do I need to have the define the relationship talk with her, how many more dates do I give it before bringing it up?

[zs0511]

so met this girl a few weeks ago online. things seem to be going well, we have been talking about three weeks gone out about 5 times. and we generally have a good time. we have a alot of similarities, she initiates texting, calls me, initiates hanging out. whenever we go she refuses to let me pay all the time, are dates generally last a few hours and they are usually always extended. she seems generally interested into the date whenever we hang. shes never really checking her phone she dosent seem closed off on the surface everything seems to be going ok which is good because i really do like this girl and am interested in seeing where it goes and i do want it to go somewhere. however even though the above sounds good there are just a few things that just seem off to me.

the first is i get this feeling shes hiding something, shes so secretive at times. like shes going out of town for a few weeks for work. she said the state where she was going but when i asked oh what part ( i have alot of friends in one of the major cities in the state shes going to) her answer is i cant tell you im meeting with clients and i cant say who they are. what does the city have to do with your client? my brother in law works for a company that deals with government contracts and hes never this secretive about where hes going. another example is we did something the other day where you have to sign a release of liability waiver. its on a computer and she didnt want me to see her last name. another thing is whenever it comes to taking a picture where both of us are in it it has to be on her phone, cant be on mine and if she sends me pictures from what we did its only ones that im in, never ones where were in the picture together. this all just seems strange. is it reasonable to think shes hiding something or hiding me?

the other thing that makes me question how she views thing is the physical aspect of things. something i was told along time ago which i 100 percent believe is the dif between friendship and a gf or romantic interest is the physical aspect. after 5 dates nothing has really happened. we havent kissed were not holding hands or anything like that. i have tried to break the touch barrier but its usually rejected. ill try to put my arm around her arm is pushed off. tried doing the high five test rejected. if you dont know what this is after she tells you good news or you do something you go for a high-five and once you do you see if the person leaves there hand there or pulls away, we did an escape room the other night and had another instance of her turning things down. we were standing next to each other and they had a really loud video playing and i wanted to tell her something so i went close to her ear so she would hear me and she turned her head away like she thought i was trying to kiss her. but even her rejecting me is weird for some reasons. the other day when we hung out we hug she gets in her car we talk a little more and when i said ill see ya later and start to walk away she gets out of her car and gives me another hug. if she rejected physical touch why would she get out of her car to hug me again. the last time we hug out something similar happened when we were leaving i was wearing a hoodie and had my hands in my front pocket. she did the thing where she stuck her arm between the opening of my body and my arm and held it but after like 30 secs she let go and when i treid to reengage it was met with pull back

because of these things im not really sure where we are with things or how she feels about things. she does things hinting shes interested but then does something that shows shes not. i have never hung out with a girl 5 times and not had some sort of physical action. the only reasons i havent phones it in yet is because i know she was in a physically abusive relationship for 2 years, and after our first date she point blank told me it takes her a while to warm up to people. that being said there is a time limit on my patient, im putting off other people and im not going to keep doing that. do you think im in the right for starting to question things and thinking i need to have a talk with her? how much longer should i give her maybe another 2-3 dates? do you think maybe its not disinterest shes just scared? 

 

[Wiseman2]

It's only been 5 dates and there seems to be a lot of weirdness and suspicions combined with standoffishness and friend zoning. It may be better to cut your losses than jump through all these hoops and mysteries. What is the "high five test" ?

Edited February 8, 2024 by Wiseman2

[zs0511]

so we went to an escape room for one of our dates (she wanted to) and we got out before the time expired so when were out i say something like good work and high five her while were walking to our cars. the high five is really irrelevant its just a way to initiate hand touching you see what happens after does she try to hold on does she let you hold onto her hand or let go. basically a way to break the touch barrier. it sounds stupid but i cant tell you how many times this has worked for me. 

and the only reason i haven't cut my losses yet is because of the think i mentioned about her past. the last date was the first time she initiated any form of contact so i may give it another 2-3 dates to see if she is more comfortable. if things stay where they are i will have the what are we talk and if i dont get a clear answer im going to tell her im out. if shes interested she wont let this happen. also im going to ask her pointblank about those  things. also she does make cracks about the future. for example when she left a date plan to me basically im at work surprise me i just said well thank for putting the pressure on me. and she called me and said my future husband needs to be able to surprise me with fun plans, one time when we were hanging out she said something and didnt hear my response and was just said oh so your rejecting my marriage proposal. that makes things weirder but you dont say that stuff to someone your not interested in even if its a joking manner

shes also not American (armenian who hasnt been in the country long) so i dont know if there is also a cultural thing attached 

[zs0511]

but its not just me right do you think its just odd behavior. like i want to ask her are your hiding me from someone or something or trying to hid something from me, and ask if shes scared for some reason.

[basil67]

I'm female, and if this was the behaviour of a guy I was dating, I would have cut him loose about three dates ago.   There's no point in asking questions of someone who's acting sketchy because there's a good chance they will lie.

Edited February 8, 2024 by basil67

[Alpacalia]

Five dates in three weeks and her not being very receptive toward you I would continue to hang out but don't put your life on hold. I think you should let her make the major move at this point and just be open and friendly. If she is interested, she will make the major move. If she is afraid (like you say) she may not let herself get into such a position. So remain friendly, but don't get invested in this girl.

[d0nnivain]

If you have been out 5x & have not been able to successfully break the touch barrier IMO you really need to have some sort of discussion about what you are doing.  At this juncture I would very much expect kissing but you can't even get hand holding.   It does not sound like she thinks this s a romance at all; rather you are the opposite sex hang out buddy.  It's best to clarify that.  

It's too early to have the exclusive talk yet because these dates aren't really romantic dates yes but you have to say something.