Post break-up thoughts. Is this behavior normal or it is not?

[mike_m]

Hello everyone,

I apologize if my English is not perfect, but I am not a native speaker. I recently broke up with my girlfriend (we had been together for more than 10 years). Of course, I feel awful, but I don't want to talk about that or about how to cope.

I need to hear other people's opinions about my ex behavior because I really can't understand some things. It will take some time, so thank you in advance to anyone who will read this.

She suffers from depression. She had suicide thoughts in the past and sometimes she'd act in an unpredictable way: crying, irritability,  out of scale reactions and so on. Two years ago she started to take anti-depressants and she was feeling better and more stable. However, a few months ago she stared to feel bad again: she'd cry for no reason, out of the blue, saying things like 'my life is awful, I hate my job, I hate where I live, I have no feelings for you'. After a while she'd calm down and apologize, crying and saying that she didn't know why she said such things. This went on for a while, we were (and are) living in two different cities and seeing every weekend. Every time we met, there was at least one episode, either a small one or a bigger one. One weekend she was supposed to come here, but she called me and told me she didn't want to see me. She said she needed time to understand what was going on and that she didn't want to lash out on me, hurt my feelings or jeopardize our relationship. I agreed to give her time, but I was not happy with the way she did that (last moment and over phone). She said she wanted to talk face to face and explain everything to me. She came to see me two weeks later. As soon as she arrived, she said that she understood that everything was because of the relationship, she didn't love me anymore and she wanted to break up. I didn't know what to say. After a few moments, we changed topic and she started to calm down. Her face changed, she started to smile, she touched my hand, hugged me. We spent a lovely evening, she made plans for the following weekends, we kissed on the way home, once in my place we had sex (she initiated it) and then we went to sleep.

The morning after she woke up and her mood was awful. She looked like an empty shell. After a few minutes she said she had not feelings for me and she wanted to break up. I couldn't not understand what was going on. I tried to calm down and I told her that she was not well. She agreed she needed to talk to someone and decided to leave. I told her that everything was okay, she didn't need to worry about the relationship, she just had to focus on getting help and feeling better. She left, she thanked me for my comprehension. After 30 minutes she called me. She was crying and asked me to come back. I agreed. She was crying, she looked exhausted. I took her home and she fell asleep on the sofa. After she woke up she started all over again. She said she had not feelings for me and wanted to break-up. I didn't know what to do, after a while I just went to sleep. The morning after she said the same things and at same point I asked her to leave. She left, then she even came back to make clear that the relationship was over. I was confused and exhausted.

A few hours later she called me from her place. She was crying and said that she was not feeling well and she did not want to talk about the relationship. She asked me to write down all the major episodes that happened in the last months as she wanted a psychiatrist to read them. I wrote everything down. She talked to a psychiatrist and he told her that she was fine, some minor psychological and relationship issues, or something like that. He also told her to stop the anti-depressants. I was speechless when she told me. I then decided to talk to another psychiatrist myself. I found a mood disorder expert and I booked an online appointment. In the meanwhile my girlfriend and I were talking through texts. She asked me about my summer plans and when I told her that I was going to make a trip we had talked about before, she told me that she wanted to come with me. She said she'd think about it and let me know. One day she called me and said she had made up her mind: she had booked the flight and she was coming too. I was cautious, but happy. We agreed to meet a few days before the departure, so two days later I went where she lives. Not more than a few hours after I arrived there, she told me she had already changed her mind. I stayed there a few more days and the pattern was always the same. In the morning she was very depressed and distant, in the evening she was a little bit better, even hugged me, kissed me and telling me she was happy I was there. I know something was wrong but I had to be strong and be by her side to help her get through this. The 4th day I was there I talked with the psychiatrist and he told me that my girlfriend had bipolar II. I told her to book an appointment with this psychiatrist and talked to him because she needed help. Two days later we woke up and she told me she didn't have feelings for me and that she didn't want to travel with me anymore. My heart was broken. I left.

A few hours later she called me while I was on the train back to where I live. She was crying and shouting, she said she was sick and she didn't know what was wrong with her. She asked me for time and space and said she wasn't ready to deal with the relationship. I told her everything was going to be alright, and I urged her to talk to the psychiatrist A few days later she did talk to him, but she said she didn't want to take the meds because the other psychiatrist told her that she didn't have bipolar and that psychotherapy was all she needed. I tried to tell her that the meds this new psychiatrist wanted to give her (mood stabilizers) would help her, but she refused to take them. I left for my trip and she'd text me every 3/4 days and asked me how things were going. After I came back, she sent me a text reminding me about a music festival held where she lives we had talked about. She did not say anything more, she didn't ask me directly to meet. After what happened the last time I saw her, I could not tell her I'd go. I did not trust her. In addition to this, I felt she had to be more straightforward instead of using the event as an excuse. Do you want to see me? Ok, you need to tell me you want to see me. She didn't. She texted me again a few days later talking about how I was doing. I got pissed. 40 days had passed since the last time we saw each other. She had asked me for time and space but she was sending me texts two times a week, mostly about nothing. It felt like breadcrumbing, so I called her and I asked her if she wanted to see me. She said no, she said nothing had changed. I was really mad as I felt she was playing with me and she had to be more respectful. At the same time, I was worried too for her mental health.

After that call she stopped texting me. Six weeks passed without any contact. Officially we were on a break, but everything was really confused. I resisted the urge to contact her because I felt she had to do it. She eventually did contact me. We talked randomly for a while, then I asked her how she was feeling and she told me she was better. I told her that communication had been difficult for me before because we used to text, but she never told me anything about how she was feeling or about us. She told me she was sorry, then she added she thought the situation was clear since the last time we met, implying we had already broken up. I couldn't believe it. I was furious. After a while she told me she wanted to talk. She called me and said she didn't know why she said we had broken up. She said she was sorry for how she handled things and that she contacted me because she wanted to see me. She told me she was feeling better, but she was afraid because she didn't feel stable and she didn't know how the following days she would feel and how she would feel seeing me. I tried to calm her down and told her there was no rush. I told her I was okay and that she had all the time she needed. We talked almost two hours and it felt great. She told me she wanted to talk with her psychiatrist one or two more times before seeing me and that she'd let me know. I agreed. I did not trust her completely, but I knew that the only way to see how she was and to help her get help was seeing her.

She called me two weeks later and out of the blue she told me once again she didn't want to see me. I couldn't handle it anymore. I told her she needed to get help, she told me I wanted to manipulate her telling her she is sick. She said she wanted to break-up, she told me that she had been sick because she was falling out of love and that psychotherapy was what she needed, she didn't need meds. Two days later she sent me a text apologizing for how she handled things, she said it was because she is confused and doesn't know what she wants. She said it's not fair to keep me hanging and the break up it's the best decision, even though she is not sure about it and it could be the wrong call. I replied two days later telling her that confusion cannot explain what she did in the last few months. I told her again that she needs helps, that I cannot pretend I didn't see the way she behaved and her moods. I also told her that I would do anything to help her live a life without depression, agitation, anxiety, irritability and so on, but she was the only person that can give herself that life. She never replied. This was one week ago.

What I struggle the most, besides losing my life companion and best friend and worrying about her mental health, is that I am not even sure about what's normal and what is not. Is her behavior sign she is not well? Or is it just "falling out of love" as she said?

What do you guys think?

Edited November 7 by mike_m

[ExpatInItaly]

6 hours ago, mike_m said:

Is her behavior sign she is not well? Or is it just "falling out of love" as she said?

Both things can be true, Mike. 

She might be mentally unwell and falling out of love. It isn't necessarily and either/or situation. It sounds like it's some of both. I do agree with her that it is best to break up. She clearly can't offer a stable, consisent relationship anymore.  It hurts but it absolutely in your best interest to let her go. 

[mike_m]

Thank you for taking the time to read my post.

I know both things can be true. I guess I just need to understand if it can be just falling out of love, because for me her behavior cannot be simply explained by that. Am I wrong?

I know she can't offer a stable, consistent relationship at the moment. I just wanted to get through this, help her get the help she needs and then see how things really were between us. Something like this happened four years ago and we managed to overcome the situation.

[Acacia98]

22 hours ago, mike_m said:

What I struggle the most, besides losing my life companion and best friend and worrying about her mental health, is that I am not even sure about what's normal and what is not. Is her behavior sign she is not well? Or is it just "falling out of love" as she said?

What do you guys think?

I think it's both. I think she genuinely wants out AND is unwell. But considering I don't know her and am not a mental health professional, my opinion may be of little value.

I do think you need to prioritize your well-being. It sounds like her yoyoing back and forth is doing you some serious harm. 

[mike_m]

14 minutes ago, Acacia98 said:

It sounds like her yoyoing back and forth is doing you some serious harm. 

It is, the last 6 months have been very stressful for me.

[ExpatInItaly]

11 hours ago, mike_m said:

I just wanted to get through this, help her get the help she needs and then see how things really were between us.

At this point, you can't (nor should) do that. It's up to her now. 

11 hours ago, mike_m said:

I guess I just need to understand if it can be just falling out of love

We won't be able to answer that, though. Only she can. And at the end of the day, what difference will it make? It doesn't change the bottom line, which is that she wants to end the relationship. Unless, of course, you're still hoping that this can be explained by mental health and thus you could could reconcile if she is treated? 

11 hours ago, mike_m said:

Something like this happened four years ago and we managed to overcome the situation.

But here you are again anyway. I think it's time you concede that for many reasons, the relationship isn't working anymore. For what it's worth, I think she really wants out, and I think there has been too much damage done for this to come back together anyway. 

39 minutes ago, mike_m said:

the last 6 months have been very stressful for me.

It's time to start your healing, Mike. Work on closing this chapter and moving forward. 

[Acacia98]

On 11/8/2024 at 3:59 PM, mike_m said:

It is, the last 6 months have been very stressful for me.

I feel for you, mike_m. You need to focus your energy on shielding yourself and allowing yourself to heal.

I get that you want to be there for your girlfriend, but

1. You can't be of any help to her or anyone else for that matter if your own world is falling apart. (At some level, you have to believe that you matter, that your own mental and physical health matter. Do you believe any of these things? Did you grow up having to be responsible for others at high cost to yourself?)

2. I think it is important to respect her choice about which psychiatrist to consult and which course of treatment to follow. A relationship between the two of you cannot work unless she makes the choice (of her own accord) to follow the path that will best manage her symptoms and enable her to live to her full potential. She has to be the one to make that decision. She has to want it.

Any serious concerns you have, you can and should share with her doctor and psychiatrist and family if possible. Let them have the info they need so that they can help her the best way they can.

Edited November 10 by Acacia98

[mike_m]

40 minutes ago, Acacia98 said:

1. You can't be of any help to her or anyone else for that matter if your own world is falling apart. (At some level, you have to believe that you matter, that your own mental and physical health matter. Do you believe any of these things? Did you grow up having to be responsible for others at high cost to yourself?)

This is true, but apart from feeling a little low, everything else is fine.

 

40 minutes ago, Acacia98 said:

2. I think it is important to respect her choice about which psychiatrist to consult and which course of treatment to follow.`

This is true. I felt I had to tell her my point of view, to give her my advice as I am the only person who saw some of the things she did, her behaviors, her moods swings, her emotional states. More important, there is the diagnosis of the psychiatrist I talked to, who was positive she has bipolar II and since she had suicide thoughts in the past, I had to urge her to consider other possibilities. What scares me the most is that the other psychiatrist she is talking to told her she is just fine, she doesn't have any mood disorder, she doesn't need meds, she just needs psychotherapy. He didn't provide a clear explanation for her mood swings, her depression, her past suicide thoughts, her anxiety, agitation, irritability, obsessive thoughts and so on. If this guy is wrong, he is putting her life in danger and that just breaks my heart. I did what I had to do, I told her what I thought about it, even though she might hate me for this and think I want to manipulate her. I had to tell her, but I didn't try to force her into anything. I just tried to do my best to handle to situation and help her. I am sure I made some mistakes, but it is such a difficult position to be in.

40 minutes ago, Acacia98 said:

A relationship between the two of you cannot work unless she makes the choice (of her own accord) to follow the path that will best manage her symptoms and enable her to live to her full potential. She has to be the one to make that decision. She has to want it.

I know, I absolutely agree with you.

40 minutes ago, Acacia98 said:

Any serious concerns you have, you can and should share with her doctor and psychiatrist and family if possible. Let them have the info they need so that they can help her the best way they can.

I don't think I can do that now. I should have contacted her family weeks, even months ago. I didn't, I thought it wasn't respectful and I regret I didn't. I don't even know what how much her family knows about it. We currently live in another country so communication is difficult. And now that we broke up, it would just look as an attempt to change the situation instead of helping her. I will never do that.

Edited November 10 by mike_m

[mike_m]

Also, I want to clarify I have no intention of doing anything now. The last message I sent her was a reply from the one she sent me two days after our last call, otherwise I would have not contacted her. In the last months, I never initiated contact, not even once. I always respected her boundaries and I gave her all the time and space she asked for. I will not contact her in the future. If she won't either, this will be it (and I have zero hopes she will).

[ExpatInItaly]

1 hour ago, mike_m said:

What scares me the most is that the other psychiatrist she is talking to told her she is just fine

It's no more concerning than a psychiatrsit who has never even met her deciding what her mental health problems are. That is extrememly unprofessional and irresponsible of the person you spoke to.

1 hour ago, mike_m said:

If this guy is wrong, he is putting her life in danger

Mike, with all due respect, you need to stay in your lane when it comes to her health care now. You have no idea what she actually communicated to this person, nor what they actually told her. You weren't there, correct? You don't know what details she omitted to her doctor, and you don't know what the doctor really said to her about her mental health. For all you know, she could be telling you something that isn't true (that this doctor said she's toally fine) simply to get you to lay off. Maybe the doctor does have deep concerns. That doesn't mean she is going to communciate them honestly to you. Perhaps she hasn't even seen a doctor herself and she's inventing things to get you to stop intervening. 

The point is that her mental health is above your pay grade. Leave it to the professionals. Leave it to her. You may be concerned about her, but you can't steer this ship for her. 

1 hour ago, mike_m said:

I will not contact her in the future.

Good, this is for the best. Work on acceptance that this chapter is closed, so you can find your happiness someday with someone more suited to you. 

[Leihla_B]

1 hour ago, mike_m said:

I will not contact her in the future. If she won't either, this will be it (and I have zero hopes she will).

This is for the best, and if she does contact you, I hope you won't allow yourself to get sucked back in. There is nothing remotely 'normal' about a partner using a breakup to control the other, much less several breakups. Allowing someone to return after ONE breakup already positions you for an eggshell walk of dysfunction, which is pointless.

When someone demonstrates that they are not even remotely 'relationship material,' you can't fix them, you need to walk away.

My heart goes out to you, and I'm sorry. 

[mike_m]

34 minutes ago, Leihla_B said:

There is nothing remotely 'normal' about a partner using a breakup to control the other, much less several breakups.

What do you mean by that?

[mike_m]

46 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

It's no more concerning than a psychiatrsit who has never even met her deciding what her mental health problems are. That is extrememly unprofessional and irresponsible of the person you spoke to.

I really don't think so. Hearing from people close to the patient is very important in mood disorder diagnosis. He talked to me, asked me questions and told me what he thought the problem was, I didn't hospitalize her or something. Then of course he talked to her and only then he confirmed the diagnosis and advised her to take a mood stabilizer. He didn't just rely on what I told him.

I actually think unprofessional is the behavior of a doctor who can't make a diagnosis with symptoms as severe as suicide thoughts and instead of telling the patient to seek help somewhere else, he told him/her that he/she is fine, he told him/her to give up all meds and to do psychotherapy with him.

[ExpatInItaly]

3 minutes ago, mike_m said:

I actually think unprofessional is the behavior of a doctor who can't make a diagnosis with symptoms as severe as suicide thoughts and instead of telling the patient to seek help somewhere else, he told him/her that he/she is fine, he told him/her to give up all meds and to do psychotherapy with him.

What evidence do you have he actually said all of this?

Look, I know you are seeking confimation bias but please leave her mental health care to the professionals she is actually working with. It is not up to you to interject anymore. 

 

Edited November 10 by ExpatInItaly

[mike_m]

1 minute ago, ExpatInItaly said:

What evidence do you have he actually said all of this?

 

She told me.

And this is BEFORE I talked with the other psychiatrist, so I had never tried to do anything at that time. I was just supporting her and being there for her, helping her get through the bad moments she had. She even asked me to write down things that happened in the last months (some of them she didn't even remembered clearly) to make this psychiatrist read them, so I guess she trusted me.

Therefore I don't see any reason for her to lie, if you are implying this. Actually is the fact this guy said she is fine that got me really worried, because besides all the episodes from the past, you have no idea the state she was in the last time I saw her, otherwise I would not even have contacted the other psychiatrist.

Someone you love cries desperately saying she is sick and doesn't know why. She looked at me with scared eyes and she said "I got broken again, I don't know what to do". I will never, ever, forget that.

Then, she talks with a psychiatrist and this guy tells her she is fine just do talk therapy with me (which she already did multiple times in the past). Well, it didn't make any sense to me. I could have never forgiven myself if something happened to her. And I still couldn't, but at least I tried to do something to help her, even if it was useless.

[mike_m]

1 hour ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Mike, with all due respect, you need to stay in your lane when it comes to her health care now. You have no idea what she actually communicated to this person, nor what they actually told her. You weren't there, correct? You don't know what details she omitted to her doctor, and you don't know what the doctor really said to her about her mental health. For all you know, she could be telling you something that isn't true (that this doctor said she's toally fine) simply to get you to lay off. Maybe the doctor does have deep concerns. That doesn't mean she is going to communciate them honestly to you. Perhaps she hasn't even seen a doctor herself and she's inventing things to get you to stop intervening.

Man, I really don't understand. You talk like I tried to do many different things, while in 12 years of relationship, 6 of them with her mental health in a very fragile state, I did ONE thing. I contacted this psychiatrist to get a second opinion. That's it.

It seems to me (and I hope) you have no idea what it means to live for years with someone who suffers from depression, who tells you about suicide thoughts, who often cries for no reason, who has severe and debilitating anxiety, panic attacks, who is irritable, even aggressive and lashes out at you with no reason and still, no matter what, being there, because you know that deep down it is not her fault. After years of just being there and seeing her suffering (and suffering myself), I tried to do something and I don't regret it all. I wish I did it sooner.

[ExpatInItaly]

2 minutes ago, mike_m said:

She told me.

Exaclty my point. 

You have no evidence. You're relying only on what she said, which may or may not be accurate. Please don't be so naive to assume she is being completely honest with you. 

5 minutes ago, mike_m said:

Therefore I don't see any reason for her to lie

Also exactly my point. You don't see it. You're too deep in the the fog to see any alternate explanations because you are badly wanting something else to be true. 

In any case, it's up to her now. Two break-ups mean the relationship isn't working for her and she wanted out. Please let be now, and don't keep tormenting yourself. It's time you believe the other part of what she said, which is that she isn't in love with you anymore. I realize that hurts a lot but it's the most important takeaway here. 

[ExpatInItaly]

5 minutes ago, mike_m said:

It seems to me (and I hope) you have no idea what it means to live for years with someone who suffers from depression, who tells you about suicide thoughts, who often cries for no reason, who has severe and debilitating anxiety, panic attacks, who is irritable, even aggressive and lashes out at you with no reason

Wrong. You are totally off the mark there. 

I know perfectly well, because I was once you. My ex was like this and I went through years of it.  Please don't make assumptions about my own background. I am speaking to you from a place of personal experience with this. 

Edited November 10 by ExpatInItaly

[ExpatInItaly]

7 minutes ago, mike_m said:

Man, I really don't understand. You talk like I tried to do many different things

No. You're simply feeling defesnive so your filter is a bit skewed here. 

I know that you didn't do different things. But I stand by my assertion that you need to step away from anything to do with her mental health now. 

[mike_m]

I really don't see why in that moment she would have told me the guy told her she is fine, which is exactly what got me worried. Anyway, feel free to disagree on this one.

The fact you went through something like this (and I am sorry because we both know it is awful) doesn't mean that what happened to you is what happened to me. I appreciate your insight, but at times it seems like you are forcing your way of seeing things based on your personal background.

[mike_m]

3 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

No. You're simply feeling defesnive so your filter is a bit skewed here. 

I know that you didn't do different things. But I stand by my assertion that you need to step away from anything to do with her mental health now. 

I am not feeling defensive. I think it is you who are accusing me of things that didn't happened and that are not going to happen.

Like this one, for instance, since I have no intention to do anything at all and I said it multiple times.

[ExpatInItaly]

1 hour ago, mike_m said:

The fact you went through something like this (and I am sorry because we both know it is awful) doesn't mean that what happened to you is what happened to me. I appreciate your insight, but at times it seems like you are forcing your way of seeing things based on your personal background.

Well, likewise to you, Mike. 

We can all only speak from our personal experience (you included) I don't know what else you woudl expect from an advice forum. I never once said that what I dealt is the same as what you are dealing with. I was  correcting your false assumption that I don't know what it's like to live with someone like this.

1 hour ago, mike_m said:

I think it is you who are accusing me of things that didn't happened and that are not going to happen.

Huh? I haven't accused you of anything. Deep breaths, bud. I can see all over the thread that you're quite touchy and quick to assume things. That may have been part of the issue here all along. Hard to say. 

1 hour ago, mike_m said:

since I have no intention to do anything at all and I said it multiple times.

Yes, and I acknowledged that. Please re-read the thread if you missed it. 

Anyway, I will leave it here. Good luck in your healing. 

 

Edited November 10 by ExpatInItaly

[Leihla_B]

7 hours ago, mike_m said:

8 hours ago, Leihla_B said:

There is nothing remotely 'normal' about a partner using a breakup to control the other, much less several breakups.

What do you mean by that?

The ultimate control is shutting down all discussion by shutting down the whole relationship.

[ShyViolet]

OP, I'm not sure what you hope to accomplish by trying to psychoanalyze her.  You're not in a relationship with her anymore and it's not your place or your business to try to figure her out or analyze her.  You did all you could in the situation and now it's over.  There is nothing left to do but just let it go, leave it in the past and focus on yourself.  

[mike_m]

6 hours ago, Leihla_B said:

The ultimate control is shutting down all discussion by shutting down the whole relationship.

This is a very interesting thought. Thank you.