.

 

Mz. Pixie, you know how I feel about you and the great advice that you dole out here. Personally I see nothing wrong with a post nuptual agreement. If she is serious and she has learned her lesson, it's a no brainer for her. It provides Tristram with piece of mind, it's a reminder to her that there will be big consequences to come if she screws up again. I can see her being hesitant if SHE'S not sure that this might not happen again. If she knows that it will NEVER happen again, then what's the big deal? It might hurt her pride a bit, but what about the hurt that SHE has caused him.

 

If I was to do that with my ex, she wouldn't like it, she would be insulted but you know what I'd tell her? Tough sh*t. You broke the trust. You lied to me and cheated on me. You lied and cheated on your kids. Suck it up princess!

 

My ex seems to think that the next day everything should be forgotten and she should just automatically have the full trust of everyone around her. Life doesn't work that way. When you lie and cheat you need to EARN back the PRIVLEGE of being trusted again.

 

Just my two cents.

[Mz. Pixie]

I can see your point, definitely but what about her standpoint??

 

I'm from a standpoint that any problem in a marriage are 50/50. I truly believe that in almost all cases there is something going on there that causes needs not to be met which eventually leads to an affair. Should you talk that out and work it out?? Sure you should. Unfortunately though sometimes people don't and we end up in a situation like this.

 

Is she to have him sign something also stating that he'll never do some of the things that may have contributed to this?

 

I can see that it would be a good faith step on her part but is this about punishing her?? In other words, mess up and you leave everything behind?? I don't believe that it's good faith to say let's have a fresh start but let's put all these restrictions on it??

 

This is about taking a chance. They are both stepping out on a limb taking a chance here, not just him. True it was she who was unfaithful but since all this came out she's taken a hell of alot from him. I can only imagine what it's been like in that house.

 

She's gotta live in this marriage too, and it can't just be all about exacting a pound of flesh from her. She's only going to take a beating for so long before she gets tired of it. That's human nature.

[Tristram]

Mz. Pixie,

I understand what you are saying, but know that she was the one that suggested it. It was her idea, and after thinking about it I think it is a good one. At this time I do not have the confidence she will not do it again. Having that paper though will give me the confidence not to worry about it and move on with my life. And no, it is not about punishing her. It is about protecting myself and my children. Plus, if I am doing something she doesnt like there are options other then "screwing around". Further more I have no further desire to punish her. And I have told her even if we end up seperating I would still want to remain friends with her if not for our sake, for at least that of the kids. Alot has changed about how I feel about her the last couple days. I am not burning inside with rage toward her anymore. I just dont trust her anymore, and I am afraid of being hurt again.

[Yikes]

I am sure that there were things that they both did that led up to the affair... BUT as I see it his wife chose to cheat and the affair is "on top" of those issues.

 

I don't see it as punishing her at all. I see it as her giving him added assurance that this will never happen again. It's piece of mind that the cheating will NEVER happen again. It's an assurance that while it is unreasonable to think that they will never have issues again BUT his wife will not resort to infidelity. Infidelity will not be an option.

 

He is not asking her to sign anything guaranteeing that she will be perfect, just that she will not lie and cheat on him ever again. It is unreasonable that she expects him to be perfect. Maybe he should sign an agreement stating that he'll never cheat too.

 

Mz. Pixie, I respect your opinion. I just don't happen to see thing the same way as you on this one.

[Mz. Pixie]

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on this one, Yikes.

 

I think it's easy for one to sit in the position of the betrayed spouse when they've been the BS. Just like it's easy for me to see Ms. Tristam's perspective somewhat. Because I've been the cheating spouse.

 

To say that the infidelity is the top issue? That's because it's the one that's causing the most pain at the moment especially to the BS.

 

I'm speaking out of my position. I would imagine that there have been lots of tears and pain on the part of Tristam since he found out. In my case I know there were alot of tears and pleading going on before I ever stepped outside of my marriage. I was in alot of pain way before the infidelity. Yes, the infidelity just made it all 100 times worse but at the time you're not thinking that it will. You're trying to make yourself feel better, at least I can say that I was.

 

Pain is pain, no matter who is feeling it and I for one can't say one pain is above the other.

[Yikes]

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on this one, Yikes.

 

Agreed. back at ya.

 

For what it's worth, part of the reason I feel the way that I do is my ex HATED putting anything in writing in the way of a card or letter because it took away her ability to lie about it after the fact. After a few times of her saying "I never said that!" and me replying with "You most certainly did and here's the proof", she avoids written correspondance wherever possible. I prefer it because she lies. I see an agreement like that as a little re-assurance when Tristram might be feeling a tad insecure due to her past infidelity.

 

To backtrack a bit. Tristram's comment about the lie detector was the first thing that caught my eye. My immediate thought was, "How sad is that?". How sad is it to feel that you have to ask your spouse to take a lie detector? (shades of Jerry Springer, huh?) I suppose the same could be said about the post nuptual agreement as well.

 

"How sad is that?".

 

I guess in the end, I think that it's unrealistic to ask your partner to promise to always be perfect. I don't don't happen to feel that it's unrealistic to ask them to promise to always be faithful and honest. In a sense we all made that promise anyway when we said "I do". I never promised her that I would be perfect, but I did promise to "love, honour and cherish her". Faults? I have many, but I never broke my promise.

[whichwayisup]

Trist, you're doing the right thing and I'm glad to hear that things are opening up abit more. And ofcourse the trust will always be an issue, maybe always, but the bond between you two will grow and together the marriage will be different, even better. More talking and understanding eachothers needs, and really being upfront and honest. Once that security is felt, that feeling of not holding back - I believe it will be much better for both of you.

 

You have time on your side, so just take it one day at a time...The rest will fall into place as it should.

[Trimmer]

Tristram -

 

I may be reading more into them, but your last couple of posts sound so calm, and a little bit sad, but without that nasty edge that I think you'll admit you had built up. I'm sad for you, but I'm also happy for you - I remember turning the corner from my nasty, angry, vicious sarcasm that felt cold and bitter, towards a kind of peaceful sadness. It still hurt, but it felt warmer and more human, and allowed me to open my eyes to see some hope far off in the distance.

 

I'm not sure how I feel about the post-nup in general, but if you do decide to go through with some kind of written commitment, would you be willing to word it in such a way that it was gender-neutral, covering both you and your wife, and become a signatory yourself, agreeing to the same commitments that she is, and submitting yourself to the same consequences in the event you break them? I'm a big believer that one shouldn't declare rules and laws that one isn't willing to follow oneself...

 

This way, while your wife is offering a certain kind of commitment to reassure you, you are showing a willingness to put your hat in the ring, too. It might help to eliminate the whole dominance/punishment theme, by changing the approach to this document from something you can hold over her head to something you have both stepped up to. Instead of an instrument of punishment, it could be one of the steps of healing that you take together.

 

And when you look at it this way, it seems like something you should be doing anyway - whether you write it down or not. I now believe that our mistake after my wife's first affair 10 years ago is that we just went on with life, and we didn't sit down and talk about what we expected from each other, what our real commitments were for the future, and really do some honest healing. I hate playing the "could have, should have" game, but I believe we missed an opportunity to heal, to fix ourselves, to start on a better future together, and although it continued to seem like a good life for a while, it eventually came back around and got us the second time.

 

Tristram, don't be afraid of the work this will take. If I am lucky enough to get into another good relationship, I believe that I will "owe it" a lot of attention and emotional work. But given the choice, I would still rather have put that hard work into healing and fixing the relationship that is now ending.

[erewego]

Quick note from a lurker here.

 

Seems that you had her write a post-nupital agreement (which she did) but there is some concern that it takes away from the 50/50 of a marriage.

 

Now, I don't know what was said on the agreement exactly but...

 

Why don't you write a similiar agreement to her? It seems win-win.

You:

1) Show her how you/she should act if positions were reversed.

2) Should ease up on future resentment from her for writing such a document

3) You are not planning on cheating on her, so you really lose nothing.

4) Extra: And if you are ready to recommit to you marriage the document can show her how much you would be "punished" if you did something as horrible to her.

 

Just a thought.

[Cecelius]

I'm from a standpoint that any problem in a marriage are 50/50. I truly believe that in almost all cases there is something going on there that causes needs not to be met which eventually leads to an affair. Should you talk that out and work it out?? Sure you should. Unfortunately though sometimes people don't and we end up in a situation like this.

 

But whether those "needs" are reasonable is a different story. Not getting paid enough attention is no excuse for letting another guy's d#ck in you. Besides, this is a little like saying that leaving your door unlocked causes burglary -- the result does not prove the cause.

 

I agree though that people, no matter how guilty they are or how wrong they were, will only put up with so much and a cheater will put up with less. generally, they are more emotionally weak anyway -- how are they going to suddenly find the moral fiber to live with punishment? For that reason, I cannot see any point in staying with a person who cheated on you .