Is it possible to win someone over?

[ZA Dater]

A friend and I were having quite a debate about this, he dates very easily and has good choice. He maintain it is possible to change the opinion of someone if they inially find him unattractive.

My counter point is this is very unlikely for most others and impossible for me.

What has your experience been with this?

[Weezy1973]

17 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

What has your experience been with this?

I think it’s possible, but it’s not done by trying to win them over. 
 

Most women I had relationships with were kind of neutral to me at first and then I became more attracted as I got to know them over time. I also had relationships with women I was attracted to right off the hop, but those relationships were in no way superior to the ones where attraction grew over time. 

[ZA Dater]

26 minutes ago, Weezy1973 said:

I think it’s possible, but it’s not done by trying to win them over. 
 

Most women I had relationships with were kind of neutral to me at first and then I became more attracted as I got to know them over time. I also had relationships with women I was attracted to right off the hop, but those relationships were in no way superior to the ones where attraction grew over time. 

That was sort of the basis of my point, it's nearly impossible to turn a rejection info sudden attraction, whereas he thinks it is and apparently has done so. I still maintain its very difficult.

Was an interesting conversation and was an agree to disagree situation but again it's also probably down to personality how things can grow or not and how neutral things are.

Probably one of the better dating related things I do see how he actually does get charisma to work for him 

[semble]

My opinion is that if you believe something is impossible then it's impossible for all practical purposes.

Your negativity is almost appalling.

 

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, ZA Dater said:

 he dates very easily and has good choice. He maintain it is possible to change the opinion of someone.

If he gets dates it's because they find him personable or attractive, not because of pickup artist  "building attraction" theories. 

Edited December 9, 2023 by Wiseman2

[NuevoYorko]

He's not "changing their mind," they are getting to know him better and he's growing on them.

Why are you "disagreeing" with him anyway?  It's his life experience.  If he's done it, obviously it can be done BY HIM.  

This won't happen with you because you are fully  invested in your negative thinking and attachment to lies and BS that help you stay there.  So you will remain in a static position while others around you are moving into different relationships or developing new skills, interests and ways of connecting.  

[ZA Dater]

1 hour ago, NuevoYorko said:

He's not "changing their mind," they are getting to know him better and he's growing on them.

Why are you "disagreeing" with him anyway?  It's his life experience.  If he's done it, obviously it can be done BY HIM.  

This won't happen with you because you are fully  invested in your negative thinking and attachment to lies and BS that help you stay there.  So you will remain in a static position while others around you are moving into different relationships or developing new skills, interests and ways of connecting.  

I disagree for the simple reason unless the person in question has some phenomenal attribute or some amazing superficial its very difficult to go from "not interest not attracted to interested very attracted" I agree it can happen from a neutral position but its less likely to happen from a position of being rejected. Again I suppose if the boot was on the other foot, why would someone wait for someone to grow on them if they can go out and find what they actually want? 

The other reason I disagree with him was suddenly his experience is mine and because he can do something so can I, which I guess sounds lovely in a fairy tale sort of way but in the world most of us live in that is less likely. He goes onto Tinder and gets good matches and well I do not so that is already the core difference.

Look at videos about " signs she or he likes you" look at what is discussed and then try and equate not meeting those requirements and then trying to meet them again? 

My dating experience is irrelevant I accept others do a lot better than me, that is fine, its life, we cant all have private jets and houses around the world. 

 

[ZA Dater]

2 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

If he gets dates it's because they find him personable or attractive, not because of pickup artist  "building attraction" theories. 

That is not really my point, its about going from "she has rejected me" to "ok she rejected me but now she is more interested in me", if its actually possible to do that for most people in the context of OLD and the seemingly endless choice some people have.

[ZA Dater]

3 hours ago, semble said:

My opinion is that if you believe something is impossible then it's impossible for all practical purposes.

Your negativity is almost appalling.

Well I suppose someone can really believe they can fly, does not mean they can actually fly, yes I am being impractical. Risk, probability and the indications of those are the way I think, apologies if you think that is negative. 

Again, why would someone change their mind, how would you change their mind and what purpose would it be to consider someone you rejected. Why even do this UNLESS the level of choice is especially low and the approach is "well I rejected so and so but seeing as my choice is limited maybe I should look at them again, make the best of this because there are no better options" which I guess sounds especially nasty but I am fairly sure it happens.

The flip side of this is it can only really happen by the person who did the rejecting to begin with, the other person will of course has very limited means to try and "win the person over" and how would they do this? 

To be frank this does not only apply to dating it applies to life, if you see much of life as simply being a commercial transaction of sorts. Based on the above I suspect your view is more romantic and idealistic which great.

[Wiseman2]

6 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

 in the context of OLD and the seemingly endless choice some people have.

"Seemingly" seems to be you imagining that everyone has an easy time getting dates, except you. However you admittedly only get on OLD to shop for likes, matches and attention from only the most attractive women with no intention of actually finding a date.

Almost as if you want to test the algorithms with different versions of your profile. Believing that somehow, the apps look at your pics and only send you women who you deem not attractive enough. 

[ZA Dater]

3 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

"Seemingly" seems to be you imagining that everyone has an easy time getting dates, except you. However you admittedly only get on OLD to shop for likes, matches and attention from only the most attractive women with no intention of actually finding a date.

Almost as if you want to test the algorithms with different versions of your profile. Believing that somehow, the apps look at your pics and only send you women who you deem not attractive enough. 

What I do is irrelevant to the question. If someone rejects you can you turn that around and if so how? As for the bold, you can decide on that one. I have been on paid apps long enough to have my own opinion on that and then ask yourself why people catfish. 

I'll say this, if these apps did not work these companies would not be turning over the figures they do, so clearly they DO work for people, if they did not, people would not keep paying. 

 

[Weezy1973]

48 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

 If someone rejects you can you turn that around and if so how?

With online dating, I’d say no, not for most people. 
 

I suspect that for people who are conventionally attractive it’s more possible. For example, Margot Robbie isn’t really my type, but if she were to show a lot of interest, I could probably be persuaded to date her. But for most of us, no it’s not really possible. 

[NuevoYorko]

1 hour ago, ZA Dater said:

why would someone wait for someone to grow on them if they can go out and find what they actually want? 

Because many people are not extremely superficial.  As they are getting to know someone that individual can be growing on them.    

I'm here with my adult daughter and her partner of 10 years.   They were friends for several years before they got together.   Wednesday was their "anniversary," which was when she fairly suddenly realized that she was attracted to him and ... the rest is history.  

It happens all the time, but not for people who are not open to it.   You're not.  Your friend, OTOH, understands it.

[basil67]

1 hour ago, ZA Dater said:

What I do is irrelevant to the question.

What you do is EVERYTHING to do with the question.    He can do it because he believes he can.  You can't do it because you believe you can't.   

Edit to add @NuevoYorko's post above is spot on.  I've seen it an experienced it.  

 

 

Edited December 9, 2023 by basil67

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, ZA Dater said:

 clearly they DO work for people, if they did not, people would not keep paying.

Yes. They work for people who are honestly looking for someone and have sincere accurate pics and profiles.  However dating apps can't guarantee success for everyone. It's just a collection of people advertising that they are looking to meet and date people.

No app can guarantee that your particular profile will attract a lot of attention or match you specifically only with women you deem attractive. So yes you're paying for access to a group of people who are looking to date. But who's on there is random. 

[Alpacalia]

9 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

A friend and I were having quite a debate about this, he dates very easily and has good choice. He maintain it is possible to change the opinion of someone if they inially find him unattractive.

My counter point is this is very unlikely for most others and impossible for me.

What has your experience been with this?

Try not to worry about his case because its uncommon. Though he's experiencing it, it is for a fact rare and most likely is just helpful in one circumstance. For everyone else, people rarely ever view you as who you really and then change their minds about the others.

Your first impression on someone has a big impact especially because you can change it on the long run. People are slaves to their inherent genes which tell them whether to find someone attractive or not is a hit or miss. Experience has told me the eye test is the most reliable although third party perspective is desired. People are very rarely black and white.

I think it is possible to change someone's initial opinion of you, but it is not easy. It takes time, effort, and patience to get to know someone and show them different sides of yourself that they may not have initially seen. Sometimes people's initial impressions are based on superficial things or biases, and those can be overcome if you are able to show them the real person you are. However, it also depends on the person and how open they are to changing their opinion. Some people are more stubborn and may not be willing to give someone a chance if they don't initially find them attractive.

So while it is possible, it is not guaranteed.

[CaliforniaGirl]

12 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

A friend and I were having quite a debate about this, he dates very easily and has good choice. He maintain it is possible to change the opinion of someone if they inially find him unattractive.

My counter point is this is very unlikely for most others and impossible for me.

What has your experience been with this?

Yes. I have been won over by men I wasn't initially attracted to.

Edited December 10, 2023 by CaliforniaGirl

[Foxhall]

21 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

What has your experience been with this?

I suppose there is one woman I consider the love of my life- have mentioned her in passing at various stages on here,

In summary we dated briefly ten years ago, basically she told me what I think you have been told on occasion- that she only seen me as a friend.

Anyways we became closer again during the covid year and she randomly appeared again in my country briefly last year. Being honest I hesitated with being in a different relationship and she was gone again very quickly.

At any rate we are still in contact again by distance, recently she said she could see the two of us being married in the future.(not that we are that young now that we can be putting things on the long finger)

Its all a bit fantasyland perhaps but I think deep down I would like that to happen,

In terms of why she changed her mind - I dont know- well ten years ago she was 30- I imagine she thought there were better options out there- ten years later at our age now-Im probably a good enough option

and there has always been a bonding there ,even if for her it may have taken a while to see me as a romantic partner.

[NuevoYorko]

OP, an observation:

Evidently in real life you do exactly the same behavior you exhibit on the boards.   You "disagree" with people when they tell you about their life experiences.  

You seem to be quite prideful about your "logical" mind, but this is straight up ... stupid.   Also disrespectful.

Why even bother interacting with people about their personal experiences if your sole intention is to refute them?  Worse, the experiences are always with things you have NO experience with and thus, no grounds for even having an opinion.

Let me make this clear to you:  THIS IS NOT A MATTER OF OPINION.   Yes, the world is bursting with couples who were not drawn to one another at first.  Sometimes neither one liked the other,  other times one was in pursuit and the other not interested.

Yes.  It happens ALL     THE     TIME.   

 

[OKtoday]

As you get older you realize that you don’t know everything and what you thought you wanted may not have been the best for you. You learn to be patient, give things a chance which opens the door to things greater than you imagined.

In this growth process of being more open minded and trying new things you may change your opinion of a person, idea or relationship.

This is one way that someone can change from not interested to interested.

[ZA Dater]

3 hours ago, NuevoYorko said:

OP, an observation:

Evidently in real life you do exactly the same behavior you exhibit on the boards.   You "disagree" with people when they tell you about their life experiences.  

You seem to be quite prideful about your "logical" mind, but this is straight up ... stupid.   Also disrespectful.

Why even bother interacting with people about their personal experiences if your sole intention is to refute them?  Worse, the experiences are always with things you have NO experience with and thus, no grounds for even having an opinion.

Let me make this clear to you:  THIS IS NOT A MATTER OF OPINION.   Yes, the world is bursting with couples who were not drawn to one another at first.  Sometimes neither one liked the other,  other times one was in pursuit and the other not interested.

Yes.  It happens ALL     THE     TIME.   

I, like you am entitled to an opinion. You do not like my opinion that is perfectly fine. You show your "class" with petty insults. How on earth debating something with someone is disrespectful? Even MORE so when other people in this very thread have described the scenario is "unlikely and do not worry about this"? 

In an OLD scenario why would someone go back to someone they did not find attractive, again others have said this is unlikely but because I maintain this is refuted as being "stupid"?

Actually something else, I am not a "yes sir no sir" I actually bother to question things rather than taking people's apparent word. 

Again, change a picture, change a bio, change interests, will any of these things really make someone change their mind? I think not. Throwing $500 a head at a dinner, maybe that might, a fancy ornate gift, that might too. Sitting and extolling ones virtues, well probably less likely with someone who has plenty of more attractive options.

Its also really ironic you chose to use the word "disrespectful".

[Wiseman2]

50 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

change a picture, change a bio, change interests, will any of these things really make someone change their mind 

That may not work unless it's simply to tweak and update a profile keeping it fresh and interesting. As far as "winning someone over", that requires an upbeat personality and openness to people. Women need to find you relatable. If you tend towards negativity, entitlement, self-pity, envy and being argumentative or arrogant that's not going to endear anyone. 

[Lisa]

Thread closed as it has ceased to be productive