Awkward at 40

[KevinM]

Here's the deal. I'm 40, and I still end up tripping over myself when I approach a woman I'm interested in. I've had two long-term relationships, and I've always done well in life. It's not like I'm some undateable paraiah! But when it comes to women, hooking up initially is just so damned hard.

 

My natural inclination is always to hold back, go slow, look for a sign that she's interested. Because I'm afraid of another failure, I tend to drag this out way too long. By the time I get around to acting, I end up embarassed and stuck in the 'friend zone' or 'coworker zone' or such.

 

On the flip side, if I get brave enough to be assertive and act quickly I get awkward and nervous. Again, I'm afraid of failure, so my words don't come out right, or I go too over the top, and I'm sure I seem either overanxious or fearful. The outcome of this is usually predictable.

 

I'm sure this kind of issue has been aired here many times, but I'd be interested in hearing some thoughts on the subject, especially from anyone who has battled the same problem.

[Sandyshine]

Remember you can absolutely continue living if she turns you down.

Lighten up, it's not so important.

 

you don't have a deadline to mate by, do you?

 

Start neutral friendly, move to sexy banter (use sparingly) see how she respondes. You can back off forever or just retreat to friendly till you think it's a better time for sexyness.

 

I shoot down men all the time, some are creeps, some I just don't know, some seem nice. Rejection can be for a number of reasons and it's not always about the man.

 

A woman may not have time for this, may have her sites on another, May be acting cool because her gossipy sister is around etc.

[KevinM]

That's good advice I'm sure. It makes a lot of sense. But somehow when I'm in the actual situation, I can't control getting 'stressed', which in turn makes me do something wrong or give off the wrong vibe.

 

Maybe part of the problem is that I usually don't like to approach someone until I know her. I'm not the typical guy who will hit on a girl just based on how she looks. I need to know what kind of person she is. Once I do and I am ready to act, I will already have some feelings for her, maybe friendly maybe more. So then the stakes are too high to be casual. I can't go in with the attitute that I have nothing to lose, so I get stressed.

 

The other problem is that I have no idea how to make "sexy banter". I'm not even sure what it would sound like!

 

*sigh * How can someone my age still be baffled by this kind of thing? :-(

[fusangite]

I'm in the same boat as you and have asked the same question in different forms literally dozens of times on forums like this. But because I remain continuously and irrationally hopeful, I'll monitor this one too.

 

Generally I find that when one asks this question on the internet, the dialogue goes something like this:

Respondent: You need to be more self-confident.

Original Poster: I know; I'd really appreciate learning strategies for doing this.

R: Look man, you've just got to bite the bullet and be self-confident.

OP: I know. But I find I'm still anxious when I move forward.

R: Look, if you're not self-confident, women won't find you attractive.

OP: I know. That's why I started this thread.

R: I think you just don't want to be helped.

[Outcast]

Fake it till ya make it. You may not be self-confident but pretend you are. Doesn't mean that you act like a boor. It means you stand tall, don't apologize for everything you do, and express some of your own opinions, wishes, and desires but do so politely.

[Nur]

I think getting over awkwardness is mostly a learned behavior. That you haven't learned to do it by 40 is not the best thing to be starting with, since most people try to master this in their teens.

 

First, try watching people who seem very self-confident and smooth. How do they stand? How do they move? I'd be willing to bet that they have open expressions, do not fidget, speak slowly and clearly, and meet the eyes of whomever they speak with. Humans are amazingly adept at picking up even the slightest cues -- make sure yours are of confidence.

 

If it your problem focuses more on what to say -- well, in that, too, practice makes perfect. The entire idea is sort of a delicate balance -- if you do not flirt or hint, you will be a "friend," but if you come on too strongly you'll be a "creep." It's a sort of delicate balance between them that you must learn and perfect yourself; there is no recipe. It's intuitive. Remember, sometimes a girl just plain won't be interested. I've had seemingly nice guys flirt with me sometimes, but I didn't always return the feelings, or was already involved with someone else, even though they did everything "right"

on their part. Sometimes it's just her, not you.

 

Remember, your body language not only affects how others see you, but it affects how you feel. You can make yourself in a better mood by smiling! (It's true!) The same applies here. If you act confident (and get into the habit of it), with your shoulders back and your chin up and your stride sure and unhesitant, then soon you'll find your feelings follow. Perhaps this will help to dispel some of your nervousness and the women you approach will at least give you consideration.

[Milo]

Fake it till ya make it. You may not be self-confident but pretend you are. Doesn't mean that you act like a boor. It means you stand tall, don't apologize for everything you do, and express some of your own opinions, wishes, and desires but do so politely.

 

Good advice, Outcast.

 

I'm about 40 myself, but I don't feel the least bit disadvantaged. You conversations with women you think you might be interested in serve a dual purpose. They introduce you and they collect information about the woman for yourself. It's not a one-way transaction. So talk about things that interest you as well as things that appear to interest her.

 

Also, don't worry about holding a continous conversation with anyone in particular. If you are at say, a party, you can converse, leave for a bit, return to simply listen, etc. Work the room some. That works great when you feel like you are delving into conversations you don't want to really get into at the moment, or you suspect you welcome is running thin.

[tinktronik]

Hmm, interesting post.My s/o is in his 40's and would never approach a woman unless they acually spelled it out for him.I litteraly had to start sleeping in his bed monagomosly for several weeks before he took the hint. This seems very strange to me . However Is it possible you are just missing the signals that a woman may be interested?

[KevinM]

Wow, so much advice, I'm sure all of it good.

 

To Sandyshine: It's easy to say 'lighten up' but if it were that simple I wouldn't have this problem in the first place. I don't usually approach women until I know them a bit. I'm not really interested in hitting on complete strangers. And by the time I know them, I've started to become emotionally invested at some level, which then makes me feel that the stakes are higher and rejection a bigger blow.

 

I would definitely like to "Start neutral friendly, move to sexy banter (use sparingly) see how she respondes." but to be honest, I have no idea how to make sexy banter. I'm not even sure what it sounds like!

 

To Outcast: I'm actually pretty good at pretending to be self-confident. Just not around women I'm interested in! In other aspects of my life, this is not an issue. Just here. Guess I need lots more practice.

 

To Nur: More than stance or actions, my problem is definitely that I don't know what to say! Somehow I always seem to come away feeling I've put my foot in my mouth. And that fine line between "friendly" and "creepy" is pretty elusive (at least to me).

 

To Milo: All good suggestions. Thanks!

 

And to tinktronik: Sounds like your SO is way worse off that I am. Boy is he lucky he found you! Honestly, I don't know if I'm missing women's signals or not. I guess if I were, I would be too dense to know it! ;-)

[Metabaron]

I have the same problem. After I get to know the person I can talk and joke, but not before. And the problem is if you never meet a person you'll never get to know them. Ok, not a rocket science. I've watched a few people who do it - so fake that it made me sick. But it works. You know how they say 'Be Yourself' - well that won't get you anywhere. You have to be one of those guys you despise, one of those that makes an idiot (at least to other men) of himself. I can't do it, but I know what to do.

 

Anyway, to offer some help perhaps. The way to do it is to practise. Practise on people in elevator, people you meet, cashiers, travel agents, men, women etc... So get talking to someone with whom you are not romantically interested. It will get you somewhat more comfortable approaching women. Also, it might be helpful to keep a log - something I've been meaning to do for a while now - like just somewhere to log that you talked to woman on such and such day or kept the conversation going. Once a week review that and if you aren't getting anything down time to visit more travel agencies, stores etc... . Also, it's important to reward yourself for job well done - if you've done well the previous week or month.

 

The real problem is that we men are not taught these things early. And the other problem is that both men and women create the picture of the person based on initial contact and sometimes the way a person looks. On countless times I've tought of a person to be an idiot only to later become their best friend. The opposite was true as for some people I thought intelligent at first only to find out later I was wrong.

 

I would also like to ask women not to judge men by some irrational thing and not to put a dagger in man's heart. I like women who if they are not interested they say so openly and with a normal voice. Unfortunately some women can be real cruel when it comes to rejecting a man or they play a little game where they are giving you false signals only to let you down later. Some laugh you off. Unfortunately this is like a dagger in a man heart. It's unexplainable why we men are like this, but we are.

 

Anyway, some thoughts from me.