Perspective

[ZA Dater]

6 minutes ago, FredEire said:

We all get older, unfortunately. But if you are 40 now all going well you still have half your life left, and when we're gone there's nothing you can do so you might as well make the best of the time you have.

I too find very few women attractive as in that "wow" factor but I don't have as many rigid requirements in terms of what the girl for me might look like. If there's an amazing chemistry that's the most important factor.

You need to welcome all possibilities into your life with open arms. Right now you have tunnel vision and have a very rigid view of how you want things to play out. But life doesn't give you what you want it gives you what you need, and sometimes that's a kick in the ass so you can learn a lesson.

If you are stuck though it's a clear sign that you are repeating the same old mistakes over and over again and not learning from them.

Will see what happens with the coffee date and whether it actually happens and then decide from there what I want to do, its tempting to pick up the entire dating thing and throw it in the metaphorical bin and accept what is.  Its clear to me OLD does not work for me, I spent a hour on Bumble and Tinder yesterday and no surprise no matches. The other flip side to all of this is the fact I try hide how lonely I am but just getting busy with other things, I sometimes wonder what would happen if I did confide in those closest to me but again they cant relate, for them dating has been a lot easier than me, its really accept and move on or try change what is.

Not an easy situation to be in because a lot of me does crave that attention and this is not a good thing, I did once look at arrangement type dating, went on two such dates but its very contrived and I did not enjoy it at all. Friend took me to a strip club, again a very contrived experience which is not really indicative of reality.

[FredEire]

5 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Will see what happens with the coffee date and whether it actually happens and then decide from there what I want to do, its tempting to pick up the entire dating thing and throw it in the metaphorical bin and accept what is.  Its clear to me OLD does not work for me, I spent a hour on Bumble and Tinder yesterday and no surprise no matches. The other flip side to all of this is the fact I try hide how lonely I am but just getting busy with other things, I sometimes wonder what would happen if I did confide in those closest to me but again they cant relate, for them dating has been a lot easier than me, its really accept and move on or try change what is.

Not an easy situation to be in because a lot of me does crave that attention and this is not a good thing, I did once look at arrangement type dating, went on two such dates but its very contrived and I did not enjoy it at all. Friend took me to a strip club, again a very contrived experience which is not really indicative of reality.

Maybe OLD is not for you, yes.

Have you ever tried martial arts or meditation groups/men's groups? You need to do things which boost your confidence rather than wallowing in defeatism.

[basil67]

29 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Also because I find so few people attractive when I do find one it becomes a very high stakes game, I really have no room to mess up and then the inexperience I have does not help either as my judgement is off so I end up having to wing it as best I can.

But you will mess up.  We all mess up and this is how we learn.  You don't get to skip that step just because you didn't do it your younger years or because you have limited options.   

 

 

[basil67]

8 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

I sometimes wonder what would happen if I did confide in those closest to me but again they cant relate,

To be fair, even those of us here with moderate success can't relate because we date within our leagues...........

[ZA Dater]

2 minutes ago, FredEire said:

Maybe OLD is not for you, yes.

Have you ever tried martial arts or meditation groups/men's groups? You need to do things which boost your confidence rather than wallowing in defeatism.

Most of whatever confidence I can find is off the back of whatever success I can find on any given day. Its odd really because I can deal with extremely difficult people and am not easily intimidated but when it comes to dating its very hard to carry that forward.

[ZA Dater]

3 minutes ago, basil67 said:

To be fair, even those of us here with moderate success can't relate because we date within our leagues...........

Well that has zero appeal to me at all, that being the case I'd rather just have nothing. Its very easy for to me to say no to what does not interest me much like people reject me for the same reason. I do not believe in leagues at all, in life you need to aspire to something else what is the point really?

By aspire in the dating context I mean be with someone you like not because they were the only option available, I know a great many people who did the "that will do" method and almost all are very miserable so there is definitely a flip side to that coin.

 

[ZA Dater]

8 minutes ago, basil67 said:

But you will mess up.  We all mess up and this is how we learn.  You don't get to skip that step just because you didn't do it your younger years or because you have limited options.   

 

 

Sadly time is not on my side and I do not have that much room for error especially based on how few people I do find attractive so its always going to be very difficult and I'll always be putting myself under a lot of pressure.

[basil67]

9 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Well that has zero appeal to me at all, that being the case I'd rather just have nothing. Its very easy for to me to say no to what does not interest me much like people reject me for the same reason. I do not believe in leagues at all, in life you need to aspire to something else what is the point really?

By aspire in the dating context I mean be with someone you like not because they were the only option available, I know a great many people who did the "that will do" method and almost all are very miserable so there is definitely a flip side to that coin.

 

What’s all this “only option available” business? Most people are degrees of average, but being average doesn’t mean they are lame partners or second best.  Average is normal.  Good people are normal 
 

[basil67]

6 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Sadly time is not on my side and I do not have that much room for error especially based on how few people I do find attractive so its always going to be very difficult and I'll always be putting myself under a lot of pressure.

None of this makes an iota of difference to the fact that you, just like all other beginners, will make mistakes.  You don’t get to skip this step just because you’re a late starter

[ZA Dater]

1 minute ago, basil67 said:

What’s all this “only option available” business? Most people are degrees of average, but being average doesn’t mean they are lame partners or second best.  Average is normal.  Good people are normal 
 

There has to be something that draws me to that person and equally not a lot of things which push me away.  For example I once had a date with someone, I found her voice extremely irritating and her conversational ability was poor, sure she might have been slim but those two things put me off completely.

I like extroverts in general and people who are in marketing, PR,  very people centric jobs because I have found their communication abilities are usually far better. 

[ZA Dater]

2 minutes ago, basil67 said:

None of this makes an iota of difference to the fact that you, just like all other beginners, will make mistakes.  You don’t get to skip this step just because you’re a late starter

What demotivates me completely is this, are people really going to be tolerant of inexperience and when I think about this its the analytical which wins out because why pick me who has little experience when they can have someone with experience. Its not like there is anything super special about me. Most dates would not be able to integrate themselves into my social circle either. Hence why one of the reasons I am keen on this lady is she is already well integrated in this circle and like me work and social are very blurred lines.

[basil67]

Just now, ZA Dater said:

There has to be something that draws me to that person and equally not a lot of things which push me away.  For example I once had a date with someone, I found her voice extremely irritating and her conversational ability was poor, sure she might have been slim but those two things put me off completely.

I like extroverts in general and people who are in marketing, PR,  very people centric jobs because I have found their communication abilities are usually far better. 

This has nothing to do with you saying that all of us average people (or our average partners) are somebody’s ‘only option available’ 

Have you got any idea how offfensive and judgmental your words can be? Given that were apparently all so bad at finding good partners, why do you lower yourself to seek out advice? 
 

[ZA Dater]

4 minutes ago, basil67 said:

This has nothing to do with you saying that all of us average people (or our average partners) are somebody’s ‘only option available’ 

Have you got any idea how offfensive and judgmental your words can be? Given that were apparently all so bad at finding good partners, why do you lower yourself to seek out advice? 
 

I simply do not categorize people as average I think of them as people, that is the difference, a CEO is a person, a guy begging for money is a person. I do not think average is actually appropriate because most people are good at something. Never said people do not find good partners I just would not think of a partner as average.

[basil67]

Just now, ZA Dater said:

I simply do not categorize people as average I think of them as people, that is the difference, a CEO is a person, a guy begging for money is a person. I do not think average is actually appropriate because most people are good at something. Never said people do not find good partners I just would not think of a partner as average.

So if you think of others as just people, it makes no sense that you only go for the prime pickings.  
 

[FredEire]

2 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

I simply do not categorize people as average I think of them as people, that is the difference, a CEO is a person, a guy begging for money is a person. I do not think average is actually appropriate because most people are good at something. Never said people do not find good partners I just would not think of a partner as average.

I think you actually don't think of them as people at all, that's the entire problem. You think of women as either a wonderful princess who would rock your world or someone you would have to lower yourself for with nothing to offer.

As I've said before even your most desirable woman would look ugly in the morning. When you take away appearance we are all very similar and go through the same trials, tribulations, doubts and challenges in life.

[basil67]

11 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

What demotivates me completely is this, are people really going to be tolerant of inexperience and when I think about this its the analytical which wins out because why pick me who has little experience when they can have someone with experience. Its not like there is anything super special about me. Most dates would not be able to integrate themselves into my social circle either. Hence why one of the reasons I am keen on this lady is she is already well integrated in this circle and like me work and social are very blurred lines.

Yes, they are intolerant of inexperience. You are intolerant of many others who aren’t prime pickings.  You’ve said such dreadful things about women who you’ve dated and rejected.

its Karma. Suck it up

[ZA Dater]

1 minute ago, basil67 said:

So if you think of others as just people, it makes no sense that you only go for the prime pickings.  
 

I do not see prime pickings either. Sit with a CEO and sit with someone homeless, yes their view on the world may differ but they are still people. I go for people who I find attractive I do not put them into different classes based on a set list of criteria or attributes they may have.

People can really shine in social interactions and others not so much, does not make them fundamentally different. For its always been about that person that has some degree of intangible magnetic attraction, that cannot be defined.

[basil67]

Just now, ZA Dater said:

I do not see prime pickings either. Sit with a CEO and sit with someone homeless, yes their view on the world may differ but they are still people. I go for people who I find attractive I do not put them into different classes based on a set list of criteria or attributes they may have.

People can really shine in social interactions and others not so much, does not make them fundamentally different. For its always been about that person that has some degree of intangible magnetic attraction, that cannot be defined.

Prime pickings are all you talk about!

[ZA Dater]

3 minutes ago, FredEire said:

I think you actually don't think of them as people at all, that's the entire problem. You think of women as either a wonderful princess who would rock your world or someone you would have to lower yourself for with nothing to offer.

As I've said before even your most desirable woman would look ugly in the morning. When you take away appearance we are all very similar and go through the same trials, tribulations, doubts and challenges in life.

Agree but someone I can communicate well with, who has good communication skills, has a set life plan, has interests I am just not prepared to compromise with someone who does not communicate well and especially someone who is apathetic, I do not care what she looks like, apathy is a big no for me. 

Again you seem to think I have never met people I do like, I have, I have met quite a few actually but I have met a heck of lot more on OLD who I really do not find attractive. A good example of this also a stupid example, someone matches with me and sure she is all charming, I am not particularly interested because I can see once again a meal ticket is being sought and so it proved, she suggested such an outlandish date that I basically just unmatched her immediately. Does not matter what she looked liked I'd have done the same thing.

Point being its not all about looks, yes they are important but not over all else.

[ZA Dater]

4 minutes ago, basil67 said:

Prime pickings are all you talk about!

I do not see people I find attractive as prime pickings. People must do what makes them happy.

[FredEire]

5 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Agree but someone I can communicate well with, who has good communication skills, has a set life plan, has interests I am just not prepared to compromise with someone who does not communicate well and especially someone who is apathetic, I do not care what she looks like, apathy is a big no for me. 

Again you seem to think I have never met people I do like, I have, I have met quite a few actually but I have met a heck of lot more on OLD who I really do not find attractive. A good example of this also a stupid example, someone matches with me and sure she is all charming, I am not particularly interested because I can see once again a meal ticket is being sought and so it proved, she suggested such an outlandish date that I basically just unmatched her immediately. Does not matter what she looked liked I'd have done the same thing.

Point being its not all about looks, yes they are important but not over all else.

My impression is that your standards are fluid and change by the minute. One moment you want a very rigid physical standard, the next you don't and only care about personality.

My suspicion is you tailor this to whoever you are talking to, if she's interested she strikes out on X requirement, if she not interested she is perfect and everything you could ask for in a woman.

The end result is that nobody every lives up to your standards and you don't have to face an uncomfortable situation where someone you like might like you back.

[basil67]

5 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

I do not see people I find attractive as prime pickings. People must do what makes them happy.

You want tall, slim, attractive, eloquent, educated, able to mingle with your high end crowd.  This is prime pickings

Yes, most of us do what makes us happy and we have wonderful experiences in love. We have full lives with our loved ones. Not sure what your point is. 

[BaileyB]

3 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

This is probably the truth, probably a fundamental problem too. No response to me coffee meet up request, lets see how many days it takes to get a reply. 

You should not go for coffee with this woman. You have already decided that you are not really interested in dating her. You have basically talked yourself into going to meet her, and now you sit judgementally waiting to see if she will reply to you. It’s like you chose these situations that will reinforce your negative and pessimistic view of yourself and the women you date - and the bitterness grows and grows… It’s like a self fulfilling prophesy - nothing good can come from this. 

[ZA Dater]

2 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

You should not go for coffee with this woman. You have already decided that you are not really interested in dating her. You have basically talked yourself into going to meet her, and now you sit judgementally waiting to see if she will reply to you. It’s like you chose these situations that will reinforce your negative and pessimistic view of yourself and the women you date - and the bitterness grows and grows… It’s like a self fulfilling prophesy - nothing good can come from this. 

I am VERY interested in dating her for a whole variety of reasons, I however suspect she has limited to zero interest in dating me hence her taking days to respond.

[FredEire]

33 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

I do not see prime pickings either. Sit with a CEO and sit with someone homeless, yes their view on the world may differ but they are still people. I go for people who I find attractive I do not put them into different classes based on a set list of criteria or attributes they may have.

People can really shine in social interactions and others not so much, does not make them fundamentally different. For its always been about that person that has some degree of intangible magnetic attraction, that cannot be defined.

But you do exactly this, all the time.

You are full of contradictions.