I'm so uncomfortable about his ex-gf

[ExpandPalace]

I need help putting this into perspective.

I've been dating someone for about six months. We have such a fantastic connection and I love hanging out with him. But there's a big but and that's his ex.

They were together something like 12 years and still live together for financial reasons. She's moving out in about two months. They have separate bedrooms and I definitely believe and understand that the romantic part of their relationship is over. They had already gradually ended up as just roommates years before they split up. In other words, they were in a loveless, sexless relationship for years before they broke up.

They have remained what they both describe as the best of friends, but their relationship is a lot like a sibling rivalry and I can't stand it. It's a few things.

First, he used to bring her up in conversation constantly. It was never in a way where I thought he had feelings for her. Often he was complaining about her. I told him I was uncomfortable with it and he explained that this is their dynamic. They give each other "sh*t" all the time (his words). They make fun of each other. Sometimes it was just recounting the past. If he brought me somewhere he had been with her, he told me about when they were there, which really hurt me. I explained to him how much it bothered me and he stopped.

A few months ago, I went to their apartment and met her for the first time. I was, quite honestly, dumbfounded and revolted by her behaviour. She was kind to me, but then at one point she scoffed at him, rolled her eyes, made a denigrating comment about something she doesn't like about him and then turned to me saying something like, "16 years of putting up with this". I felt so angry with her, but kept it to myself.

First, how disrespectful to him. Second, how inconsiderate to both of us. Here I am trying to build a healthy relationship with him and it almost seemed like she was trying to show me his negatives to deter me. I would not tolerate my ex sabotaging things with the new person I'm dating. He shrugged it off like it was same old because they've had that dynamic for so long, it doesn't phase him.

Right now he's on holiday in his birth country. He posted a picture of food and she commented something like, "You always b****ed at me for wanting to eat that" or something similar. We're adults in our forties and I feel like I'm in a twenty-something, immature social media mess. I was so surprised that she aired out old relationship grievances publicly on his social media, especially knowing that I'm in the picture and follow his account. Who does that?! Air out dirty laundry from a relationship that's been over for years, knowing he's dating someone new? I couldn't imagine ever doing that as someone's ex. I blocked her because I have no interest in having any part in their bickering. I find it so tactless and immature.

I'm turned off by the whole thing and told him I just want to be friends, but he keeps telling me how much I mean to him and he wants to talk it through. I haven't mentioned all of the wonderful things (there are many, many of them) for the purpose of keeping this brief, so I know this sounds skewed. He's just such a fabulous person and treats me so well. But I want nothing to do with his ex and I don't want to hear about her anymore. I feel like I sound jealous and I'm truly not. Quite honestly, I feel disgusted by her behaviour and how she treats him.

Edited August 9, 2023 by ExpandPalace
Typo

[Wiseman2]

Sorry this is happening. Agree it was disrespectful to bring you into their apt while she's living there. Why can't he move out? That's a huge red flag.

You've been dating 6 mos and that's enough time to decide if cutting your losses is the best course of action. 

[stillafool]

Well it seems you only have to put up with this for 2 more months.  In that time, just don't go over there or be in her company.  I find it highly disrespectful that you've told your bf you don't want to hear about her and he continues bringing her up.  I think the problem is him rather than her.  He should have put boundaries between the two of them a long time ago.  If he can't do that even after he moves she will still be in his life.  If this still doesn't work for you then just break up.  You cannot be his friend because doing so will put you back in her company.  She doesn't sound like she's going anywhere.

[ExpandPalace]

21 minutes ago, stillafool said:

I find it highly disrespectful that you've told your bf you don't want to hear about her and he continues bringing her up.

I just want to correct this one thing. He actually immediately stopped mentioning her once I brought it to his attention. He has always heard and respected my needs. I don't think he realized just how much he talked about her because, to him, she's like an old fixture. She's like family and he forgets she's an ex. It was careless of him, but he definitely stopped.

[ExpandPalace]

24 minutes ago, stillafool said:

Well it seems you only have to put up with this for 2 more months.  In that time, just don't go over there or be in her company.

I've only been the one time and made it clear I wouldn't go back. While I agree that their living together will end in two months, it doesn't solve the rest of it. They're still friends and she's still on his social media. She still sees his family and remains a part of his family. They still talk about her, etc.. Her moving out won't be the thing that helps them properly define their friendship.

[stillafool]

3 minutes ago, ExpandPalace said:

I've only been the one time and made it clear I wouldn't go back. While I agree that their living together will end in two months, it doesn't solve the rest of it. They're still friends and she's still on his social media. She still sees his family and remains a part of his family. They still talk about her, etc.. Her moving out won't be the thing that helps them properly define their friendship.

Well it looks like she's going to be around and isn't going anywhere.  So you have 2 choices, either find a way to get along with her or break up with your bf.   You cannot dial a relationship back to friends, that never works out.

[ExpatInItaly]

2 hours ago, ExpandPalace said:

They were together something like 12 years and still live together for financial reasons

Oh, honey, no. You should never have started dating him. That should have sent you runnning, rather than looking for ways to justify to yourself to keep going. 

He's not ready for another relationship. These two are still way too tied up in each other's lives and despite the claims of living as roommates, it's very clear that there is a ton of unfinished emotional business between them. 

1 hour ago, ExpandPalace said:

I don't think he realized just how much he talked about her because, to him, she's like an old fixture. She's like family and he forgets she's an ex

Oh, come on, OP. This isn't true and you know it. He knows and has always known perfectly well that she's an ex. The problem is that they have not properly processed the break-up and aren't in the emotional headspace to date anyone else yet. They broke up, yes, but hardly. They haven't truly moved on from each other and they won't do so until they spend plenty of time apart and get used to the idea that they aren't in each others' lives like that anymore. Do you really want to have a front-row seat to his healing when it finally hits him that it's over after they move out? You are going to get hurt, I can nearly assure you of that. 

Personally? There is no way I would continue dating him. He is on the rebound and there are signs everywhere that they have not let go of each other. 

[MicheleT]

Agree with ExpatInItaly 100%!  I almost threw up reading the OP — everything about their relationship is cringeworthy.  Have a clean breakup with the guy: no more blurring boundaries like what this pair have been doing!

You can tell the dude to look you up after a year when he’s 100% ready and you’re still available then.

[Gaeta]

I'm 100% in with @ExpatInItaly!  As well

Still living with his ex for financial reasons is your cue to move to next! I would never have dated this man.

It's not because they have seperate bedrooms that this relationship is over, as dysfunctional as it is, this relationship is not over.

Before this man is ready to be in a new relationship he needs to live on his own and cut with this past. 

He's not the only nice man on earth! Go find someone that got his life together!

Edited August 9, 2023 by Gaeta

[Calmandfocused]

54 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Oh, honey, no. You should never have started dating him. That should have sent you runnning, rather than looking for ways to justify to yourself to keep going. 

He's not ready for another relationship. These two are still way too tied up in each other's lives and despite the claims of living as roommates, it's very clear that there is a ton of unfinished emotional business between them. 

Oh, come on, OP. This isn't true and you know it. He knows and has always known perfectly well that she's an ex. The problem is that they have not properly processed the break-up and aren't in the emotional headspace to date anyone else yet. They broke up, yes, but hardly. They haven't truly moved on from each other and they won't do so until they spend plenty of time apart and get used to the idea that they aren't in each others' lives like that anymore. Do you really want to have a front-row seat to his healing when it finally hits him that it's over after they move out? You are going to get hurt, I can nearly assure you of that. 

Personally? There is no way I would continue dating him. He is on the rebound and there are signs everywhere that they have not let go of each other. 

Agree @ExpatInItaly

Abort mission Op. 

You need to ask yourself some tough questions including why you are voluntarily putting yourself in this chaotic mess. 
 

Your job is to make wise choices for yourself. This is not a wise choice. Instead you are choosing to hurt yourself. Not good. 

Red flag number 1 - living with the ex (unavailable for a relationship with you) 

Red Flag number 2- Talking about/ expressions of anger re: ex (unavailable for a relationship with you) 

Red Flag number 3 - everything in his life still revolves around the ex (unavailable for a relationship with you) 

He is no position to date or commit to a relationship with you. 

No one with healthy self esteem would tolerate this situation. I’m gobsmacked that you are … willingly. 

You’re kidding yourself if you believe this could ever work. 

 

[Els]

3 hours ago, ExpandPalace said:

I've been dating someone for about six months. We have such a fantastic connection and I love hanging out with him. But there's a big but and that's his ex.

They were together something like 12 years and still live together for financial reasons. She's moving out in about two months.

I think you've got it all wrong, the "big but" here isn't his ex, but rather the fact that he is in no way, shape, or form ready to be dating at this time. No sane, decent person who has actually moved on from their ex will try to date while still living with their ex. If you can't afford to move out, then sure, by all means stay temporarily, but don't date until you've succeeded in moving out. That's just disrespectful to anyone you date.

You need to seriously reconsider staying in this. I hate to say it, but it really just sounds like you're a rebound.

Edited August 9, 2023 by Els

[Stret]

OP, there are no solid rules and you might not be a rebound as someone suggested, especially because there was nothing between them for years. I can bring in another perspective - he sounds like a good guy. He stopped doing what you told him upsets you. He treats you well. He has nothing with his ex. She has nothing for him. He brought her up because a major part of his life for most of his adult life was tied to her, and all his memories of places he visited and food he ate are probably tied to her. He can't change this. If there is a nice place and he cannot bring you there because he was there with his ex in his past, you're going to limit your life and make him feel like he's walking on egg shelves. 

I stayed living with my ex while he had a new gf. There was nothing between us and we were just friends. If I said to his gf what your bf's ex told you when you visited, it would have been for the reason to show you that I am so over him and he was all yours, that there is nothing to worry about - more or less, "look at this idiot, I don't want him, there is nothing here". 

Seriously, if to lighten up a bit, you would see there is nothing much to worry about here. The dynamics between them have developed when they were in their 20s and those dynamics stay. So that's why it looks immature. You can develop different dynamics with him. 
I see her comment on social media as funny, nothing more, nothing less. 

I think you might just be jealous of his past, no matter what, no matter who. Try and be honest with yourself, and try and lighten up a bit - there is nothing that is a red flag here. The guy had a past, and situation is such that he still lives with her. Happens to many couples. He couldn't actually decide when he will meet you and he met you at an imperfect time. Would you rather he rejected you because he still lives with his ex and wants to "respect" you? No, you'd probably take it as a rejection and a silly dishonest excuse meant to let you down easy. 
Oh and BTW, my ex is still with the girl he met 20 years ago when I still lived with him. We still meet sometimes for a coffee and to catch up. I ask about his family, he asks about mine, we joke, we talk, there is nothing there. Just friends. So try and look at it from another perspective and don't ruin a good thing with being overly rigid and seeing the worst in everything. 

 

Edited August 9, 2023 by Stret
adding one more thing

[Ami1uwant]

4 hours ago, ExpandPalace said:

I just want to correct this one thing. He actually immediately stopped mentioning her once I brought it to his attention. He has always heard and respected my needs. I don't think he realized just how much he talked about her because, to him, she's like an old fixture. She's like family and he forgets she's an ex. It was careless of him, but he definitely stopped.

To be fair… they have known each other how long?  Do they have kids together?  Woth h8m living in the same place…she going to come up. It’s unavoidable.

[smackie9]

Sorry but not your place to say anything in what she says to him. He has made the decision to let her stay,  He knows she's horrible to him, so he doesn't need to be told. He is handling it the way he wants.  He doesn't need you in there putting in your opinion. It will only make this situation worse. 

Just back off, stay pleasant, it will soon be over. Things will be great once she's moved out. If it were me I wouldn't even go over there or not even talk about it. 

Edited August 9, 2023 by smackie9

[FMW]

You have bad feelings about his living situation and the fact that his natural instinct is to frequently talk about his ex.  I think that's really all you need to think about.  It doesn't matter if it can all be reasoned out to sound ok by anyone or if some see it as a collection of red flags.  It's not ok with you.  Don't second guess yourself.  You don't want to be dealing with these feelings going forward, and I don't see how you get past those feelings any time soon without immediate and significant changes (which doesn't seem to be a reasonable expectation).  

If your instinct is to get out of the situation, then that's exactly what you should do.  I think you can be friendly if you run into each other, but I don't see being friends in the true sense of the word as a viable option.

[MsJayne]

I think there's more to the end of their relationship than just outgrowing each other. Re: her derisive comments about him, she has a secret axe to grind with him, very possibly that she stuck around for twelve years and he never married her or wanted kids. I'd ask him how he intends to manage the friendship once she's moved out. I've been on both ends, dated someone whose ex-wife was still doing his washing and coming 'round for Sunday lunch 🙄, and also had an ex I'm close friends with interfere with my new relationships by overstating our friendship and making new guys feel insignificant. I'd hold my horses on dumping him because of this as it's quite possible that the reason she's moving out is because she sees she's been replaced and is actually making way for you. Their friendship will cool off a bit after she moves, probably within two years they'll only be calling each other on birthdays and at Christmas, and then eventually not even that. What you're experiencing is normal, and I know you're not jealous, because if anyone's jealous it's her, and that's why she's using derisive comments about him to try and stake what little claim she has left, the old "I know him better than you do" statements. If you like this guy and he treats you well, and you see a potential future, hang in there.

[ExpandPalace]

58 minutes ago, smackie9 said:

Sorry but not your place to say anything in what she says to him. He has made the decision to let her stay,  He knows she's horrible to him, so he doesn't need to be told. He is handling it the way he wants.  He doesn't need you in there putting in your opinion. It will only make this situation worse. 

Just back off, stay pleasant, it will soon be over. Things will be great once she's moved out. If it were me I wouldn't even go over there or not even talk about it. 

It's my place to say something if I'm dating him and he talks about his ex on our dates. You've misread my post if you think I "put in my opinion". I stated in my post that I feel uncomfortable and that's absolutely my prerogative to feel. They brought me into their dynamic. Him by talking about her, her by making comments about him to me and by posting stuff publicly on social media. And if they bring me into their situation, I become one part of it and, therefore have feelings about it.

Edited August 9, 2023 by ExpandPalace

[shellzbellz83]

1 hour ago, ExpandPalace said:

It's my place to say something if I'm dating him and he talks about his ex on our dates. You've misread my post if you think I "put in my opinion". I stated in my post that I feel uncomfortable and that's absolutely my prerogative to feel. They brought me into their dynamic. Him by talking about her, her by making comments about him to me and by posting stuff publicly on social media. And if they bring me into their situation, I become one part of it and, therefore have feelings about it.

The poster said it isn't your place to say anything about how the ex speaks to HIM, and I agree. If he's fine with her denigrating him in your presence, ribbing him on social media, etc. -- there's no point in you getting worked up over it. It's up to him to establish healthy boundaries with her, but he has to want to do that for himself. I agree with everyone else upthread who has suggested these two remain emotionally entangled.

[ExpandPalace]

13 minutes ago, shellzbellz83 said:

The poster said it isn't your place to say anything about how the ex speaks to HIM, and I agree. If he's fine with her denigrating him in your presence, ribbing him on social media, etc. -- there's no point in you getting worked up over it. It's up to him to establish healthy boundaries with her, but he has to want to do that for himself. I agree with everyone else upthread who has suggested these two remain emotionally entangled.

The title of my post is about feeling uncomfortable. My feelings are mine to have. The whole point of my post is to process and sort through my feelings about the situation, which involves her. Whether or not I voice it to either of them is irrelevant. This is about me, how I feel, and the decision I'm ultimately going to make about it. I didn't ask if I should say something. It's besides the point. The point is I feel repulsed by it and I'm trying to decide whether it's something to work through or a significant enough reason to bail.
 

I don't like being around bickering. It's incredibly upsetting to me. I don't like eye rolling, scoffing, dismissive comments, or disrespect. I want nothing to do with it in my life and I'm allowed to feel that way. I don't want to be involved in their disrespectful dynamic. I also don't want to repeat it with him. I worry it's what he wants in his life. I worry he is shutting me out because he thinks her disrespect is all he's worth. I think he's worth more, but that's up to him to work through. I felt disgusted watching them because he just shrugged it off and accepted it. I find it difficult to watch someone I care for being treated like that. It's especially difficult because I do bite my tongue. I didn't say anything and it has been eating away at me.

All of that is what I'm attempting to process. I don't need opinions about what's my business or not my business. I'm dating him and they exposed me to their dynamic and lack of resolution. Therefore, I'm involved and have feelings about it. Valid feelings.

[stillafool]

1 hour ago, ExpandPalace said:

And if they bring me into their situation, I become one part of it and, therefore have feelings about it.

Well since their relationship upsets you why don't you just bough out for yourself?  Again, it's him that can't stand up to her.  It's really not your place to get involved except to tell him you don't like the way she talks about him and you don't want to go back over to their place again while she's still living there..

[Wiseman2]

If you feel like a third wheel in their contentious relationship, it's time to reflect if you can tolerate this. While he's away take some time for yourself to see how you feel about all these red flags.

[Ageless Wisdom23]

It has only been 6 months so you are the newbie on the "Taking its Toll" on his totem pole.  I don't blame you one bit for being disgusted and mad.  Just the whole Idea she is still residing under the same roof with him for "Financial Reasons" is something  he should have considered before taking on so Quick------Another girl in his life.  It is not fair to you.  Sure, They have His and Her History but this is going way overboard.  I would not be surprised that in two Months, This little slick chick is still there.   Being Territorial.  That is what I see with her.  And he is going along with it.  Do I feel there are feelings left?   Sure.  I sure do after 12 years.  I also think if they would go tomorrow to a Counselor to see what went Wrong, They might even go back together again.  I think I would keep more to Myself until she is out of the house.  However, I am not seeing her actually pack one bag but instead Here------Continue to be a  Real Bag.  I feel it is Not over just yet between them.  I also feel that even if she would move to the other side of the World, She is never going to Be------Gone.Don't get hurt.  Hugggggs.😒

Edited August 9, 2023 by Ageless Wisdom23

[BrinnM]

First of all - if you’re all in your forties, what are these financial issues all about that prevent them from moving? That would be my first issue. It doesn’t sound like they’re having children together, and they’re not in their twenties anymore so what’s the financial issue and what’s the deal with the 2-month timeline? What will be different in 2 months?

Apart from that, I think your issue is with him not with her. You can’t control her, but you can ask him to stop certain behaviors, which you did. Good for you!

And about her: To me it seems like she’s trying to point it out to you over and over that they have a history together, that they’re still very much present in one another’s life, and that she is and will be a staple in his life, while you’re just the “new” addition at this point. She’s marking her territory, not necessarily because she wants him back, but because she wants to remain somewhat relevant in his life. It’s very odd that she would keep in touch with his family. That’s also a “marking her territory” thing. No normal person after a separation (esp if they weren’t married and if they don’t have kids together) would make a point in remaining in an ex-partner’s family of origin. There’s just no point. Same applies to social media comments. She wants to show the world and him that she’s still relevant or important somehow. She might not be a bad person per se, but maybe she has some insecurities. I’m sure if she finds a new partner this will stop pretty quickly. I understand why you blocked her, but I wouldn’t have done that. It looks petty and she probably got the impression that her attitude has had some effect on you. And that’s probably exactly what she wanted to accomplish. But again, I understand why you did it and how her snarky comments must have annoyed you.

It seems like you and your guy have a pretty good communication basis so I would just ask him to please make sure that her family limits or ceases contact with her. That’s the least he can do. Once he has moved out, he should cease contact as well, if possible. 

[shellzbellz83]

33 minutes ago, ExpandPalace said:

I don't like being around bickering. It's incredibly upsetting to me. I don't like eye rolling, scoffing, dismissive comments, or disrespect. I want nothing to do with it in my life and I'm allowed to feel that way.

Sure, you are allowed to feel this way. But if you feel this way and stay, you can't complain about it. You are 100% in control of whether you allow these behaviors to infiltrate your life.

[ExpandPalace]

A situation can have issues without the issues being in their extreme form. People seem to love making assumptions, which is a human trait I'll never fully understand. Assumptions based on incomplete information don't help situations.

They're not getting back together. I feel very certain about that. She's not a vindictive "slick chick" hiding ulterior motives. It's quite possible for two people to have dysfunctional patterns with other without there being extra layers of sinister motives.

She's sick of living with him. He drives her nuts, from everything they've said. She's not harbouring secret resentments about children or marriage. Neither of them believes in the institute of marriage (neither do I) and she's infertile. She's not clamouring to get back together with him. If she doesn't move out in two months, it will be for logistical reasons. We live in an outrageously expensive city and she can't afford their apartment alone. They made a strategic decision to roommate with each other because finding good roommates is hit or miss. I've had horrible roommate experiences so I understand. They decided "better the devil you know" because they had already sorted out so many living routines with each other that it made sense to continue living together until one could afford to move out. That makes perfect sense to me. It's practical and saved them both from financial hardship. She's on her way to live with friends for free, as a work trade, so that's how she's now able to afford to leave. Implying any extra drama in this situation is irrelevant and unhelpful.

That being said, when you reach a point where there's no love, no sex in years, and lots of built up irritation with each other, it's difficult to fully bury all of that when you're still living together. It's difficult to establish a new, healthy friendship. It's also difficult to turn a long established dysfunctional pattern into a healthy one. That's understandable, but it's creating issues in my budding relationship with him.

Thank you to those of you who validated that my discomfort is well placed. Thank you for validating that they're still intertwined with each other. I agree with those of you who pointed out that he's not ready for a new relationship.

It's not clearcut for me to break up and distance myself for several reasons and that's why I'm writing it all out to gain perspective. To put it simply, he and I are so well matched in so many ways, including the things that matter, like values, lifestyle, temperaments, and life goals. He is unbelievably kind to me. He's one of the nicest and coolest people I've ever known. He's a genuine person with a heart of gold and he's not someone you just throw away. He cares a lot about me and I'm not going to make a hasty decision to just toss him out and find some other dude. He's one of my favorite people in the world and it matters to me to be in each other's lives. I'm not someone who discards people if a romantic relationship isn't possible. I build deep, meaningful connections with people and I tend to build lifelong friendships with good people. He and I built such a wonderful connection and I'm attempting to treat it carefully.

In terms of a romantic relationship, the first problem is timing. He's everything I've ever wanted in a partner, except that he's not yet ready. That's a huge disappointment and it stings.
 

The second is the baggage he brings. It's not inherently a dealbreaker because at this age all of us have baggage and his is not only stuff I can handle, but he's very proactive in always improving himself. He's such a gem. But, combined with the bad timing, it's incredibly challenging. I would describe it as: he hasn't recently experienced someone loving and accepting him for who he is. He and his ex tolerated each other. She dislikes the things about him that I adore. They were just badly matched.

My worry is that he doesn't think he deserves to be treated with kindness and acceptance the way I treat him because it's not what he had with his ex.

If he was able to be all in with me and could call me his girlfriend without the entanglements with his ex, then I would be having a conversation with him about learning healthier relationship dynamics that aren't full of eye rolling and dismissive mocking. I would be having a conversation about what he could do to build his self-esteem and believe he deserves me. He's been very open and receptive (in fact, instigated it himself) to learning healthy types of communication. He began to accept my compliments and began to soften to my gentler nature. [ ] 

That's what I'm processing. It's not an easy decision. It takes courage to let someone go when you really love them, knowing they're not right for you (at least not now). And it takes bracing myself for some big grief if/when I end it.

Edited August 10, 2023 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
group berating