What to think, and what to do?

[ExpatInItaly]

Just be yourself, OP.

It's normal to be nervous but you again seem to be forgetting this is not just about getting him to like you. It should also very much be about seeing if you feel he could be a good match for you. 

You are trying too hard to control the outcome here. Go and see how you get on. See if there is mutual chemistry. Don't place your expectations any higher than that right now 

[Leihla_B]

5 hours ago, Runninggirl said:

...how can I deepen the connection on this date/see if we have one, so it’s not just superficial chit chat and flirting?

Don't try to skip steps. There's no such thing as an insta-relationship. Getting to know someone involves a superficial meeting ground of respect. Pushing for intimacy too quickly isn't a great way to attain it. Trust is built over t.i.m.e. and the process is reciprocal--one small question and answer at a time.

When one person is willing to reveal a bit of vulnerability, it welcomes the other to do the same. The key words are 'a bit,' rather than an onslaught.

Humor helps grease those wheels, and it never hurts to go there often.

Head high, and enjOy!

[Runninggirl]

I know i know, it’s just been a while since I’ve been in a date I’m excited about. The previous people I’ve dated they’ve been so much more interested and invested than me in the beginning. Now I suddenly feel like a 16 year old. 
Don’t get me wrong, it’s also a very nice feeling to be excited about someone again properly. I’ve liked people before obviously, but my gut feeling just feels different about it this time. 
like what I could use some help with is maybe good ideas for talking points that will give me some good insight about this guy. What can and should I ask. My mind kind of goes blank with him. 

[basil67]

2 hours ago, Runninggirl said:

like what I could use some help with is maybe good ideas for talking points that will give me some good insight about this guy. What can and should I ask. My mind kind of goes blank with him. 

What kind of insight?

[basil67]

6 hours ago, Runninggirl said:

like what I could use some help with is maybe good ideas for talking points that will give me some good insight about this guy. What can and should I ask. My mind kind of goes blank with him. 

Thinking further....insight into another person is yet another thing which can't be rushed. First date is simply about discovering if you enjoy each other's company, can talk easily and have potential for mutual attraction.   

[ExpatInItaly]

11 hours ago, Runninggirl said:

maybe good ideas for talking points

This isn't a business meeting. 

Why not just chat and see where the conversation goes? Family, friends, work, hobbies, the usual things...if you over-think and over-prepare, you are going to set yourself up to let anxiety control this date. Relax. 

[Runninggirl]

Okay, the Date didn’t go too well?

He was on time, picked me up and we went to see his new place. It was cool, I gave him compliments for the plans he had, he made a short comment about me being there in the future. He made zero moves, we just walked from room to room, I really tried to engage in his vision and show interest (which was genuine).

then we went to a sushi place, we waited a little in the car and then he kissed me pretty passionately. But I wouldn’t say it was a crazy success, it seemed a bit forced and premature. 

Then we had sushi at a very nice place. He gave me compliments for what I was wearing. We talked, but it didn’t feel like we got anywhere. The spark I’ve felt before just wasn’t there as much as before. It felt very comfortable and familiar. I felt a bit fake as if I couldn’t put my personality into my replies, the conversations just wasn’t that great. I feel like I could have done way better. 
it was nice… but I almost felt like we met up as friends, which is very confusing. It felt like I was out with him as his “buddy”. 
And there was zero romance, no effort from his side I would say. He did hold my hand a little and kiss me etc.

He ended the date when it was getting late. I didn’t feel like a got a very good goodbye either. He gave me a hard hug, we made some jokes and he kissed me on my cheek..

it’s not been that long, I’m sort of a waiting for a text giving me an indication of how it went. He texted me the last time. Or is it my turn now?

 

[basil67]

Ah, sorry to hear.

With respect to taking turns organising dates, what makes you believe he will be interested will be a second date?    And for that matter, why you do want a second date?  You've got nothing good to say about it

[Gebidozo]

OP, I’m a bit confused.

You’re saying that

1 hour ago, Runninggirl said:

he kissed me pretty passionately

and that

1 hour ago, Runninggirl said:

He did hold my hand a little and kiss me etc.

Yet at the same time you’re saying that

1 hour ago, Runninggirl said:

He made zero moves

and

1 hour ago, Runninggirl said:

there was zero romance, no effort from his side

Which is it? If he held your hand and kissed you, then he did make moves and there was romance coming from his side.

Now, if you felt that there was no romance in it for you, then that’s an entirely different story.

What surprises me most in your account is how you keep talking about what he did or didn’t do, how you’re trying to desperately guess whether he feels something or not, while saying absolutely nothing about what you did or what you felt.

It begins to sound to me like you might not be really interested in this guy romantically. I mean, that’s the vibe I would get if you described a date with me like that. You’re saying that he did romantic gestures but it still felt like just a friendly meeting. He held your hand and kissed you, but you haven’t reciprocated. Or have you? You say nothing about that.

 

Edited Sunday at 10:44 PM by Gebidozo

[NuevoYorko]

My general impression is that he'd kind of like to try out a "friends with benefits" situation with you and he's awkward about how to approach it.  

Please, please, please stop putting any emotional currency into this guy.  

I mean - if he starts courting you in a serious way,  maybe, but so far, from what you've shared, he's shown no sign of being on that track.  

Yet you're tying yourself in knots over how to somehow make it happen.

This is a pattern with you.  Go back and read some of your past threads, if you don't agree or remember.

Treat yourself better.

[ExpatInItaly]

7 hours ago, Gebidozo said:

Which is it? If he held your hand and kissed you, then he did make moves and there was romance coming from his side.

Now, if you felt that there was no romance in it for you, then that’s an entirely different story.

I'm with you.

I don't get it, OP.  He made moves. Did you enjoy that? Or were you hoping for some other sort of move? I am confused. 

 

[basil67]

I just refreshed myself on your first post about on this thread:  The way he started out is exactly how he's continuing: He is absolutely consistent in being inconsistent.    Meanwhile, you're already over invested in trying to make something of this.   Even if you can get him to start initiating more, he will soon go back to the person he showed you he is.  

 

[Runninggirl]

It was poorly written in my part.

i first mean he didn’t make a move when we met/was at his apartment and I didn’t feel like he tried to “progress” things during the date. 

Although he did things during the date like kiss me and hold my hand it somehow didn’t feel that romantic. It just felt very comfortable. He didn’t seem as invested and almost a bit reserved in some way. 
I actually tried to make ChatGPT give me some insight to the date and it made a valuable point which was:

“He felt safe and relaxed.

some can seem more reserved after getting to know you because they feel safe in the moment and assume that the interaction doesn’t have to be as intense. That doesn’t necessarily mean his interest has decreased».

Could be the same for me. Maybe this is normal and I expect dating or romance to be intense feelings because in a lot of previous romantic relations, the other party has been very hot and cold which has always felt very intense

I definitely enjoy his company, it was just way less intense in at way.

i texted him now thanks for yesterday and that I was nice to see him, and that I hope he has a great start to the new week. I basically got the same message in reply.

 

[ExpatInItaly]

10 minutes ago, Runninggirl said:

when we met/was at his apartment and I didn’t feel like he tried to “progress” things during the date. 

You have some really odd expectations. 

You also seem to need near-constant reassurance that a guy is into you, so you micro-analyze everything. You need a "move" every step of the way to soothe your insecurity, it appears. 

I personally don't think he's a good candidate for somethinng serious, but I also think you need to work on your dating anxiety and general insecurity. 

[Runninggirl]

1 hour ago, ExpatInItaly said:

You have some really odd expectations. 

You also seem to need near-constant reassurance that a guy is into you, so you micro-analyze everything. You need a "move" every step of the way to soothe your insecurity, it appears. 

I personally don't think he's a good candidate for somethinng serious, but I also think you need to work on your dating anxiety and general insecurity. 

I definitely struggle with over analyzing and anxiety.

i think it stems from rocky relationships in the past, especially my previous most serious one where I felt like I had to watch every step I took, and he would “punish” me by silent treatment/stonewalling, and extremely fluctuating interest. It has made me very sensitive to signals of change.

[ExpatInItaly]

And what have you done to address that anxiety?

It's still ruling your thought process here. 

[basil67]

4 minutes ago, Runninggirl said:

i think it stems from rocky relationships in the past, especially my previous most serious one where I felt like I had to watch every step I took, and he would “punish” me by silent treatment/stonewalling, and extremely fluctuating interest. It has made me very sensitive to signals of change.

Have you recognised that instead of learning from being with this one, you're still attracted to guys who show fluctuating interest?   Why do you think this is? 

[Runninggirl]

7 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

And what have you done to address that anxiety?

It's still ruling your thought process here. 

I did therapy for a while without really feeling it was very helpful. Because I’m aware of it, I felt like it didn’t really give me any tools how to handle it.

the woman said that the previous relationship I described was mental abuse (which I’m not sure I agree with). But that it’s natural that your brain is overly sensitive to similarities now trying to avoid the same.

i think I self sabotage a bit. Because I’m afraid of spending a lot of time and ending up in the same situation again, so I try to progress to a point where I kind of know if they’re the same or not. because the last time it happened so gradually that I didn’t realize.

I know the only thing I can do is go with the flow and see where it takes us, my issue is that I automatically act how I did in that relationship, and I no longer know what “normal” behavior. I’ve lost common sense in a way. 
 

5 minutes ago, basil67 said:

Have you recognised that instead of learning from being with this one, you're still attracted to guys who show fluctuating interest?   Why do you think this is? 

Yes, but it’s hard to tell if that’s the case here or if I’m just being overly sensitive to signs of it.

i know that I can typically be attracted to someone where I have to “earn” their love. I think it stems from insecurities growing up, I never really had family or friends that were supportive and always there. I often found that their love would fluctuate, often without me knowing why. My parents would be very on and off and have sudden outburst, and I never felt like I could rely on them.

my best friends would always deny me having other friends, but at the same time randomly abandon me for days.

i grew up feeling like I was in a limbo. This is something I’ve spent a lot of time thinking about and realizing after that relationship I had. I often idolized the typical people I’m attracted to today, that I felt like I wasn’t cool enough for or that didn’t like me. The “normal” people. And by normal people I mean the people who were well liked, had a nice upbringing, lots of friends, etc. I’ve always wanted to feel normal, and I seek their approval to get a sense of worth. 

[basil67]

1 hour ago, Runninggirl said:

Yes, but it’s hard to tell if that’s the case here or if I’m just being overly sensitive to signs of it.

Surely you've read us being pretty much unanimous in telling you that he's not very interested.   And you're way more invested than his low effort deserves.  Sure, he sends you some heart emojis, but they don't negate his lack of consistency

If your previous therapist left you without the tools to handle this, you need a new therapist

Edited yesterday at 10:27 AM by basil67

[Runninggirl]

55 minutes ago, basil67 said:

Surely you've read us being pretty much unanimous in telling you that he's not very interested.   And you're way more invested than his low effort deserves.  Sure, he sends you some heart emojis, but they don't negate his lack of consistency

If your previous therapist left you without the tools to handle this, you need a new therapist

Yes ofc. And I mean what I said a little more as a general statement, I find it harder to read romantic situations because I’ve been overly sensitive to signs 

[basil67]

35 minutes ago, Runninggirl said:

Yes ofc. And I mean what I said a little more as a general statement, I find it harder to read romantic situations because I’ve been overly sensitive to signs 

When you say 'overly sensitive to signs', do you mean trying to turn a minor interaction into something significant or meaningful?   As it stands, this guy hasn't shown a lot of interest in you to start with, the date didn't hit the mark but you're already talking about 

 

4 hours ago, Runninggirl said:

“He felt safe and relaxed.

some can seem more reserved after getting to know you because they feel safe in the moment and assume that the interaction doesn’t have to be as intense. That doesn’t necessarily mean his interest has decreased».

I just saw this and it doesn't make sense.   Either Chat GPT is talking rubbish, or English is your second language and the translation isn't working so well.  (No offence intended, I'm genuinely trying understand if it is a translation issue.  I speak only one language, so if you speak more than one, you're better than me)   When someone gets to know us and relaxes (feel safe in the moment) they open up more.  And I don't understand what 'intense' means when on a date.  

 

You are truly setting yourself up for disappointment and/or frustration if you continue with him.  Now that you've dated him once, and he's very awkward and doesn't seem very interested, why are you still keen on him?   What makes him stand out as being a good option? 

[Runninggirl]

1 hour ago, basil67 said:

When you say 'overly sensitive to signs', do you mean trying to turn a minor interaction into something significant or meaningful?   As it stands, this guy hasn't shown a lot of interest in you to start with, the date didn't hit the mark but you're already talking about 

 

I just saw this and it doesn't make sense.   Either Chat GPT is talking rubbish, or English is your second language and the translation isn't working so well.  (No offence intended, I'm genuinely trying understand if it is a translation issue.  I speak only one language, so if you speak more than one, you're better than me)   When someone gets to know us and relaxes (feel safe in the moment) they open up more.  And I don't understand what 'intense' means when on a date.  

 

You are truly setting yourself up for disappointment and/or frustration if you continue with him.  Now that you've dated him once, and he's very awkward and doesn't seem very interested, why are you still keen on him?   What makes him stand out as being a good option? 

Yes exactly, looking for meaning in minor things good or bad. Trying to turn minor interactions and my intuition/feeling into signs of how things are.

youre right, English is my second language, so its translated. I don’t take it personal, I know my English could use some improvement  It’s also difficult to get a true translation like that, I just translated it “directly” how it’s written in my native language. 

 It makes sense for me, like being relaxed makes you come off less intense. 
 

That one date felt a little less like the other ones. I’m not sure if my feeling is based off of that it felt casual and normal, and that I expected it to feel more like a “high”. It was not boring, it just didn’t feel as intense as the two times we met before that.

I like him based off our interaction before. But I don’t want to set up for failure or disappointment.

his good qualities are that we have similar values, live in the same area, a lot of the same interests, he seems like a good guy, no weird habits or addictions etc. neither of us are particularly into drinking, which is a little abnormal for the culture here and nice to find (I live in europe). He’s been in a long term relationship not too long ago, and seems like he’s looking for something serious or long term. 

[Runninggirl]

And I forgot to say maybe the thing that made me interested in the first place: I’ve always been pretty anxious and insecure, and he’s always come off as very supportive and grounding. I only started to feel anxious and get all detective with the signs as soon as we started “dating”. Prior to that all the talking just felt very safe and consistent. He might be inconsistent and not interested now, but then he’s not interested, he doesn’t come off as a guy who’s playing games etc. I think that comes from my own insecurities.

[stillafool]

9 hours ago, Runninggirl said:

i first mean he didn’t make a move when we met/was at his apartment and I didn’t feel like he tried to “progress” things during the date. 

I thought you said he picked you up for the date.  When did you end up at his apartment and why?  Is that where you expected things to "progress"?

[ExpatInItaly]

4 hours ago, Runninggirl said:

he’s always come off as very supportive and grounding.

Didn't you only meet this guy 2 or 3 weeks ago?