Not how I saw my life going

[JTSW]

5 minutes ago, Muznomer said:

It’s a “shitty” situation we are all in but he wants us both - not fair on me I agree  

But you are not in the same compartment as his wife.

You are not his priority, his family are.

He is incredibly selfish so please don't give him the option to have you both.

The longer this goes on the harder its going to be for you.

It wont be hard for him because he got his wife to fall back on.

[Muznomer]

24 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

With kindness, does it not hurt her if she doesn’t know that he is sneaking around behind her back? Is ignorance truly bliss?

He’s playing the “if this is going to end, it’s going to have to be you that ends it” game… and you are playing the “if his wife is going to be hurt by this, it’s his responsibility card because he’s the one who started this and he’s the one who stays in contact” game…

And, what is your obligation here? By your comment, it would seem that you have adopted the “head in the sand” approach to this moral and ethical dilemma - “if I just never bring her up and we don’t ever talk about her, it’s fine.” I would kindly suggest that this is how you manage to make it ok with yourself that you have set up house with another woman’s problem - if I just avoid talking about her it will be fine. If she is hurt by his behavior, that is his fault. I would gently ask, as a woman and as a human being, what’s your responsibility here? If you are complicit in hurting this woman, if you drove the get away car after he robbed the bank, does that not also make you responsible? 
 

Yes it does hurt her, but I can’t be the one to tell her.

I have an obligation to try and remove myself from the situation. It won’t be easy and I already feel the pain of never seeing him again. 😢

27 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

With kindness, does it not hurt her if she doesn’t know that he is sneaking around behind her back? Is ignorance truly bliss?

He’s playing the “if this is going to end, it’s going to have to be you that ends it” game… and you are playing the “if his wife is going to be hurt by this, it’s his responsibility card because he’s the one who started this and he’s the one who stays in contact” game…

And, what is your obligation here? By your comment, it would seem that you have adopted the “head in the sand” approach to this moral and ethical dilemma - “if I just never bring her up and we don’t ever talk about her, it’s fine.” I would kindly suggest that this is how you manage to make it ok with yourself that you have set up house with another woman’s problem - if I just avoid talking about her it will be fine. If she is hurt by his behavior, that is his fault. I would gently ask, as a woman and as a human being, what’s your responsibility here? If you are complicit in hurting this woman, if you drove the get away car after he robbed the bank, does that not also make you responsible? 
 

No ignorance isn’t bliss - I understand we both have taken her choice away by not telling her before embarking on this “relationship” - to stay or leave. As well as her thinking that everything is well within her marriage. I am just as responsible for hurting her as him so please don’t think I have sailed through it - I tried to break it off and he was able to prevent it. 

[Muznomer]

1 hour ago, BaileyB said:

He will never walk away from you? Or from his wife? Or, he wants both?

I would advise you not to take this as a compliment - it’s not. ‘He “loves” me so much that he can never let me go.’ I’m sorry, but no. 

Please. If he loved you, he would do you the kindness of ending it. He would not ask you to compromise yourself in this way. If he loved his wife, he would not be betraying her in this way. The only person that he loves is himself - and that’s why he “can’t let you go.” Men who have affairs like this tend to be selfish and conflict avoidant men - that’s exactly why he can never end it - with either woman. The easy thing to do is to cheat. And the easy thing to do is to put the onus on you - if this is ever going to end, if either of you are ever going to do right by his wife, it’s going to have to be you. Please. 🙄

So accurate - thank you for responding 

[glows]

Do you have any other friends you can rely on or spend time with even if you don’t want to discuss these details?

I get the sense that you seem very isolated and this guy has become your world.

[Muznomer]

25 minutes ago, glows said:

Do you have any other friends you can rely on or spend time with even if you don’t want to discuss these details?

I get the sense that you seem very isolated and this guy has become your world.

Two  know how I feel about him and vice versa but not the extent of our involvement. The third guessed after she saw how he was with me - surprisingly she picked up at a time I was away from him rather than anything I had said or done - even though he tries to be super careful. Unfortunately things happen where I’ve not been able to speak to her but I know she would be an amazing support.

but yes you are right for the time we were together it was just me & him - he has very few friends there other than me - I am a person who makes friends very easily and have a large social circle which I effectively abandoned for him.

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, Muznomer said:

I tried to break it off and he was able to prevent it.

Respectfully, the decision to stay or go is yours - not his. 

The truth is, you are not ready to let go yet. And because of that, he was able to “prevent” you from making the decision. In a sense, you have just delayed the inevitable. You have put the hard conversation and the pain off for another day…

Kindly, you don’t sound firm in your conviction. I do believe that you know that it needs to end - both because it’s not the best decision for you to make and because staying is causing you pain. But, it sounds like you are still very much in the contemplation stage of change - which means, a message from him, the opportunity to meet in person, a hug and some kind words is likely to sway your decision… As I said, you do not have the courage of your conviction yet. You are still very much toiling with the idea…
 

51 minutes ago, glows said:

Do you have any other friends you can rely on or spend time with even if you don’t want to discuss these details?

I get the sense that you seem very isolated and this guy has become your world.

Or perhaps a counsellor, if you haven’t considered counselling already. 

 

Edited June 21, 2023 by BaileyB

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, Muznomer said:

Yes it does hurt her, but I can’t be the one to tell her.

I have an obligation to try and remove myself from the situation.

This is very true.

1 hour ago, Muznomer said:

It won’t be easy and I already feel the pain of never seeing him again. 😢

That pain is short term though. It will pass - broken hearts heal. 

Spending your life pining for a man who can never be yours - that‘a a different kind of pain. Forfeiting the opportunity to find a man who will love you, treat you with kindness and respect, and commit to share their life with you - that pain will last for a lifetime. The regret that you will feel if you stay and waste years of your life - time that you could have spent truly living - that pain you will carry for a lifetime. 

If you have other men who have pursued you and you have declined those opportunities because you have given your heart to this MM, that is very sad. You are obviously not available to date anyone else right now because your heart and your mind are obsessed with your MM. But, what a shame to have missed out on the opportunity to find true and lasting happiness because you have chosen a man who is not ultimately available to you. 



 

Edited June 21, 2023 by BaileyB

[NuevoYorko]

20 hours ago, Muznomer said:

 

im trying to understand why I love him so much…

Well, why not?  He treats you well and you lived like a couple for a time, didn't you?  

What's the logistical situation now, do you actually see each other in real life on a regular basis?  Do you live in different countries from  each other?

I know of an affair that lasted most of the peoples' lives.  This happened in a country where it's pretty common for a husband to have a mistress, and wives to have "lovers," for that matter.  The spouse(s) knew but it was kind of an "don't ask don't tell" deal.  The man, at least, had been a philanderer when younger.  He had children, the woman didn't. They were both married but ultimately the woman divorced.   I don't know if the affair was a reason, I tend to think that their marriage just wasn't connecting them that much.  

She was a writer and didn't really feel compelled to function in a traditional type of relationship, as far as i gathered.  Really not "the marrying kind."   The peripheral nature of the affair worked for her.   There was not pressure on the man to do anything differently from what he was doing.   Neither from his wife, or the mistress.  Honestly I think that his wife was okay with his absences.  Maybe she wasn't that crazy about the situation but also maybe she wasn't that crazy about him.  

This kept up until he died of cancer at the age of 72.  His mistress was 67 when he died.  As far as I know she is still single.  

 

 

 

[Muznomer]

35 minutes ago, NuevoYorko said:

Well, why not?  He treats you well and you lived like a couple for a time, didn't you?  

What's the logistical situation now, do you actually see each other in real life on a regular basis?  Do you live in different countries from  each other?

I know of an affair that lasted most of the peoples' lives.  This happened in a country where it's pretty common for a husband to have a mistress, and wives to have "lovers," for that matter.  The spouse(s) knew but it was kind of an "don't ask don't tell" deal.  The man, at least, had been a philanderer when younger.  He had children, the woman didn't. They were both married but ultimately the woman divorced.   I don't know if the affair was a reason, I tend to think that their marriage just wasn't connecting them that much.  

She was a writer and didn't really feel compelled to function in a traditional type of relationship, as far as i gathered.  Really not "the marrying kind."   The peripheral nature of the affair worked for her.   There was not pressure on the man to do anything differently from what he was doing.   Neither from his wife, or the mistress.  Honestly I think that his wife was okay with his absences.  Maybe she wasn't that crazy about the situation but also maybe she wasn't that crazy about him.  

This kept up until he died of cancer at the age of 72.  His mistress was 67 when he died.  As far as I know she is still single.  

 

 

 

Yes we did, for almost 2 years - other than when we travelled. He has been supportive of me during a very turbulent time and I have done the same for him.

I wish it was only about a physical relationship but it’s not just that - I did say to him this isn’t real -but he assured me - any time I have doubts he has that ability to reassure me. Maybe I’m just gullible 😬

I wish it had only been a physical relationship then it would be easier to walk away as the few times we have had disagreements it was over times I was going through something & he was at home so I didn’t let him know (illness etc). I told him you can’t have it both ways -NC when home and then change it up.

I am going back in a few months time followed by repeated visits - I know when I’m face to face my resistance is zero. 
As for being in other relationships- the thought of losing him makes me back off 😢

[BaileyB]

That’s the thing, you either have to accept that ‘it is what it is’ if you decide to continue, or you decide to end it. It’s not likely that he will magically become single and available.

I think the example above, while it does happen, is the minority. It‘s not easy to compartmentalize in this way - when attachments form, it’s quite natural to want “more.” In this care, I would say that it’s quite natural because she has apparently had more - as she has said that they have essentially lived together as a couple for a significant period of time. 

You should look up “split-self affair.” That’s pretty much what he is doing. You may find it enlightening. 

Edited June 21, 2023 by BaileyB

[BaileyB]

1 minute ago, Muznomer said:

As for being in other relationships- the thought of losing him makes me back off 😢

You don’t actually have him now though. 

[Wiseman2]

5 hours ago, Muznomer said:

 It’s a “shitty” situation we are all in but he wants us both - not fair on me I agree  

But you are free and don't have to be in the situation. 

[Muznomer]

3 hours ago, BaileyB said:

That’s the thing, you either have to accept that ‘it is what it is’ if you decide to continue, or you decide to end it. It’s not likely that he will magically become single and available.

I think the example above, while it does happen, is the minority. It‘s not easy to compartmentalize in this way - when attachments form, it’s quite natural to want “more.” In this care, I would say that it’s quite natural because she has apparently had more - as she has said that they have essentially lived together as a couple for a significant period of time. 

You should look up “split-self affair.” That’s pretty much what he is doing. You may find it enlightening. 

I just read up on it - just to put it into perspective- it was strange how he was able to compartmentalise so effectively yet I struggled 

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, Muznomer said:

 he was able to compartmentalise so effectively yet I struggled 

Because he had compartments. You and his wife. Unfortunately you had to deal more with "cognitive dissonance" (google it). It's when the truth is too painful to wrap your head around,  so you rationalize that it's ok. It attempts to make the unacceptable acceptable.

[glows]

6 hours ago, Muznomer said:

Two  know how I feel about him and vice versa but not the extent of our involvement. The third guessed after she saw how he was with me - surprisingly she picked up at a time I was away from him rather than anything I had said or done - even though he tries to be super careful. Unfortunately things happen where I’ve not been able to speak to her but I know she would be an amazing support.

but yes you are right for the time we were together it was just me & him - he has very few friends there other than me - I am a person who makes friends very easily and have a large social circle which I effectively abandoned for him.

I’m curious - why not drop this guy like a hot potato and spend time with your friends?

Tell yourself it isn’t working and hasn’t worked. It’s time to move on.

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, Muznomer said:

it was strange how he was able to compartmentalise so effectively yet I struggled 

It’s not strange at all.

You have the ultimate control here because this relationship works only as long as you decide to stay.

But, the reality is, there is a significant power balance in affairs and he directs this relationship because he is only available in certain ways and at certain times. Because he has another relationship, you talk/meet only when he is available. Because he is married to another woman, you are limited in that you can’t truly be together. 

He may well be the unavailable partner, but you are the person who has to deal with the limitations here. And you are the person who is not getting your needs met.

Sure, he may miss you and want to see you when he goes home but that feeling passes when he spends time with his family, reengages in work, goes about daily life. What’s more, when he wants to talk with you, he calls you.  As they say, he has his cake and he’s eating an ice cream sundae too. While you, like cake, but you can only eat ice cream on the days that he is available - 

So yeah, it’s easy for him to compartmentalize because wherever he goes, he is happy to be there. Whereas, when he leaves you to go home to his wife… where does that leave you? Feeling bereft and alone? Wondering why you can’t seem to compartmentalize as easily as he does? Wondering why you are having so many problems dealing with the fact that you have a part-time partner - and he doesn’t have the same problems (it’s because he has another partner waiting at home). 

Edited June 21, 2023 by BaileyB

[stillafool]

33 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

So yeah, it’s easy for him to compartmentalize because wherever he goes, he is happy to be there. Whereas, when he leaves you to go home to his wife… where does that leave you? Feeling bereft and alone? Wondering why you can’t seem to compartmentalize as easily as he does? Wondering why you are having so many problems dealing with the fact that you have a part-time partner - and he doesn’t have the same problems (it’s because he has another partner waiting at home).

All of Bailey's above post is true.  I just want to add that having you also makes his home life better.  The sex puts him in a good mood and he probably isn't in a mood to argue when he gets home, which pleases his family and takes the pressure off of her.

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, BaileyB said:

But, the reality is, there is a significant power imbalance in affairs

Sorry, that should say imbalance. 

[NuevoYorko]

6 hours ago, Muznomer said:

Yes we did, for almost 2 years - other than when we travelled. He has been supportive of me during a very turbulent time and I have done the same for him.😢

 Were you both stranded from going to your home country (or countries - do you both come from the same place?)  for two years?  That's the longest COVID restriction I've been aware of.

Anyway, you are kind of in a "sister wife" situation with his actual wife.  Unfortunately she is not a knowing participant, and that is the area of your situation that I personally would not be a party to.   As far as your role as a "part timer," you seem pretty much fine with that, so him having a wife is not an issue for you in that respect - correct?

In the marriage I mentioned above, the wife was aware that there was a long term mistress.  She was not happy about it, and was a very grumpy wife - which served to drive the guy towards the mistress.  But she did know that there was an "other woman."

Edited June 21, 2023 by NuevoYorko

[Muznomer]

30 minutes ago, NuevoYorko said:

 Were you both stranded from going to your home country (or countries - do you both come from the same place?)  for two years?  That's the longest COVID restriction I've been aware of.

Anyway, you are kind of in a "sister wife" situation with his actual wife.  Unfortunately she is not a knowing participant, and that is the area of your situation that I personally would not be a party to.   As far as your role as a "part timer," you seem pretty much fine with that, so him having a wife is not an issue for you in that respect - correct?

In the marriage I mentioned above, the wife was aware that there was a long term mistress.  She was not happy about it, and was a very grumpy wife - which served to drive the guy towards the mistress.  But she did know that there was an "other woman."

Yes we were stranded for over 18 months and the relationship started towards the end of the restrictions in place. Both are from same original country as well.

I wasn’t thinking straight at the beginning and I take full responsibility for that - I’ve always known it’s not going anywhere and tbh he was meant to leave the country and me behind but it hasn’t worked that way - instead I left. He doesn’t want to end it and I’m very surprised at this. 
His wife has no idea at all and i have (in my own way) compartmentalised all of this until now. Being away from one another has made things different - he is currently home and we are not communicating at all - I fell all the things Bailey has mentioned - the loneliness and sadness but it is all my own fault for being in this situation

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, stillafool said:

All of Bailey's above post is true.  I just want to add that having you also makes his home life better.  The sex puts him in a good mood and he probably isn't in a mood to argue when he gets home, which pleases his family and takes the pressure off of her.

That’s assuming that what he has said is true - that they are in a sexless marriage. Unfortunately, there is no other way to confirm this than to ask his wife. As we are all aware, married man lie about the fact that they are having or “not having” sex with their wife all the time… it is almost essential, in that very few women would have sex with a man who admitted to being happily married and enjoying a wonderful sex life with his wife. 

7 hours ago, Muznomer said:

I did say to him this isn’t real -but he assured me - any time I have doubts he has that ability to reassure me. Maybe I’m just gullible

Do you not find this kind of condescending and a little insulting Muznomer? “Whenever reality intrudes and pops our happy little bubble, I will just create another…”

No, you have a right to be unhappy - you are in an untenable situation. But, don’t worry, he will offer you a kiss and tell you that he loves you and pat you on the head before leaving to return to his wife… 

 

Edited June 21, 2023 by BaileyB

[Muznomer]

22 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

That’s assuming that what he has said is true - that they are in a sexless marriage. Unfortunately, there is no other way to confirm this than to ask his wife. As we are all aware, married man lie about the fact that they are having or “not having” sex with their wife all the time… it is almost essential, in that very few women would have sex with a man who admitted to being happily married and enjoying a wonderful sex life with his wife. 

Do you not find this kind of condescending and a little insulting Muznomer? “Whenever reality intrudes and pops our happy little bubble, I will just create another…”

No, you have a right to be unhappy - you are in an untenable situation. But, don’t worry, he will offer you a kiss and tell you that he loves you and pat you on the head before leaving to return to his wife… 

 

I deserved that 

[Wiseman2]

33 minutes ago, Muznomer said:

 - he is currently home and we are not communicating at all. the loneliness and sadness but it is all my own fault for being in this situation

Use this time to reflect and turn things around for yourself. You can't undo the past or buy back time, but you can definitely help yourself get out of whatever dark place you were in that led you to this unfortunate situation.

Please see a physician for an evaluation of your physical and mental health. Get some tests done. Discuss the ruminating, guilt and sadness.

Ask for a referral to a qualified therapist for ongoing support. A therapist may be able to help you unpack and sort out the underlying issues that led to this, which is what you need to address to get over it.

Try to realize being in a bad place led to this. Just like gambling, drinking, overeating etc. you'll need to do more than just get rid of the substance (in this case a married man) to live your life freely and happily again.

 

[BaileyB]

25 minutes ago, Muznomer said:

I deserved that 

I did not mean to be unkind. If you found that difficult to read, I am truly sorry. 

If you have found with this man the feeling of love, and respect, and support that you have previously not experienced in other relationships - why not use this experience as proof that it exists. Perhaps, that’s why this man has come into your life - to set you on the path to finding the true love of your life.

The simple truth is - there is no lasting happiness to be found with another woman’s husband.

Edited June 21, 2023 by BaileyB

[Ageless Wisdom23]

I am not seeing him divorce his wife.  Nor leave his family.  He may have issues in his marriage(health ones too)and finding you for Him, Was probably the best thing that has happened to him.  He can more or Less, Have his cake and eat it two.  He is surely cheating on her and cheating you out of having him to yours😔elf where he is yours alone.  if you like this Situation, Who am I to judge?  But she will always be Number One.  Until Death Do They Part.

Edited June 21, 2023 by Ageless Wisdom23