There are only very few fights, but they are nasty

[BaileyB]

This insecurity and these controlling behaviors must come from somewhere - 

Eother they are intrinsic, in that you have some work to do to develop your own self esteem and reailiency. Or, you have a valid reason to be concerned about him and that’s why you watch him so closely and attempt to restrict his behavior. If that’s the case, you really need to ask yourself if this is the right relationship for you… because when you see these kind of red flags - an interest in minors and excessive porn use - that’s the kind of guy that you leave, it’s not the kind of guy that you try to reform…

Just food for thought. I know that you will not like my comments. Only you know what you are dealing with here - but, if you are seeing red flags, you walk. Sooner or later, you walk.

[brokenbird]

9 hours ago, BaileyB said:

This sounds very much like you are parenting a teenager. That doesn’t work in an adult relationship between a man and a woman. 

No, not really. He agreed to couple's therapy, but decided that it is too much for him to talk in front of a stranger, so he suggested we sit down and talk about our feelings and needs once a week.

 

29 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

That sounds like a typical 21 year old man - quite immature. I wouldn’t say that it’s necessarily a porn addiction. 

Yes, but he did it from 21-23, for maybe 2 years I can agree with being inexperienced, but after you have been doing something for 2 years, you usually get a grip, just like with a workplace. You mess up things, sometimes daily, but after 1-2 years you realize your mistakes, and get better. He was not feeling like he should get better, I dont even know how long he wanted to continue lying to my face. One time, like 2 years ago, I found concrete evidence (he was using my account on a downloading site where there are also X rated movies, and I saw a weird search history while I was downloading content for my school) and he even turned it against me, saying that its so terrible from me to not trust him, while it was obvious. Later this year he apologised for that time, saying that this really was unfair and a very stupid way of trying to save himself and therefore the relationship. So yes, he was immature for a very long time. And its worth to mention that before this circus act, I was never the jealous type. I used to watch movies with him, with whole naked sexual scenes. I used to go to the beach with him, with hot girlies wearing thongs being there, we used to watch reality shows starring unbelievably hot people. Never in my life once did it cross my mind that "oh,now I feel bad". All these happened because I found out about porn and him having favorites. Since then, my stomach drops every time I see a naked girl on tv, looking like his past fav pornstars.

[brokenbird]

25 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

because when you see these kind of red flags - an interest in minors and excessive porn use - that’s the kind of guy that you leave, it’s not the kind of guy that you try to reform…

Sadly, most people like the teen category. But the "good thing" is that most people like it for the same reason, it looks natural and youthful, georgeous women between 18-25. I remember when years back I liked porn, I liked the tracher student scenario, but I never thought of it as a 15 year old with a 40 year old, rather just a power dynamic. Someone explained to me that this fantasy is not about actual teens, but about women between the ages of 18-25, after that comes the stepmom age which is 23-28, and after that they are called milfs or grannies. My boyfriend reassured these beliefs, that he doesnt like the side of porn where they look too young, but younger than him, which is the age group of 18-24, but it was not his main thing, I remember him watching all kinds of legal stuff. I hope its not coming through as it was the only thing he watched, this was the smallest bit of the categories he preferred. 

And to the real life scenario, its also a cultural thing, in my country its an average relationship where 15-16 year olds date 18-20 year old guys. I had a 17 year old boyfriend when I was 14. Nothing sexual there, but its pretty average. He was 19 when he had a 16 year old in mind, but he didn't pursue her at the end.

[BaileyB]

He has the right to a certain amount of privacy and personal freedom in the relationship though. He shouldn’t have to hide what he’s doing from you because it’s none of your business - As such, he is not wrong to be upset and angry. You are policing him in ways that you have no right to police him.

If you are going to end the relationship, you do so on the grounds that you do not trust him. You find him to be dishonest and you are concerned about inappropriate online activities. 

What I think has happened here, for what it’s worth - he has engaged in some questionable behaviors and your intuition is screaming at you that this guy is not to be trusted. I would advise you to listen to your intuition. But that said, the response should not be to restrict his freedom and monitor his activities… the response should be to end the relationship if you do not trust him and you do not feel like he is respecting you. 
 

Edited May 8 by BaileyB

[stillafool]

1 hour ago, brokenbird said:

If you view things from my perspective, him masturbating to women's videos does sound scary, even though I know that after he experienced real sexual plesure, he obviously doesnt want to go back to prefering his hand

Are you the only woman he's ever had sex with?

[brokenbird]

14 minutes ago, stillafool said:

Are you the only woman he's ever had sex with?

Yes. Not just that, first kiss, everything. He was a quite weird guy, he could never feel connection towards women, he could easily step over his friends, too. Lack of love from family plays a part I guess. When someone asked here why I was with him if this thing hurts me to this length, this is among the reasons. That I am the first person he is conneced to and that is special for me. Its also a vers obvious reason that he does small things for me that makes me feel like I am at the right place, and I notice those things every single day, I love to cherish even the smallest of gestures. For example, today he wrote on the touchpad of a delivery box because he knows I found those dirty. For me, that is big

[stillafool]

34 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

Yes. Not just that, first kiss, everything.

Perhaps this is another reason he's into porn.  Variety.  He's young and probably wants to see more than one woman's body, curious about the way they have sex.  What he was doing is perfectly normal, even if you were always available for sex.   Frankly I'd be nervous having a bf who has never been with anyone but me, for obvious reasons.

[brokenbird]

15 minutes ago, stillafool said:

Perhaps this is another reason he's into porn.  Variety.  He's young and probably wants to see more than one woman's body, curious about the way they have sex.  What he was doing is perfectly normal, even if you were always available for sex.   Frankly I'd be nervous having a bf who has never been with anyone but me, for obvious reasons.

Yeah I agree with you, but he doesnt agree with me. What's weird is that he was so into porn for the first 3 years and now he seems completely fine without it. And I mean it. The only thing that happened in 1,5 years is that one music video and and I believe him that it began with the music itself, because he had been listening to that channel for about 6 years in his car without seeing the videos, it wouldnt seem weird if he opened it for music but found himself aroused. He told me something very smart: Everyone does the same with their bodies. Even if some do it better, it can be worked on, but its really the same, especially if you have someone that you are attracted to. And I love your body, so why would I want the same experience with a different body when I already like yours? Another woman would have the same kind of genitals, she would also have boobs and booty. You have those. No need to go and try different ones, especially because I also love you not just your body, which I also love as you know.

I only had one sexual partner before him. And Im also on the same opinion as my boyfriend, why would I try more when they would also have penises, and I get my share of orgasms, I like my boyfriend's appearance. I truly believe that if the sex itself, as a performance is good, and you also love the person, it cant really be topped. Maybe for the first time it is better for the excitement of "new", but after one time, its no better.

I want to react one more time to the "minor " thing, because that is close to me, since I was put under the harrassment of an older man when I was 13. My boyfriend is good with younglings. He has 2 younger cousins, one is 14 and the other is 15. Its petfectly clear from his behaviour and the way he looks at them that he can differentiate kids from adults. A 19 year old is not so far from a 16 year old, hence he finished highschool just a few months before he turned 20. Its basically a highschooler and a guy who finished school a year ago and  works for fun at a shop to spend his money on useless stuff. He was immature. Im not saying he wanted a serious relationship, but girls in my country are pregnant at 14, and having sex at parties at 16, so I think it was more of a bad idea from his part and not a serious mean of harm. For a few months I connected the like of teen porn to this case, but I did see the videos he chose in that category and they were some stupid sh*t like "18 year old doesnt wanna study" or "18 year old would rather f than stay in school", not girls acting like they are 12-13. It seems coincidantal but Im sure it is not. He was 23 when I saw these searches and obviously a guy who is into the fantasy of him being the older one would like that category. He is definitely not into actual children. My 17 year old "friend" was at ours 2 years ago and my boyfriend seemed completely annoyed by her, even though she is a very pretty girls who works out 5 times a week. 

[BaileyB]

26 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

What's weird is that he was so into porn for the first 3 years and now he seems completely fine without it. And I mean it. The only thing that happened in 1,5 years is that one music video

I’m sorry, but I don’t believe this for one minute. 
 

26 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

He told me something very smart: I love your body, so why would I want the same experience with a different body when I already like yours? Another woman would have the same kind of genitals, she would also have boobs and booty. You have those. No need to go and try different ones, especially because I also love you not just your body, which I also love as you know.

He may in fact love you and that may well be the reason why he is not pursuing sex with other women - he may feel no interest in “trying different ones” because he is content in your relationship…

But again, this sounds to me like a ridiculous justification meant to placate you. “All women have the same generals - you have those, I don’t need to try anything else.” While what he says is true in theory, all women are more definitely not created equally… the entire sex industry is founded in the fact that all women are not created equally and variety is very exciting for men. 

Edited May 8 by BaileyB

[BaileyB]

3 hours ago, brokenbird said:

What upset me once is that when he was almost 20, he wanted to have encounters with a 16 year old. I just asked if he still thinks it would be normal to have sex with a 16 year old

I mentioned it above only because you seemed to be concerned - you brought it up in a previous post. It is not unheard of for a 18-20 year old man to date a 16-18 year old young woman. Many of my friends met and started dating their now husband’s about these same ages. And as you said above, “teen” porn is very popular for obvious reasons. I would only be concerned if my 24 or 30 or 45 year old partner was behaving inappropriately with teenage girls… That’s obviously a huge red flag, and one that you are very aware of because of unforgettable past experiences. 

[BaileyB]

17 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

That’s obviously a huge red flag, and one that you are very aware of because of unforgettable unfortunate past experiences. 

Sorry, in my head that said “unfortunate.”

[brokenbird]

49 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

I’m sorry, but I don’t believe this for one minute. 

Oh believe me, I dont trust any living person on this earth. Yet I know this to be true. Its dad, but true, I spent months analyzing the way he behaved when he was hiding things, and he is completely different now. How to put it...he is more calm ? He doesnt act like he is walking on thin ice, probably because he doesnt do stuff that he lies about. Im fine with that.

 

45 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

I mentioned it above only because you seemed to be concerned -

I was. Even though I know a 16 year old (at least in my country, I cant talk about others ) would be more than happy to encounter a 20 year old guy instead of her own age (mostly because guys here act like children even when they are 25 and girls act like adults at teen ages) , I still found it unnerving, but not really because I believe he would be capable of acting on it now, more because I would have found him "meh" then. 

 

30 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

Sorry, in my head that said “unfortunate.”

Yes, there are many memories, men between 17-70 were into me when I was 11-17.

[Gaeta]

What you're doing is the same as a woman that caught her boyfriend cheating and now she's watching his every move. It's not a way to live for you, and not a way to live for him. You get triggered by the smallest stupid stuff like a music video popping up. Your boyfriend is maturing at a slower rate, he didn't have a relationship or sex until into his 20s, but one day he will mature out of this. He will realize he's in a cage and even his deepest thoughts are being supervised by his girlfriend.

Anyway this thread was about fighting and when we all took the same stand, that the fighting is about you controlling him, then you brought up that porn usage so the attention is not on your fights anymore but on how bad your boyfriend's behavior was before and that you've trained him to be a good tamed boyfriend. 

 

 

Edited May 8 by Gaeta

[brokenbird]

37 minutes ago, Gaeta said:

You get triggered by the smallest stupid stuff like a music video popping up.

Then what should I do? Turn away when I see any sign of sexual content and not feel disrespected? I agree its no way to live. And its very confusing too. It messes with my brain that I feel like this while also feeling cared for, listened to, loved, cherished, appreciated and desired. It feels weird that my life looks exactly as I want it to look, this man is truly amazing for me, I love every single move of his, and I also feel threatened by online content?

4 hours ago, BaileyB said:

What I think has happened here, for what it’s worth - he has engaged in some questionable behaviors and your intuition is screaming at you that this guy is not to be trusted. I would advise you to listen to your intuition.

Im not the one to be told to listen to my intuition, because I overthink everything. One time my intuition told me my ex was out cheating because he hadnt replied for hours which was very much not him, since he used to text me every minute. I facetime called him and he was sitting in his chair playing a game he just found and he got carried away. Or another one I remember, when my boyfriend kept texting someone all day, seemingly hiding it from me. I walked up on him from behind and he was texting his colleague about cars for the whole afternoon because the dude wanted to buy a new one and my boyfriend knows cars. And the worst one is when I saw the search history about his fav pornstar, it seemed like he searched literally everything about her, and for a whole week I thought he spent hours with looking at her. When I checked again, it showed that he spent exactly 5 minutes with it, just many different clicks because he couldnt find wwhat he was looking for. My intuition cannot be trusted and I dont want to waste a good guy just because I imagine things into a porn category I probably also watched too, and I for sure am not into actual teens.

Although, can you please elaborate on what you suspecting? Because to me, it seems like you think something of him that I dont realize. I dont want to resent a man for (not even doing, because he didn't act on it) "planning" something more than 5 years ago when he was definitely a stupid child. Or if you mean the porn part, then 99 out of 100 people that watch porn are creeps

[BaileyB]

17 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

Turn away when I see any sign of sexual content and not feel disrespected?

I would kindly suggest that you date a man who respects you. You will know the difference when you do - I have been with my partner for 10 years now and I can count on one hand the number of times that one of us has done something that requires an apology. There are no big fights and we don’t have weekly meetings to air grievances and apologize for any perceived hurt. 

But you have to understand that sexual content does not necessarily mean disrespect in a relationship. You have equated the two for obvious reasons - his immaturity and potentially excessive porn use (at least early in the relationship) has triggered your insecurity and this - you see the two as interconnected. They are not necessarily - except in rare cases where men are behaving in very inappropriate ways like affairs, prostitutes, live cams/excessive porn use, etc… The average man looking or masterbating occasionally at porn is not usually considered a threat to a woman with a healthy self esteem who feels secure in the relationship. Again - the fact that you see this rather innocuous thing as a personal threat speaks to the fact that you do not truly feel secure - within yourself and in this relationship. 

As Gaeta says, you can train him to do and say all the “right” things - that’s what I hear when you speak of the fact that he swears to you that he doesn’t even want to watch sexy music videos… but, as he ages and matures, he is very likely to grow to resent you and the repression of his personal privacy and freedom.  He will resent you in much the same way that you would resent him - if, as in the example provided previously, he was trying to tell you how you could dress or who you could/could not talk too…

Edited May 8 by BaileyB

[brokenbird]

15 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

would kindly suggest that you date a man who respects you

I do feel respected, until masturbation comes up. If we set aside occasional sexual content, the way I am treated is definitely more towards being a princess than a disrespected person. 

Also, what does excessive porn use mean? In those 3 years, he used it like once a week. 

 

16 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

But you have to understand that sexual content does not necessarily mean disrespect in a relationship

If someone could explain to me why, I would be open to understand.

[BaileyB]

57 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

Also, what does excessive porn use mean? In those 3 years, he used it like once a week. 

That is not excessive, in my humble opinion.

Excessive to me would be someone who chosen porn/masturbation and had no sex with their partner. Or, they had sex but wanted to have porn star sex. Someone who spent multiple hours a day watching porn. Someone who chose porn over other daily activities including work, a social life( with friends), other interests… That is disruptive to one’s life - that is a problem. Once a week is definitely not a problem - 

 

[stillafool]

It seems that everything is peachy keen in your relationship because you dispute any advice or opinion that everyone gives you about the dynamics of your relationship.  So let me ask you - why are you still here?

[brokenbird]

1 minute ago, stillafool said:

It seems that everything is peachy keen in your relationship because you dispute any advice or opinion that everyone gives you about the dynamics of your relationship.  So let me ask you - why are you still here?

I just explained a few replies back. With the advices for the arguements, I found a way to better myself. That case is closed.

With the relationship itself, and by that I mean day by day, I am fulfilled.

But. I still dont understand how a relationship with sexual content from the outside can work. And I mean content as in purposefully viewed music video, porn, etc. I still dont understand how respect doesnt corelate (probably misspelled this one) to not viewing those things. I dont understand how you can cherish and respect your partner if you go "Bridgerton is my fav series, also it makes me horny and I sometimes masturbate after seeing the women in it" , weird example but this came to mind

[stillafool]

5 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

I still dont understand how respect doesnt corelate (probably misspelled this one) to not viewing those things. I dont understand how you can cherish and respect your partner if you go "Bridgerton is my fav series, also it makes me horny and I sometimes masturbate after seeing the women in it" , weird example but this came to mind

Are you saying now that you masturbate after seeing "Bridgerton" or your boyfriend?

[brokenbird]

Just now, stillafool said:

Are you saying now that you masturbate after seeing "Bridgerton" or your boyfriend?

None of us , just an example. I could have said how can..... If he watches a music video and he masturbates. I just wanted a random example so I dont write the same thing again and again. 

I have read somewhere that a woman watches the Frasier series repeatedly because the actors are hot for her,and her husband doesnt mind it. This is what I dont get. How can someone feel truly secure if their partner watches other bodies with awe and sometimes even masturbate to them

[stillafool]

18 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

How can someone feel truly secure if their partner watches other bodies with awe and sometimes even masturbate to them

Because most people know it's just fantasy and are secure in their partner's love.  It's a bit unrealistic to think your partner is going to dump you for someone they've never met, probably will never meet, and even if they did, there's practically 0 chance that that person would want them.  

[Gaeta]

2 hours ago, brokenbird said:

Then what should I do?

I think you are resentful for things he's done in the past, I think it impacted your self-esteem, I think this has broken something in you that cannot be repaired. I honestly think you should breakup and find yourself a partner better suited for you. A man that will inspire trust and in whom you have nothing to resent.

When you met your boyfriend, and realized his lack of maturity, you should have stopped dating him instead of trying to change him or 'raise him to adulthood'. Sure he's a good guy at heart, but all the quality in the world does not replace a crack in your trust. You know it deep down, you're here because of that 'crack' that keeps nagging at you. 

[Gaeta]

29 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

How can someone feel truly secure if their partner watches other bodies with awe and sometimes even masturbate to them

If he did it in front of me, he would not be my boyfriend. 

If he does this when he's home alone then I don't care. Why would I worry?  No matter where he looks whether it's online, at the grocery store, at work, there will ALWAYS be a woman better looking than me, sexier than me, bigger boobs than me! When Jason Momoa pops up on a video, shirtless all muscles up, you think I don't stare?? lol  

[introverted1]

22 hours ago, NotToday said:

I predict that if you keep pushing this, he will become more and more resentful until he finally walks away.

For his sake, I sure hope so.