Why lie?

[DoYouLikeWaffles]

My fiancé and I have been together 7 years. We're both 40. I was in an emotionally abusive marriage prior to this. So I'm a little reactive sometimes around certain things. I've had years of therapy and do my best to implement tools marriage counseling taught me as well as using tools from regular counseling to help foster healthy communication. 

 

Our relationship has broken down to where I think it's done. There were initial red flags that I ignored that have of course come back full force. I have lost all desire for him. I've been trying for years to make things work, and it feels like I am putting all this effort in and my partner isn't. He has consistently tried to get me to join him at his hobby that pretty much consumes his life. I've gone a few times, and I get ignored the whole time, and it's uncomfortable. People are cliquey. I feel like an outsider and he disappears off to socialize with everyone leaving me alone to fend for myself or to chase after our kids if we have brought them along. I've tried befriending others there, and it just feels off and awkward. It is not my world. It's also usually camping events and I have chronic pain that flares up so I don't feel comfortable there. I explained to him how the events feel and I stopped going. I started trying to find shows we could watch together at night, I try to plan nights out for dinner, I've booked movies for us, I plan anniversary dates, I invite him on walks with me (he doesn't go on the walks), I try to share my interests with him, and I try to just chat with him about random day to day things. And it feels like he has zero interest. And I am the one putting all this effort in. I don't mind doing things in a group setting, but I want to spend time alone with my partner too. Just chatting, sharing things that happened to us that day, or whatever. It feels like his priority is this one hobby and his friends though. 

 It feels like the relationship revolves around him and his interests. I dont feel heard and I have tried a few times to no avail. So I've started mentally checking out. He does have some mental illness that he was taking medication for. He randomly stopped taking it and didn't say a thing. While medicated, he was more self aware and absolutely working on trying to find ways to help repair our relationship. We were able to communicate healthily and address concerns. He stopped taking the medication and it's like he lives in his own little world that isn't fully steeped in reality. He is abrupt and short tempered and depressed.I've asked him why he stopped, he doesn't have an answer. I have expressed concern and finally, I've told him I won't enable him. And I've started looking for a job, and am working on trying to be secure enough that we can go our separate ways. He doesn't sleep in our room, he sleeps on the couch. He started doing that on his own, I didnt ask him to. He won't talk with me, and he has been spending more and more time on his phone and computer. Or else he's out at these events. There is no real time spent together. It's lonely. 

 

So here's what I don't get. I know he's not happy. I feel the same coldness/distance from him that occurred when my ex husband cheated on me. He won't talk to me, he gets visibly annoyed when I ask if he wants to watch a show or do something with me. And yet, he just tonight started talking about all these plans he has and he hopes that we can go camping together as a family in the summer. ..why!??? I know he's been detaching and I've seen a few conversations with his friends where he has said he wants to leave me as I'm apparently this overbearing horrible person. So why even talk about wanting to spend time together in the future with me? I started detaching not that long ago after realizing that I've been putting all this effort in and just feel truly lonely. I just don't understand him mentally withdrawing but then saying all these things and making it sound like we will he together in the future when I don't think that's what he truly wants. 

 

It's just frustrating and I really want to get financially secure again so that I can move forward solo. 

[basil67]

25 minutes ago, DoYouLikeWaffles said:

And yet, he just tonight started talking about all these plans he has and he hopes that we can go camping together as a family in the summer. ..why!???

This is a question for him.  "I don't know why you said this.  You're aware that we have nothing in common anymore, and we're just treading water until we can separate and I don't even like camping"

Do you have somewhere you can go to so that you can leave him sooner?  Parents?  Sister?  If you have any shared bank accounts or property, have you spoken with a lawyer for advice?

Edited September 23 by basil67

[DoYouLikeWaffles]

I sadly have no support out here. Family lives hours away. Friends live far away too. My mom is an addict, we have no relationship. He moved into my place. So I want him to leave. I want my house back. I am a stay at home parent though, so I want to get a job again before asking him to leave so that I have some form of financial security and I'm not left struggling to find a job and daycare, while taking care of my kids. I'm overwhelmed and depressed as it is and struggling with becoming a single parent again. 

 

He has not told me that he is planning on leaving me, but I have stumbled across messages about me and how he is going to leave because I'm just unbearable and demanding. When I asked once about us, he indicated that he still wants to be with me. 

 

When I asked about him not taking his meds anymore, he had no answer or explanation for me. I told him I will not remain in a relationship with him if he refuses to take his medication or talk to his doctor at least about maybe different medication or something as I will not enable what I feel is him engaging in self destructive behavior. I also don't like that he lied to me about taking his medication when he wasn't. It is his choice whether he takes medication or not, but if he doesn't, his moods impact me as well as the kids, and I am not going to remain around it as it impacts us negatively. His response was just a shrug. And then he just shut down and stopped talking. 

The comments about hoping we can do these things, just baffled me some. It feels like he's trying to keep up a facade when he really doesn't have to. Or like he is clinging to this because he still wants a relationship, even though I don't feel we are a good match anymore.

 

And you are right, I should be asking him this. I think it just frustrates me, because I'm trying to come to terms with this, and that isn't helping me any. And the majority of conversations lately where I try to ask about anything pertaining to us, I get deflections and non answers. And I've gotten to the point where I have no desire to ask because I just get shrugs. It's like talking to a wall. But tonight, I'm just frustrated and sad. It feels like the more I withdraw lately, the more he is suddenly starting to talk about a future between us or act a bit more like a partner towards me. And for me, that just frustrates me more. I wanted that a few years ago or even 6 months ago for that matter.

 

We are going to do couples counseling in 2 weeks. Kids are involved, I want to make sure we can communicate and at least remain friendly since we will have to coparent. But I've gone through a lot these past few years and I've come to the realization that I feel we are just poorly matched and that is leading us both to feel unhappy.

[MsJayne]

53 minutes ago, DoYouLikeWaffles said:

I know he's been detaching and I've seen a few conversations with his friends where he has said he wants to leave me as I'm apparently this overbearing horrible person.

Why would he say this about you? 

55 minutes ago, DoYouLikeWaffles said:

He does have some mental illness that he was taking medication for.

What are we talking about here? Is it emotional or neurological?

 

58 minutes ago, DoYouLikeWaffles said:

I started detaching not that long ago after realizing that I've been putting all this effort in and just feel truly lonely.

It sounds like he detached quite some time ago and maybe the two of you just don't have a lot in common and don't even really like each other. If he refuses to discuss things maybe just bring up divorce and ask him if that's what he wants, that should provoke some sort of response. 

[Leihla_B]

Just as you have your agenda before separating, he may have one, too. So the future-speak might be his way of buying time until his plans line up. I'd seek legal advice as soon as possible to learn your best options. You may be entitled to some support to help you with a softer landing. Go find out. This way you can operate on real information rather than emotions alone.

[DoYouLikeWaffles]

1 minute ago, MsJayne said:

Why would he say this about you? 

I've been trying to improve communication lately. I have been trying to give insight into why I respond certain ways to things. Or trying to gain insight with him so I will ask questions to better understand when he says something vs. make assumptions that I understood. And I think it annoys him. I think he's also annoyed when I express to him when he says things that I find hurtful.

1 minute ago, MsJayne said:

What are we talking about here? Is it emotional or neurological?

ADHD, depression, and anxiety. He was apparently told there might be PTSD as well. 

There's a family history of schizophrenia, bipolar, and borderline personality as well. 

1 minute ago, MsJayne said:

 

It sounds like he detached quite some time ago and maybe the two of you just don't have a lot in common and don't even really like each other. If he refuses to discuss things maybe just bring up divorce and ask him if that's what he wants, that should provoke some sort of response. 

He won't give an answer, I get non answers. I think he's just done. I bring up feeling like we should break up, he shrugs. I've asked if he wants to still be with me, he deflects the answer. But then the next day he will talk as if everything is fine. So I'm working on getting a job and moving on because I can't do this. I get shouldered with all the responsibilities and he does what he wants. I'm resentful at this point. I've vocalized concerns, I've tried finding ways to work together, and I don't feel like it should be me putting all the effort into trying to keep this going. It takes a lot for me to detach, but I've definitely hit that stage now.

[MsJayne]

I don't have any advice other than I think you're right to not want to waste your life doing this. Being as it's your house I'd be giving him a couple of months notice to find somewhere else to live. Bagging you behind your back and telling other people he's leaving you is really disloyal and disrespectful. He probably has a point of view, maybe you'll hear about it when you start relationship counselling if you can tolerate things until then. If nothing else the counselling will help you, (hopefully), to separate amicably with minimal impact on kids. 

[DoYouLikeWaffles]

That's my hope with the counseling. Seeing the comments about me really hurt. I know they weren't meant for my eyes and that he's allowed to vent to friends. But it still hurts and it's hard seeing that it is how he views me. It doesn't read as someone venting frustration. It reads as someone that is stating that they can not stand me anymore and can not wait to leave me. I've felt the distance to start, so I knew things were not good. But it still hurts to read. I've been trying to take things one day at a time. Discovering that, stung and made me realize that the distance I've been feeling, isn't in my head and that this needs to end for both of our sakes. I think he doesn't like that I refuse to enable problematic behaviour or let him just sweep things under the rug so to speak. 

 

Couples counseling will be interesting. He didn't feel he had the proper coping tools to do it yet, but because we started arguing more, he agreed to going with me sooner vs. later. I am just hoping to have it help with things ending more amicably and being given effective tools to coparent together.

[ExpatInItaly]

2 hours ago, DoYouLikeWaffles said:

 He moved into my place. So I want him to leave. I want my house back.

And this may be why he's still hinting at doing things together when the relaionship is clearly pretty much over. It's easier for him to stay put and coast along under your roof than to get off his duff and find a new place for himself. 

But you're right to be putting a plan in place to stand on your own two feet and end it. It's beyond time, so counselling could help to navigate those waters ahead for you. 

(And yes, I certainly do like waffles)

[stillafool]

9 hours ago, DoYouLikeWaffles said:

. I am just hoping to have it help with things ending more amicably and being given effective tools to coparent together.

Be sure to explain to the counselor that ^this is your objective and not reconciliation.  I would make job hunting my top priority if I were in your shoes.

Edited September 23 by stillafool

[DoYouLikeWaffles]

On 9/23/2024 at 10:15 AM, stillafool said:

Be sure to explain to the counselor that ^this is your objective and not reconciliation.  I would make job hunting my top priority if I were in your shoes.

 

I filled out the preintake form for my counselor and it asks what issues I'm having from a checklist and asks for additional comments. I think I was able to give a good description of what's been going on and where I am at. When it asked my top 3 therapy goals, I did acknowledge some of my other shortcomings (emotional dysregulation when overwhelmed and people pleasing) and just mentioned that I want to figure out how to effectively communicate with my partner for the sake of our children. But that I was not wanting to be in the relationship anymore.

 

Job hunting has started. I have to reinstate my license for my job, and that's taking a bit longer than I'd hoped. I have a few more hoops to jump through and then hopefully, I get a job offer relatively soon. Then I have to figure out child care but that's after I land a job. I am having a hard time right now and feel like I'm on edge over every little thing. The hard part has been feeling like I can't talk to anybody about what's going on. I am very happy I found this forum. I've internalized my frustration for so long now, and it feels good being able to talk about it a bit.

[DoYouLikeWaffles]

 

On 9/23/2024 at 2:18 AM, ExpatInItaly said:

And this may be why he's still hinting at doing things together when the relaionship is clearly pretty much over. It's easier for him to stay put and coast along under your roof than to get off his duff and find a new place for himself. 

I think this is exactly it. Or he's just as confused as to what he truly wants. He was on medication that he stopped taking. When he was taking the medication, we were having healthy discussions and it felt like we were repairing things bit by bit and building a new foundation to forge ahead with. I remember even making a comment about how proud of us I was since we were both able to navigate some difficult topics calmly and respectfully. 

And then he stopped taking his medication and his entire demeanor changed. I noticed when it started, I suspected he'd stopped with his meds but wasn't sure. I asked if he had taken them yet one morning and he lied to my face. When I found the pill bottles that should have been empty 2 months ago that were still full, my heart sank. 

 

He stopped his medication abruptly before this too and I remember that he started acting very unstable and unhinged and I was confused, burnt out, and really close to leaving him. At that time, I had no clue he wasnt taking his medication until he disappeared for a few days after an argument and I found a very full pill bottle in his office. He came back, but we lived apart for a bit. He started therapy, he went back onto his medication and he had a plan for getting better and helping regain the lost trust. And I let him know that I wasn't going to stick around if he did something like this again, as it's too hard on both me and the kids. It took a lot to let my guard down again and so him abruptly stopping medication again, was a huge slap in the face.

 

On 9/23/2024 at 2:18 AM, ExpatInItaly said:

But you're right to be putting a plan in place to stand on your own two feet and end it. It's beyond time, so counselling could help to navigate those waters ahead for you. 

I've got couples counseling, individual relationship counseling, and I also reached out to a domestic abuse counselor. He's yelled at me quite a bit, and yells at the kids and I know this can be considered abusive. I'm still in denial, or not ready to admit he acts abusive. My ex husband before this was mentally abusive though  and I am aware that my current partners behavior is 100% triggering past feelings. So if anything, it can help me come to terms with any unresolved things from my past marriage. 

On 9/23/2024 at 2:18 AM, ExpatInItaly said:

(And yes, I certainly do like waffles)

Waffles are the best. 😁

[ExpatInItaly]

7 minutes ago, DoYouLikeWaffles said:

he disappeared for a few days after an argument

Where did he go? 

[DoYouLikeWaffles]

16 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Where did he go? 

He claims he slept in the car and just drove around a bunch for two days.

[ExpatInItaly]

1 hour ago, DoYouLikeWaffles said:

He claims he slept in the car and just drove around a bunch for two days.

Do you believe that?

[DoYouLikeWaffles]

6 hours ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Do you believe that?

I actually do. He came back disheveled and smelling awful. And the car was littered with food wrappers, coffee cups too. 

When he left, I assumed he would call in sick to work or something. But instead, I got a call from his employer looking for him. At first I assumed he hadn't shown, but learned quickly that he had attended a meeting remotely and was rambling and very incoherent. They were worried for his well being. I ended up calling the police for a well check, and learned that his employer had done the same thing after phoning me.

If you're asking if I think there's someone else. I don't.

My ex husband cheated and before I even got confirmation of it, I had a gut feeling and just kind of knew. 

That gut feeling isn't there this time, and as distant as he's being, he's leaving his phone and devices out around me where I could go snooping through if I wanted to. He's not acting suspicious in any other way, just mentally checked out.

I think he's unwell and depressed. But I've already gone through this and if he isn't going to take his medication, I'm not going through the emotional roller coaster of this every time he decides he is well enough to abruptly stop medication and lie about it. 

[BaileyB]

Just wanted to say, I support your decision to end this relationship. Glad that you will get some counselling and you are working to out a plan in place to support yourself and your children. This is hard, but you sound ready to do this - I wish you strength! 

[Leihla_B]

11 hours ago, DoYouLikeWaffles said:

Then I have to figure out child care but that's after I land a job. I am having a hard time right now and feel like I'm on edge over every little thing. The hard part has been feeling like I can't talk to anybody about what's going on.

You can begin this research now, and you can also reach out for support from resources for women who want to exit a relationship safely. Contact your area hospitals to connect with their human services department. Ask for a referral to services for domestic violence prevention. The key word is 'prevention,' so you don't need to have been abused in order to benefit from these services. They have networks not known to the general public that can help you make a plan and carry it out effectively. They can offer child care, legal and financial resources to help.

If you reach a dead end with one hospital, contact another. The point is to tap into organizations that help women find work and get on their feet while leaving a domestic situation in ways that benefit the children and all involved. There are people who are trained in this stuff--find them.

Holding you in my thoughts.

[DoYouLikeWaffles]

5 hours ago, Leihla_B said:

You can begin this research now, and you can also reach out for support from resources for women who want to exit a relationship safely. Contact your area hospitals to connect with their human services department. Ask for a referral to services for domestic violence prevention. The key word is 'prevention,' so you don't need to have been abused in order to benefit from these services.

I applied for before and after school care starting next year for my kids. The programs out here fill up fast, so I got put on waiting lists. I know I'll be eligible for subsidies that'll help by this point. 

I reached out for counseling from one of these services. They tried calling today while he was in the car with me. The number shows as unknown, I just let it go to voicemail. It is iffy on how much support I'll get. It's my name on the mortgage and I moved him in with me. I also have some savings despite having a s*** ton of debt. I'm well aware he could probably come after me for some of the equity in the home. But I truly believe that when he gets told I'm done, he will just leave. I think he will be too fixated on all his other issues going on to have the energy to care enough. I think he will feel relieved and just throw himself more into escaping reality. I could be 100% wrong. I'm well aware, this is just my prediction.

 

He's gone this weekend so I will be trying to reach out to these organizations a bit more during that time. 

 

5 hours ago, Leihla_B said:

They have networks not known to the general public that can help you make a plan and carry it out effectively. They can offer child care, legal and financial resources to help.

I contacted a family violence line that gave me some resources already. I just am still coming to terms with this part of things.

5 hours ago, Leihla_B said:

Holding you in my thoughts.

I appreciate this. My old job has 2 positions open. They might only be short term fixes, but its job security for the time being. 

I also made a great connection today. My partner came with me to pick our son up from school and he was livid that our son had a meltdown at school yesterday and hurt a classmate. ..he is 5 for context. I asked our son what happened, and he was really upset and in tears. My partner took him to the car and the mom I had been talking to prior to this said a few things that clued me in to the fact that she was in a similar predicament to me. Except her husband KNOWS she's leaving. So we've exchanged phone numbers and are sharing supports. I might be getting her help filling out some things as my children have ADHD and I can get support for that out here. But the paperwork is a pain to fill out. And if anything, maybe we can help each other out with school pick ups occasionally or something. But we can also vent to one another too and share frustrations. This was a welcome surprise today. And his reaction and perception to what happened with our son helped remind me that this needs to end for everyone's sake.