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[Gebidozo]

2 hours ago, FredEire said:

In my experience being handsome is an "in", women will be more willing to have that initial conversation with you and you won't have to work as hard but from there on if you don't have the personality to match you will struggle.

Then… I’m handsome? Because I never had to work hard to make a woman will an initial conversation with me. 

I know for a fact that my looks are, at most, just fine. Yet that never was a problem for any woman I liked. None of them would be interested in a guy just because of his looks.

I understand what you mean, that guys with sixpacks and faces like Brad Pitt or whatever would get more attention quantity-wise. As in, such guys would attract much higher amounts of silly, shallow women than I would. But the question is, why would I want to attract such women? I wouldn’t be attracted to them myself, I probably wouldn’t even enjoy talking to them. 

[FredEire]

25 minutes ago, Gebidozo said:

Then… I’m handsome? Because I never had to work hard to make a woman will an initial conversation with me. 

I know for a fact that my looks are, at most, just fine. Yet that never was a problem for any woman I liked. None of them would be interested in a guy just because of his looks.

I understand what you mean, that guys with sixpacks and faces like Brad Pitt or whatever would get more attention quantity-wise. As in, such guys would attract much higher amounts of silly, shallow women than I would. But the question is, why would I want to attract such women? I wouldn’t be attracted to them myself, I probably wouldn’t even enjoy talking to them. 

Maybe! Trail Blazer if that's his real photo seems to be a fairly good-looking guy and if you look like him I guess so 😂

I consider myself quite an attractive guy too and haven't had too many problems getting into conversations with women, but when I was a teenager I was very overweight and I lost it all over the space of a few months when I had a growth spurt at 17.

People's reaction to me was night and day, they went from half-interested or actively ignoring me to fully engaged and coming over to chat, rather than me having to start every conversation. It probably had a bit to do with and increase in self-confidence too but I think people are generally shallow in that way without even realising it. You have to work harder if you're unattractive or average-looking

I used to work in a hostel also and it was like living in a social experiment every time I'd direct group events. I saw the same pattern all the time, girls would usually go straight to the best looking guys and vice versa, but if the guy was trying too hard or didn't have much personality they'd strike out within a few minutes. Generally if these girls were looking to hook up they'd go back at the end of the night with the most fun guy who was talking to everyone, not necessarily the best looking one, but the advantage the really handsome guys had was they were the first person they'd end up talking to.

Edited August 15 by FredEire

[Trail Blazer]

4 hours ago, Gebidozo said:

I wonder what being “handsome” even means. All my life, I’ve been with women who told me being handsome doesn’t matter. I never considered myself handsome yet I’ve always had success with women. I’ve seen some of my friends, definitely none of them looking like models, conquering the hearts of many women. 

I’m just curious how those “handsome” guys look like and what kind of women fall for them.

Is that you on your profile photo? Are you considered handsome? Do you consider yourself handsome? I’m asking because I look a bit similar to you😃

I've never heard that one before, but I have heard that there's a lot more to attracting a woman that just looks.  Which, ipso facto, could mean that if there's enough other traits, that handsome may become far less of a factor.

That's me in my profile.  Look, I did receive some compliments from women over the journey when I was single, and my online dating escapades (some of which I chronicled on here) compared to what a lot of other guys experienced, suggested that I appealed to at least some women.

Thankfully those days are behind me, though, as online dating is a very shallow and unfulfilling experience.  Even when getting matches, I was hoping to meet someone who'd make me want to get off the apps, which thankfully I met a beautiful woman who did. 😁

[FredEire]

8 minutes ago, Trail Blazer said:

I've never heard that one before, but I have heard that there's a lot more to attracting a woman that just looks.  Which, ipso facto, could mean that if there's enough other traits, that handsome may become far less of a factor.

That's me in my profile.  Look, I did receive some compliments from women over the journey when I was single, and my online dating escapades (some of which I chronicled on here) compared to what a lot of other guys experienced, suggested that I appealed to at least some women.

Thankfully those days are behind me, though, as online dating is a very shallow and unfulfilling experience.  Even when getting matches, I was hoping to meet someone who'd make me want to get off the apps, which thankfully I met a beautiful woman who did. 😁

It's like playing basketball and being 7 foot tall. Is it an advantage? Sure, nobody would claim it isn't. But if you're otherwise slow, clumsy and shooting bricks all day you're still a shitty basketball player. And there's players like Steph Curry who are a relatively normal height but so good at other things they're still really really good.

Basically looks aren't everything but they're a big help to draw people in and start relationships, and that's when your other qualities have to take over. If you don't have good looks you just have to maximise what you have and work a bit harder to get in the mix.

Edited August 15 by FredEire

[basil67]

13 hours ago, Gebidozo said:

I wonder what being “handsome” even means. All my life, I’ve been with women who told me being handsome doesn’t matter. I never considered myself handsome yet I’ve always had success with women. I’ve seen some of my friends, definitely none of them looking like models, conquering the hearts of many women. 

I’m just curious how those “handsome” guys look like and what kind of women fall for them.

Handsome: including but not limited to: David Beckham, Chris Hemsworth, Dev Patel, Brian Tee, Regé-Jean Page.    Of course, the fact that I can see handsomeness in a man doesn't mean I need it to be attracted to a man.  I like happy eyes and a ready smile, a fun personality, positive outlook. 

I too struggle to understand why some women need a guy to be handsome in order to date them.   Though is it any different to all the male posters here who are punching above their weight in the dating pool and are perennially single?  I really don't understand why the guys act this way either.   I guess that for both sexes, there's likely a high degree of objectification going on

[FredEire]

3 minutes ago, basil67 said:

Handsome: including but not limited to: David Beckham, Chris Hemsworth, Dev Patel, Brian Tee, Regé-Jean Page.    Of course, the fact that I can see handsomeness in a man doesn't mean I need it to be attracted to a man.  I like happy eyes and a ready smile, a fun personality, positive outlook. 

I too struggle to understand why some women need a guy to be handsome in order to date them.   Though is it any different to all the male posters here who are punching above their weight in the dating pool and are perennially single?  I really don't understand why the guys act this way either.   I guess that for both sexes, there's likely a high degree of objectification going on

I think appearance is highly linked to lust and sex. I do kind of see the point that it's harder for somewhat or highly physically unattractive people because they won't necessarily be attracted to people in their "league", even though those are the people they can date.

I've only slept with people I found genuinely unattractive a couple of times when I was a horny guy in his early 20s who didn't know better, and I very quickly said never again. Looks aren't everything but physical attraction does matter, if it isn't there whatsoever you aren't going to enjoy sex and it doesn't really matter how wonderful they are as a person etc.

 

[Gebidozo]

2 hours ago, basil67 said:

Though is it any different to all the male posters here who are punching above their weight in the dating pool and are perennially single?

Nope, no difference. It’s a materialistic attitude: trying to get a shiny new thing instead of trying to connect to a human being on all levels. It’s just a totally wrong approach to dating and love. 

[Gebidozo]

2 hours ago, FredEire said:

I think appearance is highly linked to lust and sex. I do kind of see the point that it's harder for somewhat or highly physically unattractive people because they won't necessarily be attracted to people in their "league", even though those are the people they can date.

That’s the part I understand least of all: why being “handsome” is equated with being attractive.

Of course appearance is linked to lust and sex, but it’s just one of the many factors. Also, we’re talking about dating, not hooking up. 

But even for the most casual stuff, I still don’t get how attraction can only be based on looks. I once was in the same room with 10 female models who were constantly changing their clothes. I really wasn’t aroused or anything, and I’m an incredibly horny guy. They just looked poor, anemic, bored, and too much alike.

An attractive woman, to me, is someone sexy, seductive, naughty, smart, witty, cute, and, above all, kind. Looks do matter, of course. But really not that much.

[Trail Blazer]

12 hours ago, FredEire said:

It's like playing basketball and being 7 foot tall. Is it an advantage? Sure, nobody would claim it isn't. But if you're otherwise slow, clumsy and shooting bricks all day you're still a shitty basketball player. And there's players like Steph Curry who are a relatively normal height but so good at other things they're still really really good.

Basically looks aren't everything but they're a big help to draw people in and start relationships, and that's when your other qualities have to take over. If you don't have good looks you just have to maximise what you have and work a bit harder to get in the mix.

As a Blazer's fan, this resonates with me.  Damian Lillard wasn't tall (by basketball standards), but he could seemingly do it all.  Alas, it was we who couldn't entice him to stay, and we were dumped for Milwauke.

However, I digress...

I think your analogy only works to the extent that all attributes that enable someone to get a look-in would be considered "attractive". 

Like a player who gets drafted for something that a prospective club would see as benefiting them, the hard work begins once they walk through the clubrooms.

A man who has no (physical) attraction to a woman is not going to get a look-in on a dating app.  He might have other quality attributes, but if he doesn't have that thing that sets him apart when the talent scouts are looking, then he's going to sit with no offers.

[Gebidozo]

15 minutes ago, Trail Blazer said:

A man who has no (physical) attraction to a woman is not going to get a look-in on a dating app.  He might have other quality attributes, but if he doesn't have that thing that sets him apart when the talent scouts are looking, then he's going to sit with no offers.

See, that’s what I don’t understand. How can anyone tell if a man (or a woman) is physically attractive from some photo and description on a dating app? Anyone can make a good photo of themselves and write some stuff about themselves that sounds good. I can’t fathom why anyone would choose anyone based on that. 

[Trail Blazer]

56 minutes ago, Gebidozo said:

See, that’s what I don’t understand. How can anyone tell if a man (or a woman) is physically attractive from some photo and description on a dating app? Anyone can make a good photo of themselves and write some stuff about themselves that sounds good. I can’t fathom why anyone would choose anyone based on that. 

One thing that apparently women find attractive, is if a man has photos showing that he does things, and at least one photo in amongst a group of friends, also to show that he's popular amongst his peers.

Attractive photos only go so far, I have been told, and to set oneself apart, a guy must tell a story about his life, and sell that there will be some adventure.  Women are attracted to a man who can lead, or so I am told.

As far as how can anyone tell if someone is attractive on a dating site; look, it's not hard to tell if a woman is attractive, you just have to feel attracted to her photos.  That is no guarantee to translate to attraction when meeting in person.

I use the example of my partner; when we matched on Bumble, I could tell she was attractive from her photos, but her photos were more about conveying her quirky personality than her physical attributes.

When we met on our first date, I was blown away.  She was actually stunning in real life, and had a radiant smile that wasn't present in her photos, as well as a very warm personality and great sense of humor.

I was lucky in the sense that I never really got catfished (or fatfished as the term goes).  Pretty much every woman I went on a date looked similar enough to her photos.  However, my partner was the exception, who far exceeded what she portrayed online.

At the end of the day, I don't really have any sage advice to anyone using dating apps.  We can over-analyze 'til the cows come home.  It's up to individuals to work out what works, and to try and make it work for them.  A lot boils down to luck and being in the right place at the right time.

[basil67]

6 hours ago, FredEire said:

I think appearance is highly linked to lust and sex. I do kind of see the point that it's harder for somewhat or highly physically unattractive people because they won't necessarily be attracted to people in their "league", even though those are the people they can date.

I've only slept with people I found genuinely unattractive a couple of times when I was a horny guy in his early 20s who didn't know better, and I very quickly said never again. Looks aren't everything but physical attraction does matter, if it isn't there whatsoever you aren't going to enjoy sex and it doesn't really matter how wonderful they are as a person etc.

 

Appearance is highly linked to lust and sex *for you*.   *For me* it's the twinkle in an eye, a ready smile, good social skills and being a good human.  

[justwhoiam]

6 hours ago, basil67 said:

[...] the fact that I can see handsomeness in a man doesn't mean I need it to be attracted to a man.

Indeed. I can acknowledge that a man is handsome without feeling attracted to him or ever wanting to be with him as a partner or intimately.

2 hours ago, Gebidozo said:

How can anyone tell if a man (or a woman) is physically attractive from some photo and description on a dating app? Anyone can make a good photo of themselves and write some stuff about themselves that sounds good. I can’t fathom why anyone would choose anyone based on that.

If I were to choose who to go out with just by looking at men's photos, I’d have to use logic, not just my eyes—and that's probably what most women do when picking someone to date. When a woman sees a man standing in a club, a pub, or anywhere else, how does she feel attracted to him? It usually comes down to one of two things: he's someone she'd have sex with, or someone she'd love to, even if she thinks she probably wouldn't. That creates sexual tension. The first impression is based on how he looks—a combination of factors like height, teeth, hands, posture, smile, eyes, hair, confidence, and outfit. These are details that can be seen in pictures, maybe not all in one photo, but if he posts several, she’ll likely get an idea of the kind of person he is. Is that reductive? It might be, because sometimes you misjudge by appearances, or the man has qualities that don't show up in photos. And it’s not necessarily about being perfect or handsome; some women might dismiss such men altogether. Sexual tension is sparked differently for different women. Sometimes it’s the little details—red hair, no hair, or blue eyes with dark hair. My first crush in elementary school was a very assertive, opinionated boy. His friend was taller, with blue eyes and considered more handsome, but I didn’t feel anything for him. Just to help you understand how deeply rooted this is in girls from an early age.

1 hour ago, Trail Blazer said:

1 One thing that apparently women find attractive, is if a man has photos showing that he does things, and at least one photo in amongst a group of friends, also to show that he's popular amongst his peers.

2 Attractive photos only go so far, I have been told, and to set oneself apart, a guy must tell a story about his life, and sell that there will be some adventure.  Women are attracted to a man who can lead, or so I am told.

3 As far as how can anyone tell if someone is attractive on a dating site; look, it's not hard to tell if a woman is attractive, you just have to feel attracted to her photos.  That is no guarantee to translate to attraction when meeting in person.

4 I use the example of my partner; when we matched on Bumble, I could tell she was attractive from her photos, but her photos were more about conveying her quirky personality than her physical attributes.

5 When we met on our first date, I was blown away.  She was actually stunning in real life, and had a radiant smile that wasn't present in her photos, as well as a very warm personality and great sense of humor.

6 At the end of the day, I don't really have any sage advice to anyone using dating apps.  We can over-analyze 'til the cows come home.  It's up to individuals to work out what works, and to try and make it work for them.  A lot boils down to luck and being in the right place at the right time.

1 Social skills can be attractive. Some men believe that when a man is surrounded by women, he becomes automatically more appealing. I've seen this idea in movies but didn’t think much of it until a cousin of mine got divorced and told me that it’s a surefire way to attract women.

2 Telling a story through pictures? I'd say 'no.' As for 'adventure,' that depends on the woman, but it's not for me. If anything, sell excitement—very few women are interested in a perennial couch potato. Leading can be very attractive to women, I agree, as long as he treats her well and doesn’t impose or order her around.

3 I couldn't agree more.

4 This is pretty common for women—they often prefer to be creative or reject the idea of being chosen mainly for their looks or breast size. Posting half pictures or odd, seemingly irrelevant details can help weed out shallow men or those who don’t want to waste time on those kinds of photos.

5 Funny. I think my man was pleasantly surprised by my smile because in the few pictures he’d seen of me, I wasn’t smiling with my teeth showing. He jokingly admitted that he even wondered if I had bad or rotten teeth!

6 Maybe you're right, but some people are just clumsy or clueless. More than luck, they need to put in a lot of effort.

27 minutes ago, basil67 said:

Appearance is highly linked to lust and sex *for you*.   *For me* it's the twinkle in an eye, a ready smile, good social skills and being a good human.  

Most of what you described is related to appearance though 🙂

[justwhoiam]

2 minutes ago, justwhoiam said:

Some men believe that when a man is surrounded by women, he becomes automatically more appealing. I've seen this idea in movies but didn’t think much of it until a cousin of mine got divorced and told me that it’s a surefire way to attract women.

Although this might work with many women, it would never work with me. I’d see such a man as a player or a ladies' man, which is instantly unattractive to me. Being surrounded by smart looking guys could be appealing.

[Trail Blazer]

On 8/16/2024 at 4:22 PM, justwhoiam said:

This is pretty common for women—they often prefer to be creative or reject the idea of being chosen mainly for their looks or breast size. Posting half pictures or odd, seemingly irrelevant details can help weed out shallow men or those who don’t want to waste time on those kinds of photos.

I think you're on to something with your assessment.

After my SO and I added each other on the socials, I looked through her Facebook/Instagram and saw some pretty amazing photos.  Partying in a two-piece bikini on vacation in Florida with friends, and I'm like, "OMFG, damn girl!" 😍🤤

I asked her a couple of months later, "so, just out of curiosity, why did you under-sell yourself with your photo choices on Bumble?"  She said that she didn't want to "look hot", but rather, she wanted to "convey her personality" and hoped her humor would form the basis of attracting the right guy.

She's a veterinarian, so she had a photo petting a Cheetah in South Africa, a photo using a stethoscope on a chicken, scrubbing a green sea turtle (with a witty Ninja Turtle caption) at a rescue sanctuary in Australia, etc, etc.

[FredEire]

1 minute ago, Trail Blazer said:

I think you're on to something with your assessment.

After my SO and I added each other on the socials, I looked through her Facebook/Instagram and saw some pretty amazing photos.  Partying in a two-piece bikini on vacation in Florida with friends, and I'm like, "OMFG, damn girl!" 😍🤤

I asked her a couple of months later, "so, just out of curiosity, why did you under-sell yourself with your photo choices on Bumble?"  She said that she didn't want to "look hot", but rather, she wanted to "convey her personality" and hoped her humor would form the basis of attracting the right guy.

She's a veterinarian, so she had a photo petting a Cheetah in South Africa, a photo using a stethoscope on a chicken, scrubbing a green sea turtle (with a witty Ninja Turtle caption) at a rescue sanctuary in Australia, etc, etc.

Yep, a friend of min was dating a girl for a while who had one picture on her Tinder, of a pineapple lol.

It's hard to see from the male perspective but if you're getting literally hundreds of messages a day many of them just straight up asking for sex it makes a lot of sense.

[Trail Blazer]

3 minutes ago, FredEire said:

Yep, a friend of min was dating a girl for a while who had one picture on her Tinder, of a pineapple lol.

It's hard to see from the male perspective but if you're getting literally hundreds of messages a day many of them just straight up asking for sex it makes a lot of sense.

A woman I was seeing for a while, semi-seriously for a few months, but kind of more like an FWB, gave me a little insight one night into the experiences of an attractive woman on a dating app.

So, this woman straight up looked like Margot Robbie - she was incredibly attractive, but also a bit cray-cray, hence my reticence to discuss progressing things beyond the status quo at the time.

Anyway, one Saturday night at her house, a few red wines in, she asks me if I wanted to see something funny.  So, I said, "yeah, sure..."

She pulls out her cell phone, opens the Plenty of Fish app, and tells me that she's going to reactivate her account.  She told me she'd deactivated her account while with me.

So, her account is active again, she says, "let's go back and check in one hour."  One hour later, we check and she has, like, over 100 messages.  She handed me her phone and told me to read through some.

I have to say, it was somewhat alarming what I saw.  Some absolutely thirsty MoFo's, rude and abrupt, vulgar, some really, really strange intros, and the odd very reasonable ones, too, from some strange and average looking fellows. 

My assessment of this experience is that it's just absolutely crazy how much attention an attractive woman receives.  I was told by her that she deletes most messages as it's incredibly overwhelming and only reads messages from the guys who were "good looking" and filters them out from there.

 

[FredEire]

22 minutes ago, Trail Blazer said:

A woman I was seeing for a while, semi-seriously for a few months, but kind of more like an FWB, gave me a little insight one night into the experiences of an attractive woman on a dating app.

So, this woman straight up looked like Margot Robbie - she was incredibly attractive, but also a bit cray-cray, hence my reticence to discuss progressing things beyond the status quo at the time.

Anyway, one Saturday night at her house, a few red wines in, she asks me if I wanted to see something funny.  So, I said, "yeah, sure..."

She pulls out her cell phone, opens the Plenty of Fish app, and tells me that she's going to reactivate her account.  She told me she'd deactivated her account while with me.

So, her account is active again, she says, "let's go back and check in one hour."  One hour later, we check and she has, like, over 100 messages.  She handed me her phone and told me to read through some.

I have to say, it was somewhat alarming what I saw.  Some absolutely thirsty MoFo's, rude and abrupt, vulgar, some really, really strange intros, and the odd very reasonable ones, too, from some strange and average looking fellows. 

My assessment of this experience is that it's just absolutely crazy how much attention an attractive woman receives.  I was told by her that she deletes most messages as it's incredibly overwhelming and only reads messages from the guys who were "good looking" and filters them out from there.

 

Yup. A female friend showed me the same, exactly the same as you describe. And she was a nice-looking girl but definitely not Margot Robbie.

Sometimes when I've had a struggling patch in dating I remind myself of that and that I've got a lot more going for me than most of these guys 😂

[justwhoiam]

On 8/17/2024 at 5:10 PM, FredEire said:

Yep, a friend of min was dating a girl for a while who had one picture on her Tinder, of a pineapple lol.

It's hard to see from the male perspective but if you're getting literally hundreds of messages a day many of them just straight up asking for sex it makes a lot of sense.

I once opened an account on Tinder, during the pandemic, first because I was far from home and stuck there, and secondly because I had heard of the Dolly Parton's challenge, so I said: why not? Well, I only uploaded pictures of my home-made pies and tarts and had several men messaging me in just two days 😁

[justwhoiam]

On 8/17/2024 at 5:31 PM, Trail Blazer said:

A woman I was seeing [...] kind of more like an FWB, [...] opens the Plenty of Fish app [...] One hour later, we check and she has, like, over 100 messages. 

[...] Some absolutely thirsty MoFo's, rude and abrupt, vulgar, some really, really strange intros, and the odd very reasonable ones, too, from some strange and average looking fellows.

Plenty of Fish is the Craigslist of dating. So it's not surprising.