How do I be ok with the person I love swinging without me ?

[ConfusedGem]

I am new here and looking for some genuine advice and insight if anyone else out there has been in a similar situation !

So I have been seeing this guy for almost 3 years. From the beginning he said he didn't want anything serious. He was just getting out of a marriage that he had to sacrifice a lot of who he is for. Over the years I fell for him and we've grown closer and the talk of being together is more and more discussed now and is on its way to becoming something official. 

He lives in a different state than I. We travel back and forth every other month or so to spend some time with each other. He had mentioned to me before that he is interested in the swinger lifestyle. I told him that if we were together that I would be open to trying it out of respect for him and his wants/needs. That we could experience it together. 

Being that we are not official, he does date here and there. I'm not fond of it because I love him and am scared he will find someone he wants something with more. 

In the past couple of months, I found out that he had met someone. He came clean and told me about it, said they had sex but there were no feelings involved. That when he wishes to pursue a relationship, that will be with me. I was still upset. He continued to be honest with me whenever he would go out with her but one night she took him to a swingers party for her birthday. He found out that she hosts a lot of these and is very much into the lifestyle. He shared this information with me and I was very very hurt by it. Not only for being with her but now experiencing something that we discussed to do together, with someone else. 

He has become a regular to her and he has reiterated many of times that one, we are not in a relationship yet and two, there are no feelings involved. 

I love him and want to be with him and have talked about me joining him at a party when I go out there. I'm honestly all for it but I can't help but feel a bit uneasy with this girl he's been seeing. I feel as though it would be weird for me to come in and see them engage in sex since they are already so familiar with each other and he has built a bond with her without me being present so to speak. I can tell that he doesn't want to give up what they have. She has brought him into this community and has taught him a lot of stuff. I know he's been with a couple other females at these parties but that doesn't bother me because it's only this girl in particular that he goes out with almost every weekend and has more of a connection with. 

I do have my own jealousy issues and anxiety about things. I'm also an anxious attachment so I always fear that he will end up leaving me once together or I feel insecure and jealous wondering if maybe he enjoys her more than me or sex with her is better and more satisfying than sex with me. She does know about me as he's told her how much he cares for me and that we are working on progressing things forward but when mentioning that if we become official, if I'm not comfortable with doing things with her, would he stop and it was kind of a wavering answer.

I've voiced to him a lot of my thoughts and concerns. Such as compromising by not going out every weekend, choosing me for a weekend. He also said that once he tells her we're together she may choose to not want to interfere at all and it will be done. Our she may still want to keep him as her regular. He asked me to at least give it a shot and if after that I don't feel comfortable with it then he'd address it.

I know that he really cares about me and does love me. I know that he wants to be completely accepted for who he is and his wants before really committing. We are working on having long talks and have deeply improved our communicating skills. I want to be 100 percent ok with this but I find it to be difficult as unwanted thoughts arise and consume me into overthinking. 

I guess my questions are, how do I be completely ok with her in the picture ? How do I get over the betrayal in a sense of him experiencing this with her instead of me ? (I think that's where a lot of my jealousy lies) and any other advice on how to help me be more ok with this would help a great deal ! Thank you so much for reading !

 

[Gaeta]

29 minutes ago, ConfusedGem said:

I know that he really cares about me and does love me

sure...but he is not 'in love' with you. Many couples explore the life of swinging and they do it as a 'couple' meaning they experience it together or not at all, they have sets of rules that they follow very closely to not generate jealousy and resentment in their partner because their partner/gf/wife's feeling is VERY important to them. This man showed you where he stands, and he pretty much stands with himself and his needs and not a care for your feelings.

I think you are reading something in this relationship that does not exist. You've invested 3 years in seeing a man once a month, no official relationship, no exclusivity, no agreements between you 2 of any kind. 

This man is using *this is who I am* to better manipulate you. I bet he also tells you that he's a free sprit and you got to love him as he is.....erk! 

 

Edited April 25, 2024 by Gaeta

[ConfusedGem]

1 minute ago, Gaeta said:

sure...but he is not 'in love' with you. Many couples explore the life of swinging and they do it as a 'couple' meaning they experience it together or not at all, they have sets of rules that they follow very closely to not generate jealousy and resentment in their partner because their partner/gf/wife's feeling is VERY important to them. This man showed you where he stands, and he pretty much stands with himself and his needs and not a care for your feelings.

I think you are reading something in this relationship that does not exist. You've invested 3 years in seeing a man once a month, no official relationship, no exclusivity, no agreements between you 2 of any kind. 

This man is using *this is who I am* so better manipulate you. I bet he also tells you that he's a free sprit and you got to love him as he is.....erk! 

 

I can agree on a few things for sure ! I know that he is working on being in love with me as I am him. He just found out not long ago about my feelings towards him. We have also lived together for months on end at different times. He used to travel a lot for work and recently settled into a permanent position and is permanent in the state he is in. With our work schedule we see each other when we can. We have discussed that once we are together that we will have rules and boundaries and what I allow him to do or don't do, he will oblige.

[ExpatInItaly]

Oh, dear. 

OP, this man is never going to become your official boyfriend. You are terribly over-invested in someone who still hasn't tried to actually have a relationship with you after 3 years. It's time for you to read the writing on the wall and understand that if he actually wanted to be your boyfriend, well, he would be your boyfriend. 

Instead, he's dating someone else and off having sex parties. Please stop trying to force yourself to be okay with this. This man is single and behaves as such. He doesn't appear to have any real intention of being with you in a relationship. 

You badly, badly need to let him go. You have wasted far too much time on him already. 

[ExpatInItaly]

2 minutes ago, ConfusedGem said:

He is working on being in love with me

Please re-read your own words here. What does this even mean?

A man who is in love with you doesn't need to "work on" being in love with you. He just...is. You seem very lost here and unable to see the reality of the situation. You have pinned your hopes on a guy who is very clearly not on the same page as you. 

[Gaeta]

2 minutes ago, ConfusedGem said:

We have discussed that once we are together

This is a carrot he's dangling at you to keep you around in his 'harem'. Why would he EVER agree to be in a relationship with you when you stand by him while he sex everything that moves and you're ok with it?

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, ConfusedGem said:

I do have my own jealousy issues and anxiety about things. I'm also an anxious attachment

If this is true, being in a relationship with a man who is having sex with other women is only going to destroy your self esteem and it will bring you nothing but misery. 

And you are not wrong in that - never would I ever agree to be in a relationship with a man in this situation. I wouldn’t even try to accommodate because this is not who I am. I feel like you are trying to bend because you have feelings for this guy and you think that’s what you need to do to get/keep him - but it isn’t. 

You want to be in a legitimate relationship with this man but the simple fact is - he is actually in a relationship with another woman (despite the fact that he says there are no feelings and he would chose to be in a relationship with you). 

How do we know that he has feelings for the woman - he doesn’t want to give her up. 

If having a relationship with this man means that I have to tolerate the fact that he has sex with other women - that would not be a relationship that I personally would want to have. But, to each their own, if you think this is what you want then feel free to proceed… Just know, you will not be the only woman in his life - if you can live with that, it shouldn’t be a problem. I don’t actually believe that you can live with that given the fact that you posted saying that you have a problem with it…

 

Edited April 25, 2024 by BaileyB

[BaileyB]

45 minutes ago, ConfusedGem said:

We have discussed that once we are together that we will have rules and boundaries and what I allow him to do or don't do, he will oblige.

In which case, he is sowing his wild oats now - before you are together? And, you are ok with this?? 

And you think you can put this genie back in the bottle, if/when you ever move to be with him? 

 

45 minutes ago, ConfusedGem said:

I know that he is working on being in love with me as I am him.

I agree, this makes no sense. It sounds to me like he is working on the idea of committing to you - while keeping his other sec partners. While you, are trying to convince yourself that you can accept his other sex partners and his “lifestyle.” 

Oh, the things we do for “love…”

Edited April 25, 2024 by BaileyB

[ShyViolet]

You have been completely kidding yourself throughout this entire relationship.  He is telling you loud and clear who he is, and what his priorities are, and you are not listening.  He's not interested in having a full-blown relationship with you.  He never was.  He told you that from the beginning.  You are kidding yourself into thinking that he is "working on" being in love with you and "progressing towards" a relationship with you.  If this man wanted to be in a relationship with you, he would be in one with you now.  You are not facing reality.

[stillafool]

3 hours ago, ConfusedGem said:

I can agree on a few things for sure ! I know that he is working on being in love with me as I am him. He just found out not long ago about my feelings towards him. We have also lived together for months on end at different times. He used to travel a lot for work and recently settled into a permanent position and is permanent in the state he is in. With our work schedule we see each other when we can. We have discussed that once we are together that we will have rules and boundaries and what I allow him to do or don't do, he will oblige.

The bolded part sounds controlling and is not sustainable.   It sounds like you are already in love with him, which makes sense since you lived together.  He does not sound in love with you or he wouldn't be dating and having sex with this other woman every week that he doesn't want to give up.  As a matter of fact, it sounds like he's falling for her.

[stillafool]

3 hours ago, ConfusedGem said:

 I know that he is working on being in love with me as I am him.

People don't work on falling in love, it's involuntary.  You either fall or you don't.  Considering you guys lived together he's had plenty of time to fall in love with you but he hasn't.  He's getting everything he wants right now with this other woman.  You going there and trying to compete with her at sex parties is not going to work.  You are going to be terribly hurt when you see them having sex and may not be worked up enough to have sex with the other men there.   I don't see this working well for you.

[mark clemson]

Consider reading "The Ethical Slut" which despite the title is a fairly serious book on polyamory.

Like most of us, both you and he want a relationship "on your own terms". Of course, when those "terms" conflict too much, that's "incompatibility, "so what you normally have is compromises that both partners consider to be reasonable.

Relationships come in all sorts of varieties and there are men who will partner with single moms, porn stars or even trans women, even when many exclaim strongly how they wouldn't/couldn't. So perhaps you can be with a polyamorous guy, who knows. It does seem clear the viability of your relationship is far from a done deal.

[smackie9]

Getting involved with his interest in whatever activity, complying with whatever he does isn't going to make him fall in love with you. The minute your plans went sideways with him frittering around with this other women, etc, is your cue to end the relationship. You can paw and claw your way, but you won't make to his heart. 

[Mrin]

27 minutes ago, mark clemson said:

Consider reading "The Ethical Slut" which despite the title is a fairly serious book on polyamory.

Like most of us, both you and he want a relationship "on your own terms". Of course, when those "terms" conflict too much, that's "incompatibility, "so what you normally have is compromises that both partners consider to be reasonable.

Relationships come in all sorts of varieties and there are men who will partner with single moms, porn stars or even trans women, even when many exclaim strongly how they wouldn't/couldn't. So perhaps you can be with a polyamorous guy, who knows. It does seem clear the viability of your relationship is far from a done deal.

This is good advice. 

The only other thing I would add is that there is no way the OP's situationship will turn into a committed monogamous relationship with this guy. If that's the only type of relationship that will work for you, then you should move on.

[Lotsgoingon]

You can't get comfortable with your man's swinging.  

You need to dump him and move on. And it's not clear that swinging brings him any closer to you. Don't buy delusion, sister. 

[Alpacalia]

You wouldn't be the first woman to find herself in a situation where she pretends to be okay with something in order to keep a man around. You're like, I feel like I'm capable of handling this but maybe I haven't been as transparent about my feelings as I think I've been since he takes my calm collective answers as my being okay. 

You're scared that she is going to take over and you're going to be out of the picture. So you want to know how to gain control over this situation - is that correct? 

Forget being okay with things - you're obviously not.

You're both putting on a show and he IS really into it, but in his head he is calculating this like a chess game and cheating isn't a thing since you guys aren't exclusive.

The alternate reality, what could happen, does not count. This is the problem. You guys have to be on the same page, period. That's it. No more forgiving honorable agreements. Pick up your piece, remove it from the board and go back to your own seat. 

Edited April 26, 2024 by Alpacalia

[Gebidozo]

20 hours ago, ConfusedGem said:

I'm not fond of it because I love him and am scared he will find someone he wants something with more. 

Fear is a terrible reason for staying in a lopsided relationship where two people want completely different things.

 

20 hours ago, ConfusedGem said:

I know that he really cares about me and does love me.

Based on your description, it doesn’t look like that at all. It looks like he is using you, while completely disregarding your needs.

 

20 hours ago, ConfusedGem said:

I know that he wants to be completely accepted for who he is and his wants before really committing.

That’s just guy code for “I want to have a harem with concubines, and you must be ok with that”.

 

20 hours ago, ConfusedGem said:

I know that he is working on being in love with me

There is no such thing.

A person is either in love, or they aren’t. He isn’t in love with you. He is just using you because you conveniently allow him to do that.

[FredEire]

You're in a long term friends with benefits situation, I think he's been honest with you about this except the part where he said if he gets into a relationship he wants it to be you. I think he likes having you around for company and sex, an addition to dating this other woman plus his swinging.

If you were ok with this then it's fine, but clearly you're not or you wouldn't be on here making this post. It sounds like you very much have feelings for him that he doesn't have in return and you have to ask yourself if you're really ok hanging around and being his side piece or want to aim for something more fulfilling with someone else.