Relationship ending?

[Placebeyondthepines]

5 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

You emotionally invested way too much in someone you hardly knew. 

 

Weird enough I did. Even weirder is that after the second date I wanted to end it.

[Acacia98]

18 hours ago, Placebeyondthepines said:

Of course, she has the right

but why she came? She cooled off when I wanted to kiss her. If somebody doesn't feel the same, doesn't that person bail out? Or show cracks?

Why is she acting like she is buzzing to come over? Why was she making plans with me for next week? Why not overcomplicate things?

I don't feel entitled not even in a percent. I am fuming on myself, not because she didn't kiss me. I am fuming because, like Expat said above, she blew the top off, but also I didn't talk about relationships with her at all, just wanted to take things crescendo, and I feel she was annoyed by that, hence the "you let me think" phrase.

I don't want to come as entitled, I just find it super-super-super odd. 

I hope I've been clear about where I came from and what is wrong, imho.

So here's one possibility: perhaps she has her own set of issues and they're just starting to be visible to you. Maybe this isn't just a reaction to something you said or did. Maybe this is a huge part of who she is.

Anyway, whatever the case may be, I think you should take a huuuge step back. It sounds like you really want to talk to her and understand what happened and why. It also sounds like she doesn't want to talk and is distancing herself. When you reach out under such circumstances, it's easy to come across as the guy who just can't take a hint. So if I were you, I would stop trying to communicate with her. No more greetings, no more jokes. Just silence. Whether or not you choose to engage if she resumes communication is up to you. Personally, I'd be wary. You see, you are in an emotionally vulnerable place and you need to be focusing on yourself and your healing, not trying to figure out the psychological motivations of a relative stranger.

[Placebeyondthepines]

1 minute ago, Acacia98 said:

So here's one possibility: perhaps she has her own set of issues and they're just starting to be visible to you. Maybe this isn't just a reaction to something you said or did. Maybe this is a huge part of who she is.

Anyway, whatever the case may be, I think you should take a huuuge step back. It sounds like you really want to talk to her and understand what happened and why. It also sounds like she doesn't want to talk and is distancing herself. When you reach out under such circumstances, it's easy to come across as the guy who just can't take a hint. So if I were you, I would stop trying to communicate with her. No more greetings, no more jokes. Just silence. Whether or not you choose to engage if she resumes communication is up to you. Personally, I'd be wary. You see, you are in an emotionally vulnerable place and you need to be focusing on yourself and your healing, not trying to figure out the psychological motivations of a relative stranger.

Yep, agree. If it's true that I am the first person she dated in a year, that she is alone for a while now, then clearly she is fighting with some stuff. When I've asked her early on why she is single she said: Because I am sick in the head.

I thought she was joking. Then she repeated that when she came over and I realized she meant it.

The second part, as difficult as it is at the moment, it's the right thing to do. And I am trying with every cell of my body to do that.

[Placebeyondthepines]

On 3/18/2024 at 11:05 PM, basil67 said:

She came because she thought the two of you were great buddies and were going to have a great time.  Given that you weren't ready for a relationship, this is not an outrageous assumption on her part

basil67

I was thinking at this today. What woman, who is dating someone and flirting with someone, accepts going to a strangers apartment to be buddies with? 

I mean, you see my point of view. 

The rest I am 100% on board, it was tooooo soon to date. But just answer that, is awkward, right?

[Wiseman2]

She wasn't trying to be your buddy. You were too aggressive and entitled telling her you have enough friends. And no, inviting someone over for dinner and expecting it means sex is an assumption. 

[Placebeyondthepines]

4 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

She wasn't trying to be your buddy. You were too aggressive and entitled telling her you have enough friends. And no, inviting someone over for dinner and expecting it means sex is an assumption. 

Nop. 

I might be entitled, but I've been brutally honest:

1) I didn't want to be friendzoned.

2) I like her, she said she likes me, there is no way we can be friends. We continue to have the same tempo and then she goes out with someone else, or I do that. What do you think will happen? People get hurt.

[basil67]

5 hours ago, Placebeyondthepines said:

basil67

I was thinking at this today. What woman, who is dating someone and flirting with someone, accepts going to a strangers apartment to be buddies with? 

I mean, you see my point of view. 

The rest I am 100% on board, it was tooooo soon to date. But just answer that, is awkward, right?

If I'm with someone I see as a buddy (even if there was some flirting), I wouldn't be expecting or thinking about sex or kissing if I went to their apartment.  

Out of curiosity, did you ever use the word "date" to describe any of your meetups?  Were you paying for her?  Did you have deliberate but casual contact such as holding hands or walking arm in arm?   If the answer to at least two of these questions is YES, I will change my view and say that she probably should have expected you to make a move.   That's the point where I'd start expecting physical interaction if I went to someone's apartment.

Edited March 20, 2024 by basil67

[Placebeyondthepines]

Just now, basil67 said:

If I'm with someone I see as a buddy (even if there was some flirting), I wouldn't be expecting or thinking about sex or kissing if I went to their apartment.  

Out of curiosity, did you ever use the word "date" to describe any of your meetups?  Were you paying for her?  Did you have deliberate but casual contact such as holding hands?   If the answer to these questions is YES, I will change my view and say that she probably should have expected you to make a move.   That's the point where I'd start expecting physical interaction if I went to someone's apartment.

Well:

- There wasn't a buddy vibe between us at all, but a bonding one.

- Yeah, we used both the word date.

- I did not go for holding hands because she told when we were talking early she said she hates people who touch you or seek to do that (in clubs, bus etc).

- At our third date we were at a bar and the hostess came and asked us: Are you a couple. I dodged and laughed and said: next question.

As I mentioned above there was a key moment, I think, where she expected my move, after the first date she invited me to a bar where she got a bit drunk and was with her friend and I did not go. 

My theory is that: saturday, while the hours were getting closer, she took her time with herself and asked some questions and the results was she actually doesn't want anything. And told me that I didn't do anything, but she also mentioned she didn't do anything.

 

[basil67]

It's all a bit messy isn't it.  If only life came with guarantees  

[Placebeyondthepines]

53 minutes ago, basil67 said:

It's all a bit messy isn't it.  If only life came with guarantees  

It is, very messy. I mean, I do not regret rushing into it, I think I acted like I should. Honest and slow. Will not change anything, if I would do it again. It's just sad, for me at least, because before I've went for the kiss we were really bonding. Painkiller for my ex or not, really enjoyed the 1,5 months I had with her. 

[Placebeyondthepines]

1 hour ago, basil67 said:

It's all a bit messy isn't it.  If only life came with guarantees  

PS: After the failed kiss and her telling me she is sick in the head I tried to get back to the subject, but she changed it shortly, awkwardly laughing or going on talking.

I took her hands into my hands. I don't think she stayed 5 seconds. She looked like the Duracel rabbit.

It was very awkward for me, not making sense of it. I tend to do this when there is no logic, none.

[basil67]

18 minutes ago, Placebeyondthepines said:

It was very awkward for me, not making sense of it. I tend to do this when there is no logic, none.

This is something you could work on in therapy - how to cope with the fact that much of life is chaos and utterly without logic.  With the exception of literal catastrophe, when stuff doesn't go as expected,  all you can really do is learn to shake it off and redirect.   Getting upset about chaos having no logic isn't logical

Edited March 20, 2024 by basil67

[Placebeyondthepines]

On 3/21/2024 at 12:32 AM, basil67 said:

Getting upset about chaos having no logic isn't logical

That's a big step. And have no idea where to start.

And the funny part: I work with chaos on my day to day job.

[basil67]

34 minutes ago, Placebeyondthepines said:

That's a big step. And have no idea where to start.

And the funny part: I work with chaos on my day to day job.

I'd start by accepting that life and relationships aren't logic.  And that's because we aren't robots who are programmed to follow A+B=C. 

We make decisions based on emotions and feelings. We have both sensible and irrational thoughts. We make stupid decisions and great decisions.  We say and do things we regret and we say and do the perfect thing.  Or we can make an arguably bad decision and a good outcome will surprise us...or vice versa.  

The emotions around this not working can be dealt with after you get your head around the lack of logic in human lives

[Placebeyondthepines]

28 minutes ago, basil67 said:

I'd start by accepting that life and relationships aren't logic.  And that's because we aren't robots who are programmed to follow A+B=C. 

We make decisions based on emotions and feelings. We have both sensible and irrational thoughts. We make stupid decisions and great decisions.  We say and do things we regret and we say and do the perfect thing.  Or we can make an arguably bad decision and a good outcome will surprise us...or vice versa.  

The emotions around this not working can be dealt with after you get your head around the lack of logic in human lives

Thank you.

I would add: try and drop expectations. Anything can happen.

[Placebeyondthepines]

So, went out this weekend with friends and I decided to test the waters and send her a short: how are you message.

We ended up talking yesterday and we are going to meet up tomorrow night. However, not like that because we ended up talking yesterday, I was trying to light up the mood with jokes, but she became instantly super intense and told me: she took the week and decided she can offer only friendship.

And we ended up talking a lot on the subject, I've told her again that I wasn't searching for a relationship, I've been out of one, I wasn't that into her, but liked her company a lot and only wanted to kiss to see if something can happen. Things you knew from my posts. But I sense she was having none of it, she was acting like she did everything ok, like it was normal to act like that. And it was a red flag for me, so it became a massive turn off, but also made me realized I might have dodged a massive bullet.

Gonna meet her tomorrow to see if we can be friends, but for me is the end of the road. 

[ExpatInItaly]

Why would you bother trying to be friends with her?

Leave this be. It is pointless to see her again. Next. 

[Wiseman2]

She's acting normal because she didn't do anything wrong. Please don't bother trying to be friends. You already told her in a nasty way that you have enough friends. 

[Gebidozo]

18 hours ago, Placebeyondthepines said:

So, went out this weekend with friends and I decided to test the waters and send her a short: how are you message.

We ended up talking yesterday and we are going to meet up tomorrow night. However, not like that because we ended up talking yesterday, I was trying to light up the mood with jokes, but she became instantly super intense and told me: she took the week and decided she can offer only friendship.

And we ended up talking a lot on the subject, I've told her again that I wasn't searching for a relationship, I've been out of one, I wasn't that into her, but liked her company a lot and only wanted to kiss to see if something can happen. Things you knew from my posts. But I sense she was having none of it, she was acting like she did everything ok, like it was normal to act like that. And it was a red flag for me, so it became a massive turn off, but also made me realized I might have dodged a massive bullet.

Gonna meet her tomorrow to see if we can be friends, but for me is the end of the road. 

Hmm, something’s off here. If you aren’t ready for a relationship yourself, aren’t even “that into her”, then why the disappointment, the criticism of her behavior, the strange desire to still and try be friends?

It appears to me that your ego has been bruised. That probably happened because you’re still too vulnerable and emotionally unstable following the breakup. When people have insecurity and fragile ego issues, they often become hyper-sensitive and hyper-critical. I’m well familiar with the feeling. You should let it go. You need to work on yourself and restore your self-confidence. 

[ExpatInItaly]

2 hours ago, Gebidozo said:

If you aren’t ready for a relationship yourself, aren’t even “that into her”, then why the disappointment, the criticism of her behavior, the strange desire to still and try be friends?

Exactly. 

I don't think you are being honest with yourself at all, OP. It seems like this a knee-jerk reaction to feeling rejected by her, and you're not willing to let go so you're trying to be friends in the hopes of rekindling some interest in her. 

None of this is healthy for you. You need to take time to yourself without dating at all, and get back to a more emotionally-strong place. 

[Placebeyondthepines]

@Gebidozo & @ExpatInItaly

Spot on in almost everything.

Clearly there is the ego there present, but this week with no contact helped me a lot on understanding a few things and first of all that I was upset on myself, most of all. Because I did not listen to my instinct, like I should have.

- Like I've said earlier, after the second date I didn't feel the spark and made a step back for a day because I wasn't that into her like I wanted to be.

- But missed her and tried to come closer because she was showing things I was lacking and missing from my ex-partner. 

- I said, why not? Why not try and see? So invited her home to be intimate & see if there can be something between us.  And you know the rest.

Sunday we've talked casual at first, then she became intense and started talking with me about that and the further we talked, the more I saw same signs of my ex. And it was a massive turn off. 

I've been honest, told her exactly that, I was not into you, but we became closer and wanted to try to, but she never said: Yeah, I shouldn't have kissed you, I shouldn't have come to your home with a bottle of wine, flirted etc. For her it was all me and that raised a massive wall in front of me because I've seen her like she is. Show at least 1% responsability.

So I think I am going out of curiosity tonight, to see how things are. I enjoyed her as a person, I really did. But the sex/relationship door is permanently closed for me. And trust me when I am saying that because another drama is the last thing I need.

I think I need to meet her and get it out of the system, because I've said my piece, don't want to say anything else to her about "us". If we can talk as human beings, then I think it will be alright.

[basil67]

Wait wait wait....you don't want a relationship but you used the word date when you were taking her out.  And now you're mad because she wouldn't have casual sex with you?    

If you don't want friendship and don't want a relationship, just come straight out with the proposition of casual sex.  Don't muddy the waters doing romantic things which are going to lead to nothing other than a few shags. 

Edited March 26, 2024 by basil67

[ExpatInItaly]

36 minutes ago, Placebeyondthepines said:

think I need to meet her and get it out of the system

Get what out of your system? 

[Placebeyondthepines]

27 minutes ago, basil67 said:

Wait wait wait....you don't want a relationship but you used the word date when you were taking her out.  And now you're mad because she wouldn't have casual sex with you?    

If you don't want friendship and don't want a relationship, just come straight out with the proposition of casual sex.  Don't muddy the waters doing romantic things which are going to lead to nothing other than a few shags. 

But those were dates, I mean, she kissed me, we stayed 7 hours in every one of them. Those were dates.

I didn't knew what I wanted. I mean, I know now, wanted to be intimate together and see if I want more or not because we were having a good time together.

When I made a step back after the second date I felt her absence, so I went back to see what is this.

Edited March 26, 2024 by Placebeyondthepines

[Placebeyondthepines]

9 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Get what out of your system? 

Meeting her face to face. 

We usually go in the same places, work in the same industry so there is a big chance we are going to see each other often in places and events. And after last week, I need to know if it's going to be awkward or not. 

Edited March 26, 2024 by Placebeyondthepines