Pushed Her Away - Can't Come to Terms With it

[helloladies21]

I'm about to say some unflattering things about myself in this post. I predict some of you will say I'm being too hard on myself. Others will say I should feel bad about what I've done. It's probably some of both.

At the beginning of the year, I (44 year old male, divorced, no kids) was about to go into my busy season at work. I wasn't going to have a lot of time to go on dates, so I matched with a woman (45 year old female, divorced, 4 kids) on my last remaining dating profile and shut it down. I hate to sound so shallow and judge myself for it, but I was only just attracted enough to go on a date with her. She was very nice though, so I went on a second date with her. Then a third. We had sex. It was really good. Our sexual chemisty was off the charts. I've been with dozens and dozens of women and had some icredible sexual partners. On average, she was the best sex I've had. She immediately tried to get me into a relationship afterward. I told her I couldn't do that so quickly and I needed to get to know her better before I decided on something like that. But I agreed to not see other women while we were seeing each other. We got close very quickly over the next several weeks, but I knew I wasn't attracted enough to her to make her my permanent partner. But she was such a good person and so into me that I wanted to be good to her. I took her on nice dates, showered her with attention throughout the day. I liked making her feel good. I could tell she was falling for me. But I started to feel guilty, as if I were leading her on. I tried to break things off with her because I didn't want to waste her time anymore. I felt terrible about it and rekindled things a few days later. I won't lie, the amaznig sex played a huge part in it. Part of feels like if the sex wasn't so good, I wouldn't have gone back for more. Does that mean I was using her for sex? I haven't figured that one out yet.

One day, she told me a married couple from out of town were coming in to stay with her. She was more friends with the guy, but they were both close friends of hers. She wanted us to all go out for some dinner when they came in. We all met up and they were very nice.

I tried to break it off with her again a week or so later. Everything I felt for her wasn't enough to overcome how moderately attracted I was to her. She came back a few days later and basically said she was ok with us just having sex with each other while keeping it open. We kept seeing each other for a couple more weeks.

One night after she came over, we started talking about our previous partners. We talked about sex a lot and were very open with each other about that topic. She's bi-sexual, which I have no problem with (ex-wife was also bi), so the topic of previous female partners of hers came up. She then disclosed that she had slept with the female only of the married couple that came over a month prior about two years ago. I'm a mature adult and expect the women I date to have history, so that wasn't the issue, but the fact that she waited until a month after to tell me rubbed me the wrong way. She's a very honest person and I have no sense that something happened between them the weekend they came over. So we had a pretty huge two day argument about it. She basically said that there was no chance of anything happening between them, so she didn't think it was important enough for her to tell me. I told her that's my determination to make and if I would have known in advance, I would have viewed everything through a completely different lens. I even got her to admit that she would have wanted to know about my previous partners if I were still in contact with them. But she wouldn't take ownership of the fact that she did something wrong. She blocked me on social media and we haven't chatted since. That was three months ago. Looking back, I still think she should have told me. I would have told her if I were in a similar situation.

I've dated a few women since then. None of them with any long term potential. At best, they are a mild distraction. I can't stop thinking about this one that I kept pushing away. I don't know what's wrong with me. I ended up liking her a lot more than I expected to. I'm a little worried that I rejected someone who I could have been with in the long term. It's not sitting right with me.

Anyone have any thoughts about this?

[glows]

Just wondering here - did she remind you a lot of your ex-wife? And were you uncomfortable with that? What was the thought process really. I’m hearing is sex and being physically attracted but what else drew you to her?

Did you have different values? Not compatible in lifestyle or long term goals? Did she push too hard or was too eager beaver too early on? Was it a turn off? 

If so, that’s fine. Sometimes it just doesn’t work out. I got the impression she seemed way too into you and you were lukewarm from the start or just doing favours for her to keep her happy because she’s a “good person”. 

Regarding her ex female sex partner more often than is usually expected people mistake same sex pairings to not count which is misleading and a double standard. You weren’t comfortable with her completely at the start and throughout and that’s fine. You don’t have to keep beating yourself up about not wanting to pursue this. Trust yourself a bit more.

[ExpatInItaly]

This was not going to work out anyway, OP. 

I sense that your ego is bruised by her keeping this secret, but nothing more. You say you liked her more than you expected, but that still wasn't very much. Not enough to actually have a relationship with her. Your gut was telling you this wasn't the woman for you, and you turned out to be right in more ways than one. 

As such, I don't believe you pushed her away. You simply weren't interested enough. There's a big difference. 

[Wiseman2]

3 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

 She came back a few days later and basically said she was ok with us just having sex with each other while keeping it open. 

Unfortunately it doesn't seem like you're ready willing or able to date seriously at this time. You apparently were both ok with a casual situationship. 

In this case she doesn't owe you an explanation of past sexual history or activities.

Perhaps nebulous situationships aren't the solution for you either if you become jealous in them. Take a break from dating for a while. Try to figure out what type of situation suits you and your needs.

[helloladies21]

6 hours ago, glows said:

Just wondering here - did she remind you a lot of your ex-wife? And were you uncomfortable with that? What was the thought process really. I’m hearing is sex and being physically attracted but what else drew you to her?

Good question, but no. Both are very good people, but the are actually opposites in many ways. Ex-wife was passive, submissive, not mature. Recent girl is driven, intense, and mature. Maybe a little too mature. She had a bit of a wild past, but was in bed by 9:30 on most nights these days. She gave up drinking. Things weren't very spontaneous, which is a quality I look for. I.e., think running off to the bathroom to have sex on a night out. I need someone who has a little bit of that wild side.

I got over my ex-wife a long time ago. I never think about her, or any of my other exes, anymore.

6 hours ago, glows said:

Did you have different values? Not compatible in lifestyle or long term goals? Did she push too hard or was too eager beaver too early on? Was it a turn off? 

I would say just the opposite! Our morals and politics aligned perfectly. We were in tune on that level. She is a mom of 4 and they are older, so that isn't a problem. She said she didn't want to get married again, which is no problem for me, since I never gave any respect to the tradition of marriage. The fact that she wanted me so badly so early was not a turn off. It's a huge compliment. If I would have been into her, I would have went with it right from the start.

6 hours ago, glows said:

you were lukewarm from the start

I was lukewarm at the start. I started to like her more and get close to her as time went on. She had a lot of qualities that I look for. But deep down I felt like I could do better. Only in a couple of different categories: physical attraction and level of excitement.

I guess I feel guilty for keeping it going as long as I did and doing so for the wrong reasons. I didn't want to be lonely for a few months until I could have started dating again. So I kept her around. And she really cared about me. I don't like hurting people who develop that level of feelings for me. I should be more responsible than this. And then I started to like her more than I expected to, which makes me feel like I lost something that could have been good for me. She would have taken care of me and cared for me if I stayed with her.

I did end of really liking her, but I was already committed to a path of the both of us ending.

I guess a good question for me to ask myself: If she were to contact me today and apologize for not telling me about her history with this other girl, would I get into a relationship with her? Maybe. And if that's my answer, I'm not sold on her and it's best for me to stay out of touch and keep doing my best to move on.

[helloladies21]

4 hours ago, ExpatInItaly said:

I sense that your ego is bruised by her keeping this secret

I wouldn't say it was ego. I just don't think it was nice what she did. Not considerate. And hypocritical, since she would have wanted me to let her know under similar circumstances. I do believe she owes me an apology.

[helloladies21]

7 hours ago, glows said:

Regarding her ex female sex partner more often than is usually expected people mistake same sex pairings to not count which is misleading and a double standard.

Believe it or not, she actually takes this more serious than me. The way I found out about my ex-wife being bi was her kissing another girl on a drunk night out with a friend without me around. I had no problem with it, but this recent girl said she considers that cheating.

[Wiseman2]

2 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

. And hypocritical, since she would have wanted me to let her know under similar circumstances. I do believe she owes me an apology.

Why did you conceal that you were just stringing her along?  She doesn't have to explain her past sexual history to you at all. Unfortunately it seems like you're looking for random reasons to eliminate her. Sort of sour grapes or guilt for stringing her along.

[Alpacalia]

10 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

Looking back, I still think she should have told me. I would have told her if I were in a similar situation.

I'm not even sure why you might think this is a requirement. 

This may be a prime example of why you don't ask questions that you don't want the answers to. 

Opening up a can of worms has brought to light an issue for the two of you. You could have made it clear that you don't want to know the details of her past sexual partners, but that you do very much appreciate her providing you with a heads up in the future. Though it was only a one-night stand with another woman, the fact remains that they shared an intimate experience and this is what is contentious for you.

Honestly, I think it is understandable that you felt confused and a bit guilty in this situation. It is never easy to reject someone and it can be even harder when you really care about them and feel a connection. That said, you have to do what is best for you and it sounds like you made the right decision in not pursuing a relationship with her if you were not 100% sure.

As for her not telling you about her past relationship with the married couple, it seems like it was an oversight on her part and not something malicious. It is unfortunate that something small like this caused you to part ways, and I can understand how that might sting a bit.

It's for the best, as you were planning on ending it anyway. She just beat you to the punch.

Edited June 24, 2023 by Alpacalia

[glows]

3 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

If she were to contact me today and apologize for not telling me about her history with this other girl, would I get into a relationship with her? Maybe. And if that's my answer, I'm not sold on her and it's best for me to stay out of touch and keep doing my best to move on.

Agreed. For whatever reason she’s not checking off all your boxes even the subconscious ones. I have no clue why you’re back on forth on this and can only chalk it up to missing the feeling of someone into you. 

Think of this as fond memories with someone you liked a lot. It happens. End story, move on. You have some of that sometimes over time - passionate romances but no cigar. No harm in reminiscing but this was not a match. 

[ShyViolet]

11 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

I'm a little worried that I rejected someone who I could have been with in the long term.

Everything you've said prior to this contradicts this.  You were not that attracted to her, you felt lukewarm about her from the start, you felt that you could do better.  You tried to break up with her multiple times because you knew it wasn't fair to her that you weren't that into her and didn't want the level of relationship that she wanted.  That is not the way someone feels when there is potential for being together for the long term.  You are just saying that because you feel bad, but it's not how you truly felt.  And as for her, it sounds like she may have very low self-esteem to keep running back to someone who has tried to break up with her multiple times, who has told her they aren't interested in a relationship with her.

Wasting any more of her time would not have been the right thing to do.  If you had continued to see her, this cycle would have continued.... of you second guessing the whole thing because you are not that attracted to her, and trying to break it off repeatedly.  

[helloladies21]

1 hour ago, Wiseman2 said:

Why did you conceal that you were just stringing her along?

That's quite a leap. Was I supposed to know where things were going on our first date? I didn't know. Maybe things about her personality could have pushed me over the top and made me want to get into a relationship with her. And my feelings for her did progress as we continued to date. Just not to the point of being in a relationship.

1 hour ago, Wiseman2 said:

She doesn't have to explain her past sexual history to you at all.

She essentially admitted that she would have wanted to know if I put her in a similar situation. She can't be a hypocrite.

[helloladies21]

1 hour ago, Alpacalia said:

I'm not even sure why you might think this is a requirement.

I asked her in what situations would she have wanted to know. She said if I "were having a drink alone with someone who I dated and hadn't seen in a while." Or if I/we "were in a group of friends and there had been some sort of relationship between me and someone else in the group." How is the second situation any different than what actually happened? She didn't see them as similar, but I see no difference.

1 hour ago, Alpacalia said:

This may be a prime example of why you don't ask questions that you don't want the answers to. 

I actually didn't ask. It was in the flow of conversation. And I have no problem talking about things like this. I'm very open sexually and can't get upset about things that happened before she even met me. It's not the sexual act that bothers me. It's the fact that she didn't deem this important enough to tell me prior to meeting them. And then she refused to take ownership of it and apologize. If she would have said "I was wrong. I'm sorry." I would have completely dropped the issue. But she is most likely too stubborn to admit it.

1 hour ago, Alpacalia said:

As for her not telling you about her past relationship with the married couple, it seems like it was an oversight on her part and not something malicious. It is unfortunate that something small like this caused you to part ways, and I can understand how that might sting a bit.

I agree she didn't do it on purpose. I told her multiple times I thought that. And it is too bad that something small like this caused us to stop talking. I really did enjoy getting to know her.

Thank you for your thoughtful post.

[ExpatInItaly]

3 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

I wouldn't say it was ego. I just don't think it was nice what she did. Not considerate. 

The reason I say it bruised your ego is because you didn't seem to question ending it with her until she told you she had had sex with someone else. 

3 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

I do believe she owes me an apology.

Are you also planning to apologize for this? Because this wasn't very nice, either. Not considerate:

3 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

I didn't want to be lonely for a few months until I could have started dating again. So I kept her around.

 

[helloladies21]

39 minutes ago, glows said:

I have no clue why you’re back on forth on this

I don't even think I'm back and forth on it. I just miss her a lot. But that's the point: I don't know what that means. Did I do what I had to do by breaking it off or did I miss out on something that could have been right for me? I haven't come to terms with that.

Our conversations were very easy and flirty. I was never bored taking to her. And we were always in a race to get each others' clothes off when we saw each other. She's smart, ethical, sexually adventurous, and she cared about me so much. She had fallen for me.

Do I think I can do better than her? In some ways yes; in some ways no.

[helloladies21]

36 minutes ago, ShyViolet said:

And as for her, it sounds like she may have very low self-esteem to keep running back to someone who has tried to break up with her multiple times, who has told her they aren't interested in a relationship with her.

I don't know if I ever sensed that from her. I think it's as simple as she had fallen hard for me. Maybe she thought she could convince me into being with her. Or maybe the sex was so good for her too that she couldn't let go of that. It's hard to let go of someone you care about. I'm feeling that first hand.

I agree with everything else in your post. Good job.

[helloladies21]

23 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Are you also planning to apologize for this? Because this wasn't very nice, either. Not considerate:

4 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

I didn't want to be lonely for a few months until I could have started dating again. So I kept her around.

I said above I should be more responsible than this. But it wasn't like this the entire time. My feelings for her grew as I continued to see her.

But all of this is theoretical. I don't think I'll hear from her again and I'm not reaching out to her (if that's even possible she may have blocked me in her phone as well). We should stay out of touch and move on.

[Els]

It sounds like you only wanted her once you couldn't have her.

I don't even really understand what the purpose of this post is. You didn't even want a relationship with her and you were happy to string her along for your selfish gain, so how is it a big deal that she didn't tell you about sex that she had 2 years ago? She doesn't owe you that information if you're not in a relationship, and frankly your priorities are absolutely backwards. She was right to block you, and good on her for doing that. IMO she should have done it earlier, but better now than later.

 

Edited June 24, 2023 by Els

[helloladies21]

1 hour ago, Els said:

so how is it a big deal that she didn't tell you about sex that she had 2 years ago?

Because she wanted me to meet these people and set up an evening for us to meet and get to know each other. It wasn't a chance meeting. And she said she would have wanted to know in similar situations. Is she wrong too? I would have felt the need to tell her if I were in her shoes. I would have told her. Even though we weren't in a relationship at that time, we were exclusively dating each other. And my feelings had progressed beyond just sex by then. That's how it started for me, but not how it ended.

I'm writing this post to come to terms with things. To get a better understanding of why this hurts. How I can get over it and even if that's the right thing to do. To be prepared in case she reaches out to me. It's not as simple as getting dumped by a girl that I didn't care about and I was using for sex. That doesn't accurately state the facts of what happened. If it did, this thread would not exist.

I said up front that some of you would be mad at me. I expected this.

[glows]

No one is mad at you. We don’t even know you. You didn’t like she wasn’t as upfront so were torn. She got frustrated and argued with you and you stood your ground. You’re both just not compatible. For all you know she could have been on the fence about you and your delivery or the way the “two day argument” went down pushed her in the other direction or your tone may have shocked her. We don’t know exactly what was said but a two day argument pretty much says it all.

Frankly as much as you both may have developed something emotional and special it wasn’t enough to sustain anything long term. I sincerely doubt this is the only issue she had for her to end it so abruptly and then block you. I’m also thinking about what her family and close friends must be advising her - get rid of this guy who’s tried to break up with you and hurt you so many times. As you said it’s best to move on. 

You’re upset about the disclosure issue but that’s really not the point. You’re not compatible and hurt her already too many times. 

[Wiseman2]

15 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

  She blocked me on social media and we haven't chatted since. That was three months ago.

I've dated a few women since then. . At best, they are a mild distraction.

It's doubtful you'll hear from her. But at least you're dating again. Perhaps don't probe women for their past sexual history because you seem to have difficulty handling it, whether they're just a "distraction" or someone you care about.

[MsJayne]

8 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

But deep down I felt like I could do better.

To me it sounds like this is the actual crux of the problem. I'd like a dollar for every male who pretends to be genuinely interested in a woman because the sex is good but who avoids committing because he's so certain that Cindy Crawford's waiting for him just around life's next corner.  I'll avoid labelling that behaviour as it may cause offence. I'm confused about why your woman should be expected to reveal her past sex life to you, you're not in an actual relationship so why do you think she owed you this? Even if you were in a relationship, she still wouldn't have an obligation to disclose her past sex life because it's her business. You feel like you could do better, (translation, you think she's not good enough for you), so you avoid commitment, yet you appear to be jealous of a past lover. This is incongruous behaviour and must be very confusing for her. The thing you seem to be most upset about is that she blocked you, effectively making her the one that ended it, so maybe that's the real reason you're hurting rather than that you actually had feelings for her. If I was you I would have a think about respect, values, and compatibility. 

Edited June 24, 2023 by MsJayne
Left something out.

[Alpacalia]

4 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

I actually didn't ask. It was in the flow of conversation. And I have no problem talking about things like this. I'm very open sexually and can't get upset about things that happened before she even met me. It's not the sexual act that bothers me. It's the fact that she didn't deem this important enough to tell me prior to meeting them. And then she refused to take ownership of it and apologize. If she would have said "I was wrong. I'm sorry." I would have completely dropped the issue. But she is most likely too stubborn to admit it.

Hmm.

If the woman you were dating had been more open and transparent about her past experiences with this woman sooner, would it have changed how you felt? Sure, perhaps knowing the full truth would have helped you to be better informed. You could have made a more informed decision with full knowledge of the situation.

I support your desire to understand why you're feeling this way and think it's worth exploring self-reflection on why this experience might be making you feel inadequate. I'm also curious how your perspective might shift if you knew it was a man instead of a woman that she had an intimate past experience with.

In any event.

Unfortunately you can't control how a partner discloses their past. Unless you have a specific agreement or ask the right questions, it's difficult to know what someone may or may not have done in the past. So, it's much better to focus on how you can better understand and manage your insecurities and questions about any potential partner than dwell on the past. 

It's all about taking steps to strengthen your confidence and assurance that you can handle whatever comes up when you plan to be in a relationship.

Edited June 24, 2023 by Alpacalia

[basil67]

4 hours ago, helloladies21 said:

I agree she didn't do it on purpose. I told her multiple times I thought that. And it is too bad that something small like this caused us to stop talking. I really did enjoy getting to know her.

If you agree that she didn't do it on purpose...and that it's something small, why do you want an apology?  And given that this was nothing more than her not being able to read your mind, what exactly did you want her to apologise for?   Also, do you realise that now you are no longer a thing, she no longer owes you an apology?   

Lastly, the way you describe the thing you had with her, you sound very much attracted.  I can't get my head around you speaking of all the great sex, good fun and commonalities but saying there's no attraction. 

[helloladies21]

1 hour ago, glows said:

No one is mad at you. We don’t even know you. You didn’t like she wasn’t as upfront so were torn. She got frustrated and argued with you and you stood your ground. You’re both just not compatible. For all you know she could have been on the fence about you and your delivery or the way the “two day argument” went down pushed her in the other direction or your tone may have shocked her. We don’t know exactly what was said but a two day argument pretty much says it all.

Frankly as much as you both may have developed something emotional and special it wasn’t enough to sustain anything long term. I sincerely doubt this is the only issue she had for her to end it so abruptly and then block you. I’m also thinking about what her family and close friends must be advising her - get rid of this guy who’s tried to break up with you and hurt you so many times. As you said it’s best to move on. 

You’re upset about the disclosure issue but that’s really not the point. You’re not compatible and hurt her already too many times. 

I was referring to the previous poster, not you. Not saying that I might not deserve it from some people. It's a possibility I have to be open to if I am to consider all advice equally.

I'm sure it was a culmination of all the issues I caused for her. A person can get rejected only so many times. And she has a therapist, who, I am certain, told her to cut contact with me. I'm not so arrogant to say it's bad advice.

She had some great qualities, but I know there's a better fit for me out there. I have to come to terms with this and move on.