How to end this toxic relationship?

[Gebidozo]

Guys, I’m sorry I’m asking questions for a friend again, but I really want to help, and prefer to get your wise advices before I give any advices to that person myself.

The friend in question (let’s call her Laura) is my lady’s childhood friend, the closest thing to a sister she has.

Laura is in her early 30’s. A couple of years ago, she got into a relationship with a guy who was seemingly very passionate about her. She wasn’t that much in love with him in the beginning, but gradually his passion made her feel more and more affection towards him.

Then, about a year ago, he suddenly announced that he must get together with another girl, approved by his society (he is some sort of a bigwig in the fashion design world), one he would take out to company gatherings and banquets or whatever else they do, have photos with, show to everyone, basically a token model-like girlfriend. He said he still loved Laura. He said he wanted to continue their relationship, but covertly. He said he had no romantic feelings for his new girlfriend, and would always find time for Laura.

Laura was hurt and repulsed, and tried to break off contact with that guy. But he kept texting her and calling her. He kept coming to her apartment, sitting outside of her window, begging her to let him in. This has been going, on and off, for one year. She would tell him “No more”, he would beg her to continue, she would cave in, let him in, have sex with him, tell him “no more, that was the last time”, and the vicious cycle would resume.

She’s hurt, she’s suffering, she doesn’t understand herself. She realizes that she needs to break off all contact with him, but some dark force is compelling her to keep sleeping with him through all the hurt and humiliation. For some reason, she feels she is more in love with him now that he’s officially involved with someone else than she was so when they were together.

She understands that the guy is a jerk. She knows that what she’s doing is wrong. Yet she keeps doing that.

What can be done to help her?

[BaileyB]

Nothing. There is nothing that you could, or should, do to help her. It is not your place. 

If she is struggling with this, I would encourage her to find a counsellor. 

And when she is done with him, she should threaten to tell his new girlfriend or file a protection order if he contacts her again. That should keep him away. 
 

[glows]

Is your partner asking you for this advice? Or are you contacting Laura without your partner knowing and thinking of giving advice without it being asked?

This is a grown woman and I understand your general concern but unless it’s affecting your relationship with your partner as in you and your partner and your partner is very upset all the time around you, keeps mentioning Laura and consumed by her friend’s problems then this is really none of your business at all nor is it your partner’s. Your partner can listen up to a point but eventually stop enabling this friend with her issues. I’m sure Laura is well aware of her options but her warped mindset that she’s more in love with him now even though she’s humiliated is the main conflict and only she can come to terms with that. If there is an emergency she might be there for her but don’t get so tangled and involved with this person’s love life. She’s the creator of her own ongoing misfortune and I’m sorry to say that. 

[happyhorizons]

4 hours ago, BaileyB said:

Nothing. There is nothing that you could, or should, do to help her. It is not your place. 

If she is struggling with this, I would encourage her to find a counsellor. 

And when she is done with him, she should threaten to tell his new girlfriend or file a protection order if he contacts her again. That should keep him away. 
 

He is clearly manipulating this lady for his OWN GOOD solely.  He clearly does not worry about her feelings in any of this.  She needs to be DONE with him PERIOD.  

[Gebidozo]

23 hours ago, glows said:

Is your partner asking you for this advice? Or are you contacting Laura without your partner knowing and thinking of giving advice without it being asked?

This is a grown woman and I understand your general concern but unless it’s affecting your relationship with your partner as in you and your partner and your partner is very upset all the time around you, keeps mentioning Laura and consumed by her friend’s problems then this is really none of your business at all nor is it your partner’s. Your partner can listen up to a point but eventually stop enabling this friend with her issues. I’m sure Laura is well aware of her options but her warped mindset that she’s more in love with him now even though she’s humiliated is the main conflict and only she can come to terms with that. If there is an emergency she might be there for her but don’t get so tangled and involved with this person’s love life. She’s the creator of her own ongoing misfortune and I’m sorry to say that. 

My partner is asking me for advice. I rarely contact Laura on my own. It’s not affecting my relationship with my partner, I’m just sad to see her sad because her very close friend is sad. 

Personally, I’m more interested in general advice for such cases. It just appears inexplicable to me that a strong, smart, independent, good-looking woman would let that guy do this to her and have feelings for someone like him. 

[happyhorizons]

1 minute ago, Gebidozo said:

My partner is asking me for advice. I rarely contact Laura on my own. It’s not affecting my relationship with my partner, I’m just sad to see her sad because her very close friend is sad. 

Personally, I’m more interested in general advice for such cases. It just appears inexplicable to me that a strong, smart, independent, good-looking woman would let that guy do this to her and have feelings for someone like him. 

Being compassionate and caring about others is never a bad thing.  Your concern is wonderful but as you alluded too IT DOES not sense but in the end it is HER decision to get past this.

[glows]

9 hours ago, Gebidozo said:

My partner is asking me for advice. I rarely contact Laura on my own. It’s not affecting my relationship with my partner, I’m just sad to see her sad because her very close friend is sad. 

Personally, I’m more interested in general advice for such cases. It just appears inexplicable to me that a strong, smart, independent, good-looking woman would let that guy do this to her and have feelings for someone like him. 

I would challenge those concepts of “strong, smart, independent”. No one is perfect and perhaps it’s you or your partner not truly understanding Laura that is preventing you from accepting that she may not be all those things (whatever strong, smart, independent means). People see what they want to see as outsiders. Frankly from what you’ve written about Laura unfortunately I have to disagree with your assessment. She may smart and independent in other areas of life but it doesn’t mean it’s exclusive of making critically negative and debilitating choices. I’d be supportive but draw the line at listening to the same thing over and over. He wouldn’t keep coming around if Laura didn’t keep giving in.

I think Laura’s self-esteem was damaged and low to start with. It’s a professional’s job to uncover why she allows people like this in her life.

 

[basil67]

9 hours ago, Gebidozo said:

It just appears inexplicable to me that a strong, smart, independent, good-looking woman would let that guy do this to her and have feelings for someone like him. 

I would argue that she's not as strong, smart or independent as she appears.  And don't confuse being book smart with being emotionally smart.

All in all, the only way for her to end this is for her to pull on her big girl panties, make a decision and stick to it.   However, in reality I expect she won't change until she hits rock bottom

Edited April 15 by basil67

[ExpatInItaly]

On 4/13/2024 at 12:16 PM, Gebidozo said:

What can be done to help her?

Therapy with a professional. 

 

[d0nnivain]

On 4/13/2024 at 6:16 AM, Gebidozo said:

What can be done to help her?

Nothing. She will put her foot down when she's good & ready.  Until then she is choosing to let this continue. 

I understand that this woman is your FI's BFF but unless she point blank asked you personally, not through your FI & especially not implied through what you think you understand when your FI talks to you about the BFF, you have to keep your mouth shut & your opinions to yourself.  The fact that your FI is asking you for advice is all the more reason you should stay out of it & your FI should too.  Again unless the woman asked your FI for advice, your FI needs to hush.  Just because the friend is complaining doesn't mean she wants to be told what to do.  She may simply want to vent.   

Edited April 15 by d0nnivain

[Gebidozo]

14 hours ago, d0nnivain said:

Just because the friend is complaining doesn't mean she wants to be told what to do.  She may simply want to vent.   

She isn’t just complaining, she often calls my FI, they meet, and my FI listens to her crying and asking her what to do for several hours.

Obviously, every time my FI tells her to go no contact with that guy, every time her friend says she will, this time it will be different, and every time it’s the same, the guy calls after a few days, says he wants to meet, they meet, they have sex, the vicious cycle repeats.

To clarify, I’m not at all bothered by my FI being there for that girl, they are like sisters, they have known each other since primary school, and I love it that my FI is being a good, supportive friend. It just feels weird that there is nothing I can do to help.

 

Edited April 16 by Gebidozo

[glows]

49 minutes ago, Gebidozo said:

It just feels weird that there is nothing I can do to help.

The problem is your partner is asking for your advice which likely means that she herself is overwhelmed. I suggest she distance herself if she’s feeling this way. The answer isn’t to become entangled by way of being a “supportive friend”. I feel like you’re both creating this as a bigger issue and enabling Laura. It’s natural to feel upset when someone we care about is also upset and struggling but it can’t go on forever. Sooner or later the friendship will fizzle out as your partner and Laura have less and less in common. 

[basil67]

I'm thinking along the same line as @glows.   I've been in the situation of your FI a couple of times, with women who are desperately unhappy with their husbands, but unwilling to pull the pin (both times, due to the involvement of children) 

It can get absolutely exhausting, and sometimes you've just got to ignore the messages and create some emotional space.  And I fully agree that it enables the other person - it's because venting their frustration is like letting steam out.  They then feel better after the venting and go back to the partner.

If your partner is stressed, anxious or just overwhelmed by the amount of support she's needing to give, it's OK to put her friend on silent so that she doesn't break through when your FI is doing something nice or just doesn't want to be disturbed.  It's also OK to tell the friend that she is feeling overwhelmed by being support person and doesn't have any bandwidth to help right now.  

[d0nnivain]

The friend's behavior -- repeatedly taking the guy back -- is all the more reason for you & your FI to stay out of it.  Intellectually the friend knows what to do.  But she also wants to be with this guy on some level.   The best thing your FI can do for herself is say to the friend, "I don't want to talk about this anymore.  It's always the same thing with you." Your FI has to model the behavior of closing the door on something. 

Edited April 16 by d0nnivain

[mark clemson]

On 4/13/2024 at 3:16 AM, Gebidozo said:

(he is some sort of a bigwig in the fashion design world),

What can be done to help her?

It sounds to me like she is trying to "win" him against the odds. The stakes are high as he is a high-status male and this would be a bit of a Cinderella story if she "wins." So she is willing to put up with more to try to maintain the relationship and (she hopes) win him and the status, lifestyle, and self-perceived validation of her that comes with it. The "dark force" driving her is nothing more than human psychology - with her rolling the dice on improving her circumstances via a relationship with him, with perhaps some sunken-costs fallacy psychology thrown in to boot.

She's an adult and playing for high stakes - you can advise her all you want, but she will keep at it until the costs outweigh the (perceived, potential) benefits and she finally gives up.

[Alpacalia]

She's going to ride this train to the end of the line.

I would kindly remind her to watch out for the switchyard and kiss her forehead softly goodbye when she gets off at her final destination.

Yeah I know it's a very kind thing to do to the people you care about, you let them go do what they want, let them experience the good and the bad things.

Then when you see them again, you say to yourself "Wow you're life is totally screwed now."

People that stay in toxic situations do so willingly. They hope that things will get better. There's also a self-esteem aspect. Sometimes people don't feel that they deserve a decent loving partner. She basically just needs to break the girl code and find another guy to make her feel desired that she's equally crazy about.

[Gebidozo]

Thank you for your advices, everyone. 

I’m realizing now that I somehow feel guilty for being happy with my FI, while her two best friends are stuck in toxic relationships. It’s like we don’t really deserve to be happy while people close to us are unhappy. Sometimes I feel a need to apologize to other people for my happiness. Has anyone ever felt that way? Is it normal? 

 

[happyhorizons]

Just now, Gebidozo said:

Thank you for your advices, everyone. 

I’m realizing now that I somehow feel guilty for being happy with my FI, while her two best friends are stuck in toxic relationships. It’s like we don’t really deserve to be happy while people close to us are unhappy. Sometimes I feel a need to apologize to other people for my happiness. Has anyone ever felt that way? Is it normal? 

 

You cannot solve everyone's problems and you should DEFINITELY not feel bad for being HAPPY.  Just love and support those that you care about and help where and how you can. 

[basil67]

3 hours ago, Gebidozo said:

Thank you for your advices, everyone. 

I’m realizing now that I somehow feel guilty for being happy with my FI, while her two best friends are stuck in toxic relationships. It’s like we don’t really deserve to be happy while people close to us are unhappy. Sometimes I feel a need to apologize to other people for my happiness. Has anyone ever felt that way? Is it normal? 

 

Unless they are being held hostage, her two best friends aren't "stuck" in the toxic relationships.  They simply aren't ready to leave

And no, it's not the slightest bit normal to feel guilty about having a happy life....and kindly, I think you're being a bit dramatic.  I count my blessings on a very regular basis and I don't owe anybody an apology for having a good life.

Edited April 17 by basil67