Marriage and Christianity

[meowpurr]

I don't come out here much, but I mentioned before that I am married.

I'm not. We live together as husband and wife, not commonlaw. We just consider it.

My question is... I'm on disability and I'm also on medicaid. I'll never be able to work. Michael, my fiancee/boyfriend, whatever you wanna call him, makes wayyyy too much money. If I marry him, I lose EVERYTHING! But he doesn't make enuff for both of us to live on. ( I buy the groceries and stuff for the house with my disablity. He pays the bills, house payment, etc.)

Both of us are VERY Christian people and we both feel guilty for just living together, and I know it's a huge sin in God's eyes. I don't wanna lose my money, though.

Any suggestions?

[slubberdegullion]

Living together is not a sin. According to scripture, you are already married in the eyes of God.

 

Fornication, on the other hand, is a sin, but since you're in a committed relationship, it doesn't apply.

 

Relax. Chill. Have a cigar.

[Moose]

If I marry him, I lose EVERYTHING!

Where are you placing your priorities?

Both of us are VERY Christian people and we both feel guilty for just living together, and I know it's a huge sin in God's eyes. I don't wanna lose my money, though.

Who provides for all of us? God. Who can make the impossible, possible? God. Who should you place your faith in? God.

 

There was a man not tithing like he should. So the Pastor told him, "If you tithe your 10%, I'll make sure all of your bills get paid".....the man asked the Pastor, "You're willing to do that for me?", Pastor replied, "No, but God is, and He promised to do so".......

 

Marry him, legally and in front of God. Then live for Him. He'll take care of the rest!

[Outcast]

The answers you get will depend on how moralistic/ultra-right the people who answer you are. You have to decide for yourself which view of Christianity is valid: the one in which God's just waiting to punish you for the slightest transgression or the one in which God is loving and forgiving.

[Admiral Thrawn]

I don't come out here much, but I mentioned before that I am married.

I'm not. We live together as husband and wife, not commonlaw. We just consider it.

My question is... I'm on disability and I'm also on medicaid. I'll never be able to work. Michael, my fiancee/boyfriend, whatever you wanna call him, makes wayyyy too much money. If I marry him, I lose EVERYTHING! But he doesn't make enuff for both of us to live on. ( I buy the groceries and stuff for the house with my disablity. He pays the bills, house payment, etc.)

Both of us are VERY Christian people and we both feel guilty for just living together, and I know it's a huge sin in God's eyes. I don't wanna lose my money, though.

Any suggestions?

 

You may write a letter to your local representative of Congress or Parliament, or whatever, against any laws you do not like. However, if the institution of marriage is available, then you should get married, and trust God that your boyfriend will get a raise or a better job.

 

Pre-maritial sex and Extra-maritial sex is fornication according to the Bible. Common-law marriage is a form of 'serial monogomy' and is fornication. You are not on some island off the Pacific ocean somewhere with only you and your boyfriend, so that is out of the question.

 

If you want to listen to the other posters assaguate your conscience, that's fine, but if you want the cold hard truths, then you will have to marry.

[Becoming]

Marriage is a civil union for the good of the state. It wasn't until the Middle Ages that the church became involved in marriage because conflicts over legitimate inheritance were disrupting society to the point where wars threatened others. Then clergy became involved in the rites because they were some of the few people who could read and write. It was at that point that the church realized it had some important things to say about marriage and began to think of marriage as a sacrament, around the 13th century.

 

You are not alone. There are several older people who simply can't afford to marry one another and live. They lose retirement income to marry, which means they have to make the decision over whether or not to buy food or medicine they need in order to live. It's not a matter of cutting back on luxuries but of survival. In those cases, some clergy are privately blessing unions with close friends and family. These rites aren't legal but recognize the desire to make covenant with one another, which is the basis of our true Judeo-Christian heritage, not some civil ceremony done on behalf of an oppressive state.

 

When the state's policies are such that they oppress to the point where people cannot do the moral thing and survive, ya gotta ask, what would Jesus do? He would challenge the social policies that impose such a dilemma on two people who want to be married in the eyes of God, and he would follow the higher law of God over against the state that crucifies. He might also judge those who would condemn you as somehow less religious, as we see with his angry actions against the Temple's moneychangers in John's gospel. He would also condemn greed, if that's a motivating factor.

 

Now, you've been given some ways of interpreting the situation as far as we understand it, which is limited to what you offer us. Only you and God know your hearts and situation in order to know what is the right thing to do. Read and study and pray for discernment.

[meowpurr]

But I was married before 6 years ago and my exhusband and I lost everything the week after we got married.

I DID have faith then that God would see us through.

We ended up having to sell our house and moved into a tiny apartment. We had a baby that couldn't even go to the doctor sometimes because all the money went towards the apt. and food.

That's why I'm so scared of getting married once again. We just bought a brand new house. I help him with $250 a month of my own money for the house payment. I'm on food stamps, too not Michael So if we get married Michael had to come up with $500 more a payday. And I have NO money for clothes. Michael makes $15/hour plus bonuses. And That's way too much money for me to keep my insurance and disablity.

 

A question: Back in biblical days, you did not need a marriage certificate to be considered married. What changed?

[Becoming]

Rich people wanted the state to guarantee inheritances. Before that, vows were made before the Christian assembly as part of the Sunday service.

[slubberdegullion]

Back in biblical days, you did not need a marriage certificate to be considered married. What changed?

Social customs changed. There didn't used to be funerals, either. Nor bar mitvahs (sp?), or Christmas (though there was a Roman pagan festival that happened on Dec. 25, which was appropriated by Constantine as the birthday of Christ) or pretty much any Christian religous celebration.

 

But as the power of the Church grew to such an extent that the Church and State became one, they insisted on a social gathering or similar event to mark the big two passages in a person's life; namely, marriage and death.

 

So take from it what you will. Liberal thinkers like myself believe that a loving God would not damn you to hell without an ice maker because you didn't perform some sort of ceremony. Conservative thinkers believe that the ceremony is necessary before God sees you as duly joined.

 

Either way, the decision is yours, to be based on your personal beliefs in conjunction with the reality of your situation, which includes your finances.

[Becoming]

And trusting God doesn't mean you have to check your brains and swallow everything the church tells you. The church is in an unholy bed right now with the state and doesn't see how it is compromised by that relationship.

 

At the same time I'm dissing society, I realize that marriage by the state extends certain protections that you will not have if you remain unmarried, protections that are good. I assume, for example, that the house is in your SO's name. That means if you break up, you get nothing. You're truly on your own.

[slubberdegullion]

I assume, for example, that the house is in your SO's name. That means if you break up, you get nothing. You're truly on your own.

That depends on your jurisdiction. Best check first, before any assumptions are made.

[quankanne]

if you're Christian, you'll understand that living together IS a sin, no matter how honest your intentions are. Under the law, you are not only living together, but are in a common-law marital relationship. For purposes of taxes, you're still single, though ... go figure.

 

I feel for you, being in a tough spot like that. My aunt and uncle would not get married because of potential loss of pension. I don't know if they just "dated" or actually lived together, but they finally did get married about 10 years ago when he and a group of his co-workers hit the state lottery. Otherwise, they'd still be in the same boat as you and your guy are.

 

I could tell you until I'm blue in the face what to do, but that isn't going to remedy anything when you're determined the thing to do is keep on keeping on as you are, simply because you'll be penalize for marrying. Best thing to do is to keep praying on this ... and to start buying lottery tickets

[Becoming]

But truth is, we all live in sin. Sin is an inescapable condition. Which is why we need grace. It doesn't sound like you're considering that grace to have you covered no matter what you do, which would be to consider Christ's sacrifice as no big deal. Are you seeking to live in such a way as to care for all others--especially the most vulnerable in the world, which the Bible is always talking about as being the basis on which our actions will be judged.

[Admiral Thrawn]

 

A question: Back in biblical days, you did not need a marriage certificate to be considered married. What changed?

 

Whatever constitutes an official marriage seems to have changed. However, as a rule of thumb, as long as the marriage is recognized by the law of the land, and my society as a whole, then it is indeed a marriage.

 

IF the law of the land says you just have to jump up and down together three times and say "we are married" in order to be married, then so be it. Each state, both now and throughout time, have different practises.

[Becoming]

Whatever constitutes an official marriage seems to have changed. However, as a rule of thumb, as long as the marriage is recognized by the law of the land, and my society as a whole, then it is indeed a marriage.

 

IF the law of the land says you just have to jump up and down together three times and say "we are married" in order to be married, then so be it. Each state, both now and throughout time, have different practises.

 

They're not interested in whether they're married in the state's eyes, but in God's, though. I doubt you'd say that what the state says on the matter takes precedence over God, would you? Or is the state God?

 

Yes, the Bible tells us that marriage is an honorable estate and to hold it in high esteem. But it doesn't really tell us what constitutes that marriage. Is it the covenant made between the two in public? Is it physical union? Engaged couples could have sex in Mary and Joseph's day without problem. Jesus' admonition against divorce was to protect women who could be divorced for any reason just by having the man say to her, "I divorce you" 3 times, leaving the woman destitute and utterly reliant upon others for her life because as used goods she wasn't desirable to others who were honorable.

[Admiral Thrawn]

They're not interested in whether they're married in the state's eyes, but in God's, though. I doubt you'd say that what the state says on the matter takes precedence over God, would you? Or is the state God?

 

 

That's an interesting question. God's appointed the state, since Genesis, to provide law and order and protect the vulnerable in society. Romans 13, also shows that God works with a state in basic matters of law, justice and order.

 

The State's institution of marriage (ie. through churches, or courts) is respected by God if it is according to the Bible. If the State has no institution and there is no church that they can get married in, then our friend is off the hook, can can marry any way they want.

[a4a]

The State's institution of marriage (ie. through churches, or courts) is respected by God if it is according to the Bible. If the State has no institution and there is no church that they can get married in, then our friend is off the hook, can can marry any way they want.

 

There is no state law that "God" or religion has to be part of any ceremony or marriage for that matter.

 

a4a

[Admiral Thrawn]

There is no state law that "God" or religion has to be part of any ceremony or marriage for that matter.

 

a4a

 

Canada, for example, recognises marriages performed in a church by a Minister. Many other states do. You can also choose to get married in a court. Marriage license cost about $ 110.00, but other than that levy, it's rather quite simple and easy to get married to anyone.

[penkitten]

it is a shame that our government doesnt reward you when you try to do the "right" thing by getting married.

instead all social security, pensions, food stamps, daycare help, afdc all gets affected and cut. medicaid , medicare and other health care is affected, wic is affected. your childrens school lunch is affected. your income tax refunds start to suck. subsidized housing is affected.

it seems the longer people just live together they can make their ends meet. once you get married they take everything away.

 

they should start figuring out a way to reward people that wont scare them out of getting married.

[penkitten]

also consider that there are alot of legally married people who have married on paper that are not considered to be married by god.

 

people who marry for the wrong reasons, to gain citizenship, celebrities for show, etc. and for that matter people who just shouldnt be together because god didnt put them together.

 

just because two people get married doesnt mean that god recognizes it.

[Chris777]

look at your statements

I don't come out here much, but I mentioned before that I am married.

I'm not. We live together as husband and wife, not commonlaw. We just consider it.

 

If I marry him, I lose EVERYTHING!

 

At the beginning of your statement you say you consider yourself married, but in whose eyes is it in? You obviously have justified it for your selves, in your eyes, but in the end neither justification in your eyes, or ours will matter, only Gods.

 

If I marry him, I lose EVERYTHING!

say this again out loud, and think about it

 

 

But he doesn't make enuff for both of us to live on. ( I buy the groceries and stuff for the house with my disablity. He pays the bills, house payment, etc.)

Both of us are VERY Christian people and we both feel guilty for just living together, and I know it's a huge sin in God's eyes. I don't wanna lose my money, though. Any suggestions?

 

what was the situation before you moved in together? As in why did you do that as opposed to marrage?, and what are your priorities? Please yourself, and live comfortably , or please God.

 

I know things can be Tough Financally.Me and my daughter are currently living with my parents. and I am looking into disability, if i can even get it. I feel like I am a burden to my family, I have totally exhausted my 401 k, and have even had to file for un employment, Even though I have doubts I could maintain a job considering I was fired for job performance on a desk Job. But Things arent bad, I am not currently "in need" The lord has provided. I may want things, I may want a car, I may want to be Whole again. My daughter, want's

Her mother. But I don't know If We will get any of those.

 

I entered My marrage through Adultry, Using her claimed abuse as justification, for entering into a situation I knew was wrong , according to the commandments. At the time I didn't understand why it was wrong other than It being one of the 10 commandments.

And when She decided she wanted to end our marrage, I could not see anything other than shock and disbelief, much less, any sort of understanding, at the price of my own sin. Especially since I commited it with the "noblest" of intentions. Looking back I now realize I destroyed 2 families, with my sin. The family that I broke up,to be with my ex wife, And the family we made together, when she decided to continue, in her ways.

 

Neither my daughter, nor her half siblings see or hear from their mother much any more, She has had some physical illnesses, as well as being occupied, with a few different guys, the past 8 years. I assume Since She is supposed to be physically well, she is just too busy with her boyfriend, and his family, to call, or visit her children often. I have had to make arrangements with the very man whose marrage I destroyed, for my daughter to see her siblings. He hasn't brought it up, In a long time, the last time was before I could see the pain and destruction, that I had caused, as actually being a result of my sin.

 

I have tried explaining what happened to my daughter, as best I could, But I don't know if I will ever have the courage, to do so with my step children, "I am so Sorry", seems to come off as an insult, or slap in the face. As for my ex wife, I sometimes wonder What might have happened, If I had encouraged her more, to struggle to keep her first marrage in tact, instead of following all of the foolish and irresponcible psychobabble, like "it would be better for the kids in the long run",and " If you don't love him why put yourself ,and them through it" and best of all "dont worry about the kids they will be fine".

 

Those words and thoughts comforted me, and gave me an excuse to justify my own selfish desires over any possible ramifications, of my persuasion for her to divorce him, to marry me ,and the fornication we commited together, For her children, by her 1st husband, not to mention our unborn child Considering how badly I wanted a child of my own, It never dawned on me, that my actions then could end up hurting her (my daughter).

It's humiliating that My ex wife has technically been together with her current boyfriend/commonlaw husband, longer than we even knew each other.

 

Especially when he has threatened, and attacked her, on several occasions over the past several years. He even raped her, driving her into the house, of yet another man, who ended up beating her up yet again, after she didnt fall for him, (or who knows, what the truth is that she didn't tell me). She has apparently decided to go back(yet again) to the man who raped her. I had to draw the line on visitation for my daughter sake, no matter how much her mom assures me he wont harm anyone but her.

 

I know she is the one who keeps going to people who abuse her, but

I still feel responcible, in the sence that Maby things would be different if she had stayed with her 1st husband. My 2 oldest step kids have now dropped out of High school, hopefully their younger sister will finish it. My ex wife would never have allowed them to drop out while she was still married, to her 1st hubby(, or me,) but since she is kept occupied by the Bf, and his "ailing" father, their dad has allowed alot of things to happen, that probably wouldnt if the situation had been different.

 

I am sure I will be told, that not all of it was my fault, and that my ex is just as guilty, and it would be nice to duck out of the spotlight and forget the whole thing ever happened, But it did, and stroking my ego, and trying to throw part of the blame off of myself, onto someone else, does not in any way change, or diminish the fact, that

I actively, and willfully participated, in the sin that brought this situation about. Their is nothing I could do to possibly attone for it. It is something only God can make good from. And I have no doubt that he is able and willing . How is that for some food for thought?

[Chris777]

so much for trying to edit a post while trying to get my kid ready for school.

 

I was planning on spacing things out a bit, but i exceded the time limit, plus "humiliating" would probably be better said as unnerving, and whatever else I forgot, aside from not seperating my questions further from my situation, which was meant as an example

[Becoming]

Chris, your situation is a nightmare, which, yes, sin created and which marriage is meant to avoid through the sacred covenant to care for one another no matter, even at personal sacrificial cost. Though a public ceremony and marriage license may make it harder to back out of that covenant, truth is, a covenant is only as good as the commitment two people have to it.

 

I've been married for 25-years. I'm Protestant and still consider it sacramental. I'm not against marriage! I'm all for it, as a matter of fact. But I know long-time saints of the church whose social security would seriously be cut to the point where they'd have to make the choice between eating and necessary medicines if they got married. So which is more moral in the eyes of God: condemning people who covenant to care for one another in front of their pastor and friends but not legally marry OR saying they must marry and watch them die from lack of meds or starve? My reading of the Bible goes with option 2.

 

And which Biblical view of marriage should we follow? Father Abraham's? King David's? the ones where women are chattle? The words about marriage in Ephesians 5 were radical for their day--words of mutual care and affection in a world where marriage was a mere business arrangement. These are the ones I presume Admiral means by the Biblical view of marriage, right?

 

And when the state no longer sanctions or makes it possible to follow these higher laws of God, we are bound to the higher law. We in the church need to be working to change these marriage-penalty laws instead of spending all our energy condemning the poor.

[a4a]

Why not just be married without the official state marriage license?

 

If it is that important to you to feel guilt free and not loose your benefits just have your religious ceremony and simply do not send in the papers.

 

In most states the person performing the ceremony simply sends in a copy of the marriage lic. to the state swearing it was performed.

a4a

[Becoming]

Why not just be married without the official state marriage license?

 

If it is that important to you to feel guilt free and not loose your benefits just have your religious ceremony and simply do not send in the papers.

 

In most states the person performing the ceremony simply sends in a copy of the marriage lic. to the state swearing it was performed.

a4a

 

Pastors aren't just for wedding hire.

 

Don't apply for the marriage license at all so there are no papers to send. Ministers marrying people are acting as ministers of the state when they sign marriage licenses. We discovered when my sister-in-law married that the pastor she wanted to perform the ceremony had to jump through all kinds of hoops. Here's what was true in that case: If a pastor goes to another state to perform a ceremony, he/she has to go to the courthouse to show credentials and get clearance from the state. It is the pastor's responsibility to send in the marriage licence after the marriage, and this responsibility cannot be left to the couple.

 

If OP is really devout Christian, the couple already belongs to a church.

Many clergy have a problem with blessing a union that is not an official marriage. But not all do.