How do you recover from child abuse?

[Becoming]

Great post, enki. Your description of the armed forces as the tooth fairy in cammies had me laughing out loud. :lmao: Sounds like a real win-win situation for you. Here in the US, you'd have been in the 101st invading other countries (oh, don't get my political rhetoric going!) And of course, you can share as you wish and at whatever comfort level. Glad it has felt somewhat safe. But I now have this picture of a frothy tooth fairy in cammie with a big-ass gun emerging from a cloud of smoke and destruction as the conquering hero. (Too many movies, obviously!) You made it out of your past alive and are now helping to liberate others. You really are a hero.

 

Those of us who are helpers often have nowhere of our own to turn to for help. Then again, maybe that's just my beliefs trying to tell me there really is no help available even if I ask for it. . . . Who knows? Work in progress. . . .

 

I've been thinking about Rumplestiltskin a lot lately. Had no idea why, but generally when stuff like this keeps popping up, I've finally figured out to pay attention to it. But now I know why: we are all spinning straw into gold.

 

So I went back to look up the story and found this:

The name Rumpelstilzchen in German means literally "little rattle stilt". (A stilt is a post or pole providing support for a structure.) A rumpelstilt or rumpelstilz ("rattle stilt") was the name of a type of goblin, also called a pophart or poppart ("rapper" or "thumper") that makes noises by rattling posts and rapping on planks, similar to a rumpelgeist ("rattle ghost") or poltergeist ("noisy ghost"), a mischievous spirit that clatters and moves household objects. (Other related concepts are mummarts or boggarts that are mischievous household spirits that disguise themselves.)

 

In my case, as was true for the poor miller's daughter, my father's desire to look bigger in the eyes of society (and his, of course) led to me as a child being in the impossible situation of trying to spin all this straw into gold when I didn't have a clue how to do that. In fact, I knew I couldn't. Enter the dwarf Rumpelstiltskin, a force that looked like he would help us do the impossible--but at a price--our first-born child. But we agreed (what choice did we have, really?).

 

Years later, the force that saved us now wants what we hold most dear. The only way to save our first-born child is to get the best of our poltergeist ghost from the past is by guessing his name. This is akin to exorcism where you need the demon's name. It seems to me that therapy is about tracking Rumpelstiltskin to get the demon's name and power over it. I feel like I've gone through dense forest and have now happened upon this poppart dancing around the fire thinking he's won. I have been watching his dance and am listening now to his chant. I feel like I am about to learn the name.

 

The thing is this poltergeist is me. It'd be easier if it were some external demonic force like in the movies. But it's a part of me. A part I don't understand that seemingly sabotages even as it has helped me get to be where I am. It is the part of me that is able to take a bad situation and make the best of it--at the expense of my innermost soul. I haven't really come to believe that I have any power in making my own situations. It's like I just accept whatever I'm placed in by others, like the miller's daughter. That needs to end.

 

As you said, enki, all these feelings are out of their cages, and they scare me. They won't go back into their cages anymore. They simply won't. And yes, they are calming down some, but I feel like the poet Byron who lived with a lion in his house. I just keep wondering when the lion's going to eat me.

 

It's like Max in Where the Wild Things Are (http://childrensbooks.about.com/cs/picturebooks/fr/wildthings.htm) only I can't seem to sail home. I haven't mastered the art of staring the wild things down like my dog (border collie) does with rapt attention as the queen of the wild things.

 

I like the idea of me becoming some kind of wild queen dressed in nature. A good queen, but one you don't want to mess with because I don't do bullsh*t. Must contemplate this more later.

 

So I saw Dr. Psychiatrist today. Very big older German guy with kind eyes. I like him very much. He spent 2 hours with me. 2 hours! Geez. He must think we're going to have a very long relationship. But he listened to me. So I'm being put back on med I was on before I slid slowly into this depression. Basically this med helps me sleep, but it can damage my liver, so we have to be careful. I was just so grateful that someone heard my cry for help. Last psychiatrist I saw in Oct. put me on fish oil, which helped with my pain but nothing else. If I had stood up for myself in Oct., persisted in saying I need help, people!, I wouldn't have lost months in morass.

 

As to the question enki raised: Does it help if instead we ask, “How do you feel in response to what I’m saying?” Actually, the way Dr. Smart Cookie asked the question was perfect in helping us discover what I actually do that I have never seen before. I just shut my feelings off. I go all Mr. Spock. It's like I have this split personality so that I swing between this huge Mr. Spock and all these little rumpelstiltskin emotions dancing wildly about. I think it's time for my miller's daughter to turn Wild Queen and quit being passively bandied back and forth, and/or quit swinging around like a female Tarzan and stand up with her feet planted firmly on the ground and say like Max to the whole rumpus drama, "Now stop!"

[Mz. Pixie]

Glad to hear the dr. visit went okay B!

 

You guys are amazing, that's all I wanted to say!

[blind_otter]

“Intuitive Feeling.” All four of us probably learned that at first as a survival skill hoping we could anticipate parental behaviour. It can now be an extremely useful way of assessing many situations in the world. It can also be another method to approach our own feeling functions.

 

HAH! I would bet money that you guys are INFPs or INTPs. Good ol' 1%-ers.

 

My mother broke into my house to clean my kitchen. I was glad but I was pissed that she still thinks I am some sort of apendage with no personhood. No space to be away from her and "safe".

 

I am still ambivalent about therapy. I need to just get it over with, but I've achieved a tenuous stability in the past few weeks that I am loathe to give up just yet.

 

And I second MzP's statement!

[Becoming]

E(just barely) N F J (which is why I want all this mess put away, now, thank you very much!)

[blind_otter]

Well shut my mouth! I woulda never guessed that in a million years. Maybe the J is a good thing, B. Too much P and you end up swimming in your mind all the time.

 

My goodness that was a letter attack. I was shooting letters at ya like ammo.

 

I've been taking Griffonia seed extract for about a week and a half. It has been quite beneficial. I am better able to roll with the punches.

[RubixCube28]

I was servearly emoshionaly abused and neglected tho out my hole child hood and into being a young adult..Not to mention other forms of abuse I won't get into here.. I find that the hardest times are when you have nothing to keep your mind bizzy.. Like night time that's always been hard for me prob why I have a prob with sleeping and night terrors..Any ways I find that you never fully get over it it's always in the back of your mind.. You need to personaly axcept it as part of your past..And find the best way for you too deal with it so you can move on.. I found that trying to be a better person then those that did it to me helped.. I am always trying to help others in my every day life..Also this may sound strange but too forgive the people who hurt you.. I found that to be helpfull as well.. Hope you can find the best way to deal with it for you.. Best wishes..

[Mz. Pixie]

Griffonia seed extract?? What the heck does that do for you?? I was thinking of Black Cohosh too- anyone ever taken that?? I guess I can wait until my appt next week before I go beefing up my otc meds though!

 

These personality test things you guys are talking about confused me. I've taken one but I don't know which one it was. Anyone got any links to take one? I'm curious. The last one I took said my dream job would be the office manager of a non profit foundation that I could really get behind. Because I like to help people, AND tell people what to do! :lmao: Mine are always off the chart for whichever aggressive personality type there is. The one I took at church was the otter (hey, it's party time) the golden retriever (very sensitive) the beaver (the planner) and the lion (the leader) I was the lion off the charts!

 

Welcome Rubik's to this thread! We welcome any type of contribution you have to this topic. Yes, when you are idle the time is harder, especially at night. I know what you're talking about as far as trouble sleeping. I don't have night terrors but maybe it's B_ot that does?? Good to see you, and feel free to post anytime.

 

I feel like we have our own little private board going here ladies!!!!

 

Today was a hard day for me. Not to mention the earlier drama of the week I've been going on and on with the ex about the kids' schools. They got accepted to the school, the best private one in this area. My new inlaws have offered to help me pay for it without any additional funds from him- that is where my ss goes too. She has offered to pick them up afterschool and keep them at her house- even during the weeks he has them. He still wants to be an ass!

 

I had my mammo today. I have had a lump removed from my right breast years ago- non cancerous but about the size of a quarter. Since 2003 I've had one in my left breast and my OBGYN wants me to have it taken out. I was considering it- she said afterall that was the only way to know 100 percent it wasn't cancer. So, I go today to have it rechecked. They call me back and tell me that they need more films. So, I go back to have the other films taken and start pulling off my right sleeve and she was like ummm no it's your left. She puts the films up on the screen and I can't even freaking see anything. Written on it is arrows with the word "Penetration". That kinda freaked me a bit. So they take films of the left and squish me hard. Then I had to have a ultrasound of both breasts.

 

Turns out I have a tiny hard flat cyst in the left breast. She seemed more concerned about it due to it's size and the fact it's flat not filled with fluid. She wants to look at it again in four months. I also have another one in the right breast I didn't even know I had. All in all I was over there for three hours. What was scary is that they found one in the left that I couldn't even see on the film, and I also had one in my right I hadn't felt. All the anxiety of waiting and being pushed and prodded kinda exhausted me. I lost my best friend to cancer when we were 28, and I'm 38 now. Scares the piss out of me.

 

I rush back to work, and I have to take a half of a day personal pay to make up the hours I'd been gone. Which pisses me off because I really like to use my time for fun stuff ya know like vacation.

 

I know I complained earlier about being bored but since then I've been swamped. My desk was covered. We're busier at the end of the month because I work in a sort of real estate atmosphere- without giving too many details and there are more closings at the end of the month. Then, my immediate boss tells me if I take a half of a day I will need to leave early too or I will have too much overtime by the end of the week. I freaking hate punching a time clock and I didn't have to do it until I got in this department because before I was management. Everyone in the office gets so bitchy at the end of the month, and one of the girls had a death in her family so my immediate boss is getting bombarded with her stuff too and bitching about it. Well, that is why you're the boss sweetheart. When I was the boss in my old department I had to cover my employees desks too!

 

So I leave early and hub is out of school. He's studying to take his Praxis in math so he can teach algebra next year and one of his fellow teachers is tutoring him. He wanted to meet up afterwards so I go over to school and he's not done yet. He calls me as I'm getting out of the school driveway and we go to a little place we like for dip and chips and tea before he heads to his other job. It's three nights a week so we can get out of debt to build a bigger house for all of our younguns!

 

I just feel so defeated sometimes, like giving up. Today was one such day. That is why I had a hard time earlier focusing on Becoming's thread. I find it hard to concentrate when I don't feel well emotionally. So I sit across from him and look in his eyes and he reaches across the table and just holds my arms and pulls them across the table to him and leans down and kisses my hands. He said, "You feel helpless, don't you?" Yeah, I do.... the school situation- it's the best for the kids and I'm spinning my wheels which in turn leads to me thinking it's my damn fault because I wanted to get a divorce so I could be happy. I just don't know what to do about it. I can take him back to court but what if he goes for full custody? I could lose even though I'm not abusive and I'm a great mom. The only thing I believe could ever make me try to take my own life would be losing my kids. I'm so tied up in being a good mother because I never had one. He knows this but he hates to see me letting my ex take advantage of me and not do what's best for the kids.

 

I told H I felt like there was no place to hide. I know what's right for them but if I pursue it I could lose what I have?? H said that if it didn't work out the way we wanted it to then he was always going to help me get them picked up (it's 45 minutes one way). Then he leaned down and kissed me and told me I was too beautiful to try to hide.

 

I felt very destructive tonight on the way home. I have felt that lately when I get down. Like I could get drunk, or go on a wild shopping spree, or worse. Since I have no addictions yet, what's up with that??

[Becoming]

Welcome, Rubix! Feel free to jump in anytime. You're right--it's when I'm alone that all my past demons come out to play, too. Which may be why I don't like being alone too much. I like it some, but not too much.

 

Anyone else have trouble sleeping as well? The meds I've been put on are primarily to help with sleep. I have never in my life slept well. Rarely do I have night terrors, thank God. I hate those.

 

MsP, I'm sorry you're having a bad time. :( I know that strange destructive desire. I usually go shopping during those times. I don't know why. It can just be grocery shopping or going on the WalMart run. I think it's because being able to buy something makes me feel powerful instead of helpless. Isn't that weird?

 

But mention that destructive desire to dr. because it's a sign the depression could be getting worse.

 

You've got a lot going on right now. My sister-in-law is the person in charge of closings for a real estate firm so I know some of her pressure and how busyness affects everyone in the office. I hear it from her. Whyever would you think your H could get full custody of the kids?

 

And what a sweetie your H and family is. You're going through this tough, tough time, and he's working nights, too. That's difficult. You've got a lot on your plate. I think sometimes that the depression is trying to tell us "Too much!"

 

Maybe we have a tendency to stay too busy to keep running from the bad memories/thoughts?

 

And yes, please do tell us what in the world griffonia is., Otter. It sounds like something akin to unicorn horn powder or something from a griffon. Never heard of it. I take black cohosh for hot flashes, and that stuff works well for that. Not so sure about the depression except I'm not waking up 6x/night sweating and cold.

 

I can see how having your mother show up to clean your kitchen would be both wonderful and awful, Otter. Can you send her over? I've got a whole basement she could organize . . . .

[enki]

Hello Rubix, and please allow me to join with MzP and Becoming in welcoming you to the thread. As you love cats, perhaps you might enjoy this: “Dogs have masters. Cats have staff.”

 

MzP, there is an online version of the Myers-Briggs Test at

 

http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/JTypes2.asp

 

Alternatively, we could all just ask BOt! She picked most of us. Good for you, Otter.

 

Becoming, you certainly are “about to learn the name.” (The word “spell” as in witch’s spell, and the word “spell” as in naming are, as you said, relevant to the idea that if we can name something, it is conscious, so we can relate to it, rather than being “spell-bound” by it. After all we can’t relate to anything if we don’t know it exists.)

 

Those of us who are helpers often have nowhere of our own to turn to for help. Then again, maybe that's just my beliefs trying to tell me there really is no help available even if I ask for it. . . . Who knows?

 

Becoming, you do! Who said this?

 

“Come to Me, all you who labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.” Matt. 11:28.

“If anyone thirsts, let him come to Me and drink.” John 7:37 (But note 7:39, “But this He spoke concerning the Spirit … for the Holy Spirit was not yet given …”)

 

We won’t get help if we don’t know the name of the person to ask, will we?

 

When trying to understand fairy tales or dreams, I always stick closely to the rule in Ps. 18:22, (cited in Luke 20:17) “The stone which the builders rejected has become the chief cornerstone.”

 

If we read very carefully from a good translation of the original text of Rumpelstiltskin, we find that when he came to collect the Queen’s first-born, she offered him all the wealth in the kingdom, but he replied: “No: something human is dearer to me than all the wealth in the world.”

 

An unconscious complex, in this case a wild part of the animus, acts as if it yearns to become conscious, to have something human.

 

From the website “wild things” you gave us, “Max is ..the most wild thing of all” and make him their king. Max and the wild things have a fine time creating a rumpus until Max wants to be” …where someone loved him best of all.”

 

It was common in ancient times for parents to sacrifice their first-born child, as Abraham thought he would have to do with Isaac. The texts usually say it was to “propitiate” the god involved, whatever that means! In fact it was a ritualistic attempt to let the deity come closer to consciousness.

 

There is no suggestion that Rumpelstiltskin was going to kill the child or eat it. He just wanted access to consciousness. If he really didn’t want to have his name known, why not shift to another kingdom, or another dimension, rather than dancing around a fire in the middle of the night burbling his name out for all to hear?

 

And when he was named, and the spell was broken, what happened? He tore himself in two. One half remained in the earth, here with us. And the other half? Well, it did what BOt’s and my favourite Yeats poem said:

 

“ … love fled

And danced upon the mountains overhead

And hid his face amid a crowd of stars.”

 

There is always an earthy bit and a spiritual bit to love, even if it is a god of love: even, Becoming, if it is your God of love. Does he not have an earthly component in your increasingly admirable and heroic H., and a heavenly component personified by your Living Christ?

 

And the name? “God” is an Anglicised version of “Yod” the first letter of the Tetragrammaton, the Greek word for the four-letter name of Jehovah, literally Yod, Heh,Vau, Heh.

 

Yod (Greek Iota, English Jot) is written as an apostrophe.

Heh is Hebrew letter E, and Vau is V.

 

Thus the true name of God is ‘EVE.

 

God’s son’s name is Yod Heh Shin Vau Heh, meaning literally “Tooth of God,” as the Israeli Security Service is called Shin Beth, Tooth of the House. The word would be written in English as ‘ESVE, Yeshua, English Joshua, Jesu.

 

Just a few notes on lions: “I just keep wondering when the lion’s going to eat me.”

This may not give much comfort, but we all get eaten by a lion sooner or later; not just any lion, but a Green Lion! (Seriously!)

 

In Alchemy and ancient poetry, the green lion represented the realm of Saturn, the Roman equivalent of Jehovah. (The Jewish Holy Day is Saturn’s Day. Saturn is the star of Israel.) In the days when people believed the earth was the centre of the universe, they believed that Ialdabaoth, Saturn’s realm was lion-like, and the child of Chaos. Psychologically that’s quite right. Whenever something comes up out of Chaos, the unconscious, we first see it as chaotic and wild, but as it comes closer to consciousness it becomes more civilised.

 

Alchemical imagery for emergence of the Self is shown in Ripley’s Cantilena, from which Jung cites:

 

“God gave thee the glorious, glittering armoury of the four elements, and the Crowned Maid [Virgo redimita] was in their midst. A wonderful balsam flowed from her and she shone with a radiant face, adorned with the precious stone. But in her lap lay the green lion, with blood flowing from his side. She was crowned with a diadem and was set as a star in the highest heaven…became a supreme victor triumphant, a great healer of the sick and a redeemer [reformator] of all sins.”

 

But why a green lion?

 

“And the “green-lion” of alchemy is the youthful form of the corn god, as also of the sun, the light.” [Neumann, 1991] Jung equates the blood of the green lion with the aqua permanens, and, citing Ripley, with spirit. [Jung, 1989 @293]

 

So there, dear Becoming is your ravenous lion, and there too is your potential to be Queen of Heaven. She is there for us all.

[blind_otter]

I am night terror girl. I've had them since I was a child. Mind consist of paralysis, and I FEEL like something is in the room. Or someone(s). I feel like I'm being held down, sometimes, and I can't move my mouth or speak or see clearly. I see blurry things all around me and I can't move and it freaks the hell out of me.

 

They were supposed to go away when I got older, they are common in children. But they never did.

 

I joke about my "alien abductions".

[Becoming]

Those of us who are helpers often have nowhere of our own to turn to for help. Then again, maybe that's just my beliefs trying to tell me there really is no help available even if I ask for it. . . . Who knows?

 

Becoming, you do! Who said this?

 

“Come to Me, all you who labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.” Matt. 11:28.

“If anyone thirsts, let him come to Me and drink.” John 7:37 (But note 7:39, “But this He spoke concerning the Spirit … for the Holy Spirit was not yet given …”)

 

We won’t get help if we don’t know the name of the person to ask, will we?

 

Sometimes you just want God with skin, though. Which is why I like Jesus. I do see the paradox fully human, fully divine in him. And he valued women over against most men of his age. In fact, scripture indicates that he was the embodiment of Wisdom, associated with Holy Spirit, who was personified as a woman in the wisdom traditions. That's why I simply cannot call the Holy Spirit a he.

 

Yahweh (the only name God gives when Moses asks) in Hebrew is a lovely word. It means I am who I am/I was who I was/I will be who I will be. It's just being-itself. Life energy. Full identity. What IS/was/will be.

 

And interesting stuff about the lion eating us. I love the Chronicles of Narnia and the description of Aslan the lion, an obvious Christ figure in the children's book. There's one part where Lucy snuggles down into the lion's mane as they ride off to save her brother that is so wonderful--safety and warmth we all crave.

 

Anyway, in ancient communion liturgies, a vestige of which still remains in the mass, there is the notion of the covenant meal where ritually we ingest the offering of one another so that there is a mutual indwelling of one another's essence. We often think of communion as being the offering of Godself to us, but even though I know this tradition, I've never offered myself up to be ingested by God. It's just a different, more terrifying metaphor in many ways. We think of offering ourselves to God, but not to be eaten!

 

There was this other god, Molech, in the ancient Middle East who was depicted as a huge mouth that babies were sacrified to. He was never satisfied, though, which is why there were perpetual offerings. There is a tradition of food offerings to Yahweh in the Hebrew scriptures, though, but it is one in which we eat and drink with God in fellowship, and God is well-pleased with our offerings of communion.

 

So we like Jung, do we? I've only dabbled in a couple books and like Joseph Campbell's stuff. I'm certainly no expert like you, enki! I just find all these symbols and myths fascinating attempts to describe Something More, the Mystery that holds our lives.

 

The real problem is that two deep belief systems are clashing in me. The one knows I am a child of God who loves/provides/cares/helps/empowers/disciplines. The other part is still being baptized (with my own tears, it seems), being washed clean of the beliefs my parents instilled that have been like wild things running rumpus over my life--that I'm not worth caring about; I'm here to please others; otherwise, I'm to keep my mouth shut (hence my current profusion of words!); that I'm here for others to do whatever they damn well please with me; that somehow it's all my fault; etc. I really do believe good will triumph in the end, though I have no illusions that this is a world that crucifies. It's just that redemption seems to be such a long process so that I find myself crying out like Habakkuk: "How long, O Lord, how long?" I just need to keep my eyes on the vision of the day of the Lord's peace/harmony/wholeness that is surely coming even though it seems to tarry and keep walking toward its coming.

[enki]

I FEEL like something is in the room. Or someone(s). I feel like I'm being held down, sometimes, and I can't move my mouth or speak or see clearly. I see blurry things all around me and I can't move

 

BOt, would you please describe any of these things or people as well as you can. That would give us some idea of what is going on and we may be able to work out some solutions.

 

Becoming, it's 3.30 a.m. here and I just came on briefly to reply to BOt. Would it be OK for me to give some thought to what you last wrote and provide a more reasoned reply in about 14 hours?

 

Meanwhile for some rather beautiful images of the Goddess in Nature, perhaps try

 

http://www.jonathonart.com/intro.html

 

Cheers from one very sleepy enki.

[blind_otter]

THe best I can describe them? I did it a buncha times as a kid and was told it was my very vivid imagination. But since my sub-acute seizure cluster in 2003, I don't really HAVE a vivid imagination any more. So I dunno what to make of it now.

 

It's usually like I wake up, and am fully aware, but I have no control over muscle movement or fine motor coordination. It takes great effort o open even my eyes. I see things, which I assume are either normally not perceptible, or just random creations of my brain electricity misfiring. Tall, very thing, shadowy figure(s). Sometimes one, sometimes more, never more than like 3 or 4. Above me, around me. I don't feel threatened so much as I am frustrated and upset because I can't move. It's like a waking dream. Then I suddenly come to, usually very groggy, like I didn't get good sleep, and everything in reality is completely different from how I perceived things while half asleep and paralyzed.

 

This has happened as far back as I can remember, never more than one night at a time, at random (AFAIK) intervals.

 

I believed for a while that it wouldn't happen if I had someone/something in the bed with me. I have 3 dogs and a cat for that purpose! haha. But as an adult it has happened with other people in the bed with me, so I don't know. Usually the other person doesn't even register until I "wake up".

 

But it is strange.

[Becoming]

I am night terror girl. I've had them since I was a child. Mind consist of paralysis, and I FEEL like something is in the room. Or someone(s). I feel like I'm being held down, sometimes, and I can't move my mouth or speak or see clearly. I see blurry things all around me and I can't move and it freaks the hell out of me.

 

They were supposed to go away when I got older, they are common in children. But they never did.

 

I joke about my "alien abductions".

 

Is this like what happened to you as a child with the first rape? And were you drinking/drugging at time?

 

I had something like this happen when I was a child--except that I wasn't asleep. We lived in a house that my parents, moving into the area, got at a steal--big old Victorian--because everyone knew it was haunted.

 

I know there are physiological reasons for night terrors, etc. I watched my father go through a psychotic episode where he was convinced there were demons feasting on his entrails, which ended with medication. I don't want to scare you further, Ot, but you know there are some who would see this as a for-real thing. I saw the exorcists Ed and Lorraine Warren on campus one time years ago. They're the folks who worked on the Amityville house the movie was made from. At the end of it, they said something that has stuck with me: If you ever encounter something you feel is evil, I don't care if you don't believe in a thing. Invoke the name of Jesus Christ and tell it to go away in his name.

 

I fear sounding like some kind of fundamentalist Christian here, and I have no illusions about all the crazy sinfulness of the church, but I've often wondered, based on things that people have said coming back from death, if baptism doesn't REALLY mark us as God's and seal us against the harm of evil. Luther was reportedly plagued by what he saw as demonic forces, and he just threw the Bible at them yelled, "I have been baptized!" I have done this to all my crazy thoughts at times metaphorically, and it helps.

 

Then again, maybe it's easier for us to see evil as some externalized force we're doing battle with instead of as something from the dark nether world of our psyches, which once we expose all these to the light we see is not so evil after all.

 

I dunno what to make of all this, but I do know that what's happening to my H right now is evil. So, as I learned from an African-American Christian friend of mine, I just prayed a hedge of protection around him, that no evil could come close to him, that only good could flow in and evil out.

 

Seems I have a few spells of my own in prayer. So here's one for Otter:

 

Great I Am, you made our sister Blind Otter to be in communion with your goodness. Thank you for the open honesty of who she is. We're grateful for her adventurous curiosity, her deep ponderings, her willingnesss to share love. Wrap her in the safety of your comfort when she is scared. Protect her that no evil may touch her spirit anymore. Give her your wisdom, power, and courage to continue her quest to wholeness, that she may no longer be a blind oughter, but enlightened to live in joy, as you created her to be. Take all the accumulated crap of her life and compost it that she may blossom forth in the full glory of Life. I ask this through our brother Jesus who loves us enough to have taken the scourge of an abusing world on our behalf so that we might live to know the full power of your love. Amen.

[blind_otter]

Is this like what happened to you as a child with the first rape? And were you drinking/drugging at time?

 

Nope, I was molested by the swimming teacher. The rape when I was 12 was a teenaged boy at summer camp.

 

Actually now that you mention it it happened LESS when I was all f***ed up. I assume because my sleep patterns were messy.

 

I'm going to print out that prayer, sweets. Thanks!!

[Becoming]

Sweet dreams, enki! Nice pictures and accompanying essays I will read more of later. I'm currently looking for a picture of my Sophia, Queen of the Wild Things. She's equally at home in nature or in the best of ballrooms, and she has arrived in my imagination, like Venus rising from the ocean, in a wild outfit with a staff and shophar, which are interesting symbols.

 

MzP: We didn't adequately respond to what must be your fear as a result of all the mammograms. I have this picture in my mind of a rattly old car with springs that are shot when I think of you--not exactly a flattering picture, huh? But it seems there are all these things going on that have you as rattled as a shaky car (like ours), yet you just keep going like our trusty car. (No, I'm not saying you're old! )

 

You poured yourself out to us in narrative form, yet we have to read between the lines to know what you're feeling, so please forgive for guessing wrong. What friends do you have IRL to talk to about all this? Between this and xH being a butt and current H working long hours and kids going to this that and the other thing, and end of month rush at work, you must be run ragged.

 

One Christmas we were poor as church mice, so we had a "Would if I Could" Christmas where we sent one another gifts we would give if we could. Here are my "would if I could" gifts to you:

 

• you time to do whatever you wanted with whomever you wanted.
  
• vacation to anywhere in the world
  
• a cup of tea on fancy china dressed in hats and gloves and boas (a grown-up tea party!) with cute little sandwiches and treats and the leisure to talk with friends
  
• a bubble bath in a beautiful place, surrounded by candles, good music, novel of choice, and drink of choice
  
• knowledge you're going to be ok and freedom from the fear of cancer
  
• wholeness in mind, body, and spirit
  
• those great spontaneous bear hugs from your children
  
• good lovin from your H for a whole weekend alone
  
• xH to suddenly turn into a rational person who thinks of his children's welfare first
  
• a merry heart free from the darkness of depression
  
• a $5000 shopping spree for clothes and a makeover (though I'm sure you don't need one)
  

 

Others can add to this at will. Just know we are surrounding you with prayers and blessings.

[enki]

Tall, very thing, shadowy figure(s). Sometimes one, sometimes more, never more than like 3 or 4. Above me, around me. I don't feel threatened so much as I am frustrated and upset because I can't move. It's like a waking dream. Then I suddenly come to,

 

BOt: Are your slim figures like the ones in this picture

 

http://qag.qld.gov.au/site_popups/collectoin/collection/man_feeding_his_dogs

 

or are they even more stick-like?

 

Also, pardon me for being a bit thick, but I’m now unsure as to whether you are having true night terrors, or whether you are having a sort of transient paralysis as you wake up, and feel frustrated rather than afraid. If it’s the latter, you already know you have nothing to be concerned about (well, you’ve always come out of it haven’t you?)

 

However, it would be really interesting to hear more detail about the shadowy figures, such as whether they are male or female, and whether it would be possible for you to send messages to them. Clearly, if you can’t move, you can’t actually speak to them, but you probably know we can communicate in dreams without speech.

 

Please believe me. No matter how weird they are, all these images have some real meaning that can be put to use. Best wishes, and I’d love to hear more about them.

[enki]

she has arrived in my imagination, like Venus rising from the ocean, in a wild outfit with a staff and shophar, which are interesting symbols.

 

But every Queen has to have them; a staff to do her menial jobs, and a shophar to drive her limmo!

 

Hope you will forgive me Becoming, but that was too good to miss. You may have revenge though by envisioning this. My only visit to a synagogue was at the end of Yom Kippur, and of course they blasted out on one of these terrifying things just behind me, so I didn’t expect it. Apparently I nearly leapt out of my seat, and used MzP’s WTF word, much to the amusement of my friends.

 

To be serious, as personification of the final phase of the individuation process, Sophia as Queen-Priestess is truly our redeemer, and I would imagine could be reconciled quite easily with Christianity as a personification of the Holy Spirit. That’s why I included the reference to John 7:39 yesterday. Her staff and shophar can be seen as symbols of authority over the terrestrial and spiritual worlds respectively, earth and heaven, conscious and unconscious. Even Her colours, black, white and red are consistent. After all She owned those colours a long time before saints were ever invented.

 

If Gnosticism does not offend your belief system, there is some wonderful material on the web regarding Sophia in what scholars usually refer to as the non-canonical gospels. Such people would hold that the books of the New Testament were selected for political and philosophical (sic) considerations, rather than by divine guidance. I hope that view does not offend your faith, because if not, you may enjoy these links.

 

http://www.pistissophia.org/The_Holy_Spirit/the_holy_spirit.html

 

or go to:

 

http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/nhl.html

 

and follow the links half way down the page entitled

 

Writings dealing primarily with the feminine deific and spiritual principle, particularly with the Divine Sophia: The Thunder, Perfect Mind; The Thought of Norea; The Sophia of Jesus Christ; The Exegesis on the Soul.

 

As to being eaten by the Green Lion, please believe I was speaking about a metaphorical psychological process, not a concrete religious experience, and certainly nothing like the symbolism of the Mass.

 

When profound unconscious material comes into consciousness, it first appears as messy, even excrement, as Martin Luther experienced when he first had doubts about Catholicism. Later, as you and I both know, it takes on a demonic appearance, but eventually incorporates and grows roses.

 

Likewise we sometimes experience “going into” the unconscious, often symbolised as entering a cave, but also as if we are being “ingested” by a huge beast, as in Jonah or the Inuit legend with the same motif.

 

Finally I believe, I really do know, that this beautiful Queen who has come to you will transcend those two deep belief systems clashing in you. The ancient Sumerians called this Wisdom Goddess the Queen of Heaven and Earth because She reconciled the two worlds. They could see this Goddess in every woman.

 

Here is a translated fragment of one of their prayers to Inanna.

 

"Shining light of heaven,

light of the world,

enlightener of all places where men dwell,

who gatherest together the hosts of the nations.

Goddess of men, divinity of women,

thy counsel passeth understanding."

 

May She watch over you Becoming. You deserve it!

[Becoming]

But every Queen has to have them; a staff to do her menial jobs, and a shophar to drive her limmo!

 

Hope you will forgive me Becoming, but that was too good to miss. You may have revenge though by envisioning this. My only visit to a synagogue was at the end of Yom Kippur, and of course they blasted out on one of these terrifying things just behind me, so I didn’t expect it. Apparently I nearly leapt out of my seat, and used MzP’s WTF word, much to the amusement of my friends.

 

:lmao: :lmao:

Ohmygosh! I laughed long and loud at the thought of this. Thanks! I generally have the same reaction to bagpipes in worship. Why on earth?

 

Yet I found out interesting things about the shophar--I didn't really know what it symbolized--it was a calling of a special day of the Lord, a call to arms against enemy forces, a call to divine assembly. Quite interesting. I think the staff (not as handy as Jeeves, unfortunately:p ) is also about guidance and the power of God given to Moses to work divinity on earth.

 

And the Holy Spirit is most definitely female. Whoever says otherwise doesn't know Christian traditions. No other way to read all the materials, which I've explored. I may sound like a nut-case at times with the demonic thing, but I dunno. I know there's Something good at work through all the crap of my life. But I think I've always seen it as external to me, working through me at times, but not something which I exist within and which interpenetrates me, which is what I find interesting about the ancient texts of the mass. (I don't believe the whole transubstantiation thing as described by popular religion.) But the metaphor of ingesting God, of God ingesting us is fascinating. God doesn't want to consume me, as I think I've subconsciously feared despite my faith, given my past history and children's associations of parents with God. This force simply wants to be in communion with me to delight in me to discipline me so that I can get in on more good stuff God wants for me. This is a difficult thing for an abused child to believe even though it is our every wish. So despite this knowledge, there is this continual warring with a mixed-up childish faith. It's time to put away childish things.

 

Gnosticism was suppressed by the church in some unnecessarily evil ways, and the church too often plays mind games with women's faith to keep them subservient, which is what I think was really going on. So the feminine divine has become more important to me than it was in the past because it helps me see myself as a part of it all, indeed, as a powerful partner with this divine force for good at work in the world. The church at the present, though, isn't too supportive of these explorations, unfortunately.

 

It's interesting that my daughter asked me this a.m. if I thought there really was a devil. And I said no. I explained the meon, the nothing that precedes creation in many creation myths, a nothing out of which something emerges. The meon is beyond good and evil, yet always potentially good or evil, depending upon what we choose to do with it, a force which I think can become demonic in the way in which we appropriate/work with it. And I think that this perverted force requires personification and naming in order to work with its existence instead of allowing it to hover in the shadows of life undetected. Sometimes it's just the meon coming forth into the light of existence, but sometimes that nothing has become evil and needs to be met with resistance, not befriending. Discerning those two has become important for me. I could look at evil's destruction as the leveling that is necessary for anything new to emerge, but this pooh-poohs heinous genocide and violence that I don't think we would want to call good, even though belief in the resurrection can tend toward this.

 

Keep in mind that this is a person who can't answer those questions on psych tests about whether people are basically good or basically bad. I think each of us is a unique admixture of both.

 

Are there really demons hovering around our beds at night? I don't think so. But there are some who do. I have had sane, intelligent students from other countries refuse to sit in certain seats because they are already occupied by other spirits no one else sees. So I wonder if our culture just doesn't see these things anymore. I have had definite impressions of some kind of evil force around certain people, and I got one the first time I met my H's boss. By every external proof, he appears good, yet I told my H to always watch his back with that man, and it turns out I was right, as is coming to light. I have also seen good people seemingly chased by dark forces threatened by their goodness and progress toward the light, as though there is something in the universe, and perhaps in us as well, that doesn't want us to know we are children of God.

 

I think that this force of evil is one of our own making out of what philosophers call our meonic freedom. I don't think we're caught in some cosmic war between good and evil, as ancient gnostics did, at least as I understand them. Their writings varied a lot, and the church didn't always use proper discernment with regard to what so-called "opponents" were really trying to say.

 

I really do feel like these various forces in me are being pulled together around this figure who embodies wisdom, is a nurturing and creative ruler who is also a just warrior/champion for good.

 

Rumpelstiltskin is still rumpusing in the forest, but I think a showdown is imminent. I am learning his dance and finding the power of my royal voice.

 

A direct question: What does Jung thing about evil? Is there such a thing or is it only shadows in progress or what? I never could tell from my limited reading. But as abused children we have stared into evil's eyes, and it sure didn't feel benign.

[enki]

as abused children we have stared into evil's eyes, and it sure didn't feel benign.

 

Well said, Becoming. My parents solved the problem quite easily (for them .) They accused me of having evil in MY eyes! Simple, huh?

 

Unfortunately for me, as for the Jews under German National Socialism, as I was the putative carrier of all their despised, feared, hated ‘evil’ shadow material, they felt justified in treating me in a manner worse than any of my sibs copped. Before I was born, Father (a school teacher) had already been in trouble for hitting a female student across the face. He never did that in a school again, but the Education Dept. couldn’t do much about how he treated his own kids, and I learned at age 8 what happened if I told any teacher or other adult what the parents did to me at home.

 

Just a couple of points from your last post before we tackle Carl Gustav. First, please rest assured that I do not infer that the Judeo-Christian deity eats people. The Green Lion is symbolic of the unconscious, particularly the collective (universally shared) bit of the unconscious. I don’t see the unconscious and God as being identical: in fact, referring to what you called “children’s associations of parents with God” it would follow that a paternalistic God can be at best only half, and with respect, probably only one quarter of the totality of the psyche. If this offends you, please tell me and I will back off, but this view does open new ways of perceiving redemption, for both genders.

 

Keep in mind that this is a person who can't answer those questions on psych tests about whether people are basically good or basically bad. I think each of us is a unique admixture of both.

 

This question is in the Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory (MMPI) simply as a detector of optimism/pessimism. I didn’t know anyone in the Mid-West would concern themselves with the depth psychology of good and evil. I thought they just worked hard, drank Bud, voted Republican, and left ethics to their Preachers.

 

As to Rumpelstiltskin, I fancy he may evolve into a “Consort to the Goddess” rather like Hera-cles (who was Hera’s original consort before the Zeus-Apollo cult was incorporated,) or Cernunnos of the Northern Europeans.

 

A direct question: What does Jung thing about evil?

 

This is what Jung thinks. What enki thinks is another matter altogether!

 

Jung saw evil as a real entity in itself, and was quite impatient with those who deny the “…reality of evil, because they regard it as a mere privatio boni and thereby dismiss it with a euphemism.” CW 9 (i) Para 603.

 

He was concerned that propounding an all-good God left humanity in the possession of all evil, because with the fading importance of Satan, man had to carry the Devil’s burden. CW 7 Para 394.

 

“The unconscious is not just evil by nature, it is also the source of the highest good: not only dark but also light, not only bestial, semi-human, and demonic but superhuman, spiritual, and, in the classical sense of the word, “divine.” …the unconscious is essentially “duplex,” paradoxically dualistic by nature, fiend, monster, beast, and at the same time panacea, “the philosophers’ son,” sapientia Dei, and donum Spiritus Sancti.” CW 16 Para 389.

 

Jung’s principal work on God and the problem of evil is “Answer to Job,” in which he views the back of Yahweh (in the same sense that Moses did in Exodus) but argues that Job’s perception of the dark side of God led to the inevitability of God having to incarnate as human, otherwise humanity would know something God did not.

 

Unfortunately Jung made two errors. He wrongly attributed a greater role to Wisdom than the book of Job actually shows. Job 28:12 ff is the only mention of Wisdom, reducing to the rather anaemic conclusion in verse 28 “… the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom,…” Is that all?

 

Second, Jung either did not know or did not admit that the book of Job is pinched from two much earlier Babylonian works, The Poem of the Righteous Sufferer and Acrostic Dialogue on Theodicy. Neither of those spoke of the need for an incarnation, but then their writers would have ignored the Wisdom Goddess at their peril!

[Becoming]

My parents solved the problem quite easily (for them .) They accused me of having evil in MY eyes! Simple, huh?

 

I know some of what you're talking about with telling--no help, only made things worse at home. Don't ever do that! And I kept the secret well into adulthood. No one would have believed me because my parents were pillars of the community with absolutely no public blemish.

 

Here's the problem with naming evil, isn't it? It can be fairly relative in a sick way. While I think we do have to make some distinctions between what is the shaowy unconscious coming to light and darker forces at play, when we define something as evil, we run the risk, at the extreme, of genocide.

 

Herein lies the problem with some of psychology for me, at least what I read 25-30 years ago, and I know a lot has changed. There was a kind of "whatever feels good to the individual is good" mentality (grossly overstated) that falsely isolated an individual out of the whole matrix of social relationships. I know therapy is an isolation for the purposes of study and re-entry into ordinary life, but in America psychology has mingled with rabid individualism to lead to a "society" of isolated monadic narcissists.

 

I've seen changes in counseling practices in the last 10-15 years, but we still have an individualistic sense of entitlement to MY happiness here (as evidenced by our current administration off starting wars for the benefit of their oil business). It is even invading how we do church, which should be an exemplary community of how life is meant to be lived together. There ARE some universal goods upon which human rights are based; otherwise, we will continue to sanction abuse of all kinds on a continuum that leads to genocide and war.

 

I don't want to label something as evil in such a way that it perpetuates a cycle of abuse. Take Mr. Rumplestiltskin, for instance. I had labelled him a rather demonic force to be resisted. In my active imagination I asked him the other day why he wanted my child. I had always assumed it was because he wanted to boil her like a cartoon cannibal or something. And the reply came: "Because I'm lonely. I want someone to play with." Well, now we can work a deal where all can happily consort and poor Mr. Rumple will not have to tear himself in two. He knows he cannot have the child, but he's been invited to my castle where he can play with the princess under watchful eyes and where he can grow to self-realization with his many prodigious gifts. But he has to act in accord with the beneficient Queen's rules for the good of all.

 

That said, in real life, there is the need to resist that which destroys good. Where to draw that line in real life often has me stumped because it is all so ambiguous. In my case, my parents had their good moments, making the abuse all that more difficult to come to terms with in many ways. It's important to be able to draw some lines in order to have appropriate boundaries--to know what's good for me and what's not so good, at least not at this time--and this is difficult for me.

 

And interestingly enough, I often draw the line where others condemn those who are different from them, naming such difference as bad (which is what I think leads to genocide) Open-mindedness and the ability to see things from many perspectives is something I value, so I am in a quandry over how to distinguish good from evil sometimes, though I draw the line at words/behavior that hurts. Then again, sometimes something that hurts is just what's needed to heal. So it's all so confusing.

 

I'm sure we've all have trouble with appropriate boundaries. Anyone else been able to follow this post this far to be able to share their experiences with boundary issues? And help?

[blind_otter]

I've had a major problem with boundaries. I either have too many or too few. I went in search of a deeper understanding of the concept of self versus other a few years ago when I discovered the Buddhist principle of anatman, or "no self" -- the self concept we cling so vigorously too is nothing more than a collection of aggregates - sensory experience processed into information by the information filters that are our sensory organs, memories, experiences, each not arising independently, but interconnected through the river of experience and existence.

 

"Other" is a concept we create in order to achieve some kind of philosophical standard by which to judge self and other. In Buddhist theology, there is no "I" -- only the understanding that any concept of "I" is based in delusion. The ego has a tendency, like anything else living, to try to preserve itself. Misleading you into thinking that your thinking is reality rather than a collection of aggregate experiences.

 

Where do boundaries figure? I realized that they are tools. Frost said that good fences make good neighbors. I think it's like a relational shortcut -- misunderstandings occur all the time because our aggregates and preceptual organs differ organically. To establish some sort of baseline allows interaction to proceed smoothly.

 

But I find that some people react very negatively to me establishing boundaries with them. My mother, at first, because she was used to having no bounds with me. Children often rebel insistently because they very often lack an understanding of the concept and see it as cold or rejecting.

 

I have to manually close off many empathic impulses in order to maintain sanity for myself. Otherwise I would spend my time weeping for the pimples of humanity, fergawdsake.

[Mz. Pixie]

MzP: We didn't adequately respond to what must be your fear as a result of all the mammograms. I have this picture in my mind of a rattly old car with springs that are shot when I think of you--not exactly a flattering picture, huh? But it seems there are all these things going on that have you as rattled as a shaky car (like ours), yet you just keep going like our trusty car. (No, I'm not saying you're old! )

 

You poured yourself out to us in narrative form, yet we have to read between the lines to know what you're feeling, so please forgive for guessing wrong. What friends do you have IRL to talk to about all this? Between this and xH being a butt and current H working long hours and kids going to this that and the other thing, and end of month rush at work, you must be run ragged.

 

One Christmas we were poor as church mice, so we had a "Would if I Could" Christmas where we sent one another gifts we would give if we could. Here are my "would if I could" gifts to you:

 

• you time to do whatever you wanted with whomever you wanted.
  
• vacation to anywhere in the world
  
• a cup of tea on fancy china dressed in hats and gloves and boas (a grown-up tea party!) with cute little sandwiches and treats and the leisure to talk with friends
  
• a bubble bath in a beautiful place, surrounded by candles, good music, novel of choice, and drink of choice
  
• knowledge you're going to be ok and freedom from the fear of cancer
  
• wholeness in mind, body, and spirit
  
• those great spontaneous bear hugs from your children
  
• good lovin from your H for a whole weekend alone
  
• xH to suddenly turn into a rational person who thinks of his children's welfare first
  
• a merry heart free from the darkness of depression
  
• a $5000 shopping spree for clothes and a makeover (though I'm sure you don't need one)
  

 

Others can add to this at will. Just know we are surrounding you with prayers and blessings.

 

Awwwww, how sweet!!! I will take all of these "virtual" gifts and add, "Thank you ma'am".

 

I do feel kinda like that old car Becoming

 

IRL friends? Well, my best friend turned her back on me when I got divorced. She didn't approve of my relationship with my new H- as we met when I was separated. That is a wound that has not healed yet and it's been over a year since we've had a conversation. We'd been through 10 years of friendship and more terrible things that I can count.

 

Since I'm living in a new place, and we're attending a new church, H and I are struggling to build some friendships together. He has a few friends from before but not close because he's always been working so much. I have a few co workers that I'm good friends with. But, you know how you can have a friend and things just click with them? I am still wondering if I'm ever going to have that again?? In 10 years I've lost one best friend to cancer and another as casualty of divorce..... We're kind of in a rebuilding phase I guess you should say. My mother in law is a great source of comfort for me, as a matter of fact, she picked my kids up for me on Friday and had me a bouquet of roses when I got there. I think me not having closer friends is one of the things that is so hard, because I can't always depend on H for my emotional support- it's not fair to him, but yet I don't have much of anyone else.

 

I went over a hurdle on Saturday. My son had a basketball game at my old church that I attended for 18 years. I haven't been back there since way before I left my ex. Had to see alot of people I hadn't seen, who have all been sitting in judgement of me- and it was hard. One woman who I'd been really close to and worked in the nursery with for five years looked at me like I was a bug on her shoe and turned her nose up at me when she spoke. All of a sudden I felt H's arm go around my neck in support. Much of the other people were lukewarm. I did get one person that hugged me- a girl that used to babysit my son years ago. She was sweet. I almost broke down though over the old bat's reaction. It was all I could do to hold the tears back. Later H told me how proud he was of me he said, "You did it. You went in there and looked them all in the eye and held your head up high" He said he knew deep down how hard it was for me to do that and he's right, it was. I have to do it again in two weeks.

 

Tomorrow is the doctor. Hope she's blocked out a full hour for me or more!

[Becoming]

I've had a major problem with boundaries. I either have too many or too few. I went in search of a deeper understanding of the concept of self versus other a few years ago when I discovered the Buddhist principle of anatman, or "no self" -- the self concept we cling so vigorously too is nothing more than a collection of aggregates - sensory experience processed into information by the information filters that are our sensory organs, memories, experiences, each not arising independently, but interconnected through the river of experience and existence.

 

"Other" is a concept we create in order to achieve some kind of philosophical standard by which to judge self and other. In Buddhist theology, there is no "I" -- only the understanding that any concept of "I" is based in delusion. The ego has a tendency, like anything else living, to try to preserve itself. Misleading you into thinking that your thinking is reality rather than a collection of aggregate experiences.

 

Where do boundaries figure? I realized that they are tools. Frost said that good fences make good neighbors. I think it's like a relational shortcut -- misunderstandings occur all the time because our aggregates and preceptual organs differ organically. To establish some sort of baseline allows interaction to proceed smoothly.

 

But I find that some people react very negatively to me establishing boundaries with them. My mother, at first, because she was used to having no bounds with me. Children often rebel insistently because they very often lack an understanding of the concept and see it as cold or rejecting.

 

I have to manually close off many empathic impulses in order to maintain sanity for myself. Otherwise I would spend my time weeping for the pimples of humanity, fergawdsake.

 

 

Nice post. I like the idea of boundaries as tools. But if you go back and look at the Frost poem the quotation is from, it's in a negative light. The narrator ends up asking something like before I put a wall up I want to know what I'm walling in and walling out.

 

Ah, here it is: http://www.bartleby.com/104/64.html

 

I guess I've seen boundaries as more like walls and less like moveable gates that I can put up wherever I want whenever's appropriate. I think I've been like the obdurate neighbor in Frost's poem, following convention, when evidently my psyche is screaming for me to play with elves!

 

The Buddhist idea of the self I understand, but I think it mingles with the nonexistence I felt as a child so that I didn't know who to become, how to assemble all the disparate perceptions. Identity is a very fluid concept for me, perhaps too fluid at times. According to Jewish philosopher Buber, nothing can be distinguished from anything else without its other. That we all begin in relation and that only by distinguishing ourselves as other do we begin to have a self. Is that what you're describing?

 

The self-preservation of the ego I understand all too well. Even though I know losing self to find it is true in that sense, I think what I fear is flying off into the nothing I felt as a child, where others determine who I am. I KNOW (head) that can only happen if I let it. Still, I am fighting the fear (gut) that when I stand up for who I really am that I'll just get hit. I know, I know. My gosh, this fear is hard to shake. It's wily.

 

And I understand the needing to shut off the empathic. What's the trick to that!

 

And we still don't know what griffonia seed is. Spill.

[Becoming]

Wow. That must have been tough, facing all those folks. How great that your H understood and was there supporting you.

 

You've had so many losses in such a small amount of time. Hopefully you can plug into a church, maybe kids sports parents, where you can find some new friends. I find making friends difficult in real life. Like who has time between work and kids?

 

I lost a good friend to lung cancer a couple years ago, and it was tough. Your MIL sounds almost too good to be true. I rarely trust real goodness. I'm just left wondering when the other shoe will drop. Do you do that, too?

 

Please let us know about all your test results.

 

And hopefully your dr. tomorrow will help you. I found writing everything down and handing it to the dr. in a list of symptoms helpful this last time. If nothing else it organized my random thoughts.

 

Prayers for tomorrow's help.