Being Friends with an Ex and Someone I Met on a Dating App

[Esteban]

I dated C in June, but on the 3rd date she said she just would prefer to be friends. I never even kissed her on the dates (only because she kept avoiding it), although I did kiss her later in July at a party, since then just friends.  I tend to see her about once every 2-4 weeks when I'm dating someone, and maybe once a week when I'm not.

I dated E in August and September. She wasn't too happy about my friendship with C. E almost broke up with me one day I went to see C. After that day I decided to not see C for a few weeks and went to see her again once E broke up with me (for a different reason). E and I decided to be friends.

I am now dating M. M isn't too happy that I'm friends with C and E. After the 2nd date with M, after sleeping together, I said I wanted to be exclusive and she agreed. I also said then however that I am going to be friends with C and E and she didn't really comment but in reality when I saw E she wasn't happy I saw her 1 to 1 (i.e. no-one else there), or that I told her the next day rather than in advance.

I have very few friends where I'm living now, apart from C and E I only have one other friend in this country. I like having female friends. I realized I missed having female friends which I haven't had for so many years. When I explained this to M, she accepted that I could see C and E 1 to 1, however to make her feel more comfortable I said I wouldn't see them at my house, or get drunk, or go dancing. M was uncomfortable when C was at my house for hours one day.

M is my neighbour, but C and E met me on Bumble, and we don't share mutual friends, so we usually meet 1 to 1. In the 6 weeks I've been dating M I've seen her 10-15 times and met up with C once and E also once.

E has been dating others since we broke up. E is very open to meeting M or whoever I'm dating to make her feel safer.

C hasn't been dating, and it's not clear how much she really finds me attractive. I asked her when I was with E if she finds me attractive, thinking I could use the answer to judge whether I could be friends with her, and she only said "you are attractive" but didn't exactly answer the question. I've told C I don't see myself with her romantically long term. She tends to be a bit evasive about meeting others I'm dating, and makes an excuse, saying the 3 of us would be awkward and I should introduce a new partner later after a longer time together. C and I just feel like good friends at this point.

C and E exchange whatsapp messages around a few a week. I generally mute them and don't respond to them when I've with M.

I'm 44. M is 48, E is 48, C is about 42.

Do you think my friendships with C and E are OK? How would you feel about them if you were dating me?

Are 1 to 1 friendships with women while dating another generally bad? Or perhaps having a 1 to 1 friendship with someone is OK but not if you met them on a dating app, or they are your ex?

[Gebidozo]

10 minutes ago, Esteban said:

Do you think my friendships with C and E are OK?

Fundamentally, yes. In your context, probably not.

You said M wasn’t very happy about these friendships. I think the natural thing to do here is to minimize your interaction with E and C to please your girlfriend.

Everyone has different boundaries and ground rules in these matters. I’m fine with my SO messaging exes or meeting them in groups, but I wouldn’t be okay if she had one on one meetings with them.

 

16 minutes ago, Esteban said:

Are 1 to 1 friendships with women while dating another generally bad? Or perhaps having a 1 to 1 friendship with someone is OK but not if you met them on a dating app, or they are your ex?

Exactly. I think it’s not generally bad, but it could be bad if there had been some romantic interaction in the past and if your current partner isn’t comfortable with that.

[ExpatInItaly]

I would be wary of a guy who seemed to have a pattern of keeping women in his orbit that he'd previously dated, yes. 

[Gaeta]

If you keep A,B,C,D around I would not date you. Not many women will date you.

If you want friends then make friends outside a dating app. The problam is you were attracted to all these women. No mature woman will date a man keeping his conquests around the way you do.

 

[Dazedandconfused86]

I may be biased based on first hand experience but this is a prime example of why relationships are not worth it. You should not have to give up pre-existing friendships for a new girlfriend.

[smackie9]

Yeah as pointed out by Gaeta, not many will be interested in dating you or would appreciate it when you are friends with past romantic interests. Having no friends is no excuse for that. I agree there are better ways to make friends than from dates that didn't work out. I have to ask, how would you feel if the person you are really into had a stack of attractive men that they dated, chose to be friends with, stays in contact, hangs out with? And gives you the song and dance about not having friends is why these men still remain in her life....

When you choose to commit to someone, then you adjust contact with exes, etc accordingly. Same rules would apply to your GF. If you live by different rules and expectations from whom you are with, then you are incompatible. If you wish to keep these friends, get rid of the GF.

[Gaeta]

54 minutes ago, Dazedandconfused86 said:

I may be biased based on first hand experience but this is a prime example of why relationships are not worth it. You should not have to give up pre-existing friendships for a new girlfriend.

I would not give up my long term friends for a new boyfriend but l would drop in a heart beat men l kept in touch with for 6 months. I would not call friends people l met in June & September. 

It's perfectly fine if relationships are not your priority but for people looking for a life partner, keeping orbitors says a lot about their needs of any type of attention.

[Leihla_B]

Yeah, I would not continue seeing a guy who kept dating site friends. My own private rule is to never involve myself with anyone who is still involved with exes beyond shared children. It's not a prescription for anyone else; it's just too messy for me. With billions of people in the world, remaining attached to exes speaks of unfinished business that I would have no desire to step into.

[Esteban]

M is not my girlfriend, but I have seen her over 10 times, been on a weekend away with her. So it's close to that.

It looks like the consensus is I should end or limit my friendships with C and E, at least if I want to continue with M.

My friendship with C, who I met in June, is a very good friendship. We know everything about each other, spent the majority of our time together 1 to 1, have had hour long conversations just to chat. I've been friends with people for years and years and not reached this level of closeness.

[Esteban]

21 hours ago, smackie9 said:

 I have to ask, how would you feel if the person you are really into had a stack of attractive men that they dated, chose to be friends with, stays in contact, hangs out with?

I'd be fine with it in the first weeks of dating. Longer term...less so.

I think there is a difference between being friends with 1-2 people you met on a dating on vs a "stack" of them though. The latter would give a different impression about a person.

But of course I would not complain about the person I'm dating doing the exact same thing I'm doing...give me some credit...

[ExpatInItaly]

2 hours ago, Esteban said:

My friendship with C, who I met in June, is a very good friendship. We know everything about each other, spent the majority of our time together 1 to 1, have had hour long conversations just to chat. I've been friends with people for years and years and not reached this level of closeness.

And it's your prerogative to remain friends with C. 

Just be aware it may limit your dating pool  since it's also a woman's prerogative to see herself out if she's not comfortable with it. 

[smackie9]

Then you date women who see things the way you do and is ok with it. You can't force someone to accept your friend situation. IMO she should just drop you instead of complaining about it.

[basil67]

I'm not sure I'd want to date someone who's "friends" were a collection of women he'd been interested in 

[Esteban]

Well M, the one I was dating, came over to my house Sunday and she had some criticisms about me for various things but mainly re friendships with C and E and she said maybe we should separate. I'd thought about it and decided I wouldn't give up 2 friends for her as, after taking the time to reflect, I didn't think M and me was for a long-term relationship. So I just agreed and said I won't give up my friends and we should separate. We carried on talking and it became apparent that she had been hoping for a different answer and was really saying we should separate to force me to drop the friends. In the end, I had to reiterate that we should separate and tell her she wasn't the love of my life and it was quite upsetting and emotional separation for both of us. Felt terrible Sunday night and yesterday, but better today.

I think I will need to make some changes next time partly due to the consensus viewpoint on here. Probably I shouldn't have taken her at her word when she first said she was Ok with me having the other friends (at first). Perhaps I should have checked more carefully her thoughts on it before moving the conversation quickly on. I think next time I might try taking a period of time off from the other friends and then reviewing it. Or maybe the friends become not in-person friends while I'm dating.

[Gaeta]

16 minutes ago, Esteban said:

Or maybe the friends become not in-person friends while I'm dating

Makes no difference for a woman that wants a man with no orbiters. 

I hope you fully enjoy these 2 friends because it will be a while before you meet a woman open to all this. 

[Esteban]

On 11/24/2024 at 5:02 PM, basil67 said:

I'm not sure I'd want to date someone who's "friends" were a collection of women he'd been interested in 

It is not a collection, there are 2 of them.

Perhaps a bit of context can help.

I am from the UK and moved to Chile in 2014 so that my wife (now separated) could return to her home country. Just before leaving I had 5-10 friends (depending on what counts as a friend vs acquaintance or friend of a friend or work colleague that you occasionally see socially etc). They are all male. I have kept in touch with most of them and still see them when I go back to the UK once every few years. Until this year, I haven't had a female friend for over a decade.

When I arrived in Chile I was, at 34, at an age when most people my age have their friendships formed. I also had to counter with language and cultural differences in South America, and the fact that I had young children and wanted to spend a lot of time with them. I didn't make any friends for years, initially I thought some of the other Dads in my kids school might become friends but nothing came of it. A few of them would say "hey we should go out some time" but then flake when I named a specific day and time. A lot of men my age were in a similar position in that they had younger children and the social life can take a back seat so it's hard enough keeping up with the existing friends. I joined various clubs including Taekwondo, tennis, but I didn't make any friends there. One issue is that social life here in Chile happens hanging around a barbeque with other blokes (and nothing vegetarian available on the barbeque), but I'm a vegetarian. I tried joining environmental and animal rights organizations as well, many of those would just not even respond to me or ignore me. I do think people have been a bit more hesitant with a foreigner here although I see this improving in recent years. I decided to live in a small provincial town for the ability to be able to afford to rent a big house and a garden and a nice standard of life for the family, but that limits your options for friendship.  When I went to the taekwondo club all the other members were teens or early 20s. There aren't as many clubs for people in 30s or 40s in a place like this.

My first real friend I made here in about 2018, he was a good neighbour  so I invited him out for beers and am still friends with him.

Of course then there there was the pandemic. Not much opportunity for making friends.

C and E are the only other friends I have in Chile. If I end my friendships with C and E I'll have only one friend here.

I am a bit picky about who I'm friends with and other people sometimes feel the same way about me. Being a vegetarian who really cares about climate change is really niche, especially over here.

It's not that common for me to have someone where we can easily make each other laugh, easily share a silence, comfortably share intimate details. And I do have that with C and E and it's taken me years of trying to find someone like that.

I think that there should be a dating app for friends only, as far as I know there isn't a popular one that genuinely focuses mainly or only on that.

Edited Tuesday at 06:56 PM by Esteban

[ExpatInItaly]

Like I said, you can choose to remain friends with whomever you want. 

But you need to be realistic that many women you date won't go for it, regardless of context or why you want to stay friends with these ladies. The optics aren't so good.  And you may find the same is true for your friends, if one of them meets a man who isn't keen on their friendships with you. There is no guarantee they will keep you in their lives if that happens, so be prepared for that possibility too. 

It's your life, and your call to make. Just be realistic in your expectations of how this may affect your love life. 

[Gebidozo]

7 hours ago, Esteban said:

It's not that common for me to have someone where we can easily make each other laugh, easily share a silence, comfortably share intimate details. And I do have that with C and E and it's taken me years of trying to find someone like that.

This level of friendship with someone you used to be interested in romantically would make most people you’d date uncomfortable, not just M.

 

[Gaeta]

7 hours ago, Esteban said:

 

It's not that common for me to have someone where we can easily make each other laugh, easily share a silence, comfortably share intimate details. And I do have that with C and E and it's taken me years of trying to find someone like that.

This is the type of dynamic you share with a girlfriend, not a female friend. Why would you have a girlfriend if you already have deep connection & emotional intimicy with these friends? The only thing these friends are not giving you is sex. So the girlfriend is for the sex and your female friends fulfill you every other way? Don't you see how warped that is. 

Any woman looking at this would think there won't be anything private between her and you. You will report everything to these 2 friends.  These 2 women that only a couple of months ago you did not even know! 

We all told you why this woman did not go along with it. It's not a mystery to you anymore. 

[Esteban]

Gaeta:

“conquests” I don't see my 2 friends as conquests. I see them as friends.

“keeping orbitors says a lot about their needs of any type of attention.” Why do you feel a need to use negative language like "orbitors" and referencing attention seeking, instead of just debating the facts and giving an opinion?

“because it will be a while before you meet a woman open to all this”  Not everyone thinks the same as you. Plus, I already said above I would change the way I do it next time.

“So the girlfriend is for the sex and your female friends fulfill you every other way? Don't you see how warped that is” What makes you think she was just for sex? I never said that, never gave that impression and she absolutely wasn't just for sex.

"Why would you have a girlfriend if you already have deep connection & emotional intimicy with these friends?" why can't I have closeness with a friend? I wonder if you understand the words intimacy and intimate. Looking at the definitions online from Oxford, Cambridge and Webster it can include simply closeness or friendship or private information other than romantic or sexual information.

"You will report everything to these 2 friends. " No I did not and will not.  I never said that. I also never shared sexual details about her with anyone expect for very basic details (I did mention that we had sex when they asked).

"a couple of months ago you did not even know! " A couple of months means two. One of them I met 3 months ago, the other 5. Why do you feel the need to exaggerate and make it seem worse than the reality?

Moderators; if you review the thread you'll see that I didn't engage the first three times she was rude but she just had to keep coming back with a 4th post and use a word like "warped" even after I didn't directly engage with the first three and the debate was basically closed. I'll be polite to people who are rude to me once or twice but eventually I get tired of it.

EDIT: Just to clarify, I only referenced the moderators to try and stop getting into trouble for my own response defending myself. To be crystal clear, I am NOT suggesting Gaeta's comments warrant moderating. And I suggest don't lock the thread, if she does respond further I won't let it get into a big argument.

 

Edited Wednesday at 08:28 PM by Esteban

[Gaeta]

@Esteban: I apologize for making you feel that way 🙁 If I take a subject at heart I can get carried away at times. I hope you will continue with this thread. I am truly sorry. 

[MsJayne]

If you've had certain friends for years, genuine friendships, you don't ditch them when a new partner comes along and start trying to dictate who you can be friends with, but what you're describing is a whole different dynamic. You have to evaluate how important C & E are to you, and have a think about how a new woman will perceive these friendships. Usually in this scenario one half of the friendship is invested in the hope that it will develop into something if they hang around long enough - example, C's disinterest in meeting M is obviously because C is hopeful and sees M as competition. My advice is that when you meet someone who you think may be a long-term prospect, don't muddy the water by assigning false importance to casual acquaintances and stop hanging out with women who would forget you in a heartbeat if they met another guy. What you're doing is red-flag behaviour for any self-respecting woman, making her feel like she's in some competition. Telling the other two women that you had sex with M is "reporting". It's none of their business, and the fact that they asked is more than enough justification for M being irritated by them. You probably haven't told her that you talk about her with C & E, but you don't have to, she can smell the stench of disloyalty.  

[Esteban]

20 hours ago, Gaeta said:

@Esteban: I apologize for making you feel that way 🙁 If I take a subject at heart I can get carried away at times. I hope you will continue with this thread. I am truly sorry. 

No worries. Thanks for your response. I feel like the thread is probably close to running its course to be honest, but we'll see. I'll perhaps update it if there any significant updates before the end of the year, but I have a feeling there won't be. I expect C and E will just stay friends with me, and I'll wait until next year before having any more dates.

I can perhaps respond to any comments but it seems like at times everyone is making some version of the same argument, and I've already acknowledged that the consensus is against me, and that I'll change somehow next time.

As mentioned above I think next time I might do something along the lines of continue to see my friends still while having the first 1-3 dates with someone else, then not see them for a month as I navigate that period of say date 3 to date 10 or 15,  then perhaps ask the new person I might date to meet C and/or E and then let them decide if the friendships can continue. And respect their decision. I can also consider ending the friendships if really necessary, but probably only if it really has a chance of long term love.

[Esteban]

19 hours ago, MsJayne said:

 - example, C's disinterest in meeting M is obviously because C is hopeful and sees M as competition.

When I asked C about meeting M she did say it was a bit soon, as I think I might have mentioned in my original post. But when I saw her again on Saturday after making the post on Friday she said, without me bringing it up, that she would meet M.

However M wasn't really interested in meeting C. I think for women like M it's better to not have any female friendships except something like a sister-in-law or the mother of your children or someone you only meet in a group setting. In that respect, she's a bit on the conservative side, and others would be the same. For M, the meeting the friends wasn't really the best answer. In the end, the main choices were to end things with M, end the friendships.

E is keeping in touch with a lot of her exes, not just me, while still dating others. She went to meet one of her exes new girlfriend to make her feel at ease, and still meets him for coffee.

[basil67]

1 hour ago, Esteban said:

I think for women like M it's better to not have any female friendships except something like a sister-in-law or the mother of your children or someone you only meet in a group setting. In that respect, she's a bit on the conservative side, and others would be the same.

I am not conservative or from a conservative culture and pretty much everyone around me would share the views of M. 

In the male-female friendships around me, the guys are friends with the guys and the girls are friends with the girls, but all will be friendly together in a group setting.   Brothers and sisters in law don't socialise 1:1.   Nor do people socialise 1:1 with baby momma/baby daddy - their goal is a connection to facilitate functional co-parenting.