Separated 3 months - no change - need thoughts!

[alle]

Just wanted to get some advice from others in the same position or been through what I am going through?? Any advice from anyone would be great....Please!

 

My husband and I have been together for 12 years. We met when we were 18 and have been married for 3 and a half years. We have a 4 yo daughter and 2 yo son.

 

Things between us were great up until I was due to give birth to our son. I had 2 weeks to go and my husband went to a work conference interstate for 5 days. After the first night he called me to say he had gotten very drunk at the work cocktail party and ended up with a female colleague in his room. They were just drunk and talking and ended up falling asleep... nothing happened he swore on his daughter's life! He flew home the next day though and didn't stay for the entire conference. We didn't fight about it or speak of it again. We just got on with our lives and our babies. He changed companies 2 months later and had nothing else to do with this girl since.

 

Last Sept 2005 we decided to start going out as a couple again as we had put 'us' on hold quite a bit from raising the children and my husband's career is so demanding with very long hours. We went out for dinner and as we were leaving my daughter carried on a big fit and wanted to come with us. As we hadn't been out for so long without the children I understood what she was going through but he just got very angry. We left her with his parents for a few hours and went out regardless. Driving to dinner my husband made the comment that our marriage was a joke!! ?? I asked him why and he says that we were more like a business transaction than a relationship. He says he saw me as his children's mother and not his wife and that was wrong. I didn't want to enter into the argument or hear anymore so I refrained from asking questions and changed the subject.

 

The next night we went out to a 60th birthday with family and friends (kids also) and when we got home he stated "he wasn't in love with me anymore. He didn't want to hurt me but didn't know if our marriage was what he wanted with the kids, responsibility and all it had eventuated to".

 

That same week I had paid his mobile phone bill and found text messages (number only not content) to the same number at strange times at night and for hours and many of them. My girlfriend dialled the number for me on her silent number and found out it was a co-worker of his. I mulled over whether to ask him about it and I did. He flew into a rage about that question infuriating him, that he and her were just friends and that if I even had to ask it meant I don't trust him. He then told me I was an angry woman and not the woman he married anymore and he left. He is living with his parents close to where we live and has been for 3 months now.

 

Since then he says that if the trust is gone then so is the marriage. He refuses to talk to me at all except for issues with the children. If I try and suggest counseling or trying to work through things he says it's gone and will never come back. He leaves, hangs up on me or ignores my text messages unless it's to do with the children.

 

Then just before Christmas he started to be nice again and say we'd talk about us in the New Year. Now it's the New year it appears that he just wanted to smooth things over for the holidays and has reverted back to being nasty and hostile. I asked him how he could just shut us off without any chance of reconciliation and why he is so angry and nasty to me. He says that when I realise it is over he will then be nice to me. He said that he didn't think I had trusted him since his mistake before our son was born and he just couldn't be with me.

 

I tried to tell him that actions speak louder than words and that if I had dealt with my own trust and stood by him through it and believed what he told me to this day then that should be enough for him to see I do entirely trust him.

 

I do know he still has a lot of contact outside work with this co worker and my daughter even told me that Daddy's girlfriend was with them on the weekend. She's just 4 and she asks me why daddy has a girlfriend and doesn't live with us. He still denies there is anything going on between them. My daughter told me that this woman has a little boy and she tells my daughter that she loves her very much.

 

I don't know how to get through to him when he just shuts me out. I don't get upset in front of the children but when I am on my own I am hurting a lot. I didn't think my husband would ever treat me this way or say the nasty things he does. It's killing me emotionally. He's not being his normal, caring responsible self and I don't get how that changed.

 

Any thoughts, advice or anything would help so much!

 

Thanks, Alle

[Ladyjane14]

Your husband seems to be having a fairly flagrant affair. Even your four-year old knows about it.

 

In some ways, the ability of a WS (wayward spouse) to tell bare-faced lies is just SHOCKING. But it's all too common.

 

Your husband has been lying to you for quite some time it would appear. Men don't leave without a reason the way he did. The excuses he gave you were just too flimsy.

 

Unfortunately, some guys don't believe they've cheated until they've had actual intercourse. They won't recognize the Emotional Affair as infidelity in the marriage. They'll often stick with the "just friends" story. Once committed to it, they'll continue on sticking with their story even after the affair becomes physical.

 

It's a common tactic really. The idea is to keep the wife from finding about the affair so as not to endanger the divorce settlement. After the divorce, the affair couple will act like they've only just now become involved. That's the plan....and he'll say whatever is necessary in order to make it work.

 

Among the out-and-out lies are the rationalizations and justifications. This is how he gives himself permission to proceed with an illicit relationship. He'll sell them well, because he's convinced of them himself. In his foggy brain, he believes these are good enough reasons. But they're only excuse....mountains that he's made out of molehills. Don't buy into it. Because he's going to turn those weak-ass excuses back on YOU in an effort to clear his guilty conscience and make YOU at fault.

 

"You don't trust me." is a rationalization. If his wife doesn't trust him anyway, then why not go ahead and have the affair? If he's already 'doing the time', then why not 'do the crime'?

 

"You're just the mother of my children, not my wife" is a justification. This gives him permission to cheat. You're not really a Wife to him, so why not?

 

Do you see through his Affair Babble yet?

 

Really, it's time to stop being nice to him. He's just doing what he has to in order to keep you calm. He doesn't want you to make a big fuss while he moves on with his life.

 

I don't know if you've checked out marriagebuilders.com yet, but what you need right now is "Plan B". The basic synopsis is that in Plan A, while your husband is 'on the fence', you behave sweetly to him. You identify and fulfill as many ENs (emotional needs) as you can. And you continue to call him back to the family and into accountablility.

 

Plan B is best executed after a really good Plan A. You want your spouse to see what he's going to be missing afterall. It does no good to get into a No Contact situation with someone if they're just going to be glad of it.

 

I think you've probably put in a pretty good Plan A already though, based on what you've written. Plan B is for the cheater who is 'off the fence' and in the OW's yard. Clearly, he is.

 

It's time to make him see what he's going to be missing by taking it away from him. You have children together, so No Contact will be nearly impossible. But you can do Minimal Contact. The best case scenario would be that you never discuss anything with him aside from the children, and only briefly as possible.

 

It's time for you to get a lawyer, and to consider filing for divorce. You need to protect yourself and your family. You need full custody of your children, and you need to protect your home and assets. Right now, he can take whatever he wants.

 

Quite frankly, if my four-year old came home telling me that "Daddy's girlfriend says she loves me soooo much".....I'd go off like a BALLISTIC MISSILE. He wouldn't get ANY visitation until I had a full explanation of why some stranger was permitted intimate contact with my children.

 

If it's at all possible, you need to hire a PI and get the details on the affair. You need to know who this woman is. If she's married or significantly involved, you need to EXPOSE her to her S/O. You need to know exactly what your husband is doing and expose him to the key people in his life. The bubble of fantasy is burst when the ugliness of the affair is dragged out into the light.

 

Part of that "fantasy" is holding onto all that you had before. It's not possible. He needs to start dealing with that. There's a price to be paid for abandoning your family. It's time for him to start paying it. This also will make the affair less fun. Don't you think he'd like to have both his OW and his WIFE being cooperative with him? Don't you think he wants you to be his "Friend" after he's done deserting you? Wouldn't that all be so much easier for him?

 

You don't have to let that fantasy continue. You can give him a peek through the window of divorce BEFORE it becomes an actuality. You can show him the consequences of his actions NOW, while there's still time for him to change.

 

He will put tremendous pressure on you when you start messing with his affair. He'll tell you that YOU are the one ruining any chance of reconcilliation. He'll say horrible things to you when you expose him and the OW. He'll continue to try to make this all about you....and not about his affair.

 

You don't fall for that. These are common tactics, and the bottom line is that your marriage has NO CHANCE at reconcilliation unless this affair ends.

 

Further, you don't take him back until he PROVES to you that the affair is over. Change the door locks. Refuse his calls. See a lawyer and make him accountable for his actions. Above all, protect your children and your assets.

 

If he ever does come back to the family, he'll be glad that you preserved all this for him. If he doesn't, then why would you even begin to care if he's mad at you?

 

You have to consider that there's a REASON that he's keeping you in the dark. Clearly, he's afraid that you could ruin his plans if you had all the details of what's really going on in his life. He's keeping his distance. He's unapproachable, and keeping you at arm's length with his moodiness. These are indicators that he's worried about what you can do.

 

So....get the details and then DO IT! Make what he's been avoiding something that has to be faced.

 

It's extremely difficult to enjoy your new romance while your wife's lawyer is bending you over the settlement table. The added bonus is that the more stressed out he is....the more stress he'll bring into his relationship with OW. It won't be long before he'll have trouble on EVERY front.

[dgiirl]

Oh Alle,

 

I think the best advice I can give you right now is to implement no contact. Let him have his fling with the ow, and move on with your own life. Build up your self esteem, which naturally is probably a little low at the moment. Your conversations with your stbxh seems non productive right now, and I think you will only push him further away. Implement no or limited contact and focus on yourself and your kids. Let him do what he's going to do, cos honestly, you cannot control him anyways. Stop telling him everything about yourself and build up a little mystery. There are two resources you can start reading. marriagebuilders.com and divorcebusting.com. They didnt work for me, but maybe they can help you.

[alle]

Thank you both so much for your thoughts and advice. I know I had all those things going on in my mind subconsciously but it's believable when you hear it from other people. Makes me feel as though I am not going crazy!!

 

I know what he says is just trying to justify his own actions because each time I speak to him it's logical and sensible thoughts I give him so he's nothing else to throw at me but blame me for why he left. Our marriage was just at a lull with 2 small kiddies but it was at a turning point with the ages they were and the more 'feedom' from routines created by babies to now young kids/toddlers! It was getting so much easier.

 

I felt that if I treated him with the same 'no contact' he would think that I don't care about him at all and it'd make it easier for him to realise his decision to leave was right. I reckon he'd be glad for no contact or just about the kids. He has said to me before he's willing to discuss anything to do with the children but that's it!

 

I thought about hiring someone to expose the affair but it's so expensive and it's money I could do with for the children. I do wish I could expose it, it would just make this process so much easier to get through!

 

I am not silly, the amount and quantity of text messages to this OW (who by the way is a co worker of his, a single Mum with a 4 year old boy) and the times he did them were enough to give me the gut feeling to ask. He also said he was at one place and his mobile phone bill stated he was in a totally different suburb on many occasions!

 

I suppose he is right in a sense that if I had to ask then I don't trust him. But has he given me any reason to trust? I reckon he did the texting on purpose to bait me and see how I react. If I said nothing then maybe I did trust him but he knows me better than that and I fell for it and reacted just the way he wanted me to.

 

I truly believe he went through the emotional separation from our relationship way before me because that's how he keeps his composure and can say sometimes some rather nasty things and not look at all remorseful for it.

 

Yes, I do need to move on and make him see the reality of his decision to leave his family. Whether that makes a difference to him at all who knows?? It'll help me be a better, stronger person for myself and my children in the long term.

 

Thanks for your advice and I will read those resources to see if they can help me also!

[Ladyjane14]

Since you're reading anyway, here's a recent thread in which Exposure was discussed, as well as the importance of Investigation:

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t78283/

 

You might also buy (or borrow at the library) a copy of Surviving An Affair by Harley. I like this program better than others because of it's dual nature. Not every marriage can be saved, (or even should be for that matter...IMHO). I think this program builds in some allowances for that.

 

The methods put you in the best possible position to salvage the relationship, but it also calls on you to safeguard your own future and that of your family. If the marriage ultimately fails....the program prepares you for that as a possible outcome. The author is the same guy from Marriagebuilders btw, but the book is more in depth.

 

The bottom line is that whether your marriage survives or not, you've done all you could...and YOU survive either way.

[DacaInaru]

I'm sorry to hear about what your going through.. I would have to agree with some of the posters here that you definately need to go on with your life..

 

Its apparent that he's been cheating on you..and won't own up to his part in this whole thing by pegging the blame on you and saying that your mistrust is what has ruined the marriage..

 

Move on.. his infidelity is what ruined the marriage not you..

 

good luck

[Mz. Pixie]

Borrow a car from a friend and follow him. Even if you guys are separated, it's still adultery.

 

The way you counteract NC with making him go the other way is to be firm but loving.

 

Something along the lines of-

 

I love you and I'm fully capable of forgiving your actions (assuming that you are of course) and committing myself to working on our relationship. Yet, I've realized that I cannot hold you to me if you don't want to be so until you are able to get rid of the OW I will have to make any interaction with you solely concerning our daughter. I will have to at some point move forward with making myself happy, and I would truly like that it be with you but if not, then move on and be happy I will.

 

Then, stick to it. He doesn't want to hear it anyway because it makes him feel guilty.

 

Then, set about making a life for yourself. Don't let him know where you are, what you are doing. He may get really curious pretty quickly. When he does, again, state that you're willing to work on the marriage, if he gives up OW and comes home, but that your personal life is none of his business. Let him see you dressed up when you pick up your daughter, even if you have to pretend to have a social life. Don't answer his calls immediately when he calls, that kind of stuff.

 

He didn't do the text messages on purpose, he was just thinking he wouldn't get caught. He GAVE up his right to privacy when he was conducting a emotional affair behind your back. That was time he could have invested working on your marriage but chose not to-friends my ass!

 

Ladyjane has given you some excellent advice, and she knows where she's coming from- her husband had a EA with someone and they recovered!