Upcoming 2nd and 4th dates question

[max3732]

For the first time in years I've had the chance to go out with 2 different women that seem to be interested.

One lives over 4 hours away and travels to my area often for work and we have been talking about meeting halfway (I posted about her before). We've been in touch and finally have a 2nd date coming up. I'm going to pick her up at her hotel and take her to a nice dinner. I really enjoyed talking to her and find her hobbies and experiences interesting. Since we've only had 1 date I really am excited to get to know her as a person a lot more.

The downside is of course the distance and also she doesn't get along with one of her parents and seems to have something of a rebellious streak even though she looks very sweet (enjoys speeding >100 mph and talking her way out of tickets)

As I've posted before I'm over 40 and still a virgin and was wondering if things go well at dinner is there a chance she'd want to escalate physically in her room? If so I'm guessing she'd invite me up? Or what do I do with that if I'm interested?

With the 2nd woman we've been on 3 dates and I we have a ton of things in common, from politics (1st one I mentioned is apolitical), to values, to favorite activities and food. It's very easy to talk to her and I feel good around her. The downsides are:

(1)She has a youtube channel and her videos are a bit off. I've shown them to a couple friends and my parents and everyone says she looks like a nut and I agree. She overshares like crazy and has videos of every little thing and is just a bit disturbing. In person I don't see any of that though.

(2) Even though I like that she's into fitness, she's into weight lifting and part of her channel is showing off her big muscles. I don't mind that she lifts, but don't find the big muscles that attractive or feminine, even though her face and way she dresses is feminine as is the way she acts. I never really got this any thought before and it's obviously something that she could change, but seems to something she's very excited about. When I asked her she said she was overweight before and is excited to be fit.

How would you suggest approaching these 2?

[flitzanu]

12 minutes ago, max3732 said:

I never really got this any thought before and it's obviously something that she could change, but seems to something she's very excited about.

don't go into something expecting the other person to "change" because that's who they are.  if you don't like it you shouldn't pursue it.

[basil67]

2 hours ago, max3732 said:

For the first time in years I've had the chance to go out with 2 different women that seem to be interested.

One lives over 4 hours away and travels to my area often for work and we have been talking about meeting halfway (I posted about her before). We've been in touch and finally have a 2nd date coming up. I'm going to pick her up at her hotel and take her to a nice dinner. I really enjoyed talking to her and find her hobbies and experiences interesting. Since we've only had 1 date I really am excited to get to know her as a person a lot more.

The downside is of course the distance and also she doesn't get along with one of her parents and seems to have something of a rebellious streak even though she looks very sweet (enjoys speeding >100 mph and talking her way out of tickets)

As I've posted before I'm over 40 and still a virgin and was wondering if things go well at dinner is there a chance she'd want to escalate physically in her room? If so I'm guessing she'd invite me up? Or what do I do with that if I'm interested?

If you're interested in sex, go up with her.   But do you really want to be dating someone who is not only long distance but drives recklessly, putting others on the road at risk?  I would not date someone who did this

2 hours ago, max3732 said:

With the 2nd woman we've been on 3 dates and I we have a ton of things in common, from politics (1st one I mentioned is apolitical), to values, to favorite activities and food. It's very easy to talk to her and I feel good around her. The downsides are:

(1)She has a youtube channel and her videos are a bit off. I've shown them to a couple friends and my parents and everyone says she looks like a nut and I agree. She overshares like crazy and has videos of every little thing and is just a bit disturbing. In person I don't see any of that though.

(2) Even though I like that she's into fitness, she's into weight lifting and part of her channel is showing off her big muscles. I don't mind that she lifts, but don't find the big muscles that attractive or feminine, even though her face and way she dresses is feminine as is the way she acts. I never really got this any thought before and it's obviously something that she could change, but seems to something she's very excited about. When I asked her she said she was overweight before and is excited to be fit.

How would you suggest approaching these 2?

You've already shown her weird stuff to your friends and family and they think she looks like a nut.  So how in good faith can you introduce her to them knowing they already have preconceived ideas about her?  This would be an awful thing for you to do to her.

And why are you talking about potential for her to change her muscular body?  She is who she is.  Don't ever take on someone with the hope you can change them - it's beyond disrespectful.

[max3732]

57 minutes ago, basil67 said:

If you're interested in sex, go up with her.   But do you really want to be dating someone who is not only long distance but drives recklessly, putting others on the road at risk?  I would not date someone who did this

You've already shown her weird stuff to your friends and family and they think she looks like a nut.  So how in good faith can you introduce her to them knowing they already have preconceived ideas about her?  This would be an awful thing for you to do to her.

And why are you talking about potential for her to change her muscular body?  She is who she is.  Don't ever take on someone with the hope you can change them - it's beyond disrespectful.

Not sure if I'd be interested in sex, but making out and getting closer to it. She says she only drives like that when there aren't any cars around, but I don't know. She brought it up when I told her I got a speeding ticket.

When I showed my friends and family I didn't tell them anything before hand, just that she has a youtube channel. I told them that it's not how she acts in person at all. So hopefully they'd keep an open mind.

It's only been the last few years she's added this muscular body. When I look at pictures of her from 3+ years ago she looked much more attractive (in my opinion) even when she was overweight. It's not that she's not attractive now... I still think she's really cute, but it's not what I'd prefer. In grand scheme of things I don't know how important it is.

[ShyViolet]

4 hours ago, max3732 said:

was wondering if things go well at dinner is there a chance she'd want to escalate physically in her room? If so I'm guessing she'd invite me up?

How are we supposed to know?  I guess that is up to her.  Don't try to "invite" yourself up.  If she brings it up, she brings it up.

4 hours ago, max3732 said:

and seems to have something of a rebellious streak even though she looks very sweet (enjoys speeding >100 mph and talking her way out of tickets)

This is not "rebellious", it's irresponsible and reckless.  She is likely to kill herself or someone else with this dangerous behavior, and it speaks very poorly to her character and judgment.  

 

4 hours ago, max3732 said:

(1)She has a youtube channel and her videos are a bit off. I've shown them to a couple friends and my parents and everyone says she looks like a nut and I agree. She overshares like crazy and has videos of every little thing and is just a bit disturbing. In person I don't see any of that though.

So are your standards super low because you're over 40 and a virgin?  That is what it is sounding like.  There is something pretty significantly wrong with both these women.

Up to you, how low you want your standards to be.

[basil67]

1 hour ago, max3732 said:

Not sure if I'd be interested in sex, but making out and getting closer to it. She says she only drives like that when there aren't any cars around, but I don't know. She brought it up when I told her I got a speeding ticket.

If she invites you up to her place, she will likely be wanting sex.   It's still reckless driving

1 hour ago, max3732 said:

When I showed my friends and family I didn't tell them anything before hand, just that she has a youtube channel. I told them that it's not how she acts in person at all. So hopefully they'd keep an open mind.

They can't unsee what you showed them.  And she'll probably be nice to them without knowing what they secretly know.   If you were planning to date her, showing your family her secret weird life was a shitty thing to do

1 hour ago, max3732 said:

It's only been the last few years she's added this muscular body. When I look at pictures of her from 3+ years ago she looked much more attractive (in my opinion) even when she was overweight. It's not that she's not attractive now... I still think she's really cute, but it's not what I'd prefer. In grand scheme of things I don't know how important it is.

But the point is you're talking about change.   Don't date someone with a secret hope that they change

[SurfCity]

Do you have an example of her being a nut in her YT videos? Are you sure that you're not making a big deal out of nothing? Is "every little thing" showing herself making breakfast, going to Starbucks, walking her dog etc? If yes, that's pretty standard for YouTube; there's nothing nutty about it. 

I don't think that you should look down on the other woman for speeding when you yourself were just recently ticketed for speeding. You don't say how fast you were going, but it seems like reckless driving is something that the two of you have in common. 

[introverted1]

14 hours ago, max3732 said:

It's only been the last few years she's added this muscular body. When I look at pictures of her from 3+ years ago she looked much more attractive (in my opinion) even when she was overweight. It's not that she's not attractive now... I still think she's really cute, but it's not what I'd prefer. In grand scheme of things I don't know how important it is.

Her body doesn't exist for you, Max.  If she is happy being more muscular, that's her choice.  Your choice is to either like her for who she is or to move on. 

[max3732]

16 hours ago, basil67 said:

If she invites you up to her place, she will likely be wanting sex.   It's still reckless driving

They can't unsee what you showed them.  And she'll probably be nice to them without knowing what they secretly know.   If you were planning to date her, showing your family her secret weird life was a shitty thing to do

But the point is you're talking about change.   Don't date someone with a secret hope that they change

With my family and friends I felt like it would have been deceptive and wrong not to show them her videos. These are not "secret" as she has her channel listed on her dating profile. I also didn't show them any particular video, but just told them the channel name and I believe they all looked at different ones. 

16 hours ago, SurfCity said:

Do you have an example of her being a nut in her YT videos? Are you sure that you're not making a big deal out of nothing? Is "every little thing" showing herself making breakfast, going to Starbucks, walking her dog etc? If yes, that's pretty standard for YouTube; there's nothing nutty about it. 

I don't think that you should look down on the other woman for speeding when you yourself were just recently ticketed for speeding. You don't say how fast you were going, but it seems like reckless driving is something that the two of you have in common. 

Yes, it has a lot of the kinds of things you described and I guess a lot of people post stuff like that, which I also don't quite understand. Also videos of her talking to herself in her car. Who would want to watch someone talking about how they slept that night or their plans to run errands for the day or go to a museum or whatever? Even being interested to the point of considering dating/marrying her I find these difficult to watch. One video she zoomed in on her shoes and is showing her closet as she's talking. 

That's not her being a nut in the videos though. What I mean is she'll do a slow motion of her laughing  and then cut to a black and white video of some rock star or something slowed down too. Just a lot of cuts of random clips and effects, like zooming in as she's talking. What she's talking about too in some is just some kind of off the wall psychology or really personal stuff like if she's having a health issue or she didn't like how someone talked to her. 

The other thing is she's showing off her body and has a video from the floor basically looking up her skirt and not behaving in a very lady like manner. Just like in person she's also commenting on her boobs and adjusting them in some videos.

She has years worth of videos and I can't get myself to watch them for too long. That's also why I asked my family and close friends what they think and told them to just pick a random video. All of them said she seemed like a nut.

My speeding ticket was for while I was traveling on an empty road and not much over the limit. Hers was in the triple digits and she said her parents complained she got too many tickets growing up and she speeds and swerves in and out of lanes all the time. I wouldn't say the 2 are at all comparable.

3 hours ago, introverted1 said:

Her body doesn't exist for you, Max.  If she is happy being more muscular, that's her choice.  Your choice is to either like her for who she is or to move on. 

 

[Gebidozo]

40 minutes ago, max3732 said:

With my family and friends I felt like it would have been deceptive and wrong not to show them her videos.

Why? This is so strange. What do your family and friends have to do with a person you haven’t even begun dating exclusively yet? 

 

40 minutes ago, max3732 said:

Who would want to watch someone talking about how they slept that night or their plans to run errands for the day or go to a museum or whatever? Even being interested to the point of considering dating/marrying her I find these difficult to watch.

To me, considering marrying someone you’ve been on 3 dates with is a lot weirder and more off-putting than posting videos of oneself doing anything, really.

 

40 minutes ago, max3732 said:

The other thing is she's showing off her body and has a video from the floor basically looking up her skirt and not behaving in a very lady like manner.

My goodness, you sound like the butler Carson from the TV show “Downton Abbey”. It’s not 1924 anymore. It’s perfectly okay if you don’t like her videos, it sounds like you don’t like her personality in general. No problem, just don’t date her, that’s all. There is no need to make a fuss out of her videos and insist that she is “nuts”.

Edited December 8 by Gebidozo

[Alpacalia]

 It reminds me of when I was in the beginning stages of this. He is in law enforcement and would post videos that were really dark and it bothered me. It got to the point where I had no interest in watching anything dark and I just told him he could send me videos of his dog instead. lol

I think you're just trying to find things to pick at. I'd rather they were passionate about something, creating something, making music, writing a book, something..anything. If she wants nice muscles, that's hers, her body to do with as she chooses. If you don't like it feel free to date another woman who is more in tune with what you want. 

[Els]

1 hour ago, max3732 said:

With my family and friends I felt like it would have been deceptive and wrong not to show them her videos

You have been on 3 dates. It's not "deceptive" and "wrong" to not be showing all her social media channels to your parents and friends... in fact, it's pretty weird to show them all of that for a person you've met 3 times. Why are you even giving your parents a play-by-play of your dating life when you are 40??? Are you also going to fill them in on whether you have sex and what you did during sex...?

 

1 hour ago, max3732 said:

Yes, it has a lot of the kinds of things you described and I guess a lot of people post stuff like that, which I also don't quite understand. Also videos of her talking to herself in her car. Who would want to watch someone talking about how they slept that night or their plans to run errands for the day or go to a museum or whatever? Even being interested to the point of considering dating/marrying her I find these difficult to watch. One video she zoomed in on her shoes and is showing her closet as she's talking. 

It sounds like you're still living in the 80s. People watch these things all the time, some content creators even make a living out of doing that. There's an entire billion-dollar company (Twitch) that was born out of people streaming their everyday lives, before it pivoted to a video game focus. YOU may not be interested in watching this, and that's your prerogative, but to call someone "nutty" for doing it is just condescending and incredibly arrogant.

I think you should definitely not see the 2nd woman again, she deserves far better than a person who's constantly putting down her hobbies and her weightlifting.

[lemonicetea]

In regards to the first woman, I think speeding at 100 mph is beyond just having a rebellious side. Maybe if it was just a one time thing when she was a teenager, I will let it slide. If she’s still regularly doing this as adult, I’ll stay clear. If she invites you back to her room and you are interested in sex, then go with her. If she doesn’t bring it up, don’t force it upon her. 
 

With the second woman, it sounds like you guys have a lot in common and get along. So why are you putting down her hobbies? Typically women who start weightlifting as adults don’t become overly muscular, and even if she does, wouldn’t you still like her as a person?  Honestly the You Tube videos don’t sound that bad. I’m not into watching random people’s vlogs, but there is an audience for that kind of stuff. As long as she isn’t hurting anybody or doing anything illegal, what’s the big deal? You don’t have to watch them. 
 

Also side note, why do you feel like you are being deceptive to your parents? Why do they need to see the social media account of somebody you’ve seen only three times? Does she know about this? Seriously, a few months ago I had to call off a second date with somebody because he told me about how he was showing off my dating profile  to his coworkers and was dejected when he found out I didn’t tell my parents about our first date. If I were in her shoes, this would make me uncomfortable. 

[max3732]

3 hours ago, Gebidozo said:

Why? This is so strange. What do your family and friends have to do with a person you haven’t even begun dating exclusively yet? 

 

To me, considering marrying someone you’ve been on 3 dates with is a lot weirder and more off-putting than posting videos of oneself doing anything, really.

 

My goodness, you sound like the butler Carson from the TV show “Downton Abbey”. It’s not 1924 anymore. It’s perfectly okay if you don’t like her videos, it sounds like you don’t like her personality in general. No problem, just don’t date her, that’s all. There is no need to make a fuss out of her videos and insist that she is “nuts”.

My family asked me if I've been dating anyone and asked to see what she looked like and wanted to know about her. You think that's strange? If she puts her channel on her dating profile that has hundreds of followers you think it's something she wants to keep secret? My other good single friends discuss our experience with dating and show the profiles of the people we've gone out with it. Considering this one put up these videos and I found them concerning I thought I'd ask my friends/family their opinion. All said she looked like a nut.

2 hours ago, Alpacalia said:

 It reminds me of when I was in the beginning stages of this. He is in law enforcement and would post videos that were really dark and it bothered me. It got to the point where I had no interest in watching anything dark and I just told him he could send me videos of his dog instead. lol

I think you're just trying to find things to pick at. I'd rather they were passionate about something, creating something, making music, writing a book, something..anything. If she wants nice muscles, that's hers, her body to do with as she chooses. If you don't like it feel free to date another woman who is more in tune with what you want. 

I do like that she's passionate about a lot of the same things I am and some of the things she's passionate about I admire. For example, both of us enjoy classical music and are usually reading multiple books. Once when she was texting me I was thinking about how much I enjoy her messages and being with her, but how weird I found her videos.

2 hours ago, Els said:

You have been on 3 dates. It's not "deceptive" and "wrong" to not be showing all her social media channels to your parents and friends... in fact, it's pretty weird to show them all of that for a person you've met 3 times. Why are you even giving your parents a play-by-play of your dating life when you are 40??? Are you also going to fill them in on whether you have sex and what you did during sex...?

 

It sounds like you're still living in the 80s. People watch these things all the time, some content creators even make a living out of doing that. There's an entire billion-dollar company (Twitch) that was born out of people streaming their everyday lives, before it pivoted to a video game focus. YOU may not be interested in watching this, and that's your prerogative, but to call someone "nutty" for doing it is just condescending and incredibly arrogant.

I think you should definitely not see the 2nd woman again, she deserves far better than a person who's constantly putting down her hobbies and her weightlifting.

See what I wrote about. My parents asked me if I've gone out with anyone and what I could tell them about her. It's weird to show them her public channel? I'm not giving them a "play by play", but value their and my friends opinion of someone I'd consider. I also find it rather insulting and condescending with your question about filling them in on sex, although apparently people also make a living filming and posting that and people watch it, but I would also consider it "nutty" to post that.

I enjoy playing videogames, but also don't understand why someone would watch someone else play a game. Are there also people watch others reading a book or watching TV? Maybe you can watch other people eat or sleep? I think that's pretty weird to spend your valuable time watching someone you don't know and have no desire to ever meet talk about getting up, bruising her teeth and then driving to the store to pick up cereal, regardless of whether it's the 80s, 2020s, or 2050s, or whatever decade it happens to be. I'm all for mindless entertainment, but this is ridiculous.

1 hour ago, lemonicetea said:

In regards to the first woman, I think speeding at 100 mph is beyond just having a rebellious side. Maybe if it was just a one time thing when she was a teenager, I will let it slide. If she’s still regularly doing this as adult, I’ll stay clear. If she invites you back to her room and you are interested in sex, then go with her. If she doesn’t bring it up, don’t force it upon her. 
 

With the second woman, it sounds like you guys have a lot in common and get along. So why are you putting down her hobbies? Typically women who start weightlifting as adults don’t become overly muscular, and even if she does, wouldn’t you still like her as a person?  Honestly the You Tube videos don’t sound that bad. I’m not into watching random people’s vlogs, but there is an audience for that kind of stuff. As long as she isn’t hurting anybody or doing anything illegal, what’s the big deal? You don’t have to watch them. 
 

Also side note, why do you feel like you are being deceptive to your parents? Why do they need to see the social media account of somebody you’ve seen only three times? Does she know about this? Seriously, a few months ago I had to call off a second date with somebody because he told me about how he was showing off my dating profile  to his coworkers and was dejected when he found out I didn’t tell my parents about our first date. If I were in her shoes, this would make me uncomfortable. 

What's tough with the first woman is on the surface she seems to sweet, works out regularly, has a great education and hobbies and I enjoyed talking to her. That speeding and driving style as well as her rebellious stories from when she was a teenager kind of scare me. What I didn't know was whether as the man I should initiate considering going back to her hotel room, but if it's up to her that's fine. I wouldn't want to have sex, but do something short of that.

With the 2nd woman we do get along really well and I find most of her hobbies very interesting. I like her general attitude towards life and our conversations flow very well. I waited until the 2nd date date to kiss her and think that went well too. It was my first kiss in almost 2 years so it got me more interested in it. 

My concern with the videos is if that's really who she is and she's putting on an act for me. I don't care much for swearing and am very humble and private, but she acts the exact opposite. I feel a bit uncomfortable watching her adjusting her boobs with a picture of 2 bouncing watermelons on the screen with sound effects and also showing off her "legs", by showing an upskirt type video. Also with the weightlifting I'm afraid she's taking something because she does have rather large muscles and looks almost like these bodybuilders in some areas. I've been doing weights for years and she has bigger muscles than me. In the videos she's also flexing and posing all the time too. 

I'm very close to my parents and have some single friends in the same boat as me (similar age and lack of success) so we try to see how we're doing and give tips and advice. I went out with someone else that had a youtube channel and I didn't find it odd so I never showed it to anyone. This one I found odd so I asked their opinion when they asked me about anyone I've gone out with