How to react when you are the only one reaching out to get together

[Wiseman2]

You could move some of these people to the "acquaintance" category and focus more on real friends you can count on.

[roses20]

1 hour ago, Wiseman2 said:

You could move some of these people to the "acquaintance" category and focus more on real friends you can count on.

I am in this process mentally trying to do so. I don't feel.about her only as an aquintance so that is the hardest part, because we have been seeing each other for the last 2 years. But it is a gradual process and your suggestion is right

[stillafool]

11 hours ago, roses20 said:

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That is the thing. With past friendships, I did not have this issue, they would invite me places all the time. I never thought or felt I am expecting too much from them, because they would search for my company, I never had to calculate how many times we were seeing each other or this stuff I am telling you now. Everything was mutual when it comes to how much time we wanted to spend together, most of the times.

Why don't you socialize more with those friends?  They seem to value your friendship and show it.  Why are you trying to be friends with a woman who does not and isn't afraid to show it time and time again.  

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My friendship with her is the only "more distant" one that I have had. Distant as in having a more slow pace in talking to each other when we are not seeing each other. So paradoxically, it is the one friendship where I did not put many expectations, I assume it is because I saw she was also a more aloof type of person. And these things I am writing here, I did not tell her or make her feel them, I only kept them to myself, because I know these feelings I need to go through them and see what is the best solution for me to toughen up. I wish English was my first language so that I could express more accurately, because I see that things get lost in translation, but language barrier is a thing I guess.

She is distant with you because she isn't as into the friendship as you are.  Frankly, she seems to be distancing herself hoping you'll get the hint and end the friendship.  She is aloof with you but as you can see that isn't the way she's treating her newer friends that she's now going out with and on vacation with.  Still you're not getting the hint which she probably finds frustrating and that is why she didn't say anything when you told her you would have wanted to go to the beach with them.  When you're not invited it's because they don't want you to go and there's no need to question it.

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I have always maintaned a balance with her, never reached out more than 2 per month, if I felt her not in mood to talk, I did not force it. I tried mirroring her behaviour and not be "too much" for her because I saw that is how she is, so I cannot expect her to be like other people I have hung out with. 

You shouldn't have to monitor and mirror your contact if she were a true friend.  You would reach out whenever you want to and  you wouldn't have to wonder why she's not reaching out making plans with you if you were real friends.  You're not, and that is why you walk on eggshells around her to maintain some type of frienship.

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About the part that she is with me because I keep reaching out. Lately, because she was never sure if we could hang out because she would be tired from the club the next day, I stopped initiating. And she has reached out, but it was on the same day, when she felt she was not tired or hungover. So yeah, even if she reached out, it was kind of last minute , and we would see each other in the same day. So now it's like she seeks my company , but it's only when she has time or energy left after hanging out with them and always last minute.

She isn't really seeking your company if it's always last minute all the time.  She doesn't make plans with you the way she does the other women.   

 

I'm really curious why this persons friendship is so important to you given the way she treats you.  Why not socialize more with the friends you mentioned in the first paragraph who value you?  Those are the friends you should be seeking, not this one.  You deserve better than her as a friend.

[NuevoYorko]

I just re-read your original post.  This is the way it starts:

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I have been friends with this girl for over 2 years now. At first, she would also write to me to hang out and it was once per month maybe when she did that. After the first 2-3 months of us knowing each other, I was mainly the one who would reach out to her to ask her if she wants to hang out and do something. 

So, the trajectory of your friendship was basically that she initiated once per month for the first 2 - 3 months.  So that's 2 or 3 times total of her doing it.

For the ensuing 2+ years, it's been the way it is now.   

That's not necessarily "bad."  Clearly it's not the way you'd like it to be ideally, but it seems that you really are and always have been fairly casual friends who've enjoyed each others company on occasion.   

If you still do enjoy connecting with her on that type of timeline,  that's what you should do.  Don't sell yourself short on developing more in depth friendships though.  

 

[stillafool]

22 minutes ago, roses20 said:

I am in this process mentally trying to do so. I don't feel.about her only as an aquintance so that is the hardest part, because we have been seeing each other for the last 2 years. But it is a gradual process and your suggestion is right

According to your first post in this thread even the 1st year of your friendship you only wrote to each other or hung out once a month and then only after  2-3 months later you were the only one reaching out but she would respond only. That certainly sounds more like acquaintances than actual friends.   So you really haven't spent much time with her as friends at all.  I still don't understand why you are so intent to hang on to this woman when you have other friends who actually want to spend time with you.

[roses20]

51 minutes ago, stillafool said:

I'm really curious why this persons friendship is so important to you given the way she treats you.  Why not socialize more with the friends you mentioned in the first paragraph who value you?  Those are the friends you should be seeking, not this one.  You deserve better than her as a friend.

Well I am also socializing with new people, emphasis on new. They are not even aquitances as of now, I just met them. So I can't call them friends. 

Regarding your first question, we exchanged gifts on our birthdays, we talked about personal stuff. More than you would do with an aquintance. And it's the fact that I have seen her at least once a month these years. And I felt good in her company when we would see each other. I mean, if she would annoy me with her presence or something, I would not care that she did not initiate. But we get along well. But I suppose she gets along even better with her new friends, that's why she is making them her priority. 

It's not that it's "so" important, but we get along well normally and it's a bummer when these things happen with a person you feel good with. And as how someone else said somewhere in the first page of this post, when I find someone who I get along with and feel comfortable with, I tend to value them more because for me at least, I don't find people who I like very easily. I guess that is the reason. And since things are changing, it feels different than if she was someone who I did not particularly like

 

[stillafool]

57 minutes ago, roses20 said:

Well I am also socializing with new people, emphasis on new. They are not even aquitances as of now, I just met them. So I can't call them friends. 

I wasn't talking about you meeting new friends but to spend more time with the friends you mentioned in your 1st paragraph of this thead.  They seem like your true friends.  Where are they?

[Alpacalia]

2 hours ago, roses20 said:

It's not that it's "so" important, but we get along well normally and it's a bummer when these things happen with a person you feel good with.

But you don't feel good with her.

[basil67]

1 hour ago, Alpacalia said:

But you don't feel good with her.

Indeed.  This whole thread was started because deep down you know that she's not as committed to the friendship as you are.  

To you, she's a first tier friend.  But to her, you're a second (or third) tier friend.   Your problems with her not reaching out or inviting you away are happening because you're expecting more of her than what the friendship means to her.  

[Acacia98]

On 8/10/2023 at 9:28 PM, roses20 said:

But last time we saw each other, she told me they were going to the sea side and I just felt bad, because she never asked me if I would like to join them. She just casually told me they were planning on going. 

(...)

I felt as if I am not included in her plans and now I even feel reluctant to ask her why she didn't consider asking me if I also wanted to join them... this kind of took me by surprise. I don't understand why she is acting posessive, or at least this is the vibe I am getting, that she wants me separate from them, as if they are her lovers, not just regular friends. She even told me a false date when they were going (I found out later after seeing her profile pic change) . I really wanted to go to the sea and I would not think it would bother her to be there with her.

Maybe I need some comforting opinions, I don't know, but it has been on my mind since then and I don't know if I will be able to pretend that I feel ok with this when we see each other. It kind of hurts, because I can't stop thinking about it. And I don't know how to bring this up to her, because it is building resentment in me. And in the past I hold on my hurt and never expressed it out of fear of losing someone and it only affected me.in the end.

@roses20, this kind of clarifies things for me. The last time you posted about this friend, it was not very clear whether she was just being absentminded and forgetting to reach out to you or she simply didn't value the friendship as much as you did. Today, I get the sense that she doesn't value your friendship much.

Now, ideally, you should have accepted this and made adjustments to the way you related to this woman, i.e. you should have stopped prioritizing the friendship so much. That would have relieved much of your resentment. Unfortunately, you seem to have decided, perhaps subconsciously, that the way this woman treats you determines your value as a human in the world. So you are kind of paralyzed, remaining in place, because deep down inside, you seem to fear that you don't deserve better. The other problem is this: you seem to make the mistake of believing that because you would behave a certain way, other people should behave that way. So instead of accepting that this woman has flaws that make her a lousy friend to you, you're spending a lot of energy feeling indignant that she's not being as inclusive as you would have been.

The reasons you use to justify maintaining the status quo are pretty similar to the ones I've seen people in abusive relationships using to justify staying with their abusive partners. Also, based on your own explanation, you seem to have a history of getting into friendships with people who don't respect you/care about you. That's probably something you will want to examine and try to make sense of someday.

Remember, you're not helpless. You have the power to either de-prioritize this relationship or end it altogether.

[roses20]

On 8/12/2023 at 10:31 PM, stillafool said:

I wasn't talking about you meeting new friends but to spend more time with the friends you mentioned in your 1st paragraph of this thead.  They seem like your true friends.  Where are they?

Those friends I was talking about are now married with kids and have also moved out of the country. So that is why now I am in this period where I need to almost start from scratch and form new friendships. I am also aware that even if I will make other friends, life may also take them some other places too.

Coming back to the present, yesterday I went with these new people I mentioned on a roadtrip. One of the girls asked me if I wanted to join them, they were also relatively new to each other as a group ( funny because this is what I was writing about here and then this invitation came). I felt good yesterday , it was nice, the conversation was good and I will go in the future with them if other trips will be made or just for a walk outside, whatever the occasion may be. It made me feel a bit better this trip.

Edited August 14, 2023 by roses20

[Alpacalia]

5 hours ago, roses20 said:

Those friends I was talking about are now married with kids and have also moved out of the country. So that is why now I am in this period where I need to almost start from scratch and form new friendships. I am also aware that even if I will make other friends, life may also take them some other places too.

Coming back to the present, yesterday I went with these new people I mentioned on a roadtrip. One of the girls asked me if I wanted to join them, they were also relatively new to each other as a group ( funny because this is what I was writing about here and then this invitation came). I felt good yesterday , it was nice, the conversation was good and I will go in the future with them if other trips will be made or just for a walk outside, whatever the occasion may be. It made me feel a bit better this trip.

I'm so happy for you. I'm sure it's daunting to form new friendships but the alternative is holding on to a friendship that has hurt you and constantly reminding yourself of what used to be. You deserve to have great and fulfilling relationships with people that are worth your time and appreciation. Going on trips with them, having conversations and being welcomed into their community is a great first step for you! Just keep investing your energy into things that make you feel happy and fulfilled and I'm sure you'll build on this connection and create friends who will last you a lifetime.

Edited August 14, 2023 by Alpacalia

[NuevoYorko]

Good for you!  Keep enjoying life. That's what it's all about.

[Esteban]

A possible explanation is that she likes you enough to do something together when you suggest it, but not enough to contact you. That would be best guess.

It´s also possible that she wants to see you once every 2-3 months, but you are contacting first. From her point of view there´s then no need to contact you. You can test this theory by not reaching out to her for 3 months.

It´s also possible she´s just someone who always waits for others to reach out first. There are people like that. You can test that theory, treading carefully, by asking a mutual acquaintance about their relationship, or asking the other clubbing girls about it when she is in the toilet or something.

One other possibility is that she slightly wants to end the relationship with you, but not enough to go through the awkwardness of doing it. Look out for hints of slight hesitation when you suggest meeting or neutral rather than warm language.

I`m wondering if a good strategy is to tell her that you´d like her to be the one to reach out from time to time. Say this 1-2 times and make sure she hears and understands you. Then, immediately or soon after that, just wait for her to contact you, even if this ends the relationship.

I´ll share my experiences in a separate post.

Edited August 18, 2023 by Esteban

[Esteban]

Unless it somehow appears later it looks like the separate post I mentioned about my experiences was lost or somehow deleted when I pressed send. Not sure I feel like rewriting it now.

[roses20]

6 hours ago, Esteban said:

Unless it somehow appears later it looks like the separate post I mentioned about my experiences was lost or somehow deleted when I pressed send. Not sure I feel like rewriting it now.

I was actually curious about your experience. Maybe you can try again making a post. Perhaps there was an error with the site

[roses20]

15 hours ago, Esteban said:

A possible explanation is that she likes you enough to do something together when you suggest it, but not enough to contact you. That would be best guess.

It´s also possible that she wants to see you once every 2-3 months, but you are contacting first. From her point of view there´s then no need to contact you. You can test this theory by not reaching out to her for 3 months.

It´s also possible she´s just someone who always waits for others to reach out first. There are people like that. You can test that theory, treading carefully, by asking a mutual acquaintance about their relationship, or asking the other clubbing girls about it when she is in the toilet or something.

One other possibility is that she slightly wants to end the relationship with you, but not enough to go through the awkwardness of doing it. Look out for hints of slight hesitation when you suggest meeting or neutral rather than warm language.

I`m wondering if a good strategy is to tell her that you´d like her to be the one to reach out from time to time. Say this 1-2 times and make sure she hears and understands you. Then, immediately or soon after that, just wait for her to contact you, even if this ends the relationship.

I´ll share my experiences in a separate post.

These are valid points, though hurtful if it is the truth. But as you said, I suppose there are degrees of liking someone enough for you to be motivated to contact them. I never experienced this in the past though, this concept is new to me.

We don't have mutual aquintances and when it comes to going clubbing again, I already mentioned to her a couple of weeks ago that maybe when she comes back, I can join them. But it is weekend now and no sign of contact from her. What can I say, for me it is tough, because when I see someone do these things, naturally I tend to disociate from them emotionally and be neutral, because if I invest energy again, I know it does not matter anymore. 

And I hope I can say what is on my chest and have a conversation with her about it, because I don't want to be this fog between us if it is to end here. I wouldn't want her to contact me just because I said so, if it's not from her heart naturally. It would not make me feel as if she really wanted it. 

I think this has affected me this much because I am more of a close friend type of person, where I like when I feel close and familiar to friends, it's more soul fulfilling than just going out with people randomly who are not close friends. Of course, this stage is needed in order to eventually develop close friendships, if you find people you relate to on a deeper level.

[stillafool]

1 hour ago, roses20 said:

We don't have mutual aquintances and when it comes to going clubbing again, I already mentioned to her a couple of weeks ago that maybe when she comes back, I can join them. But it is weekend now and no sign of contact from her.

You stated before that clubbing is no longer your thing, even though you went along with them before.  Was she the one who invited you to come or did you invite yourself?

[roses20]

25 minutes ago, stillafool said:

You stated before that clubbing is no longer your thing, even though you went along with them before.  Was she the one who invited you to come or did you invite yourself?

Even if it is not my main thing like it used to be in the past, I did tell her I wanted to go from time to time, just not very frequent and when the weather got warmer. So when the weather got warmer, she told me if I wanted to go. That and the fact that we would have a discount if we were more girls, the club had an offer. So I don't know anymore why I was invited. And after that night, I did not go for a few months, I was also visiting my hometown etc. But now I wanted to go again at least one more time before summers ends, so I told her that I would like that, when they are also going. And I know that every weekend they are dancing, so I don't know what to make of this, because last time we talked, she was out of town and she would have to contact me to see if we would go clubbing or do something else during daytime.

The thing is that when a friendship is reciprocal, even if there is a bump in the road, most of the times it can be solved, if one person expresses their feelings about the way things are going. But in this case, I feel (I may be wrong, but knowing her attitude in general I kind of doubt it) that when I tell her that I feel things have changed from her side, that she will not put much thought and just won't care and go see her friends and just be annoyed that I am feeling.like this. But I want to express myself if the occasion arises and if things keep going like this. 

Edited August 19, 2023 by roses20

[stillafool]

15 minutes ago, roses20 said:

But in this case, I feel (I may be wrong, but knowing her attitude in general I kind of doubt it) that when I tell her that I feel things have changed from her side, that she will not put much thought and just won't care and go see her friends and just be annoyed that I am feeling.like this. But I want to express myself if the occasion arises and if things keep going like this. 

Yeah I hear you and I do believe she will be annoyed that you are bringing this up to her yet again.  She isn't going to change and she'll probably wonder why you haven't realized that by now.  It's probably that she feels more compatible with those other girls or they may be the ones inviting her to the clubs.

[roses20]

28 minutes ago, stillafool said:

Yeah I hear you and I do believe she will be annoyed that you are bringing this up to her yet again.  She isn't going to change and she'll probably wonder why you haven't realized that by now.  It's probably that she feels more compatible with those other girls or they may be the ones inviting her to the clubs.

Bring what yet again? I did not say to her that I feel she changed, I only told that I would have liked going to the seaside too back then. But I did not have a conversation in depth or anything. And I don't think someone has to realize anything, I believe in communicating. It's really hurtful when people are ambiguous on purpose so that they make you try and guess what they mean by doing certain actions. Anyway, whatever will be, will be. 

It's just that I would never put someone through something like this, so that they feel unwanted and hope they would go away. It's just lack of consideration especially when you have been friends for some years. 

And I get it that someone may feel more compatible with other people. But does that mean that you ignore older friends and their value is gone in your eyes just because you have different compatibility with someone else? People have different friends, but ditching older friends is lack of appreciation, just because you found a shiny new object. 

Edited August 19, 2023 by roses20

[stillafool]

4 hours ago, roses20 said:

And I get it that someone may feel more compatible with other people. But does that mean that you ignore older friends and their value is gone in your eyes just because you have different compatibility with someone else? People have different friends, but ditching older friends is lack of appreciation, just because you found a shiny new object. 

Of course it's not wise to forget about your old friends in favor of the new; but people are also free to socialize with whomever they chose without including the old friends.  Maybe they want to spend time alone with a certain group and that's their business.  No one wants to feel forced to invite someone because if they don't feelings will be hurt.  Grown people do what they want to do.  They are also free to elminate people from their life if they chose.  

[basil67]

5 hours ago, roses20 said:

And I get it that someone may feel more compatible with other people. But does that mean that you ignore older friends and their value is gone in your eyes just because you have different compatibility with someone else? People have different friends, but ditching older friends is lack of appreciation, just because you found a shiny new object. 

Hon, look back at your first post here.  She isn't the close friend which you'd like to believe she is - you are placing far more value in this friendship than she is. 

If something went wrong, I would certainly have a conversation with my BFF because her ongoing actions show that the friendship is appreciated on her side too.  And we'd listen to each other.  But if they were like your friend who wasn't interested enough to take turns reach out after the first couple of months of friendship, then they will just that conversation needy and annoying...so I'd just let them go.

With regards to the club, the reason you're not invited is one of two things - she either doesn't think of you or doesn't want you there.  No amount of conversation is going to change this.  Do you really want to push yourself in with a group which doesn't care for you?

There's also a repetitive theme in your posting about how you treat others.  It seems you don't understand that people aren't the same and that they have different values and methods to you.  You know the saying "treat others how you would wish to be treated"?  It's actually really bad advice because different people want different things. 

Edited August 19, 2023 by basil67

[Alpacalia]

roses20, you're coming from a place of vulnerability, and it's perfectly natural to feel bitter in these circumstances - it's not unreasonable at all.

But two years of friendship and understanding her behavior patterns from your observation and experience should help you decide what to do.

You have to know when to take someone at their word, and if she's not showing much interest in spending time with you, it's better to find the strength to accept it and move forward, rather than continuing to invest in a one-sided friendship. We can't expect other people to be as invested as we are in a friendship, so sometimes it's better to acknowledge that and let go when it's not quite right.

Look how much time you've spent mulling over the situation so it might be worth looking for use that energy to nurture other friendships or even pursue other interests that are meaningful to you. It could be anything from taking an online course to learning a new language or visiting new places.

The bottom line is that in order to feel fulfilled, you have to take an active role in tending to your own needs. Fall in love with yourself.

You can't rely on someone else to do that for you, no matter how strong the friendship is. Why do you want to be a part of someone's life if they don't reciprocate in the same way, right?

I rather sit around with a fork in my eye.

And if this particular friendship wasn't going to last anyway, it's a good thing you discovered it sooner than later which saves you both a lot of heartache in the long run. So I think it's lesson learned and worth trying to draw energy from other supportive, positive relationships in your life. It's hard to lose a friendship but it can also be liberating as it opens new doors and provides an opportunity to grow in new ways.

I haven't lost any friendships to this extent, with the exception of what I posted earlier about during that time period because I felt she wasn't a very good friend, and other than drifting apart from a few friends from high school but we still keep in touch from time to time. I am so graced to have such an amazing supportive network of friends that have been in my life so long.

In the end, I hope that you take away something positive out of this - whether that's learning a lesson about yourself or the importance of meaningful relationships.

That's really all you can do!

Edited August 19, 2023 by Alpacalia

[NuevoYorko]

Can't you just go back to the way it was before you started ruminating about it so much?  I know your emotions don't agree with this, but what you have described is a rather casual friendship  with a person you have known for 2 years, and spent some time with about once a month.  

You initiated, but it seems like you were both enjoying it.   Still, you saw each other infrequently, your friendship did not develop further, and you were happy with that, except for the fact that you did all the contacting.

Why not just call her and see if she's down for a walk or whatever you enjoyed together once in a while in earlier times?  

Edited August 20, 2023 by NuevoYorko