My GF often borrows money from me

[tokidoki]

I've been with my SO for nearly two years. I make a little more money than her but neither of us is hugely rich, nor poor.

Often, she will ask me to lend her small sums of money, $100, $200. Generally I'm ok with it but I am often waiting a week or so before being paid back. This week she asked me to lend her $200 again, but I said I can't as I only have $80 to last me to the end of the month and I don't want to go overdrawn, as I've had to pay charges lately. She sulked a bit, which I didn't appreciate. I asked if she had anyone else she could ask and she said no. 

I let it lie for a bit and said I could lend it to her if she was absolutely sure to pay me back in a few days, and I wouldn't have to ask for it back. Being owed money makes me anxious and I don't like being in a position of responsibility for someone else's finances. I told her that she could always borrow from the bank and apply for an overdraft but she told me she couldn't apply online and had to go to the branch. I asked her to give me her phone and within 3 minutes I had made an application for a $1000 overdraft and had it approved. She had obviously not tried very hard.

She is still sulky with me and I don't really see why. I've lent her money multiple times before and whilst she has always paid me back, I'd like to go a month without being owed money by someone else, gf or not. I don't think I'm a bad guy for drawing a line in the sand there.

[d0nnivain]

There's a reason Shakespeare advised "Never a lender or a borrower be."  Hamlet Act 1 Scene 3

You are lucky she has paid you back.  Normally between intimates (friends, dates, family etc) the amounts you talk about are considered gifts by courts if they don't have the requisite signed paperwork saying they are loans.  

Since you got her an overdraft from her bank perhaps the issue is she's not good with money.  Ask her if she wants to sit down & do some budgeting with you.  You may be able to find more money for her if her money is better managed.  

[Sony12]

I feel it's always a good rule of thumb to never loan partners large sums of money until you two are serious as people will take advantage of the situation.

[tokidoki]

We are definitely serious, we live together. I don't mind lending her money if she is in a bind but what I have a problem with is that if I'm asked and I say that I'm unable to, I get a sulky silent treatment. It's not fair.

[d0nnivain]

If you live together & are serious it's even more important that you & her are on the same page about money & budgeting.  

You are right it was unfair of her to sulk.  You need to tell her that.

[Gaeta]

28 minutes ago, tokidoki said:

We are definitely serious, we live together. I don't mind lending her money if she is in a bind but what I have a problem with is that if I'm asked and I say that I'm unable to, I get a sulky silent treatment. It's not fair.

Why is she running out of money? 

If my partner managed his money well but came across unexpected expenses lets say dental expense or car repairs I'd give/lend him the money without a second thought BUT if he ran out of money because he spent it on videogames and such I would definitely let him suffer and let him experience the consequences of his financial mismanagement. 

She sulks because she is now taking your help for granted. 

Edited October 18, 2023 by Gaeta

[tokidoki]

We went on an expensive holiday last month...she works freelance so her money isn't necessarily guaranteed each month. This month she's slightly short on the rent so she asked me to lend it to her for a week. I would lend it to her but I just don't have the money myself. She's definitely not just spending frivolously and mismanaging her finances.

[d0nnivain]

Since you live there too, how will the rent get paid if you don't pay it? 

Especially because she is freelance, she needs help budgeting.  

[tokidoki]

I've paid my half of the rent. She is short on hers.

[Gaeta]

18 minutes ago, tokidoki said:

We went on an expensive holiday last month...she works freelance so her money isn't necessarily guaranteed each month. This month she's slightly short on the rent so she asked me to lend it to her for a week. I would lend it to her but I just don't have the money myself. She's definitely not just spending frivolously and mismanaging her finances.

So she is responsible with her money and she makes about the same as you. She has a cash flow problem that's all. Her money comes in less regularly than yours. 

So my question to you is: Are you a couple or room-mates?

Couples help each other - room-mates split the bill and everything in half. She is short on the rent? You do exactly what you've been doing. 

That being said, she needs to be more pro-active in her finance. She should have gotten that margin on her account, she should have an emergency account or at least an emergency credit card she keeps clear. 

Edited October 18, 2023 by Gaeta

[tokidoki]

We're a couple. What do you mean 'do exactly what you've been doing'. I should clarify. I'm not asking advice on whether to lend her money or not. I'm asking for advice on how to deal with her becoming sulky and passive aggressive when I tell her that unfortunately, I'm not able to lend her any money this time. I have lent her money many times in the past.

[glows]

Her relationship with money may be a little more complex than just doing the logical thing like applying for an overdraft. I’m looking at the way she reacts sulking and if her patterns don’t change unfortunately this is an ongoing battle. It’s not about the money.

She asks you because it’s an ingrained behaviour pattern. That’s how she solves her problems and likely gains validation that you care for her, that you’re her boyfriend and taking care of her. It may sound twisted but this is how she feels loved or secure. I’ve no doubt she’s aware you don’t have enough for yourself but she doesn’t care because by you giving her money or lending it it shows that you still care about her. 

If you do continue with the relationship both of you have to work together as a team. Not my part of the rent and your part. It’s one rent, one home. She has to change the way she looks at you as she can’t use money to keep validating your feelings for her. It’s stressful for the both of you. 

[Weezy1973]

1 minute ago, tokidoki said:

I'm asking for advice on how to deal with her becoming sulky and passive aggressive when I tell her that unfortunately, I'm not able to lend her any money this time.

You both have different expectations when it comes to your finances as a couple. This is an important discussion to have. You might solve it by opening a joint account where you each put a portion of your paychecks to cover joint expenses like rent, utilities and groceries. 
 

As for her sulking, you need to ask her why. Communication is probably the most important part of relationships. I’m guessing as you’ve lent her money a lot she’s come to just expect it. If you’re serious about her, talking about money is pretty important.

[Gaeta]

3 minutes ago, tokidoki said:

We're a couple. What do you mean 'do exactly what you've been doing'. I should clarify. I'm not asking advice on whether to lend her money or not. I'm asking for advice on how to deal with her becoming sulky and passive aggressive when I tell her that unfortunately, I'm not able to lend her any money this time. I have lent her money many times in the past.

I mean you help her when she's short in money. But that has been solved as she has a margin on her account now. 

You spend 3/4 of your story talking about her borrowing money so I assumed it was the main subject. As for the sulking I think the best way to deal with it is to ignore it. she is being passive aggressive, unconsciously she wants to punish you by having a bad attitude toward you. I would ignore it, keep your smile on, do things you enjoy! and not seek her presence/attention as long as she's unpleasant. 

[tokidoki]

9 minutes ago, glows said:

Her relationship with money may be a little more complex than just doing the logical thing like applying for an overdraft. I’m looking at the way she reacts sulking and if her patterns don’t change unfortunately this is an ongoing battle. It’s not about the money.

She asks you because it’s an ingrained behaviour pattern. That’s how she solves her problems and likely gains validation that you care for her, that you’re her boyfriend and taking care of her. It may sound twisted but this is how she feels loved or secure. I’ve no doubt she’s aware you don’t have enough for yourself but she doesn’t care because by you giving her money or lending it it shows that you still care about her. 

If you do continue with the relationship both of you have to work together as a team. Not my part of the rent and your part. It’s one rent, one home. She has to change the way she looks at you as she can’t use money to keep validating your feelings for her. It’s stressful for the both of you. 

I'm sorry but surely you can't expect that if two of us are living there we don't split the rent down the middle?

I think you're right though. Of course I want to help her when she needs it but I also don't want to be taken for granted. I show my love for her in lots of ways but I'm not a bank...if I don't have the means to help her at one point in time then it doesn't mean I don't care about her. I know you understand this, of course. I appreciate your advice.

We had a brief talk since I posted this and she said 'it feels like you don't want me to ask for your help' which is not true. She can ask for my help but also needs to understand that it isn't always a given that I will be able to. She also said 'maybe i see the relationship differently to you' - I feel like she is making me feel guilty for something I can't control. Very annoying.

Edited October 18, 2023 by tokidoki
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[Gaeta]

6 minutes ago, tokidoki said:

Of course I want to help her when she needs it but I also don't want to be taken for granted. I show my love for her in lots of ways but I'm not a bank

If you don't always have the fund for her you can still help her find solutions to her situation,  which you did but you did it on your own, you did not involve her. It probably felt to her like 'here's your margin don't bother me again'. 

She's still sulking so of course she will say things to make you feel guilty. You need a conversation on how to manage your financial life together when she's done sulking.

Like someone suggested a joint account in which money is deposited to cover your living expenses is good. No point of putting money in that account the last day of the month, she needs to deposit money in there each time she is paid so she is ahead. 

 

[Gaeta]

18 minutes ago, tokidoki said:

I'm sorry but surely you can't expect that if two of us are living there we don't split the rent down the middle?

Actually no, the rent should not be split in the middle, it should be paid proportionally to your revenue. The one earning more pays more proportionally otherwise all of her money will go on paying bills while you have extra money that you don't want to share. 

If your rent is 20% of your revenue and her part represents 30% of her revenue, then you have an unfair deal. 

[d0nnivain]

25 minutes ago, tokidoki said:

I'm sorry but surely you can't expect that if two of us are living there we don't split the rent down the middle?

I think you're right though. Of course I want to help her when she needs it but I also don't want to be taken for granted. I show my love for her in lots of ways but I'm not a bank...if I don't have the means to help her at one point in time then it doesn't mean I don't care about her. I know you understand this, of course. I appreciate your advice.

We had a brief talk since I posted this and she said 'it feels like you don't want me to ask for your help' which is not true. She can ask for my help but also needs to understand that it isn't always a given that I will be able to. She also said 'maybe i see the relationship differently to you' - I feel like she is making me feel guilty for something I can't control. Very annoying.

If you are a couple rent isn't necessarily split down the middle unless you earn roughly the same amount.  If one of you is a higher earner then shared bills are split proportionately.    Example if you earn $50k per year & she earns $35k per year, you pay 60% of the shared bills (rent, utilities, food etc.) while she pays 40%.  You are supposed to be working as a team.  

Like your GF I am self employed & have unreliable income but I used to keep a large cash reserve to offset that problem.  when DH & I married we structured our finances differently because of the cash flow disparity.  He pays all recurring charges:  mortgage, utilities,  insurance premiums etc.  I pay for the large expenditures in cash when they come up & I have the cash.  For example I buy the cars, the vacations, the kitchen remodel etc.   We've been limping along with temporary low cost solutions on an expensive home repair until I can come up with the money to pay for it.  

Money is an issue / symptom in your relationship but it's not the problem.  She relied on you & got hurt when you did not lend her the money.  You felt taken advantage of & were doubly upset when she sulked.  In different ways you are both expressing that you each feel the other doesn't love you or care enough about the relationship.  You have communication issues.  

You can control your finances.  It's only October 18 so the fact that you only have $80 left for the month worries me on your behalf.  That is not much of a margin unless that is after all bills including food, rent & utilities are paid.  Still you both need to open up the books to each other & come up with a better budget for your relationship.  Especially if her income is sporadic how can you help her earn more?  

[FMW]

No, you're not a bad guy for saying no when you don't have the money.  She's in the wrong for sulking if she expects you to put yourself in a difficult position (no money until your next pay day).

If this was just a very occasional thing it would be different.  But it sounds like it's a regular and ongoing situation.

Unless you discussed this beforehand and agreed to regularly float her loans, then I don't see why you should be expected to do so, especially when it depletes your own funds so that you have nothing left.  So she certainly has no reason to sulk if you say no.

Personally, the sulking would just be an additional issue to the regular requests for loans.  Both would be a problem for me.  Unless you committed to giving ongoing financial assistance prior to moving in together, I would feel taken advantage of.  Of course partners help each other, but this seems more than that.

I don't know if you are a woman or a man (it seems you're probably a guy), but i believe if you were a woman talking about your boyfriend, more people would be telling you to cut them off.  I'm a woman btw.

If you choose to continue to live together you will need to either find a less expensive place so she can afford her half, or come to terms with paying more than she does ( you said you made a little more than her - depending on how much, changing the agreed upon split might be so somehing to consider. 

Otherwise, resentment on both sides is likely to grow. 

ETA - it sounds like maybe your place is too expensive for both of you if you're both short on funds.  

 

 

 

Edited October 18, 2023 by FMW

[tokidoki]

I pay 47% of my income on rent. She undoubtedly pays a higher percentage as she earns a bit less but what, if she paid 47% as well then there would be a shortfall and who will make that up? me? Seems like a mathematical headf*** that will only create tension. She lived here first and was already paying rent and I moved in later. 

Sure, she maybe makes less but there is no ceiling to her income. She can make more by charging more. 

$80 is enough when you've covered all expenses and only need to buy food. It's enough if you don't need to go out for dinner or buy alcohol.

 

[tokidoki]

7 minutes ago, FMW said:

No, you're not a bad guy for saying no when you don't have the money.  She's in the wrong for sulking if she expects you to put yourself in a difficult position (no money until your next pay day).

If this was just a very occasional thing it would be different.  But it sounds like it's a regular and ongoing situation.

Unless you discussed this beforehand and agreed to regularly float her loans, then I don't see why you should be expected to do so, especially when it depletes your own funds so that you have nothing left.  So she certainly has no reason to sulk if you say no.

Personally, the sulking would just be an additional issue to the regular requests for loans.  Both would be a problem for me.  Unless you committed to giving ongoing financial assistance prior to moving in together, I would feel taken advantage of.  Of course partners help each other, but this seems more than that.

I don't know if you are a woman or a man (it seems you're probably a guy), but i believe if you were a woman talking about your boyfriend, more people would be telling you to cut them off.  I'm a woman btw.

If you choose to continue to live together you will need to either find a less expensive place so she can afford her half, or come to terms with paying more than she does ( you said you made a little more than her - depending on how much, changing the agreed upon split might be so somehing to consider. 

Otherwise, resentment on both sides is likely to grow. 

ETA - it sounds like maybe your place is too expensive for both of you if you're both short on funds.  

 

 

 

I agree with you re: rent split. The sulking is annoying but it's not an ongoing thing. Yes, she's asked for me to loan her money in the past but it's not a particularly regular occurence. We live in a very expensive city in very difficult times when it comes to the cost of living. 

We have had to tighten our belts this month because we went on an expensive vacation last month and went a bit over budget. I covered her and she paid me back, but I've had to live on significantly less than usual this month because of it. That doesn't bother me, it happens sometimes. I've made my bed, I'll lie in it. When I'm short on cash I borrow money from the bank via overdraft - that way I don't have to ask others for help and I'm only indebted to myself. 

Yes, I'm a man and she's a woman.

I should also add that I contribute financially in other ways that she doesn't. For instance, when her ex room mate moved out, she took a lot of furniture with her. I spent over $3,000 on furniture for the flat and didn't ask for a single cent towards it.

Edited October 18, 2023 by tokidoki

[Gaeta]

9 minutes ago, tokidoki said:

She lived here first and was already paying rent and I moved in later

So what happened that she went from being able to pay rent on her own to struggle to pay half of it?

Ok you answered 

Edited October 18, 2023 by Gaeta

[tokidoki]

When her flatmate moved out I had to be put on the tenancy.  The agency upped the rent to reflect the rising cost of living in our city when we signed a new agreement. Very little we could do about it, and looking for a cheaper place would have been very stressful given the competition for apartments in the city these days. There was no guarantee that we would have got a better deal elsewhere. 

Also, She uses the apartment for business operations, working from home, which I don't. She can claim a portion of her rent as a business expense and reduce her tax liability, which I can't. All in all a 50/50 split is simplest and it would be difficult for her to justify that it's unfair on that basis.

[introverted1]

Your gf needs to plan better with her money and definitely needs to understand that there may be times when you cannot cover for her.  

Agreed that a 50/50 rent split is fair.  I am sure that when she had a roommate, the rent was split 50/50 and not pro-rated based on incomes.  If/when you two decide to be life partners, you can then discuss how to set up your mutual finances, which would address things in addition to rent like student loans, car payments, insurance, savings goals, etc.  

As for the sulking, I think you two need to have a conversation.  Perhaps you can help her identify ways in which she can create her own slush fund so that she has money to fall back on if her freelance work isn't enough to cover her bills in a given month.  

[Gaeta]

Does she sulk often?

I read in your history that back in May her room mate moved out early and your gf ignored your suggestion to find a temporary room mate and wanted you to move in early to fill the gap. This moving in together started with you relying on you to fill the gap financially.