Struggles with OLD

[expos4ever]

49 minutes ago, Sony12 said:

Yes ED is a big issue some women have. Yes the guy can take a pill but many of these ladies don't want their sex lives to be based around the effectiveness of a pill.

Fair enough, but is it realistic for woman above, say, 60 to expect that a man will not need a pill? After all, bodies wear out, even ones that are well cared for. Likewise, men of my age (66) cannot expect to find a woman of the same age who retains the beauty of youth.

[Sony12]

6 minutes ago, expos4ever said:

Fair enough, but is it realistic for woman above, say, 60 to expect that a man will not need a pill? After all, bodies wear out, even ones that are well cared for. Likewise, men of my age (66) cannot expect to find a woman of the same age who retains the beauty of youth.

 

No it's not realistic. Though keep in mind this is online activity where people tend to be a little pickier than they normally would be in real life and where they are also at times looking to combine the fantasies they have with a real world relationship. 

[introverted1]

4 hours ago, expos4ever said:

Fair enough, but is it realistic for woman above, say, 60 to expect that a man will not need a pill? After all, bodies wear out, even ones that are well cared for.

A body that isn't overweight and which has been maintained with exercise and healthy food, should not need a pill at 60. 

[expos4ever]

14 hours ago, introverted1 said:

A body that isn't overweight and which has been maintained with exercise and healthy food, should not need a pill at 60. 

An AI tool I queried responded thusly: "According to research, a healthy male aged 60 with a normal BMI is likely to experience a rate of erectile dysfunction (ED) around 20-30%. And I found some data that suggested that being overweight doubles your chances (although that data was for men of about 30).

So while being overweight does increase risk, the risk of ED at age 60, even among the healthy and slim, is still not that low.

[FredEire]

21 hours ago, Sony12 said:

 

No it's not realistic. Though keep in mind this is online activity where people tend to be a little pickier than they normally would be in real life and where they are also at times looking to combine the fantasies they have with a real world relationship. 

I have a bit of a debate with my flatmates about modern dating, one is 34 and has been taken for a few years now, the other guy is 26.

I'm 31, single, and while I'd say I still look decent I probably do look about my age. A degree of balding, some wrinkles coming in. Fairly healthy and athletic and try to keep up a good lifestyle

Over the last year or so I've found it much more challenging to meet women than in the past. I'm finding there's just a lot of low interest, both in person and on OLD.

While it might be down to some personal stuff to a degree, confidence not being as high etc, I think the dynamic has changed as well. My flatmates say early 30s is a great age because women in their late 20s and early 30s want to meet a man who's a bit more mature and ready to settle down.

I would argue with the rise of OLD a lot of those women just go for the hottest 25-year-old they can get and hope they can change him and make him want to settle down with an older woman. I say that from experience because I dated a string of girls in their late 20s/early 30s when I was that age, most of which ended with them asking to get serious despite me being clear that I wasn't looking for a relationship.

Obviously everyone wants different things and I'm sure there's women out there who are open to meeting men the same age as them or a couple of years older, but I feel like the above is just much more common than before. Which doesn't leave men in their early/mid 30s who more or less look their age in a great position unless they go the route of dating much older women as you've done.

Edited March 2 by FredEire

[Sony12]

58 minutes ago, FredEire said:

I have a bit of a debate with my flatmates about modern dating, one is 34 and has been taken for a few years now, the other guy is 26.

I'm 31, single, and while I'd say I still look decent I probably do look about my age. A degree of balding, some wrinkles coming in. Fairly healthy and athletic and try to keep up a good lifestyle

Over the last year or so I've found it much more challenging to meet women than in the past. I'm finding there's just a lot of low interest, both in person and on OLD.

While it might be down to some personal stuff to a degree, confidence not being as high etc, I think the dynamic has changed as well. My flatmates say early 30s is a great age because women in their late 20s and early 30s want to meet a man who's a bit more mature and ready to settle down.

I would argue with the rise of OLD a lot of those women just go for the hottest 25-year-old they can get and hope they can change him and make him want to settle down with an older woman. I say that from experience because I dated a string of girls in their late 20s/early 30s when I was that age, most of which ended with them asking to get serious despite me being clear that I wasn't looking for a relationship.

Obviously everyone wants different things and I'm sure there's women out there who are open to meeting men the same age as them or a couple of years older, but I feel like the above is just much more common than before. Which doesn't leave men in their early/mid 30s who more or less look their age in a great position unless they go the route of dating much older women as you've done.

It's actually extremely common for dating to start slowing down once you get into your 30's and it starts becoming more difficult to find people to date. While what your flatmate said is true that women in their late 20's and early 30's are starting to look for more mature men who are willing to settle down. He at the same time though is leaving out one pretty significant detail. Many single women in their late 20's and early 30's these days have young kids at home that they are trying to raise. Dating becomes significantly less important when they are trying to raise young kids. With divorce rate being what it is these days and it becoming more and more common place for people to decide to just live together and not get married the number of young single women trying to raise kids is higher now than ever before.

You are probably starting to seem too old for the young girls in their early and mid 20's who are living care free personal lives for the most part (and you also might be noticing now how young they are).

One of the main reasons I became interested in dating older women (old enough at times to have kids my age or a little bit older) is that they had significantly less drama going on in their lives. Their kids either had or were about ready to move out and they were ready to spend time on themselves again. Trust me it isn't uncommon at all for women to say that they would go a decade or more without dating at all because they were focusing on their kids. And these were good looking and highly sexual women.

Also another thing is while I don't know where you live and it might be a different situation in your part of the world. However here in the U.S. adult men living together really isn't viewed as being that attractive. Again where you live it might be viewed totally different but here in the U.S. a man in his 30's living with two other adult men wouldn't be viewed as being that attractive to women looking to settle down. They might question if he is financially stable as well as have thoughts going through the back of their mind if he is sexually involved with them.

 

[introverted1]

4 hours ago, expos4ever said:

So while being overweight does increase risk, the risk of ED at age 60, even among the healthy and slim, is still not that low.

According to published research analysing nearly 20 million men, the rate of ED among men in their 60's is ~11%.  And this does not stratify men by weight or health.

Quote

Of 19,833,939 men meeting inclusion criteria in the primary analysis, only 1,108,842 (5.6%) had an ED diagnosis or PDE5I prescription (mean [SD] age: 55.2 [11.2] years). Prevalence of ED diagnosis or treatment increased from age 18–29 years (0.4%) to 60–69 years (11.5%), then decreased in the 7th (11.0%), 8th (4.6%), and 9th (0.9%) decades. 

I stand by the assertion that a healthy, not overweight, man in his 60s should not have chronic ED nor need blue pills to maintain an erection.

 

 

[FredEire]

45 minutes ago, Sony12 said:

It's actually extremely common for dating to start slowing down once you get into your 30's and it starts becoming more difficult to find people to date. While what your flatmate said is true that women in their late 20's and early 30's are starting to look for more mature men who are willing to settle down. He at the same time though is leaving out one pretty significant detail. Many single women in their late 20's and early 30's these days have young kids at home that they are trying to raise. Dating becomes significantly less important when they are trying to raise young kids. With divorce rate being what it is these days and it becoming more and more common place for people to decide to just live together and not get married the number of young single women trying to raise kids is higher now than ever before.

You are probably starting to seem too old for the young girls in their early and mid 20's who are living care free personal lives for the most part (and you also might be noticing now how young they are).

One of the main reasons I became interested in dating older women (old enough at times to have kids my age or a little bit older) is that they had significantly less drama going on in their lives. Their kids either had or were about ready to move out and they were ready to spend time on themselves again. Trust me it isn't uncommon at all for women to say that they would go a decade or more without dating at all because they were focusing on their kids. And these were good looking and highly sexual women.

Also another thing is while I don't know where you live and it might be a different situation in your part of the world. However here in the U.S. adult men living together really isn't viewed as being that attractive. Again where you live it might be viewed totally different but here in the U.S. a man in his 30's living with two other adult men wouldn't be viewed as being that attractive to women looking to settle down. They might question if he is financially stable as well as have thoughts going through the back of their mind if he is sexually involved with them.

 

In my area there's actually a lot of single childless women in their late 20s and 30s. The issue is more there's huge focus on career and if you're a single woman at that age with no plans for a family you'd probably rather just sleep around with good looking young men while you're still relatively attractive yourself and hope maybe one of them wants to settle down.

I have a friend for example who's 37 and she's gotten into a relationship with a guy who's 28. Kids aren't a concern for her so she's just gone for furthering her career and a younger guy.

I could probably date a girl of that kind of age as well but I want to have a family. I also don't have much interest at this stage in dating a girl under 25 and as you said yourself the feeling is probably mutual anyway. What I'm looking for is someone my age or late 20s who'd like to have a family, but there isn't much of that around these days.

In terms of living situation where I'm from the property market and rental situation is horrific, you're actually lucky to have a room to yourself never mind a whole flat as a youngish working professional, unless you've already worked your way up in a high-powered career. People in their 30s even sharing rooms or living with parents is depressingly common.

Edited March 2 by FredEire

[FredEire]

1 hour ago, Sony12 said:

It's actually extremely common for dating to start slowing down once you get into your 30's and it starts becoming more difficult to find people to date. While what your flatmate said is true that women in their late 20's and early 30's are starting to look for more mature men who are willing to settle down. He at the same time though is leaving out one pretty significant detail. Many single women in their late 20's and early 30's these days have young kids at home that they are trying to raise. Dating becomes significantly less important when they are trying to raise young kids. With divorce rate being what it is these days and it becoming more and more common place for people to decide to just live together and not get married the number of young single women trying to raise kids is higher now than ever before.

You are probably starting to seem too old for the young girls in their early and mid 20's who are living care free personal lives for the most part (and you also might be noticing now how young they are).

One of the main reasons I became interested in dating older women (old enough at times to have kids my age or a little bit older) is that they had significantly less drama going on in their lives. Their kids either had or were about ready to move out and they were ready to spend time on themselves again. Trust me it isn't uncommon at all for women to say that they would go a decade or more without dating at all because they were focusing on their kids. And these were good looking and highly sexual women.

Also another thing is while I don't know where you live and it might be a different situation in your part of the world. However here in the U.S. adult men living together really isn't viewed as being that attractive. Again where you live it might be viewed totally different but here in the U.S. a man in his 30's living with two other adult men wouldn't be viewed as being that attractive to women looking to settle down. They might question if he is financially stable as well as have thoughts going through the back of their mind if he is sexually involved with them.

 

In terms of slowing down - yeah I can see that. A lot of it is that a lot of people aren't what you're looking for and you're not what a lot of people are looking for either. It gets more specific, compared to a guy in his early 20s who is just hooking up with any girl who comes his way (probably not the best thing to do in hindsight, but very common).

[Sony12]

58 minutes ago, FredEire said:

In my area there's actually a lot of single childless women in their late 20s and 30s. The issue is more there's huge focus on career and if you're a single woman at that age with no plans for a family you'd probably rather just sleep around with good looking young men while you're still relatively attractive yourself and hope maybe one of them wants to settle down.

I have a friend for example who's 37 and she's gotten into a relationship with a guy who's 28. Kids aren't a concern for her so she's just gone for furthering her career and a younger guy.

I could probably date a girl of that kind of age as well but I want to have a family. I also don't have much interest at this stage in dating a girl under 25 and as you said yourself the feeling is probably mutual anyway. What I'm looking for is someone my age or late 20s who'd like to have a family, but there isn't much of that around these days.

In terms of living situation where I'm from the property market and rental situation is horrific, you're actually lucky to have a room to yourself never mind a whole flat as a youngish working professional, unless you've already worked your way up in a high-powered career. People in their 30s even sharing rooms or living with parents is depressingly common.

Yeah I'm sure the living situations there cut down on the number of people choosing to have kids at a young age (which in the long run is probably a good thing). Here many people are out of the house by their late teens or early 20's. New housing additions, condos, and apartment buildings are going up all the time. Most people who have a steady income are able to afford a place of their own. 

If you did a search of profiles of women 35 and under in the state I live probably 75-80% of them would say they have kids living at home. As a guy if you want to get serious with a young lady here you usually have to accept that she will be a package deal.

 

[FredEire]

32 minutes ago, Sony12 said:

Yeah I'm sure the living situations there cut down on the number of people choosing to have kids at a young age (which in the long run is probably a good thing). Here many people are out of the house by their late teens or early 20's. New housing additions, condos, and apartment buildings are going up all the time. Most people who have a steady income are able to afford a place of their own. 

If you did a search of profiles of women 35 and under in the state I live probably 75-80% of them would say they have kids living at home. As a guy if you want to get serious with a young lady here you usually have to accept that she will be a package deal.

 

The housing situation is very bad in most of Europe, particularly my country. I have a couple of friends who moved to the US for that reason.

Different issues in different parts of the world, the common thread is it seems to be becoming more and more different to meet someone you want to settle down with everywhere.

 

[FredEire]

58 minutes ago, Sony12 said:

Yeah I'm sure the living situations there cut down on the number of people choosing to have kids at a young age (which in the long run is probably a good thing). Here many people are out of the house by their late teens or early 20's. New housing additions, condos, and apartment buildings are going up all the time. Most people who have a steady income are able to afford a place of their own. 

If you did a search of profiles of women 35 and under in the state I live probably 75-80% of them would say they have kids living at home. As a guy if you want to get serious with a young lady here you usually have to accept that she will be a package deal.

 

And to be honest I'd completely disagree it's a good thing that less people are having kids. Aging populations, infantilised adults who never really had to grow up, people aging and realising that there's nobody around any more because the older generation has died off and they don't have a family.

If someone doesn't want to have children personally, because they don't like kids/it would be a health risk/they prefer to push further in their career etc I think that's perfectly fine, each to their own. But when whole societies are pushed in that direction it becomes a big problem.

Edited March 2 by FredEire

[Sony12]

Yeah sorry about that situation. I imagine it is really tough for young adults wanting to create a life of their own and being stuck in an environment where they basically have to live in a dormitory type of atmosphere through no fault of their own. 

I had fun when I lived in the dorms while in college and made a lot of good friends. But after a couple years of living in that environment I was ready to get out of there and get a place of my own.

Edited March 2 by Sony12

[expos4ever]

5 hours ago, introverted1 said:

According to published research analysing nearly 20 million men, the rate of ED among men in their 60's is ~11%.  And this does not stratify men by weight or health.

What is your source? This is from the Mayo Clinic:

Problems with erectile dysfunction are super common. If you look at the decade of life, that predicts what percent of men will have problems. So, for example, 50% of 50-year-olds, 60% of 60-year-olds, so on and so forth, will have problems with erections.

And this is from the National Library of Medicine:

It is estimated that by the time a man is in his 40’s, he has about a 40% chance of having some form of ED and this prevalence increases about 10% per decade thereafter. 

And from Boston University School of Medicine

The disorder is highly age-dependent, as the combined prevalence of moderate to complete erectile dysfunction rises from approximately 22% at age 40 to 49% by age 70. 

I am not saying the study you appear to have found is "wrong", but, based on my quick research, the picture is less rosy.

And note that I am disputing that taking care of yourself dramatically improves the odds.

[FredEire]

1 hour ago, Sony12 said:

Yeah sorry about that situation. I imagine it is really tough for young adults wanting to create a life of their own and being stuck in an environment where they basically have to live in a dormitory type of atmosphere through no fault of their own. 

I had fun when I lived in the dorms while in college and made a lot of good friends. But after a couple years of living in that environment I was ready to get out of there and get a place of my own.

Yeah exactly, I'm the same. I'd for sure be living alone if I could afford it, and the plan in the next couple of years is to get myself to a place financially where I can. The flipside with this stuff as well is often when you meet a girl she'll be sharing a room/living with some crazy strict old lady, and you feel like teenagers sneaking around looking for a bit of intimate privacy in your 30s lol.

I've considered moving to the US once or twice, though I have a friend who lives in NYC and says he hasn't dated anyone since he's been there and there's a huge work obsession and not many people wanting families. So, grass isn't always greener, different dating issues depending on where you are.

[introverted1]

12 hours ago, expos4ever said:

What is your source?

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28032424/ 

There is a big difference between occasional ED, which most men, regardless of age, have experienced, and chronic/persistent ED..

People who take care of their bodies by maintaining a healthy weight and exercising can generally expect those bodies to perform well for quite some time. I am not sure how you can dispute that.  Again, the published research indicates otherwise:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6479091/

Quote

Obesity is a major public health issue worldwide and is frequently associated with erectile dysfunction (ED). Both conditions may share an internal pathologic environment, also known as common soil. Their main pathophysiologic processes are oxidative stress, inflammation, and resultant insulin and leptin resistance. Moreover, the severity of ED is correlated with comorbid medical conditions, including obesity. 

We should probably take this offline if you want to discuss further; we are thread-jacking at this point.  🙃