There are only very few fights, but they are nasty

[BaileyB]

Essentially, you have told him that you don’t want him to watch porn. Whether you have stated it in as many words or not, the message is clear - porn is a threat, and your expectation is that he should not want to watch it. But yet - you are lying to him and telling him that you don’t care, when clearly you do. 

But he does - because he is a man (that said, LOTS of women watch porn too). He is going to watch porn but he is also lying to you - telling you that he doesn’t really like it. I don’t know how this video got into my stream… 🙈

I hate to break it to you, but you are going to be very disappointed in men, for this and so many other reasons… guaranteed, are going to be disappointed because you set very rigid and unrealistic expectations. This discussion reminds me of men on this site who visit and are distraught because their new girlfriend has previously been with another man. The expectation is, that he would prefer a woman who has never been physical with another man because… what if he is better/I’m not as good? Those guys have set themself up for a world of pain in much the same way that you have because their insecurity has caused them to adopt a very rigid and unrealistic expectation of women. That discussion makes about as much sense as this one does… and, if I was your boyfriend, I would have no interest in a relationship in which my partner tries to tell me - subtly or otherwise - what I. Can and can not do about something as trivial as watching porn occasionally on my phone. 

Edited April 24, 2024 by BaileyB

[Gaeta]

1 hour ago, brokenbird said:

Ugh I rather not, I dont want to be even more disappointed in men. 

You mean you'd rather not understand and accept the nature of things because that would demand some efforts on your part. You much prefer making his life miserable with unrealistic expectations that will eventually end the relationship. 

Expecting a man, especially a young man, to never ever look at videos with sexy women is like asking a dog to stop licking its butt. 

[brokenbird]

4 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

But he does - because he is a man (that said, LOTS of women watch porn too). He is going to watch porn but he is also lying to you - telling you that he doesn’t really like it. I don’t know how this video got into my stream… 🙈

It was me who said that I dont know how my tiktok is full of girls. Because I dont watch them, Im not interested in them. And I do believe he doesnt watch porn now. Also he didn't say he doesnt know why the music video was played or anything. 6 months ago he admitted that the music got him in the mood, no lie there. Yesterday he said he willingly opened a song like that, because he knew for sure he doesnt watch it while driving and if he wanted to hide it, he would have,but he doesnt want to hide stuff because as of right now, he doesnt consume stuff like nudity. Maybe in the future he will, but not know.

4 minutes ago, Gaeta said:

You mean you'd rather not understand and accept the nature of things because that would demand some efforts on your part. You much prefer making his life miserable with unrealistic expectations that will eventually end the relationship. 

Expecting a man, especially a young man, to never ever look at videos with sexy women is like asking a dog to stop licking its butt. 

Religious guys dont even feel the urge to look at this type of content. Its not just dicipline, they dont have the urge for it, so probably it is not a neccessity? Also its weird you say young man, when the p0rn consumer statistics show that the 2 biggest consumer group is 15-25 and 30-40, so aged men also watch a lot of it.

[Gaeta]

28 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

Religious guys dont even feel the urge to look at this type of content. Its not just dicipline, they dont have the urge for it, so probably it is not a neccessity? Also its weird you say young man, when the p0rn consumer statistics show that the 2 biggest consumer group is 15-25 and 30-40, so aged men also watch a lot of it.

OMG where do you get that non sense!!? It's biological !! Do you know how many  'religious' men and religious leaders have secret affairs?? You need to educate yourself on simple men biology 101.

I am 58, everything under 40 falls in the category of young to me. 

Edited April 24, 2024 by Gaeta

[brokenbird]

Just now, Gaeta said:

OMG where do you get that non sense!!? It's biological !! Do you know how many  'religious' men and religious leaders have secret affairs?? You need to educate yourself on simple biology 101.

I am 58, everything under 40 falls in the category of young to me. 

Uhh I get it from my ex colleagues, like 6-7 Arab guys between the ages of 22-34. They are Muslims and we used to grab coffe together and talk about intimate stuff like this. Or I can use as an example 2 Christian guys from my highschool, we still keep in contact and had beers like a year ago. Most of these guys dont have girlfriends, some do, and they all told the same thing. They dont feel the urge to acknowledge that someone looks attractive when they have a partner. They said women look like men to them, nothing to find hot or desirable. So I dont know,according to them, they are not like this because they want to be good for their gods but because they feel like that. Any other guy I talked to say the opposite that these religious guys said 

[Gaeta]

21 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

Uhh I get it from my ex colleagues, like 6-7 Arab guys between the ages of 22-34. They are Muslims and we used to grab coffe together and talk about intimate stuff like this. Or I can use as an example 2 Christian guys from my highschool, we still keep in contact and had beers like a year ago. Most of these guys dont have girlfriends, some do, and they all told the same thing. They dont feel the urge to acknowledge that someone looks attractive when they have a partner. They said women look like men to them, nothing to find hot or desirable. So I dont know,according to them, they are not like this because they want to be good for their gods but because they feel like that. Any other guy I talked to say the opposite that these religious guys said 

We are not talking about the urge of acknowledging a pretty woman. No man respecting his girlfriend will drool over another woman while in her presence. We are talking the occasional porn video or those sexy dance videos watched in private.

In bold: Sorry to say but they are lying. Probably out of ideology or to look good in front of each other. My boyfriend is a practicing Muslim (I'm Catholic) so I have a view right into this community. Appearing pure & humble in front of their community is extremely important. They will never e.v.e.r. admit watching porn in front of each other...but you bet they all do it in private.

Edited April 24, 2024 by Gaeta

[brokenbird]

1 minute ago, Gaeta said:

We are not talking about the urge of acknowledging a pretty woman. No man respecting his girlfriend will drool over another woman while in her presence. We are talking the occasional porn video or those sexy dance videos watched in private.

In bold: Sorry to say but they are lying. Probably out of ideology or to look good in front of each other. My boyfriend is a practicing Muslim (I'm Catholic) so I have a view right into this community. Appearing pure & humble in front of their community is extremely important. They will never e.v.e.r. admit watching porn in front of each other...but you bet they all do it in private.

Wow, that really surprised me. My brother's father is an Arab man, also a Muslim and my Mom used to tell me that if I want a guy never ever looking at any other women in any way, I should date an Arab man like him because they are so strict and appreciative. He even practices the Ramadan in Europe, so I would have never thought he could be "the same" as a non Arab person.

Okay, then let's say his love and attraction for me doesnt depend on him opening a music video for visuals or opening it just for the music. But how should I handle if he did it purposefully and still lied about it even after I almost broke up with him a year ago for lying about p0rn? How should I build trust if I feel like he might lie? (Although I truly believe that those music videos yesterday didn't mean any visual pleasure and he just listened to it, its quite obvious) For the effectiveness, I can be a honest person instead of a hypocrite. If a handsome guy pops up on tiktok, I watch him,see that his smile is nice and go with my day. If my favorite movie character is present in a spicy edit, I watch it, see that its nice and I go with my day. I dont feel anything threatening because I love my boyfriend so so much. But then again, I dont look for these, they come across my page. Then why do I feel like it is threatening if he does it ? I feel like this whole thing is pointless if he purposefully watches something. I feel like his focus is pointed outwards the relationship. 

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, brokenbird said:

Religious guys dont even feel the urge to look at this type of content. Its not just dicipline, they dont have the urge for it

Do you not watch the news? How many priests have been accused of sexual assault? We have women on this board in affairs with married men who are very active within the church. How many politicians who attend church with their wives have been exposed for extramarital affairs? You may be trying to fool yourself but you are not fooling anyone else - men have sexual urges and engages in sexual behavior - even religious men who attend church twice a week! 

 

 

[brokenbird]

1 minute ago, BaileyB said:

Do you not watch the news? How many priests have been accused of sexual assault? We have women on this board in affairs with married men who are very active within the church. How many politicians who attend church with their wives have been exposed for extramarital affairs? You may be trying to fool yourself but you are not fooling anyone else - men have sexual urges and engages in sexual behavior - even religious men who attend church twice a week! 

 

 

Then us women just have to accept that even if they dont watch p0rn, they will sometimes look at women?

[Gaeta]

10 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

But then again, I dont look for these, they come across my page. Then why do I feel like it is threatening if he does it ? I feel like this whole thing is pointless if he purposefully watches something. I feel like his focus is pointed outwards the relationship. 

Because you lack self esteem. You fail to understand that your boyfriend loves you for other things than your body. It's the sum of you that he loves and that's only found in 'you'. 

You walk downtown and you see beautiful shoes in store windows. You stop, you look,  you think those are pretty, and you move along with your day. Watching sexy videos for men is a little bit like that. They look, it's nice to them, they move on with their day. 

You also compare how you feel about videos and assume your boyfriend should feel the same. Example you say: you don't seek these videos they just show up on your feed so why does your  boyfriend feel the need to seek those videos - this is where you need to educate yourself on how women and men are wired differently. You cannot apply how you feel about things to other people or other gender. 

You create the lies with your unrealistic expectations and rules. He lies to you because what you expect of him is against his very nature. A 24 yo man is filled with testosterone, they have a lot of sexual tension and they need to release that stress and NO having sex with their gf is not always enough. You cannot win that battle. You are trying to shut down something that has been programmed into men for thousands of years. Please educate yourself on the matter. 

[stillafool]

54 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

They dont feel the urge to acknowledge that someone looks attractive when they have a partner. They said women look like men to them, nothing to find hot or desirable. So I dont know,according to them, they are not like this because they want to be good for their gods but because they feel like that.

Why don't you set your boyfriend free and start dating one of these guys^?

[BaileyB]

20 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

Then us women just have to accept that even if they dont watch p0rn, they will sometimes look at women?

We have to accept that men are sexual beings - just like women. Most men, just like women, look at members of the opposite sex. They also watch porn. And if you believe the statistics - something like 30-50 % of people will cheat on a partner in their lifetime. 

You can’t control him. He is his own person and he will do what he wants to do - 

[brokenbird]

14 minutes ago, stillafool said:

Why don't you set your boyfriend free and start dating one of these guys^?

2 very obvious reasons. 1 being that I am not good enough in their view. Im not going to dress the way they women to dress like, Im not going to stay home and birth 5 children. I dont want to be like the ideal women they described. Probably that is why they treated me as a friend, Im not pure enough for them and I dont want to be. 2 is the same around, I dont want to live with such rules. They are not fit for me. 

2 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

We have to accept that men are sexual beings - just like women.

When I said this on q different site, they boooed me that I am narrow minded because I separate men and women, because there is no such thing as men are like this and women are like that. Literally put me to the ground for thinking the way you guys explain. And that one is quite a similar site to this, so its weird.

Okay. Let's imagine a miracle scenario. All my worries and "nagging" go away in a heartbeat. All my traits that you call controlling and other things, just disappear. I am perfect now. Could this relationship go fine after he lied about things you say he did so because of nagging and fear?

[BaileyB]

30 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

And that one is quite a similar site to this, so its weird.

It’s not weird, it’s true. Both sites are trying to tell you to expand your view of men and women, they are human beings - nothing in life is rigid in the way that you expect it to be. The feedback that you have received on both sites is consistent. 
 

31 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

Could this relationship go fine after he lied about things you say he did so because of nagging and fear?

I don’t even understand your question. 

Personally, I’m not convinced that this is a healthy relationship for either one of you. 

[brokenbird]

1 minute ago, BaileyB said:

It’s not weird, it’s true. Both sites are trying to tell you to expand your view of men and women, they are human beings - nothing in life is rigid in the way that you expect it to be. The feedback that you have received on both sites is consistent. 
 

I don’t even understand your question. 

Personally, I’m not convinced that this is a healthy relationship for either one of you. 

The only way I think it could be healthy if all the past events could be let go. All of it. Lying, yelling, s***talking. 

[BaileyB]

28 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

The only way I think it could be healthy if all the past events could be let go. All of it. Lying, yelling, s***talking. 

What are you doing to make this happen? Are you both in counselling? How are you both learning to be better partners for each other - learning to communicate with each other, resolve conflicts in the relationship, and forgive each other for all the hurt? 

Personally, I wouldn’t chose to be in a relationship with a man if this kind of stuff was happening. My partner and I do not speak to each other in this way. If he did, that would be my cue that he is not a healthy partner for me - I would end it.

Edited April 24, 2024 by BaileyB

[stillafool]

1 hour ago, brokenbird said:

I dont want to be like the ideal women they described.  (man she)

 

1 hour ago, brokenbird said:

I dont want to live with such rules. They are not fit for me. 

This is probably how your boyfriend feels about you and what you want.

[Gaeta]

29 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

The only way I think it could be healthy if all the past events could be let go. All of it. Lying, yelling, s***talking. 

It's not going to go away.

When you break a vase you can glue it back together but it will always be a broken vase. 

Words hurt. Words end relationships or repair relationships. You 2 have a broken relationship no matter how you look at it. 

[brokenbird]

6 minutes ago, Gaeta said:

It's not going to go away.

When you break a vase you can glue it back together but it will always be a broken vase. 

Words hurt. Words end relationships or repair relationships. You 2 have a broken relationship no matter how you look at it. 

This I definitely dont agree with. Because then you could say that if someone had a bad childhood, they cant be normal aduls. A broken vase is for sure not a proper example.

[Gaeta]

1 minute ago, brokenbird said:

This I definitely dont agree with. Because then you could say that if someone had a bad childhood, they cant be normal aduls. A broken vase is for sure not a proper example.

You are very naïve, and I say that with the most respect. 

I was talking about relationships, not about broken childhood. 

[brokenbird]

5 minutes ago, Gaeta said:

You are very naïve, and I say that with the most respect. 

I was talking about relationships, not about broken childhood. 

But it is the same. Something hurt because of a situation, and to these situations I contributed

21 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

Personally, I wouldn’t chose to be in a relationship with a man if this kind of stuff was happening

At first I thought you were talking about the lying. Well, he doesnt talk like that when I dont get to his nerves

[Gaeta]

10 minutes ago, brokenbird said:

Well, he doesnt talk like that when I dont get to his nerves

Do you talk to him like that?

[brokenbird]

Just now, Gaeta said:

Do you talk to him like that?

If he snaps, I sometimes snap back. But I became a very calm talking person over the past maybe 2 years 

[BaileyB]

2 hours ago, brokenbird said:

This I definitely dont agree with. Because then you could say that if someone had a bad childhood, they cant be normal aduls. A broken vase is for sure not a proper example.

A broken vase can sometimes be repaired in much the same way that a difficult childhood can sometimes/often be healed. It doesn’t change the fact that the vase was once broken or that one’s childhood was difficult - both are fact. Any repair or growth that may occur with time doesn’t change the past - it is, what it is - as they say.

Edited April 24, 2024 by BaileyB

[brokenbird]

Just now, BaileyB said:

A broken vase can sometimes be repaired in much the same way that a difficult childhood can sometimes/often be healed. It doesn’t change the fact that the vase was once broken or that one’s childhood was difficult - both are fact. 

Maybe I can also express my opinion on this.

I can think of drawing on the same paper. In the beginning, you break some pencils and even though that doesnt really affect the paper, it does a little, because that pencil is not there anymore to continue the drawing. Sometimes you press too hard and the paper gets worn or even forms a hole. Sometimes you use watercolor paint on paper which doesnt stand water, so it gets a new texture. You use too much rubber, which makes it wrinkly and you can even tear the paper. But after all these things, it would be easy tó just get a new paper or glue another one on top and pretend it is fine. Instead you can trim a slice from one end, cut up the slice into pieces and glue them on the holes and tears. You can put that paper out in the sun to dry out the watercolor paint caused wetness. Then you can take oil paint, and color the whole paper with it. The texture will be visible, even the glued on pieces, but the paint might make it compliment the overall picture.

This example might be crazy for some of you, but I am an artist myself and most of my creations came from caos, and turned into scarred but pretty art.