Can't feel happy without being sure of marriage

[thatwoman567]

Most of my relationships have ended because deep down, I’ve felt very insecure about the future of them. 
 

im not sure why, but I’ve always wanted a husband and kids and to be married. I wanted the comfort of knowing I have a committed partner by my side. I’m happy alone but I want to take that next step with the right person.

 

 I’ve also always believed that I’ll ‘just know’ when is the right one for me.

 

 Most of my past relationships ended because the guy would balk at talks about the future. They’d say things like “let’s see where things go” and “I need to do x,y,z before I can even talk about that” or just the general air of them taking about marriage and kids was so damn awkward.

 

im dating someone now and have been for two monthes. This person treats me well and I genuinely love spending time with him. We’re both in our thirties. He asked me to be his partner a month in and I said yes. He plans all the dates and pays. He’s polite and courteous. We have so much fun together doing anything. I like talking to him. He wants kids and do I. He makes plans for travel for the future.

 

The problem is, deep down I’m really really scared. I’m scared I’ll have to leave him.

i asked him recently what sort of plans he has for the future relationship wise. I asked whether he hypothetically wants to be married and if so, what are his plans? Does he want to live where he lives? Work the same job? Change houses?

 

his answer was just him blabbering on incoherently about …none sense?

 

he said that is hard to tell whether someone is good for you or not. Sometimes you date someone for a few months, travel, live with them ext and realize they have traits you can’t put up with. He’s mentioned an ex he lived with and travelled with prior to being with me and ultimately the relationship ended on bad terms (he didn’t go into detail, simply said it’s better to be alone than with the wrong person) . He’s also mentioned he’s had exes in his youth with addiction problems. 
 

I asked him what traits he was looking for and he replied that he likes all the traits I have…. Also he said he’s picky

 

he talks a lot about work and how he isn’t sure whether he will be permanent at his job by the end of next year. If he isn’t, he wants to travel and wants me to go with him.

 

i really like this guy but it’s concerning to me that he’s able to make travel and date plans but can’t verbalize what traits he wants in his partner.

 

two monthes is a short time. I don’t want to rush or pressure him but I want a relationship that is built on intention. 
 

i don’t want to give up on the connection yet. The feeling I’m getting is that this man wants to test out if I’m a good match for him before taking the next step. I also am in no big rush to marry…tomorrow…. But I’m not looking to waste my time with a man whose values don’t align with mine.

 

 What sort of advice can you give me?

[NuevoYorko]

How did you meet this man?   How have you met the others you've dated in recent years?

[basil67]

Sometimes we don't know what we want until we see it.   Or we meet someone who's not what we thought we wanted and have to reassess.   

When I met my partner, I wanted someone who didn't want children....but he wanted children and a number of months, I came to realise he'd be a great dad and that I'd enjoy having children with him and changed my mind.  We now have two grown children.   But had either of us rushed things and insisted on on a list of traits, we would not be together now. 

Also, at only two months in you can NEVER be sure of marriage.  At twelve months in you still can't be sure!   If you can't show the patience to explore a relationship and decide on marriage in due course, your dating is doomed.

Edited November 24 by basil67

[Els]

Honestly, if you are this torn up about the lack of "future plans" with a person you've only known for two months (?!?), it doesn't sound to me at all like you're "happy alone". To be blunt, it sounds like desperation. It sounds like you're just looking for a warm body to fill the "husband" void, that you think marriage will solve all your problems and be a happily ever after. But it's not. Marriage is a dynamic thing that evolves and grows and changes, and you have to be patient and move with it and give and take - much like any relationship.

It seems to me like you are creating a self-fulfilling prophecy, because nobody worth marrying would stay with a person who is constantly probing them about their future plans at two months in.

[thatwoman567]

4 hours ago, NuevoYorko said:

How did you meet this man?   How have you met the others you've dated in recent years?

Most of these people through the internet. why?

[thatwoman567]

2 hours ago, basil67 said:

Sometimes we don't know what we want until we see it.   Or we meet someone who's not what we thought we wanted and have to reassess.   

When I met my partner, I wanted someone who didn't want children....but he wanted children and a number of months, I came to realise he'd be a great dad and that I'd enjoy having children with him and changed my mind.  We now have two grown children.   But had either of us rushed things and insisted on on a list of traits, we would not be together now. 

Also, at only two months in you can NEVER be sure of marriage.  At twelve months in you still can't be sure!   If you can't show the patience to explore a relationship and decide on marriage in due course, your dating is doomed.

I understand that. Ive also been in situations where I could see that person being my husband only for them to break it off. Ive been on the other end of the spectrum as well.

Thank you for telling me about your experience. I too was not fully impressed by my partner at first, but I am still very curious getting to know him. The more I know him the more I realize I really like this person. 

Im scared because Ive had that feeling of "wow he's the one" in the past only to get dumped completely out of the blue. i had no clue. Ive also been with people I was super into but have not treated me well and I had a hard time leaving because "they were so nice at the start."

 I reasonate with the point about patience. I do lack patience and the ability to live in the moment. He doesnt have that. I struggle with just getting to know a person without that clarity. Im scared he will turn out to be an abusive a*hole or worse at the flip of a hat. Ive had that happen before. I dont want to project anything onto this new partner but i find it difficult to stay patience when my mind is racing

[thatwoman567]

13 minutes ago, Els said:

Honestly, if you are this torn up about the lack of "future plans" with a person you've only known for two months (?!?), it doesn't sound to me at all like you're "happy alone". To be blunt, it sounds like desperation. It sounds like you're just looking for a warm body to fill the "husband" void, that you think marriage will solve all your problems and be a happily ever after. But it's not. Marriage is a dynamic thing that evolves and grows and changes, and you have to be patient and move with it and give and take - much like any relationship.

It seems to me like you are creating a self-fulfilling prophecy, because nobody worth marrying would stay with a person who is constantly probing them about their future plans at two months in.

Yeah that sounds about right. On some level, I do want to be 'chosen' and loved and seen as a catch. i think both of those things can be true. I enjoy my time alone, but that doesn't mean I want to be single for the rest of my life. Nor does it mean I will be happy single for the rest of my life.

I dont think marriage will 'solve all my problems', but I want to build a relationship with someone who is my team mate, someone who wants to play alongside me. In the past I was led on to believe by past partners that we were a team, that we had a relationship, that we were together only for them to dump me completely out of the blue with no explaination. That hurt. I never want to experience that again. Id be lying if I said I wasn't scared of that happening this time around.

I am trying not to probe. That is why I am on the internet seeking advice. I am very neurotic, lol, i'll admit that. But I also think I am loveable and worthy of love. I want to be the kind of patient person who seeks and accepts love and gives it time to grow. I honestly don't think I know how to . I don't think I'll find the answer by avoiding love altogether. I really like this person. I do want it to work. I want to work on myself.

[Gebidozo]

I’ve come to the conclusion that marriage shouldn’t be pre-planned at all. Either it happens to a couple organically, or it shouldn’t happen.

I used to be obsessed with the idea of marriage. Every time I tried to go into that direction it backfired at me.

The latest occurrence was a real eye-opener. I proposed marriage to the woman I’m with now, and she told me this, “I’m not sure what you like more, marriage or me”.

I didn’t even understand that at the time, it seemed gibberish to me. Then I realized that she was right. I wanted marriage because I wanted marriage, not because our relationship has naturally arrived at the point where both are ready to get married.

So I asked myself this question: if I had a choice between marrying someone else and being with this woman together without ever getting married, which would I choose? The answer was obvious: of course, I’d choose this woman. So I made that choice mentally, accepted the idea that we’ll never get married.

Once I let go of that obsession with marriage, of the idea that I must be married in order to be happy, I actually became happier. The nagging pressure was gone. I began to enjoy our relationship more. I began to like the uncertainty. Life has become a daily reassessment of itself.

[thatwoman567]

16 minutes ago, Gebidozo said:

I’ve come to the conclusion that marriage shouldn’t be pre-planned at all. Either it happens to a couple organically, or it shouldn’t happen.

I used to be obsessed with the idea of marriage. Every time I tried to go into that direction it backfired at me.

The latest occurrence was a real eye-opener. I proposed marriage to the woman I’m with now, and she told me this, “I’m not sure what you like more, marriage or me”.

I didn’t even understand that at the time, it seemed gibberish to me. Then I realized that she was right. I wanted marriage because I wanted marriage, not because our relationship has naturally arrived at the point where both are ready to get married.

So I asked myself this question: if I had a choice between marrying someone else and being with this woman together without ever getting married, which would I choose? The answer was obvious: of course, I’d choose this woman. So I made that choice mentally, accepted the idea that we’ll never get married.

Once I let go of that obsession with marriage, of the idea that I must be married in order to be happy, I actually became happier. The nagging pressure was gone. I began to enjoy our relationship more. I began to like the uncertainty. Life has become a daily reassessment of itself.

Thank you for sharing your insights. That is very deep. I wonder if you and your significant other did marry in the future once you've released your tension and pressure to marry?

I am very jealous of people for whom marriage and childbirth happened organically. I had an old friend who had been married and had her first child at 19. She divorced and before 25 was once more married and with one more child. I was so jealous of her because I had also wanted to be married young with a baby, to be younger mother and then to spend my middle age with my partner focusing on my career. As it stands now, I have neither career nor partner nor children.

I am no longer 19. I feel in my heart I can't afford to 'wait around' and 'let it happen organically' even though that actually is WHAT I WANT. It is so frustruating to me.

Why is it so easy for others and so hard for me? I am jealous to see my peers wed and happy.

I am in my prime age for childbirth. I am scared to miss my gap. I feel childbirth will be significantly harder as I age. I want it to happen organically but as of now, I am under pressure to have it done with. I am scared that i will never have children of my own. I am scared ill get old, that the men I meet will be super particular with age and won't want me at all. I am scared all I have to offer now is my youth. I am scared my only value to men is that I am young-ish. I feel the need to rush and lock it in right now before it is too late. Like it doesn't matter with whom.

But that's not true because in my heart of hearts I want all of this to happen with a man I fully love: my best friend and my lover. I want to have a family I am proud of. I want to be a calm woman who accepts life as it comes. I am frustruated I am none of those things...

[ShyViolet]

8 hours ago, thatwoman567 said:

 Most of my past relationships ended because the guy would balk at talks about the future. They’d say things like “let’s see where things go” and “I need to do x,y,z before I can even talk about that” or just the general air of them taking about marriage and kids was so damn awkward.

How early in relationships have you been bringing up marriage and "the future"?  If you are bringing up marriage at 2 months of dating in all these relationships, you are sabotaging potentially good relationships.  Bringing up marriage at 2 months of dating is considered by a lot of people to be weird.  It's no wonder you have a pattern of scaring guys off.  One can't possibly know at 2 months of dating whether they see themselves marrying the other person.  These guys are right when they say "we need to see where things go" and "it's too early to even talk about that."  But there you are fixating on this idea of marriage and bringing up the topic inappropriately early in relationships and scaring guys off.  You really need to relax and let relationships develop and learn to bring things up when its the right time.  You are too fixated on marriage and not letting relationships develop.  

Marriage is not the end-all be-all of life.  You sound like you're not actually interested in dating, you're just interested in finding a husband.  It's not likely to work that way.  Being desperate for a husband instead of being open to dating will probably not get you what you're looking for.

[S2B]

You want a husband- most guys would be thinking you’re just vesting them for how they can provide for you - instead of showing them why you would be a great galley I marry by bringing things into the partnership.

[thatwoman567]

8 minutes ago, ShyViolet said:

How early in relationships have you been bringing up marriage and "the future"?  If you are bringing up marriage at 2 months of dating in all these relationships, you are sabotaging potentially good relationships.  Bringing up marriage at 2 months of dating is considered by a lot of people to be weird.  It's no wonder you have a pattern of scaring guys off.  One can't possibly know at 2 months of dating whether they see themselves marrying the other person.  These guys are right when they say "we need to see where things go" and "it's too early to even talk about that."  But there you are fixating on this idea of marriage and bringing up the topic inappropriately early in relationships and scaring guys off.  You really need to relax and let relationships develop and learn to bring things up when its the right time.  You are too fixated on marriage and not letting relationships develop.  

Marriage is not the end-all be-all of life.  You sound like you're not actually interested in dating, you're just interested in finding a husband.  It's not likely to work that way.  Being desperate for a husband instead of being open to dating will probably not get you what you're looking for.

That's fair. I do admit I am anxious about finding my person. I understand that can come off as weird. But when is the right time?

Ive dated men before where on dates 1-2, they told me they never wished for marriage or kids. They were just looking for something long term. No problem! I understood straight away that these were not the sort of people whose values aligned with mine and wished them well. If these people can be upfront from the start, why shouldn't I?

I usually bring up the question a couple of monthes into dating.

I do want a husband. I do want kids. I'm not seeing how that is a problem in my dating journey. I do wish to date to marry. I do examine the person I am with under the lens of 'will he make a good husband'.

Again, I am happy to have friends, aquaintances, mentors, colleagues....a variety of relationships. But for my significant other, I think I am fixated on the idea of whether this is my husband or not. I am not interested in living with someone before marriage or having children before marriage. I am not just looking for a 'friend with benefits'. I am not just looking for someone to fill the role of my husband or partner.

Again, it isn't like I will marry the first person who asks either. But I want to know this is someone who has similar values to mine.\

 

[S2B]

I think you have viewed this as someone fitting into this perfect little package that you get to choose.

life is unpredictable and things may not go as you plan. It usually doesn’t go as planned.

its just not a tidy little decision. 

[S2B]

Being happy - yes you can - that’s a decision everyone makes every day they wake up. Either you choose to be happy or you don’t. That is only up to you. It’s NOT dependent on whether or not you are married.

have you considered counseling?

I think you could benefit from long term counseling.

[Acacia98]

I'm just wondering, OP, why not bring up the question of what people hypothetically think of marriage and kids at the very beginning, when you're relative strangers getting to know each other? Isn't that the stage at which one should gauge values? At that point, neither of you is invested, so you're just two people getting to know about each other's hopes, goals, and dreams in life.

[BaileyB]

I think you are overthinking this. You are looking for a guarantee and there is no such thing in relationships.

At two months in, you shouldn’t be able to say that this is your forever partner and neither of you should have a five or ten year plan. If you like spending time with the man, if he treat you well, and you seem to value the same thing - just plan another date… not a wedding. 

When I met my husband, I was just so relieved to have finally met someone with a home I felt compatible. I wanted to remember and enjoy every moment of the early part of the relationship - I did not rush it, I enjoyed it. We didn’t have a plan, and that was ok. We still don’t have a plan - but, we have made decisions together that has built a happy life that we both love.

You can too - if you don’t let your anxiety get you and sabotage this relationship. 

Edited November 25 by BaileyB

[Gebidozo]

11 hours ago, thatwoman567 said:

I wonder if you and your significant other did marry in the future once you've released your tension and pressure to marry?

Oh, my revelation about the meaning of marriage happened literally 2 months ago. So I don’t know what will happen. The relationship has improved since I stopped freaking out about marriage, that’s for sure. I might raise the question again in a year or so, maybe. Or maybe not even.

 

11 hours ago, thatwoman567 said:

I had an old friend who had been married and had her first child at 19. She divorced and before 25 was once more married and with one more child. I was so jealous of her

But what is there to be jealous of? Having two children at such a young age is very difficult. Having them in two marriages, going through a divorce is even harder. I’m sure some people in her position would be jealous of you.

I’m not saying your friend is wrong or necessarily unhappy. But that is her life, not yours. Being jealous of someone else’s life is completely pointless and brings nothing but immense frustration and dissatisfaction with life.

[Gaeta]

Put in your profile that you are looking to marry and have a family. That will attract the men with the same goals. 

I would like to add, you idealize something you know nothing about. I was married at 20, I was a mother at 21, I was divorced at 35. If I could do it again I would do it the other way around. I would have built a solid career in my 20s-30s and have my child later in life. Instead I was too young, had no life experiences, no wisdom and it was a very long and difficult marriage.  I often give my brother as an exemple, him and his gf are both professionals and had their very first children at 40. Being 40 is NOT what it was in the 70s. A lot of people start their famiy later in life nowadays. They were smarter, wiser, financially stable. They had both been in bad relationships so they knew exactly what they wanted. 

 

[ShyViolet]

12 hours ago, thatwoman567 said:

That's fair. I do admit I am anxious about finding my person. I understand that can come off as weird. But when is the right time?

The bottom line is, it's not normal to be sure that the relationship is leading to marriage at two months into dating.  If you have this "need" to know that the relationship is leading to marriage at that early stage, that is a problem with you, and you need to deal with it and do some work on yourself.  If you have this air of desperation and anxiety about "finding a husband" when you are dating, people can sense that a mile away and it's going to turn guys off.

If anything I would say that you should put in your dating profile that you are marriage-minded or interested in marriage, so that it weeds out people who already know they don't want to ever get married.  But bringing it up at a few months of dating is the worst thing you can do and super weird.

[NuevoYorko]

18 hours ago, thatwoman567 said:

Most of these people through the internet. why?

Because if it's through a dating site, you can and should be VERY CLEAR in your profile that you are looking for MARRIAGE.    Cull the ones who do not want that or are not sure right out of the gate.   

ONLY use sites that are clearly aimed towards MARRIAGE.  

You could also hire a matchmaking service that will vet men to make sure they are dating with the exclusive goal of MARRIAGE.

Yes, some people can and will misrepresent themselves, but at least you can hedge your bets a little bit this way.   

As it is, you do come off as somewhat desperate and the fact that your entire happiness depends upon marriage is probably palpable to men you are dating and is unlikely to be an attractive feature.  Even marriage minded men are probably going to feel an impulse to flee when they sense this.  It's a big responsibility to be 100% responsible for another person's happiness in life.   Not many will voluntarily take that on.  I think most healthy people will seek others who have a balanced life and who have found ways to have joy in that which are not dependent upon a single relationship

 

[Els]

18 hours ago, thatwoman567 said:

. In the past I was led on to believe by past partners that we were a team, that we had a relationship, that we were together only for them to dump me completely out of the blue with no explaination. That hurt. I never want to experience that again. Id be lying if I said I wasn't scared of that happening this time around.

Being married doesn't mean that this won't happen - lots of people get divorced. It's the specific person that you are in a LTR/marriage with that has the highest impact on this, not marriage itself. Your own personality and emotional capabilities - the ability to be patient, to take things as it comes, to respect your partner's boundaries - will affect it as well.

You can't seriously be jealous of a woman who was a teenage mother and who is divorced and into her second marriage at 25?? That sounds like a disaster, IMO. The odds are significantly against her being in an equal, happy, healthy marriage at this stage.

15 hours ago, thatwoman567 said:

As it stands now, I have neither career nor partner nor children.

Why do you not have a career in your 30s? Do you mean that you just aren't particularly happy with your career progression at the moment (which is understandable), or that you have literally no career whatsoever? If the latter, why not?

Look, much of your life is under your control. You can have a career if you want to and put the effort into it. You can have kids by yourself if you want to - sperm donation is cheap and easy. You can probably even have a husband, eventually, if you stop scaring people away. You're currently with a man who seems to be good for you, but your pushing will end this if you don't get a hold of yourself. Have you considered talking to a therapist about this? You might have an undiagnosed anxiety disorder, and there are treatments for that.

[Maldives]

No man will want to feel pressured about marriage especially 2 months in. You have got this all wrong. Men view commitment very differently to woman. We need to see how it goes and develops before commuting to the next stage of the relationship. It has to unfold naturally. I have a friend him and his partner finally got married after almost 30 yrs but had children beforehand and were already committed to one another. Having marriage as your sole purpose of a relationship men pick up on it and it makes us run for the hills. We are generally shy of commitment because we need to first know that partner has the qualities for a long-term relationship like relating to one another goals etc. I'm sorry to say you have it all wrong wen it comes to men and commitment. Men want commitment we just need evidence your gonna stick around. You having a marriage agenda tells the man you are more interested in the idea of marriage them the man and that's a total turn off. 

[S2B]

No career? You do work and support yourself, right?

you also know you could have a baby on your own if you want to, right?

you can’t expect to know the real person until you’ve dated them a year or two. Sure, they may want to marry - but that has nothing to do with knowing who you are actually marrying if you marry soon after dating.

make long term plans for yourself! You can count on yourself.
You have no idea if you will be able to count on the man you want to marry as soon as you start dating him. 

plan to be happy all on your own. Work and support yourself. Never, ever rely on any man for your happiness - that’s up to you to give yourself happiness every single day.

[Gebidozo]

4 hours ago, Goodguy05 said:

No man will want to feel pressured about marriage especially 2 months in. You have got this all wrong. Men view commitment very differently to woman. We need to see how it goes and develops before commuting to the next stage of the relationship. It has to unfold naturally.

What you’re saying about commitment is right, but it has nothing to do with gender. There are many men who just want to have a wife and push for marriage, and there are many women who view commitment just as you correctly describe, as something that unfolds naturally. The differences are in mentality, culture, worldview, not in the gender.

[Gaeta]

I don't think OP expected the  man to tell her he sees a marriage with her specifically. She wants to date a man that is marriage oriented. Doesn't mean he will know he wants to marry her after 2  months but he is dating with a purpose. 

When I was online dating I had a purpose, it was a long term relationship. I did not meet men without the same purpose. I detailed very clearly in my profile what I was looking for, OP should do the same. 

The only obstacle I see in OP's case is that she doesn't seem to have a job, goal, dreams for herself. I don't think nowadays many men would be interested in dating a 30 something woman with no goals, looking for a provider.