witabix Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 A player? A player is a man (or woman) who gets with more than one partner and DOESN'T commit to any of them. If a player falls in love and becomes commited, he is no longer a player now is he? Take a simple analogy, a person playing a game is a player until he is killed, after which he is no longer a player. All I'm hearing from you all is that men who like to have sex with many women and like being with more than one woman at a time can't fall in love. It's idiocy at its fullest. In the past he may have lied, cheated, stole, whatever, but if he desires the change he can change quite easily. I've seen it done with much OLDER people (20s and 30s) who change in a SNAP. I've got friends at 23 and 24 who date tons of women, have sex with tons of them, and when they do find a girl they are genuinly interested in, they settle down, and these men are your text book definition of players. (Menage's, having sex with more than one partner within hours, etc). What you mean to say I believe is, "Can an INSECURE player fall in love", there's a huge difference. Because men like to flirt that makes us insecure? That makes us need an ego boost? Sure it does, anyway I'm off to work. P.S. The term hit on over here generally means flirted with with sexual communication and sexual hints going on. If you mean he cheated on his wife why not just say that? If he has that's totally different, and his wife is really just plain stupid to stay with him if she knows and has this, "deep sadness" in her eyes because of it. This is an issue of morals and perspectives. Your analogy of game playing is a little wide of the mark. No one has suggested they cannot to fall in love. Read the title of the post again. MUCH older people in their 20's and 30's, well, I consider them to be MUCH younger people. How does that affect anything? To describe a woman as "just plain stupid" to stay with some one is, I can't think of a better reply than to say, "youth has certainty beyond its years". When you have lived a little longer you MAY see things differently, then again you may not. I do not envy your certainty Hyakku. May you always be happy in your certainty. Link to post Share on other sites
hyakku Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 To describe a woman as "just plain stupid" to stay with some one is, I can't think of a better reply than to say, "youth has certainty beyond its years". When you have lived a little longer you MAY see things differently, then again you may not. I do not envy your certainty Hyakku. May you always be happy in your certainty. I know I will stay certain with this because of the simple fact that I know exactly WHY people stay in relationships like this. Being comfortable, afraid of change, and staying for other people (kids, parents, etc), and generally seeking approval from others are the reasons why people stay in abusive relationships. Its sad but true, and prove to me where it is not and I will gladly withdraw my opinions in a manner you feel fitting, but the honest to goodness truth is, people who stay in relationships where they are constantly being hurt are insecure, or live for OTHER people. Neither of which are healthy. I feel for young Hyyaku. I get what he's saying. To him, it seems like we are saying a player can't fall in love. Hyyaku, I hope you can see the difference in a player and a flirtatious man. A player is someone who plays games with peoples hearts and feelings. That's very painful to most people. No I AM talking about players. Lemme give you a few examples: Friend of mine (call him Aki): Will tell a woman he is talking to that he wants to have sex with them right there with no attacthments and may not stay with them afterwards. ON THE SPOT. And generally he does. Add to the fact that he has ex girlfriends still swooning over him, the fact that after he has broken up with his ex girlfriend HAS TOOK THERE FRIENDS and dated them, and still stayed honest the entire time. Textbook definition of player. Has settled down into long relationships in a jiffy. An insecure player cannot do this, a "player" that doesn't lie, cheat, hide like a coward, or anything else deceptive, can switch on a dime, because they KNOW what they want out of life and out of other people. Another friend of mine: Has had no strings attached sex with a girl, WALKED downstairs, had sex with another friend of hers, had the other girl catch him and he tells them exactly what he has done. There's no lies and deceit there, and again he has had commited relationships before. Another few guys: One guy TELLS a woman upfront that their relationship will never go past physical, he won't accept their number, they can call him, he won't call first, they always have to make the first call, and he is not in it for any exclusive relationship. Gets women like crazy. Another guy just goes and says CRAZY, outlandish crap, but STILL gets women. Its not being a player thats wrong, its being a lying manipulator that is. Now to those who say I'm too young, take a guy I know (a mentor if you would) in his 30's who was married and his wife CHEATED on him with his best friend of YEARS. YEARS. And you know what he did? Dropped his wife, and IS only angry because of the guy's feigned friendship. The woman cheated on him? He doesn't mind, things happen, IN fact he still talks to the woman to this day. And now he dates tons of women. A player, you could call him that if you want (he does some things that would be defined very playerish), but he never has to lie. Um...that's nice and perfectly except that...I am talking about a guy who does it because of low self esteem, needs the ego boost. So you mean an INSECURE manipulator? HUGE difference. Things change when you get older. Settling down in your early 20s isn't the same thing as settling down as an adult. I was married and divorced by the time I was 25. It's hard for me to take your opinion seriously since one of my closest friends is a 45 year old man who cannot for the life of him figure out why he can't maintain a steady relationship with one woman. Again look at the example of the guy in his 30's that I know of. Maybe you're closest friend needs to look at learning a new outlook and gaining a new skill to get in a steady relationship with a woman. Maybe he needs to reframe and get new mindsets and concepts of his reality in his mind. Maybe he needs to rethink his path in life (if he has one). Again, most people don't wanna seek help, they want to stay victims and blame the "a**h***s" and the "jerks" for getting all the women and treating them badly, its not true. Simply put I believe the book Flow says it best, If the Challenge is too high and you have a low skill level your result will be anxiety. If the challenge is too low and you have a high skill level your result will be boredom. If he's having too much of a challenge he needs to look into getting a new skill. Link to post Share on other sites
Butterflying Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 The guys that you are describing are not players because (as you say) they aren't lying and manipulating anyone, ie playing with anyones emotions. These guys you mention are single, prmoiscuous men. Still, you seem to be confusing the definition of a player. As long as a man isn't lying and manipulating anyone, HE IS NOT A PLAYER. Actually, you keep giving examples of other men and insisting they don't lie and manipulate women. You can't speak for them because you aren't them. And it seems that you haven't had a chance to experience this personally. At your age, commitment isn't neccesary anyway. You have no reason to be a player. Therefore, you have no reason to defend your actions, or your friend's actions. From what you've posted, you don't know any players. Clearly, you aren't a player. Anyway, you're too young to be taken seriously. So you have nothing to contribute here except questions. Try to learn from the experience that we who have been affected by this topic have posted. (I'm saying this will all respect, regardless of your age). Link to post Share on other sites
Touche Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 Thank you Butter! You saved me SO much typing! Perfectly said. Exactly what I wanted to say until I read your response. Please pay attention Haykku. You might learn something. I realize at your age, just like all of us, you think you understand it all. But you don't. Take this all in. No one is attacking you. Learn from what you read here. Remember it. It will serve you well later on in your life. Link to post Share on other sites
hyakku Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 The guys that you are describing are not players because (as you say) they aren't lying and manipulating anyone, ie playing with anyones emotions. These guys you mention are single, prmoiscuous men. Still, you seem to be confusing the definition of a player. As long as a man isn't lying and manipulating anyone, HE IS NOT A PLAYER. Actually, you keep giving examples of other men and insisting they don't lie and manipulate women. You can't speak for them because you aren't them. And it seems that you haven't had a chance to experience this personally. At your age, commitment isn't neccesary anyway. You have no reason to be a player. Therefore, you have no reason to defend your actions, or your friend's actions. From what you've posted, you don't know any players. Clearly, you aren't a player. Anyway, you're too young to be taken seriously. So you have nothing to contribute here except questions. Try to learn from the experience that we who have been affected by this topic have posted. (I'm saying this will all respect, regardless of your age). Ah the folly of the elderly, because you have years on me does NOT mean that my opinions are void. Please, DEFINE you're definition of player. Because many people I personally know (both young and old) will describe a player as one who just plays with multiple women, and some will describe him as one who lies. Its in the eyes of the beholder. Just like the one guy who said "hit on" was the equivalent of cheating on his wife. We have different opinions, accept them and move on, but please don't make the mistake so many elders before you have made and simply dismiss my opinions because I am younger. I literally have the joy of laughing at men and women alike who disregard me because I am younger, and then come back to me asking what the hell happened when I am able to succiently describe their exact experience and what went wrong, simply because I understand it. Again it all depends on YOUR interpretation of the word player, some define it as: A man who carries himself in an ultra-cook, ultra-confident manner; A man who is very straightforward and upfront about his lack of desire to engage in an exclusive, "committed" relationship with women. And yet others define it as: A male who is skilled at manipulating ("playing") others, and especially at seducing women by pretending to care about them, when in reality they are only interested in sex. Possibly derived from the phrases "play him for a fool", or "play him like a violin". The term was popularized by hip-hop culture, but was commonly recognized among urban American blacks by the 1970s. Again urbandictionary has a conflicting view of the term player by many different people: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=player&page=1 So its up for interpretation, funny how I'm not the only one who thinks this way, yet my opinions are void because I am young. As confucius would say, the gentleman can learn from one he feels is inferior to him (slightly paraphrased but whatever). Actually, you keep giving examples of other men and insisting they don't lie and manipulate women. You can't speak for them because you aren't them. My experiences and others are from people I am close with, not from people I barely know. Again I could tell you about my own but you'd just continue with the, "You're too young to be taken seriously" and honestly I don't really need your approval anyway, I'm just responding to the original posters question. So back on track, yes a player can fall in love OP, saying he can't is like saying that a person can't change there mannerisms, concepts of life, ideas, beliefs, or general way of life. Saying he can't is in essence saying that he must have a mental or biological "disease" or "virus" or "deficiency" that would allow him not too. Don't fool yourself, anyone can fall in love, even those who have desynthizied (sp?) themselves to certain emotions can STILL experience them, there is no way to ever completely destroy an emotion. If this sounds stupid coming from me because I'm too young, I'll have a 40 year old make an account up here so it'll help all the "old" people feel better about themselves for being on the same level as a high school boy (or man whichever floats your boat). Link to post Share on other sites
Touche Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 "If this sounds stupid coming from me because I'm too young, I'll have a 40 year old make an account up here so it'll help all the "old" people feel better about themselves for being on the same level as a high school boy (or man whichever floats your boat" HILARIOUS! You do that. Don't think we "old people" need a fake account to make us feel better though! You'll see...one day, you will realize that your arrogance is misplaced. Thanks for the laughs, honey! Link to post Share on other sites
Author incognito Posted February 17, 2006 Author Share Posted February 17, 2006 Since this is my thread and I'm the one wanting the help here...I'm gonna define it as the insecure, lying manipulator. I'm still trying to figure out if this guy is a player or not I know they can fall in love. this guy is very capable of emotion and love....I just don't know if he's playing me or not for one, and if they ever stop that ego-boosting flirtatious behaviour. My experience so far is no. Link to post Share on other sites
Author incognito Posted February 17, 2006 Author Share Posted February 17, 2006 Thanks. It's only my opinion. Glad it helps! Things an insecure man might do to drive a woman he loves away is being too possessive. He might visit her at odd times just to check up on her. He might stalk her. Or, since he's a player, he might turn back to some of those women he "played" for MORE attention, to make the woman he loves jealous. I'm sure there are many other things to drive her away. But I just wanted to point out the fact that a player literally sets himself up for failure when he falls in love. The post began by asking what happens when a player falls in love. Many of us have posted simply to describe that. I feel for young Hyyaku. I get what he's saying. To him, it seems like we are saying a player can't fall in love. Hyyaku, I hope you can see the difference in a player and a flirtatious man. A player is someone who plays games with peoples hearts and feelings. That's very painful to most people. If a man like this decides to change, YES he can change. Once he decides to change, it's not going to be squeeky clean over night. There will be reprocussions and consequences to pay. In the process of getting his life together, he may end up losing the woman he loves while he's dealing with all the changes. But once he finally gets it right, he's no longer classified as a player. thanks...another good post Link to post Share on other sites
hyakku Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 "If this sounds stupid coming from me because I'm too young, I'll have a 40 year old make an account up here so it'll help all the "old" people feel better about themselves for being on the same level as a high school boy (or man whichever floats your boat" HILARIOUS! You do that. Don't think we "old people" need a fake account to make us feel better though! You'll see...one day, you will realize that your arrogance is misplaced. Thanks for the laughs, honey! Just for future reference in case a guy does come on and concur with my opinions I was actually jokin around, I wouldn't waste my time on that I know we are all entitled to our own opinions. And I certainly wouldn't call my opinion arrogance, you are as secure in your beliefs as I am mine, that is all. But I do have to agree with butterflying, when a guy who IS used to lying and cheating falls in love, he can do some incredibly stupid things instead of just ceasing the lying and cheating. Obviously if he can attract her, all he needs to do is take out the lying, cheating, and other deceptive things, and be honest. Instead what he does is jump to the other polarity, focus on her ALL the time, and ends up being repulsive by becoming needy, clingy and just plain annoying. For a note: Alot of guys who were like this and become this way can actually become abusers because they are afraid of losing the woman so they think keeping her down will keep her attracted to them, and the sad thing is, it usually does because people have a scarcity mentality like the person they are with is the only other male or female on earth. Why are you putting yourself through the aggravation? There's MILLIONS of men out there that would treat you well, why not go for them. In fact, here give me your AIM address and we can have online sex to make you feel better (joking in case no one caught it). Link to post Share on other sites
amerikajin Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 When I think of a player, I tend to view it as a rite of passage for men - but it's something that you do when you're in high school or college. If you're still single at 30 or 40 and you're playing, you may be getting laid but you're getting not a single step closer toward intimacy. I can see if some dude's gone through a bitter divorce and wants to have a little fun around 2 a.m. on Sunday, but if someone's still going through the playboy phase at that age and hasn't ever tried commitment, then I don't think it's likely they'll ever fall in love. It just isn't possible. To fall in love means you have to take risks and devote your full attention to someone and honor them; players don't have that kind of courage. They don't want to get hurt, they fear rejection or invalidation at some point because they're afraid people will find out who they really are, and since they don't really like who they really are, they worry that others won't either. So they continue to have shallow relationships that get them laid but never get them a companion who gives a s*** about them. When someone actually falls in love, it means that they see someone who has reached into them and touched them in a way that forces them to take the risk of being hurt somewhere down the road. Link to post Share on other sites
Author incognito Posted February 18, 2006 Author Share Posted February 18, 2006 When someone actually falls in love, it means that they see someone who has reached into them and touched them in a way that forces them to take the risk of being hurt somewhere down the road. well said ........... Link to post Share on other sites
RecordProducer Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 Whoah! You've written some nasty comments about my husband since the last time I was on LS! In any case, none of it is true. 1. My husband shows his love for me 24/7 and is going out of his way to make me happy. Me and my children are really lucky to have such a wonderful man in our lives. We are very much in love and very happy together. :love: :love: 2. It's not his fault that this pen pal from Rio likes him and pursues him although he ignores her. He stopped all communication with her at my request. 3. I don't appreciate calling my husband names by people I considered my friends! Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 Whoah! You've written some nasty comments about my husband since the last time I was on LS! In any case, none of it is true. 1. My husband shows his love for me 24/7 and is going out of his way to make me happy. Me and my children are really lucky to have such a wonderful man in our lives. We are very much in love and very happy together. :love: :love: 2. It's not his fault that this pen pal from Rio likes him and pursues him although he ignores her. He stopped all communication with her at my request. 3. I don't appreciate calling my husband names by people I considered my friends! You posted the situation and people reacted to it, RP, what did you expect? Hairpats and congratulations? Link to post Share on other sites
RecordProducer Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 You posted the situation and people reacted to it, RP, what did you expect? Hairpats and congratulations? First of all, I didn't ask for help! I merely told you about this woman who was after my husband. Secondly, I gave a comic note to the whole situation so apparently I didn't have a "problem". Thirdly, it was obvious from my posts that he did nothing wrong and kept it on a friendly level with her. I also stated that he was NEVER interested in meeting this lady during 3 years of their friendship, while he visited ME six times in Europe and eventually married me within 15 months. However, what pisses me off is not the misunderstanding - it's the "divorce the a**h***, he's sh*tting all over you... you think he is great, but we think he is a scum-bag" kind of mentality I always stumble on at LS. If I say he loves me and he is faithful - it means: he loves me and he is faithful! Thank you.. Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 I don't know why you're getting so upset. Why is this making you so reactive? It shouldn't bother you since no one else is involved but you. Does the fact that other people read your story and took a different view of the situation that upsets you? You can't control other people's reactions. Link to post Share on other sites
RecordProducer Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 I don't know why you're getting so upset. Why is this making you so reactive? It shouldn't bother you since no one else is involved but you. Does the fact that other people read your story and took a different view of the situation that upsets you? You can't control other people's reactions. What upsets me is people insulting my husband and calling him an ass. I could've chosen not to reply, but I chose to reply. Besides, I could ask the others the same question: why is their reaction so bashful and pessimistic. There are other ways of "opening my eyes" about my partner's behavior than - predicting a tragic future for me and calling him nasty names. In any other case, I would be glad to consider opinions based on facts. Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 Man I've missed you RP! This place hasn't been the same without ya babe! Link to post Share on other sites
Lishy Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 RP please dont get upset ..... YOU know your husband and YOU know what is right and wrong and I am sure that if you thought something was amiss you would act on it! You are in love with him and he loves you and if you do not see a problem with him talking a woman then it is NOT a problem! You know how wonderful he is with you. I think seeing as so many people on here have been burnt in the past, we tend to feel pessimistic about partners and that can show in some replies! Please do not take it personal YOU know how things are in your own marriage and always trust in that! Link to post Share on other sites
RecordProducer Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Man I've missed you RP! This place hasn't been the same without ya babe! I've missed ya too, girl! Lishy, that's the "correct answer." For god's sake, I ain't retarded. Another thing that irks me is that when one person says something, ten more people follow him or her. Like I am an idiot and my husband - who is just talking online to someone who likes him but he never wanted to meet or date - is prone to cheating. Plus he stopped talking to her whenh I asked him to, cuz HER behavior was inappropriate. After all, he went through all the hassle of the over-oceanic marriage just to be with me. He eats from my hand and treats me like a queen. He is the most adorable creature I've ever met. You better not ask why I got upset, of course I won't let anyone think that he pisses and sh*ts all over me. There are nice people here who might feel sorry for me for no reason whatsoever. Link to post Share on other sites
Mary3 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I know a Married Man who emails me and in every letter he tries to direct it towards lingere , what I love in bed , any fantasies ,ect. To any email from him regarding sexual inudendos I give no response. He will eventually write back and ask me how I am doing. I give a bland boring answer and his next email is right on target with things he wants to do to me again. My answer back is to ignore him and not give him what he wants. I don't know if he is attemping to masterbate to any erotic words he's waiting for but it never happens. I once wrote him and said if you are so happily married why do you write me suggestive erotic letters ? To which he replies he apologizes and the cycle begins again. The answer I believe is that he gets his jollys over the internet getting girls to spice up his sex life and his mind. I have no respect for him and have deleted the Married Internet guy. Link to post Share on other sites
hyakku Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I've missed ya too, girl! Lishy, that's the "correct answer." For god's sake, I ain't retarded. Another thing that irks me is that when one person says something, ten more people follow him or her. Like I am an idiot and my husband - who is just talking online to someone who likes him but he never wanted to meet or date - is prone to cheating. Plus he stopped talking to her whenh I asked him to, cuz HER behavior was inappropriate. After all, he went through all the hassle of the over-oceanic marriage just to be with me. He eats from my hand and treats me like a queen. He is the most adorable creature I've ever met. You better not ask why I got upset, of course I won't let anyone think that he pisses and sh*ts all over me. There are nice people here who might feel sorry for me for no reason whatsoever. See, a player does NOT have to be a lying, cheating a**h***, someone like that is well....a lying, cheatin' ass hole. And now you've heard of straight from a woman who is married to one. And they told me I was too young Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 See, a player does NOT have to be a lying, cheating a**h***, someone like that is well....a lying, cheatin' ass hole. And now you've heard of straight from a woman who is married to one. And they told me I was too young Unfortunately, the fact remains. Chronos is a bitch. Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I've missed ya too, girl! Lishy, that's the "correct answer." For god's sake, I ain't retarded. Another thing that irks me is that when one person says something, ten more people follow him or her. Like I am an idiot and my husband - who is just talking online to someone who likes him but he never wanted to meet or date - is prone to cheating. Plus he stopped talking to her whenh I asked him to, cuz HER behavior was inappropriate. After all, he went through all the hassle of the over-oceanic marriage just to be with me. He eats from my hand and treats me like a queen. He is the most adorable creature I've ever met. You better not ask why I got upset, of course I won't let anyone think that he pisses and sh*ts all over me. There are nice people here who might feel sorry for me for no reason whatsoever. Well, I've gotten used to the fact that sometimes when I post information about my life, I get answers that I don't want to hear. Sometimes I do. It's just how life is. You had a right to get upset, though I don't really know where you could or even if you SHOULD direct it at anyone. More of a general "it sucks that people do that, all the time, to everyone including me" kinda thing. I'm just sayin.... Link to post Share on other sites
hyakku Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 Unfortunately, the fact remains. Chronos is a bitch. What in the hell is a chronos? Link to post Share on other sites
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