Confused by husband and his female friend

[confusedd]

I am in need of help!

My husband and I have been married for 6 years. He has a female friend (and her husband) that he has known for about 8 years. This past year her fusband and her have seperated by her choice. She claims she wants and needds her freedom. She has been relying on my husband for support during all of this. My problem is this .... she only calls him at work, never at home. Also he only calls her when he is at work, never from home. He states he has more privacy there because are kids aren't disrupting his calls. But I don't know. I really don't think my husband is interested in her in a way anything more than friendship but it bothers me that their conversations have to be so secretive. He won't talk on the phone to her in front of me. When I tell him that it bothers me he tells me to deal with it, end of story. I just don't know what to think. This friend is 800 miles away o there is no fear of anything physical going on. Maybe I am just being jealous and insecure. But I wish that he would listen to me when I say it bothers me how he handles their friendship/relationship. I don't know how to make him understand how it makes me feel. I feel really disrespected by both of them. This female friend has never felt I was good enough for "her friend" as long as we have been together. I'm just really confused. I don't want to make a big deal about nothing, but these are my feelings and I can't help them. I try to ask him if he would talk to her at home, but he says he isn't handling his friendships on my terms. I ask for some sort of compromise and he says there is no room for compromise.

 

Help me before I drive myself nutty!! I love my husband dearly and have never thought he would cheat or anything. It's just his being so secretive that gets to me .... am I crazy????

[witabix]

No, you're not crazy. I completely understand where you are coming from. It seems that some of us cannot handle these type of situations easily. Yes it is because of our own insecurities, but your H needs to be a bit more mindful of your feelings. His "deal with it attitude" really sucks. Makes you feel unimportant, increases your feelings of jealousy and insecurity, even though you know there is nothing physical going on. Its strange how it still hurts when you feel SO's attention is divided, not because you feel they need to be hanging on your every word every minute of the day or anything, yet it gets to you somehow. I know how you feel. Somehow threatened but unable to really explain to yourself what exactly is being threatened.

 

If their contact is always out of your company there may be a perfectly understandable reason for this. He may be aware of your relationship with her vis a vis the "not good enough for him" comment. He obviously disagrees with this! He may feel that it would be more insulting to you if he were to talk to her about what may be confidential stuff in front of you. Or maybe he is trying to shield her feelings from 'public' scrutiny. I don't mean to imply you are the public but I am sure you know what I mean. Private conversations do happen and are sometimes necessary. Of course your fear may be that there is something more sinister going on. I can offer no concrete signs that show this for sure.

 

What was their friendship like prior to this? How often do they talk? What do they talk about?

 

You may already know this stuff. I would suggest instead of getting upset about it try to gently persuade him to tell you what they are talking about, "How is XXXXXX getting along?", when he says they have been in contact ask him what they talked about. Do this in a normal and conversational way, don't get upset. It can be hard to hold in the annoyance but its important to keep it low key. That way you can begin to judge what is going on. He may indeed be just trying to help a friend through a bad time and if you seem to be nagging him over it he won't feel too good about it.

 

My experience is mixed on this, but I am fairly sure that the best way to handle it is with calmness, blowing it up just makes it all a lot worse for you. I am in a slightly similar stuation and I have decided to keep it calm and wait till I find out more. Remember whats the worst that can happen? Thay have some kind of inappropriate emotional bond? Well if it is anything like this its not your fault, you are not to blame for what other people do. You can only control your self, no one else.

 

Try to be strong and calm, it is probably all about nothing anyway. But keep your eyes and ears open. Good luck.

[Just Me]

I can see where you have a problem with this situation. I don't understand though how your husband can't be a little more understanding of your feelings. If anything that would only add more fuel to the flame for me. Then again I'm not on of those that like to be told to just deal with it, I need explainations and reassurance. In this case I think you should try to talk to him again about it. Explain to him that you need that reassurance no matter who silly he thinks it may be. If it upsets you the least he can do is try to help you cope with their friendship!

[glittergurl]

When I tell him that it bothers me he tells me to deal with it, end of story.

 

Mannnn, I hate when guys react like that! My husband did it twice in the past, and the last time I freaked out so bad (yelling, crying, I was plain hysterical); he finally got the message and actually never told me to "deal with it" or "get over it" again. I'm not saying you should get that extreme ; but what I mean is, if it REALLY bothers you, he has to understand and care about your feelings. That's what husbands are there for. If he can't do that, then he's being an a$$ with a meaningless ring on.

 

It doesn't matter if she's thousands of miles away, there is absolutely no reason for him to hide these phone conversations from you; especially not when he knows how it makes you feel.

[Just Me]

...but what I mean is, if it REALLY bothers you, he has to understand and care about your feelings. That's what husbands are there for. If he can't do that, then he's being an a$$ with a meaningless ring on.

 

It doesn't matter if she's thousands of miles away, there is absolutely no reason for him to hide these phone conversations from you; especially not when he knows how it makes you feel.

 

 

I SOOOO agree! What she said!

[reader]

I agree. Stay calm, take care of yourself, and pay attention.

 

The above advice from the other "posters" is excellent.

[LucreziaBorgia]

1. He won't talk on the phone to her in front of me.

2. When I tell him that it bothers me he tells me to deal with it, end of story.

3. I just don't know what to think.

4. This friend is 800 miles away o there is no fear of anything physical going on.

 

1. Those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing. This is a huge red flag. If you are insecure its because he is giving you reason to be. They are making calls this way so that you can't track them.

 

2. Red flag #2. Don't be surprised if he starts gaslighting you, and making you think that you have 'mental problems' for thinking 'something is going on'. He is sacrificing your relationship and your well being to continue his EMOTIONAL AFFAIR with this woman.

 

3. What to think? Start thinking defensively. Go see a divorce lawyer and get some legal advice on what to do if things go horribly wrong. Next, you'll want to put a keylogger on his computer so that you can monitor any emails/IM's etc. You'll want to consider blowing the whistle on using work phones to carry on an affair, as well. Check the policy on personal use in regards to phones. Don't worry about over-reacting. If you don't you'll find yourself with a husband who says he needs to separate because he needs "space" or "his freedom". This is on a horrible downslide. You have to try to stop this now.

 

4. It doesn't need to be physical to devastate your marriage. There is a member here, Owl - whose W was having an emotional affair and she actually was going to get on a plane and leave him for a man she had NEVER met in person. Your H already knows this woman. You already know she doesn't think you are 'good enough' for him. There is no reason, given the secretive nature of their phone calls after her separation to think that nothing is going on.

 

Right now, gather up evidence. Get a keylogger. Ask about phone policy at your H's work. Once you get your evidence, then you can go from there. Until then, lay low and DO NOT let your H know you are snooping. He'll just find a way to dig deeper and get better at hiding things.

[Trimmer]

She claims she wants and needs her freedom.

 

He won't talk on the phone to her in front of me.

 

When I tell him that it bothers me he tells me to deal with it, end of story.

 

I wish that he would listen to me when I say it bothers me how he handles their friendship/relationship. I don't know how to make him understand how it makes me feel.

 

I try to ask him if he would talk to her at home, but he says he isn't handling his friendships on my terms.

 

I ask for some sort of compromise and he says there is no room for compromise.

 

It's a crazy situation, but you're not crazy. I'm with LucreziaBorgia - red flags, red flags. This defensive secrecy, the inflexible stance, are the tools of someone who's hiding something. Someone who was really "just" supporting a friend where there was no emotional connection happening would have every reason to continue acting like a loving husband, offering openness, reassurance, and understanding, for pete's sake, not stonewalling and insisting on "no compromise."

 

Put it this way, even if there really is nothing going on, it sounds like you guys have a fundamental communication problem here, don't you think?

[Trimmer]

Remember whats the worst that can happen? They have some kind of inappropriate emotional bond?

 

witabix - I mean this as a respectful counterpoint, but yes that is pretty close to the worst. And when it happens, believe me, knowing that you didn't have any control over it is no comfort.

[witabix]

Point taken Trimmer. Didn't quite mean it as a "so what?" remark, but thats what it looked like I know.

[confusedd]

Thanks for the advice everyone! Y'all are right. I don't think I'm crazy, I just wish my husband would listen to me. This female friend he has is in the midst of a divorce. My husband has known her since just after high school. He met her and her husband when they lived next door to him. She is now divorcing her husband because she wants her freedom.

The biggest thing about all of this to me is my husband has a co-worker is is a man who is in the midst of a divorce because his wife wants her freedom. He thinks this man's wife is acting immature since they have a child and supports the man. Now is friend who is a woman is doing the same to her husband except they have 2 small children (under 5) and he is supporting her. I understand we support our friends but isn't it our job as a friend to tell a friend when they are being ridiuclous and stupid???

When we last talked about his conversations with his female friend I asked him how he could play both sides of the same story and he told me I wouldn't understand.

 

I agree with you that it only makes me more upset and suspicious when he tells me to "deal with it" or " I don't need to worry about it since its HIS friend". I guess I thought when you married you truly put your spouse's feelings as a priority.

 

I understand he is friends with this girl and I ahve no problems with that but its the way he goes about it that I don't like. We both have friends that are male and female. His male friends call me to chat, my female friends can call him for advice, but this one friend in particular calls only him. The few times in our marriage when she has called our house she asked for him and when he wasn't there she hung up. No attempt to get to know me or anything before she decided I wasn't good enough for "her friend".

 

Anyway, thank you all for the advice I appreciate it and I'm gonna wait and see what happens. My husband truly is a great guy and we get alone wonderfully and have so much fun together. I don't believe in my heart or head that he is cheating or ever would, I trust him. I just wish when it came to this friend he wouldn't keep me on the other side of a closed door!

Thanks!

[seachange]

When we last talked about his conversations with his female friend I asked him how he could play both sides of the same story and he told me I wouldn't understand.

 

I just wish when it came to this friend he wouldn't keep me on the other side of a closed door!

 

Yes, that's the part that troubles me. That he would say to you, "you wouldn't understand" is tantamount to saying, there are parts of him that you cannot connect to - and she can. That is indeed like closing a door in your face, with the two of them in the room on the other side.

 

I think it is highly questionable that he wouldn't try to explain his thoughts and/or feelings about the two different divorce situations with you. Why is he so sure you wouldn't understand?

 

Either that was meant as just such an insulting, sidelining comment, or he knows you couldn't really understand without knowing all the facts--and he's making it quite clear that he's not going to share them with you. Though it's hard to say what either possibility will mean for your relationship at this point, neither bodes well.

 

Please, be careful. I know you've said you trust him, but this doesn't sound innocent to me. My advice? Reread LB's advice.

[Sami_D]

Please re-read LB's post. It might sound like she's being extreme, but I think she's totally right about this.

[michaelk]

Go see a divorce lawyer and get some legal advice on what to do if things go horribly wrong. Next, you'll want to put a keylogger on his computer so that you can monitor any emails/IM's etc. You'll want to consider blowing the whistle on using work phones to carry on an affair, as well. Check the policy on personal use in regards to phones. Don't worry about over-reacting.

 

I find this advice just unbelievable. Essentially you are suggesting that she take whatever damage her H has done to her trust, quadruple it, and turn it back on him! This must be the 'nuclear arms' approach to saving a marriage. A so-called 'emotional affair' is something they might recover from. But if she does all the things you suggest and he finds out, they're that much less likely to make it.

 

This reminds me of Albert Einstein's famous saying: You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war. Just substitute 'divorce' for 'war'.

[LucreziaBorgia]

I find this advice just unbelievable.

 

What advice would you give the poster to find out what she needs to know about this? She needs solid evidence, or else her H will continue to lie to her and gaslight her and the affair will continue. People who lie don't simply stop lying out of altruistic reasons, nor will they stop lying when asked point blank to tell the truth. They stop lying only when given no other options.

 

How do I know? I've always been the 'wayward bad guy' so I understand the need to protect the affair and I understand what lengths wayward people will go through to keep the affair going. I know how deep they will bury the truth. I know this guy will not be truthful with his wife until he is backed into a corner with a stack of solid evidence - evidence found only by drastic measures like I mentioned.

 

So, that given - if you don't believe she should go to drastic measures - what is your suggested plan of action which will get her the answers she needs in order to end this affair and reconcile? What can she say or do to stop the lies and make him be truthful with her when the evidence is deliberately hidden from her?

 

As for me personally, if there is no smoke - then there is no reason to look for fire. I don't advocate snooping if there is no apparent reason to, but given this story there is plenty of reason. Reconcilation between these two cannot happen if this affair is allowed to grow and be nurtured in secrecy.

 

How do you suggest they work toward reconciliation without exposing the affair?

 

The poster needs all the help she can get, so an alternative approach in terms of building her plan might help out considerably.

[lilmoma1973]

 

I'm sorry but all the red flags are there .. He is having an affair with her be it emotional or physical.. If nothing was going on then why would it matter where he called her from !!! If my h told me to deal with it or get over it i would say get out of my house because i can't deal with it !!! Something is going on between these two and you shouldn't let it keep going on.. He must think you are stupid... Kick him out he is making a fool of you and you don't deserve this.. Good luck hope it works out

[Trimmer]

This reminds me of Albert Einstein's famous saying: You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war. Just substitute 'divorce' for 'war'.

 

Sorry, but while this is a famous quote, and certainly sells a lot of bumper stickers, I don't agree that your bit of wordplay creates any useful generalization. Gee, just substitute "smallpox epidemic" for "war"... or just substitute "hurricane damage" for "war"....

 

Or "affair".

 

michaelk - in view of the observed behaviors, what alternate advice do you offer the OP? Talking isn't working. Should she walk away? Just trust him and move on? What do you recommend?

[michaelk]

michaelk - in view of the observed behaviors, what alternate advice do you offer the OP?

 

First off, let me say that I'm certainly no expert here. I'm just responding based on how I would feel if I were him and I discovered she had been spying on me. To my way of thinking, that's a breach of trust in the same vein as his refusal to conduct his 'friendship' in the open. That said, here is my humble advice.

 

She needs to force him to take this seriously. If I were her, I wouldn't stand for the 'get over it' attitute of her H for a second. He's being a total ass and she needs to tell him so in no uncertain terms. She should insist that this 'friendship' with this other woman be conducted in the open (i.e. phone calls at home). If he's not willing to do that, then she must demand that he end it altogether. She needs to drive the point home by threatening to leave. And if he doesn't respond to THAT...well, apparently he has mentally left her already, so she shouldn't be hanging around anyway (unless there are mitigating circumstances).

 

Now let's say he won't agree to conduct things in the open, but does agree to end it. Very suspicious. How does she know that he isn't just taking it underground? She doesn't - yet. This is the point at which she really needs to keep her eyes open. She should do everything she can to monitor what he's doing short of keystroke capture programs, ratting him out for making personal calls, etc. Note when he comes and goes. Make sure the cell phone bill and credit card bill don't have anything weird on them. If he goes out of town, verify that he is where he says he is by calling him. Interact with his coworkers socially, if there is opportunity to do that. Drop by the office for lunch unexpectedly. Etc, etc.

 

In other words, if you put your foot down and you still suspect he's deceiving you, you need to 1) make sure he knows you're alert while staying within the bounds of reasonable behavior, and 2) take actions that will eventually give him away without putting you in a position where he could accuse you of breaching the trust yourself. Granted, this requires more patience than simply hiring a private detective, but what you gain is that you cannot be accused of worsening the situation on the off chance that he really does listen to you and ditch this other woman.

[Mary3]

I also want to say BIG RED FLAGS to the OP ! Sadly , you should check your financial and legal aspects NOW before he gives you the kiss off to your marraige.

 

He should NOT be so secretive . Devastating results here I see as long as he protects HIS friend.

 

I had a similar situation but I was not married. But he insisted to keep her as his friend and we broke up.

 

You lose.

 

Take care of yourself and your children ( if any ) because your husband is not thinking clearly or fairly.

[lilmoma1973]

 

I'ts evident he is getting something from this friend if he wasn't he wouldn't tell you will have to get over it!! There has to be some type of connection to tell you that and i would keep my eyes and ears open ... I think there is more to this than a friendship!!! Good luck:laugh:

[imagination]

You gotta watch out from my own personal experienced. Yes, you shouldn't be worry about physical contact between them, but you gotta be careful about emotional attachment. My husband had met this girl online, known her 3 years before met and married me. All I heard was that her husband treated her bad and she had no place to go and needed help. I said nothing even though inside I wasn't happy when he has so many female friends. Don't get me wrong, having friends is good, so you can have someone there for you in bad and good time but your husband has female friends? Yes, he once asked me if it was okay to have her moving in with me so I can have a friend because her husband kicked her out/ I think she moved out to live in shelter. He also said her husband didn't care about her at all. Then months later I found his email that he wrote of how much he loves and misses her during that time. I felt my heart was cut in thousands pieces, my feet didn't want to move, I cried so hard. So, after that I asked him about email he said that he has an emotional attachment with her, not physically, he said that she used to call him and sang him to sleep. So you see emotional is stronger then anything, so please please for right now, try to get him close to you as much as possible, be there and don't nag or get mad at him for right now. You need to win his heart over this woman but in a nice way. Let him know that you're the only one he can talk to, rely on, and always be there for him. If you dont, he might one day leave you and your children for this woman.

[Mary3]

Theoretically that might work to keep close by his side but if she wants this to keep going ( the other women friend ) then as much as he tries ( if he even wants to try ) she is going to be in the background trying to stay out front.

 

If he has no desire to end it because his feelings are deeply connected to her , then well, you lose (again).

 

And to make him pick , well that does not only work to our favor. They decide YOU need to go and they keep their friend.

 

Its sad.

[Kenyth]

This is a flirtation type affair. You don't have to put up with it. Either you're involved with other people as a couple, or not at all. Anyone of the opposite sex who want's alone time with your spouse is up to no good, period!

[jane23467]

OP - I've been in a similar position - see my thread recently. All this happened several years ago and it still hurts. My self esteem where this woman is concerned is nil. Me and him spent hours talking last night. I detailed everything that had hurt and why it still had an effect on me. For the first time I think he understood. Also, I've a male friend moving to this city and he'll know no-one when he gets here, my OH was able to understand how I felt by me using this friend as an example, like "how would you feel if ..." My OH is now going to finish the relationship with her now, the hard part for me is going to be trusting he's done it and it's not continuing secretly.

 

Believe me, if you allow this to go on you will feel like crap for years to come. Make him make a decision now - her feelings or yours, because that's what it comes down to. Good luck with it all, my heart goes out to you.