going through a hard time

[S2B]

When he goes on those trips with friends - like he did recently… can you tell with certainty that he’s is only with who you expected him to be with?

we all know he could easily plan a trip that looks as if he’s only with those friends - but could easily extend his time to meet up with someone else before he heads home… without you knowing that he stayed a few days extra to see someone else.

was anything at all amiss while he was away from you? You were away too - is it possible you were super busy and missed any important clues?

[S2B]

You said he works out and has coffee with people. Who are those people? How often does he go?

any man saying another persons name while he’s sleeping is concerning! Who is this woman? How did he explain saying her name?

Edited August 22 by S2B

[heartwhole2]

I appreciate all the words of caution. 

Yes, the trip was definitely legitimate and we were in constant contact. It's hard to explain without TMI.

As my therapist said, it feels like we're trying to put together a puzzle without all the pieces. So it's helpful for me to write it all out here. I do tend to try different theories on to see if they fit. And in my assessment, "He has one foot out the door" doesn't fit as well as it did two weeks ago. He's no longer avoiding talking about future plans, for example. 

And as the star of my own story, I don't think I've really highlighted how different our home life can be if I focus my energies on reducing his stress. He wasn't asking for things, and I wasn't volunteering to do them. Again, it's on him that he can't use his words, but I'm happy to feel useful. There was a big chasm between how much I can do to make life less stressful for him and how much I was doing before. 

The theory that I do think/hope fits is that he is conflict avoidant, and he was not speaking up about what he wanted and needed. He began to feel more and more stressed and unappreciated, again, without ever saying something. He's also someone who isn't really suited to companionable love, and he needs to fall back in love with me every so often. 

When we were about a year out of college, he kind of tried to break up with me. I think he said he wanted to "date casually" instead of seriously. I was like, sure sure, we are dating casually now . . . nothing changed, and a year later we got engaged. We would always joke about that time, with him saying, "It didn't take." And then ten or so years later, he had the affair. And now it's ten years later again. At this point I'm wondering if his wanderlust, ENFP personality is just going to try, unsuccessfully I hope, to get rid of me every 10 years. A close family friend once told me that I was the only thing he had ever stuck with. He craves newness, but I don't think that has to mean that he can't sustain a life-time commitment if he can work out his jitters and infuse the relationship with renewed passion every so often.

Ultimately, it's not within my control. All I can do is act in good faith and see if it's reciprocated.

[heartwhole2]

Update . . . well, we are getting a divorce.

It seemed like things were going well, until it didn't. I sensed a shift in him, and then he said he wanted to separate. Four days, yes days, later, he put a house two blocks away under contract, despite telling me he was going to find a furnished apartment. Obviously this isn't just a "separation." I suspect he's seeing someone now, but I'm surprised at how little it bothers me. 

This was a few weeks ago. I have been doing my best to process rapidly (while acknowledging that in no rational universe would someone need to process things this quickly). I have a lot of support; my friends have stepped up wonderfully. I am seeing all the ways that this relationship was unfair and unhealthy for me. But still, it is a big shock and change, and I have a lot of grief to process. There's no short-cut to that. I did love him, but I love me more. 

Despite his inability to find time to see a couple's therapist, we've already started seeing a co-parenting counselor. That seems to be going well. She said we are more aligned in our parenting than most of the couples she sees. We agreed on a custody schedule that is more favorable to me (he wanted 50/50, but acknowledges that it's not realistic). 

He has offered me a fair settlement. I will be able to stay in the house and maintain my lifestyle. There's still a lot to work out there, and I'm getting legal help, which he doesn't know yet, as he wants to save the money on legal fees and has no concept that I could need advice and protection. He is someone who requires a lot of catering to, and as we grow further apart, I anticipate things will get less amicable. I'm also finding that he thinks he knows a lot more than he does (well, I always knew that, but before I had a reason to accept and overlook it). I feel relief knowing that money will come in and I will be able to save it . . . he always has to take money and put it in new businesses, new rental properties, to the point that things don't make sense . . . why are we paying extra on our mortgage but we have a HELOC? He will have to divest from a few of these businesses in order to pay off the debt. Because of how complicated things were, he controlled the finances, which made me feel impotent. I am glad to be in charge of my own life now.

The children . . . so far, they are handling things amazingly well. When we told them, they started belly-sobbing, and one ran up to the attic and the other ran outside of the house. He was surprised, sigh. But they have a lot of friends and loving adults in their lives, and they are at least momentarily distracted by getting to plan their new rooms in his house. My older daughter feels angry at him and says he surely must be feeling guilty, but her angst is really quite low considering and she has a lot of insight for her age. So we'll see. Things will sink in more as we reach the holidays. I can't hide my sorrow from them, but I hope I am modeling how to love myself and how to walk away with dignity. 

I really think he was bad for my health. His constant busyness . . . working out and having coffee with friends every morning, happy hours or going out with friends most nights, always wanting to take the girls to festivals or whatever active thing he could. If I wanted to do something, he would squeeze it in, but he really just always expanded to take up all the space. And I contracted more and more until I hardly took up any. I know I will be able to give my body the rest it deserves.

And with my suspicion that he's seeing someone (probably the woman whose name he said), I realize just how hyper-vigilant I always was, which is exhausting. I don't have to worry about his restlessness anymore. This woman has three younger kids, one with complex medical needs, and I just have to laugh at the idea of him taking on more emotional responsibility. This is the man who confessed to me after his affair how annoying it was to have to be the OW's emotional support.

He wants the vacation home, with the stipulation that I will have lifetime use of it. It doesn't make sense for me to fight for it . . . it's in an isolated location and I never go there alone, nor would I want to take care of it. But that's something else to grieve. At one point when I was mulling over whether his settlement offer was fair, he said, "Well you are going to have a lot more disposable income than I will." Well yes, but no one forced you to insist on keeping the second home (which we just rebuilt, because he's never satisfied with anything) and then buying another very expensive home. No one forced you to take your two-year-old car in for a service and come back with a new one, because somehow they convinced you it made sense. Your choices and inability to save money do not impact what I am entitled to.

So there you have it. I couldn't see what I couldn't see. But now I see it, and I must move forward. I know I am going to be OK. I deserve so much more than someone who doesn't delight in me. And you know what sounds really nice? A very part-time boyfriend.

[BaileyB]

I’m very sorry to hear this update.

I know it’s hard, there is a lot to grieve. But there must be peace in the fact that you are no longer putting his needs above your own and worrying about his indiscretions. Take care. 

((Hugs))

 

Edited October 5 by BaileyB

[spiritedaway2003]

I'm sorry to read this update.  You sound like a beautiful person, inside and out.

I suspect there is someone else, very few people leave for no reason, except in certain circumstances.   There is always a reason, even if it's a reason you are not aware of yet, or don't make sense to you, though that's all water under the bridge now.  I'm glad you have a great support system and your kids are taking it as well as can be.  Also I'm glad you're seeking legal help - as far as vacation home, marital assets are 50/50, assuming you're in a state that splits everything that way.   You may want to consult a professional to see if it makes sense to sell it and split that 50/50, instead of the odd lifetime use "compromise, which he probably knows you won't ever take him up.

Take time to grieve the loss and the changes. There is no timeline to try to process it all quickly.  Take care of yourself and your kids; you have a good head on your shoulder; it sounds like you are already managing as best you can.

Edited October 5 by spiritedaway2003

[heartwhole2]

13 minutes ago, spiritedaway2003 said:

I'm sorry to read this update.  You sound like a beautiful person, inside and out.

I suspect there is someone else, very few people leave for no reason, except in certain circumstances.   There is always a reason, even if it's a reason you are not aware of yet, or don't make sense to you, though that's all water under the bridge now.  I'm glad you have a great support system and your kids are taking it as well as can be.  Also I'm glad you're seeking legal help - as far as vacation home, marital assets are 50/50, assuming you're in a state that splits everything that way.   You may want to consult a professional to see if it makes sense to sell it and split that 50/50, instead of the odd lifetime use "compromise, which he probably knows you won't ever take him up.

Take time to grieve the loss and the changes. There is no timeline to try to process it all quickly.  Take care of yourself and your kids; you have a good head on your shoulder; it sounds like you are already managing as best you can.

When he first told me he was buying another house, without thinking to explain the finances, I was very worried. But it turns out he is getting a loan from his equity at work, and it does not impact me other than making his ability to pay my alimony more difficult. Our primary residence and vacation home are of roughly equal value, so him getting one and me getting the other makes a certain amount of sense. Him buying himself another expensive home and taking on more debt is just him being . . . shortsighted. 

In his proposal, he is giving me something like 58% of our assets, including some rental properties that will make a lot of money once the loans are paid off 20 years from now (or sooner if I can work it). There's also lifetime alimony, unless I remarry (I think not, ha). The lawyer feels his offer shows good will and that he's not trying to screw me. It's his general character flaws (belief that he'll make more money in the future so it's OK to overspend today, assumption that he is an expert at all things financial, etc.) that are my concern, but I don't suspect overt malice. He does need a lot of validation and appreciation, and I'm not inclined to give those anymore, so he may become less generous over time. That's why I'm trying to get the agreement locked down soon. I just have to gather so many documents regarding partnerships, loans, deeds, etc. If he doesn't suspect I have a lawyer based on my relentless document requests, then he's an idiot. I'm waiting a bit to play that card.

[BaileyB]

You are very wise. 

Glad that you are receiving legal advice. I do love how you are using his character flaws/arrogance to secure the best settlement that you can for yourself and your children. 

[Leihla_B]

5 hours ago, heartwhole2 said:

...I couldn't see what I couldn't see. But now I see it, and I must move forward. I know I am going to be OK. I deserve so much more than someone who doesn't delight in me.

My heart goes out to you. On one hand, of course, this is sad, yet on the other, you sound relieved and liberated from the vigilance of trying to hold onto someone who didn't value you enough. You are an insightful, intelligent, and loving woman. I think you already know that you deserve better.

I hope you'll continue to write here if it's of any help, and also because we are invested in your welfare in the wake of such a heartfelt investment in working through things here. Best wishes!

[mark clemson]

Sorry to hear that HW2...

[heartwhole2]

Overall I've been doing well. I'm still in the crying phase, but the intensity and frequency are lessening. 

He's closed on his new house, but he seems . . . afraid to come inside my house when I am here. Of course, I am very scary, what with my calm but sad cordiality. Consequently, 98% of his stuff was still here until this weekend, when I had to go out of town for a night. I'm sure he is overwhelmed with trying to set up a large new house, and of course it has not occurred to him that I would like his stuff gone so I can make my home a cheerful, peaceful place. The girls report that he is fumbling to get what they need for their rooms (has left it up to them to request what they need instead of thinking, oh, they need trash cans, rugs, etc) . . . ordering a duvet cover but no duvet, etc. 

So this led to a blow up when I complained that he took my bedroom tv and left trash in the bedroom. He unleashed a barrage of complaints . . . I "hovered" while he was moving (I came in the house briefly, then left again, then texted him that I would hide away in the basement). I gave him a "honey-do" list of things to do (I reminded him of things to take and asked him to move two things for me . . . he had three friends helping him). I didn't understand how emotional it was for him. I replied simply that he had relieved me of the job of holder of his stress and I hoped would find the support he needed. That led to more complaining, to which I did not reply. So then he pretended to offer to take our daughter to school, only to rescind the offer because he "needed a respite" when I accepted. Ah, the old trick of trying to provoke me so he could feel martyred and justified. I simply didn't respond again.

I just know I need to be cautious until we get a financial agreement in place. I'm sure he sees that I am doing well and not pining for him and it's unpleasant on some unconscious level, and his ego needs to feel like he is the victim. Of course, for my part I need to devalue our relationship in order to move on, which isn't difficult when I look clearly at his faults. I'm glad I got to say my piece about not being his emotional support any more, even though he didn't acknowledge it and kept complaining. It is honestly such a relief not to have to absorb his stress any longer.

As for his stuff, I've told him that anything I want out of the house, I'm going to pile in the garage. I shouldn't have to do that labor for him, but I also shouldn't have to stare at his stuff, so I'll just decide which option is less icky for me and do that.

I was really upset about the tv . . . he had asked if he could take one, and I gave a noncommittal reply and said that then I'd have to replace it, and he never followed up. So I was shocked and angry that he just took one. My daughter and I went and got a new one right away, and actually, it's a better size for the space and the picture quality is better. The old tv was never bright enough and I was always trying to adjust the settings. I put my new comforter on the bed and my daughter and I watched a show on it last night. So that's a win, even though I rage cried for a bit. I'm sure I just needed the release.

My sister pointed out that it's not like he has no stuff . . . he has our entire second home. It's a five bedroom house. It has plenty of tvs. So if he was thinking, "Oh, she got all the stuff, I'm entitled to one tv," well that's just more "special" logic. Honestly I think it's that I have all the log-ins for streaming and he doesn't want to deal with getting his own accounts. I'm not a petty person and I want my kids to be able to watch tv too, so I'm not going to change the passwords . . . yet, haha.

 

 

[Leihla_B]

3 hours ago, heartwhole2 said:

So that's a win, even though I rage cried for a bit. I'm sure I just needed the release.

Sure, you can always make a rage cry about anything. A lousy TV that is easy to replace is a convenient enough target for getting some stuff out.

You are doing beautifully. If you need a release now and then, you're entitled to that.

Head high, sister!

[Acacia98]

On 8/6/2024 at 9:20 PM, heartwhole2 said:

He is a generally self-absorbed person.

I had a feeling you were eventually going to say this. I got that sense from your first post though I can't pinpoint exactly why. I don't really have advice to give because marriage is outside my realm of experience. But I do wish you the best.

[Acacia98]

On 10/5/2024 at 3:21 PM, heartwhole2 said:

I really think he was bad for my health. His constant busyness . . . working out and having coffee with friends every morning, happy hours or going out with friends most nights, always wanting to take the girls to festivals or whatever active thing he could. If I wanted to do something, he would squeeze it in, but he really just always expanded to take up all the space. And I contracted more and more until I hardly took up any. I know I will be able to give my body the rest it deserves.

For your sake, I'm glad that you're no longer under that pressure. You deserve the chance to rest. When I think back to your first post, it strikes me how anxious and very tightly wound up you sounded then. You sound much better in your latest post.

[heartwhole2]

Yes, I really feel like I had lost sight of the person that I am. And I thought that was because of my chronic illness, but I still have that. It was because he treated my chronic illness like a nuisance to be tolerated, and he seemed to choose things that I couldn't do as an F you, and he spent so much time complaining about all his stresses and problems without ever caring about mine. 

Like here's just one example . . . I broke my wrist slipping on our 100 year old wooden stairs. So I hired a company to install a nice wool runner. I let my STBX pick the pattern because he is very picky (a.k.a. controlling). One day after it had been installed, he exploded, "You installed that runner without even ASKING me! You didn't take into account my aesthetic preference for wood stairs!" I had slipped on those stairs and bruised my butt plenty of times before I broke my wrist, and our girls had slipped too. And he was just stewing about how he was a poor victim of me making a decor change he didn't like instead of seeing it as a necessary thing to protect me and our kids, when he never asked me before replacing the deck or buying a piece of furniture. I had to choose my battles because it was just too annoying to put up with his martyrdom.

I just didn't feel at peace and safe in my own home. And I didn't even realize it. That's the tragedy. And just realizing how little love I accepted makes me sad.

I'm sure it never occurred to him when he left that I would come back into my power and be flinty and clear-eyed. And he can't even get what he wants by complaining about how hard things are for him because I just don't respond, poor man.

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, heartwhole2 said:

One day after it had been installed, he exploded, "You installed that runner without even ASKING me! You didn't take into account my aesthetic preference for wood stairs!"

He can have wood stairs in his next home… 🤣

You are going to be safe now on the stairs. That’s a very good thing. 

[heartwhole2]

1 hour ago, BaileyB said:

He can have wood stairs in his next home… 🤣

You are going to be safe now on the stairs. That’s a very good thing. 

My daughter said all the floors in his new house are slippery. 😭

So it took five weeks, but I definitely would not under any circumstances consider getting back together with him. I see now that it would be terrible for my mental health. A few weeks ago a friend asked and I was like, "Well I wouldn't want to, and I wouldn't think it would work out, but I'd probably try for the kids." But they are so encouraging of me. This seems to be better for all of us.

[BaileyB]

I’m going to be honest… I was quite concerned by your previous posts. It worried me greatly to hear some of the things you were saying including the fact that you were going to take on more responsibility so that he could have less stress. It didn’t sound like he was treating you very well and you were going to make life easier for him??!! It felt very one sided - a little like you were walking on eggshells and acquiescing to his needs in a way that just didn’t feel good to me. I had hoped that I was wrong… but, I was quite concerned with what the stress of the situation was doing to your health.

I have a friend who has also recently been freed from a similar marriage - her husband recently told her that he no longer wanted to be married and some of the things that she has shared since they separated - 😳. But after the initial shock, she is doing so very well… there is grief and it’s not easy as a single parent. But, she says that it’s such a relief not to feel responsible for her very unhappy and unfaithful husband anymore…

Edited October 14 by BaileyB

[heartwhole2]

And even our kids have been sharing things they're concerned about. "I'm worried about Daddy's memory. He thought I still liked something I liked five years ago when I was in 2nd grade. I don't think Daddy really pays attention when I talk. It's really frustrating because Daddy hasn't ordered what I need for my new room. I was really shocked that Daddy told us you were separating and then he just immediately left and disappeared." 

I mean, I guess they could be simultaneously telling him the things about me that they're annoyed about, but I don't think so. I think I propped him up and made him look/be a lot better and on his own he is unmasked.

The whole moving out/tv debacle was probably an important step in all of this. It's really hard to break up with someone who drops the bomb and then runs away, afraid to see you. I think I needed to get that bit of frustration out. He left a bunch of trash in my bedroom and took my tv, and I said hey, that was not cool. And then he went blah blah blah, please give me space and understanding, this is so hard for me,  blah blah, and I just said "I'm not your emotional support anymore" and ignored the rest. If you do crappy things, I will say, hey that was crappy. That is a natural consequence. I will not then make you feel better for being crappy. Sorry you don't know how to do that on your own, like the rest of us grownups. 

Eyes on the prize, though . . . my lawyer wants to go over options this week. I hope we can nail down the settlement before he has too long to stew. I realize how enormously blessed I am that I will be walking away from this with my financial needs met. And it turns out those were pretty much the only needs he was meeting. I can use a vibrator for the rest, lol.

[BaileyB]

11 hours ago, heartwhole2 said:

I think I propped him up and made him look/be a lot better and on his own he is unmasked.

This is exactly what my friend is saying.

 

[heartwhole2]

Another silver lining is that his side of the family is stressful. His mom is kind of nutty and she always marries dysfunctional losers. His brother damaged his brain with drugs in his teenaged years and can't support himself, and that will fall to STBX when his parents die no doubt, if BIL lives that long. His dad is just like STBX in his constant striving for a higher standard of living than he can really afford, and all he does is buy a large sailboat/fancy house, complain about its flaws, replace it, repeat the cycle. He also lives in town but never ever asks to see the girls. One time my child was making a family tree for school and she remembered to put my father, who died before she was born, but forgot her local grandfather. I do love my one BIL and my nieces and I am sad not to be their aunt anymore. (I will still consider them my nieces but they live far away so I won't have much chance to see them.)

Whenever I wanted to see my family, STBX would complain about how stressful it was for him to miss work, and I'd cut the trip to as few nights as possible. With my health, it was often too daunting/tiring to travel without him. Finally in the last few years I just started leaving STBX at home, since he relished his "much needed" alone time so much and was too martyred to take time off of work, unless it was for something he wanted to do, like a guys' trip, in which case work seemed like no issue at all. So I will get to see my family a lot more. They've really stepped up to support me. It's funny when my mom says salty things about STBX since she is a woman of few words. She is very excited about helping me make the house my own. 

I have to see STBX today. He's getting someone to move the stupid piano his mother made us cram into our house. The girls and I are very excited to make that room more functional and cosy now that the piano no one plays will be gone. They can still (not) play it at his house, haha. 

He had not been fun to hang out with for a long time. He treated me like an annoying kid sister. It was so annoying to talk to someone who clearly wasn't absorbing anything you said. I'm really funny, and I'm always reading interesting books and articles, so it's not like talking to me should be that difficult. It didn't occur to me to leave when there wasn't any overt mistreatment, but I was not treated well. And I was constantly trying to help a perpetually dissatisfied person satisfy himself with external loci, which is a Sisyphean pursuit.

[Leihla_B]

4 minutes ago, heartwhole2 said:

It didn't occur to me to leave when there wasn't any overt mistreatment, but I was not treated well.

This turned out in your favor. He gets to be the bad guy, so he's likely to be more accommodating with your settlement. If not, your lawyer can fight with him on your behalf. If he acts out over stupid stuff like a measly TV, choose your battles carefully. No need to upset yourself when the bigger picture works well for you.

Head high.

[S2B]

I’ll be curious to see if you actually have half ow parsnip to the house he just bought.

if he was smart he would have waited until after you’re divorced to buy any large purchases. If nothing else half the fund he put down on it must have been half of your money.

I would ask your attorney.

Edited October 15 by S2B

[heartwhole2]

40 minutes ago, S2B said:

I’ll be curious to see if you actually have half ow parsnip to the house he just bought.

if he was smart he would have waited until after you’re divorced to buy any large purchases. If nothing else half the fund he put down on it must have been half of your money.

I would ask your attorney.

His firm recently got acquired, and they don't want high earners to get recruited away, so they are offering loans to stay put. That's what he is using. It's all a loan based on his future earnings, which he has to pay back. You know, which will be super easy for someone maintaining THREE expensive homes. 🙄  His new house really was unnecessarily expensive. There were other homes available in our neighborhood for several hundred thousand less. 

I am going to be squirreling my money away. We haven't saved enough for the girls' college. When I asked him his plans for college, he just sighed and said, "Well I just assume I'll have to take care of that, like I take care of everything else." Perfect, that can be our plan . . . you just figuring you will be able to take care of it. He said the same thing when we addressed how to handle buying our kids cars in coparenting therapy . . . "I know that will just be something else I have to handle." I mean, yes, my support payments will originate with you, but they are intended to enable me to contribute to these things. But if you'd rather just be a martyr, be my guest . . .

When he agreed to my 57/43 custody split in therapy, he cried a bit and said, "I just feel like I'm being penalized for being the breadwinner." He's just turning more and more into this ridiculous caricature to me. Sure sure, it makes total sense for the person with a full time job, part-ownership in several local businesses, serving on several non-profit boards, with multiple hobbies, who goes out multiple times most days, to have as much custody as a stay at home mom. He is just not moored in reality.

[heartwhole2]

1 hour ago, Leihla_B said:

This turned out in your favor. He gets to be the bad guy, so he's likely to be more accommodating with your settlement. If not, your lawyer can fight with him on your behalf. If he acts out over stupid stuff like a measly TV, choose your battles carefully. No need to upset yourself when the bigger picture works well for you.

Head high.

Yes, that's very true.

In the early days, when I still a sobbing mess, I had friends stopping by most days to sit and be with me. I wasn't up to much except crying on the couch. But every friend, without fail, would kind of go through the situation with me, and be like, "OK, so you don't have to deal with a man, and you are going to be fine financially . . . I think, I think this sounds kind of amazing, actually?" LOL

I will try to play the long game. I'm much less weepy than I was, but it can still strike sometimes. So I can't always be calm and steely. But I'll do my best. And really, the crying probably helps, because it's harder to be mad at someone who's just there being sad.