Employee/Employer Relationship(s) Question

[Guest]

Okay, so I just started working at this job a month ago, and I really enjoy it thus far. However, this is my first full-time job, and I am not really familiar with what is considered "sexual harassment" as opposed to "harmless flirting." You see, I work mainly with men--married men--most of whom have hit on me in one way or another. I am a friendly sort of person, so I don't know if my smiling and being friendly is being misconstrued as "flirting" or what, but it is really starting to get annoying. One guy went so far as to tell me that he "had good dreams about me" and doing/saying other inappropriate things letting me know what he is interested in, so I try to bring up his wife and child, and I think he finally got the hint, but now it is uncomfortable working with him; I don't want that to happen with the other co-workers who have said/done things that are on the verge of inappropriate. I want to keep a friendly relationship with these people, but not to be confused as being interested in anything other than friendship.

 

Also, while on the topic of office relationships, I have a huge crush on my married boss who is quite a bit older than me. I have never said or done anything to lead him to believe that I like him as anything more than my superior, and I don't believe in having relationships with married men, but he is separated from his wife (who even lives in a different state). Is it ethical to make advances on my boss (once he is divorced, of course)? Does anyone have any experience dating their boss? I am so confused right now. I guess that comes with my being single, 20, and working my first full-time job with mostly men. Any advice would be very much appreciated. Thank you.

[Curmudgeon]

Don't fish in the company pond.

 

Not only is it totally unprofessional. It can also lead to lawsuits and loss of employment.

 

Sexual harassment is in the eyes of the beholder. This is your first fulltime job. Don't get your career aspirations, if you really have any, off on the wrong foot. You're decidedly treading on a slippery slope. If men speak or act inappropriately to and towards you, tell them you find it uncomfortable and that's not what you're there for. If they persist, report it to management. There are labor laws against it.

[magda]

One guy went so far as to tell me that he "had good dreams about me"

Ugh

 

Wait until you work somewhere else to go after your boss. The other guys, just be less smiley and friendly to them. If you smile too much you're seen differently, especially by men. They will view you more as a waitress or flight attendant than co-worker, it's just how men are (nothing against those jobs, just that they can attract a lot of attention from men because of their nature and that they are service positions). To get more respect and get the men leaving you alone act less like you want to please and be liked by everyone. Of course you don't want to be rude and mean, but a bit of indifference and wariness will probably help get them to lay off.

[Guest]

Don't fish in the company pond.

 

Not only is it totally unprofessional. It can also lead to lawsuits and loss of employment.

 

Sexual harassment is in the eyes of the beholder. This is your first fulltime job. Don't get your career aspirations, if you really have any, off on the wrong foot. You're decidedly treading on a slippery slope. If men speak or act inappropriately to and towards you, tell them you find it uncomfortable and that's not what you're there for. If they persist, report it to management. There are labor laws against it.

 

 

I appreciate the candidness of your reply, but you could try to be a little less offensive in it. Though I am only twenty, I am perfectly level headed. I do have career aspirations, but not regarding this particular job. I do enjoy being there, but this is only to pay the bills; hopefully, I will have a "career" once I graduate college.

 

Perhaps I should have stated that on my original post: This job is only temporary, my future career lies elsewhere.

[Guest]

Ugh

 

Wait until you work somewhere else to go after your boss. The other guys, just be less smiley and friendly to them. If you smile too much you're seen differently, especially by men. They will view you more as a waitress or flight attendant than co-worker, it's just how men are (nothing against those jobs, just that they can attract a lot of attention from men because of their nature and that they are service positions). To get more respect and get the men leaving you alone act less like you want to please and be liked by everyone. Of course you don't want to be rude and mean, but a bit of indifference and wariness will probably help get them to lay off.

 

Hahaha, yeah, I gagged too. Anyway, thank you for your reply. Regarding the smiling and friendliness though, I am the receptionest, and my boss (who is female--the person who I have a crush on is her boss) requires a smile at all times; so, in a sense, it is a "service position." I mean, being new there, I do want to be liked. You see, I am actually a really shy person when it comes to meeting new people; even people who are my friends now have told me that when they first met me, they thought I was concieted because I wasn't friendly and chatty with them, so now I guess I overcompensate to show that I am actually a kind person.

 

Oh, and more about my boss (the one I like), he winks at my constintly, and even fed me a roll today (we had take-out at the office); when I was on the phone with a customer and my mouth was open, he snuck up behind me and put the roll in my mouth.

[JayKay]

It is not ethical or professional to hit on your boss.

 

There's an old saying, "Don't sh*t where you eat"

 

Best to keep messy, emotional entanglements elsewhere. When things go wrong between you and someone you work with, it can get veeeeery uncomfortable indeed. Especially with you in a subordinate position.

 

It also makes you look flake-y. Women have had it hard enough, trying to get equal pay for equal work over the decades. If you come off as a fluffy, naive flirt it makes you look insecure and lacking polish.

 

You're not in college anymore. Try to remember that.

[Guest]

It is not ethical or professional to hit on your boss.

 

There's an old saying, "Don't sh*t where you eat"

 

Best to keep messy, emotional entanglements elsewhere. When things go wrong between you and someone you work with, it can get veeeeery uncomfortable indeed. Especially with you in a subordinate position.

 

It also makes you look flake-y. Women have had it hard enough, trying to get equal pay for equal work over the decades. If you come off as a fluffy, naive flirt it makes you look insecure and lacking polish.

 

You're not in college anymore. Try to remember that.

 

 

Okay, though I am naive, I have never intentionally flirted with anyone. Are you referring to my being kind and smiling at people as being flirty, or if I were to hit on my boss? I don't act any differently than any other woman that works there, other than the fact that I am the youngest person there, and I am usually pretty quite. They all know that I am far from "flake-y;" I am actually pretty intellectual, or so I am told. I just don't have much experience working or dating; I have spent the majority of my life engrossed in intellectual pursuits. Oh, and I am in college, I am just working full time to pay for college. I am getting my degree in philosophy, and all reason tells me that a relationship with my superior would be wrong, but I can't help liking him anyway.

[HokeyReligions]

I appreciate the candidness of your reply, but you could try to be a little less offensive in it. Though I am only twenty, I am perfectly level headed. I do have career aspirations, but not regarding this particular job. I do enjoy being there, but this is only to pay the bills; hopefully, I will have a "career" once I graduate college.

 

Perhaps I should have stated that on my original post: This job is only temporary, my future career lies elsewhere.

 

Every step you take is a career step - whether or not its in the field you are pursuing. Learning how to handle office politics and how to handle yourself in a business atmosphere is vital.

 

I didn't see anything offensive about Curmudgeon's post. I think it was spot-on.

 

If men [or women] speak or act inappropriately to and towards you, tell them you find it uncomfortable and that's not what you're there for. If they persist, report it to management. There are labor laws against it.

 

That's good advice. If you are unsure of your footing when dealing with this talk to someone in Human Resources and get whatever HR information the company has and read it and understand it. Don't look at the job as just a way to pay the bills for now - look at it as part of your education because it is.

[Guest]

I appreciate the candidness of your reply, but you could try to be a little less offensive in it. Though I am only twenty, I am perfectly level headed.

 

Taking offense at a perfectly harmless post might belie that.

 

Curmudgeon's advice was perfect. You might wish to follow it.

[elisabeth160]

Its wrong for thses guys to hit on you, but its ok for you to hit on your boss? If your worried about sexual harrasment it should be a 2way street. Keep your nose out of all of it. And if u decide 2 go for the boss, keep it outside of work only. Not feeding eachother in the ofice. You giving these guys the wrong signs. That its ok 2 hit on you.

Just don't do it to others if it can't be done to you.

[SoleMate]

I also agree with Curmudgeon's post, and would request that you clarify what offended you. There may be a miscommunication somewhere.

 

As a receptionist, you are definitely in a difficult position. Yes, you do need to be courteous and outgoing in a way that is different from a grump like me who can hide in her cubicle. And yes, plenty of men will misunderstand - on purpose - that your smiles and greetings are come-ons rather than simply business activities.

 

My best advice is to keep romance completely out of the office. I understand that you do not see this position as important - it's not really a step on your career ladder. From my perspective, it is. Every position you ever have is a step on the ladder. Sure, you may be heading to law school next year, and we may see you as an federal appeals court judge before Jessica Simpson loses her looks, but the experiences you have now will still be affecting you then. AND...the reputation you develop now will always be with you. The world is smaller than you may think.

[ImWithHim]

Don't fish in the company pond.

 

 

I completely agree with you. I dated a boss of mine several years ago. He was much older than I was, but we got along really well. It didn't last more than a couple months before things went south and we ended up being stuck working together when we could hardly speak to eachother. I eventually quit and last I heard he transfered to a new location because he had a relationship with another person there and it went south as well.

[JayKay]

Okay, though I am naive, I have never intentionally flirted with anyone. Are you referring to my being kind and smiling at people as being flirty, or if I were to hit on my boss? I don't act any differently than any other woman that works there, other than the fact that I am the youngest person there, and I am usually pretty quite. They all know that I am far from "flake-y;" I am actually pretty intellectual, or so I am told. I just don't have much experience working or dating; I have spent the majority of my life engrossed in intellectual pursuits. Oh, and I am in college, I am just working full time to pay for college. I am getting my degree in philosophy, and all reason tells me that a relationship with my superior would be wrong, but I can't help liking him anyway.

 

One of your original questions was whether it was ethical or not to hit on your boss. My answer was no, it's niether ethical nor professional. And while your behavior at work may be perfectly normal, you also need to set boundaries with people who say inappropriate things to you like "I had a really good dream about you last night." You can nip that right in the bud with a simple, "Please keep it to yourself" or even, "You know, I don't like joking around in that way. It makes me uncomfortable". It's a challenge working in an environment when you are young and inexperienced and attractive. I think the advice people are giving you is very good.

[Guest]

Its wrong for thses guys to hit on you, but its ok for you to hit on your boss? If your worried about sexual harrasment it should be a 2way street. Keep your nose out of all of it. And if u decide 2 go for the boss, keep it outside of work only. Not feeding eachother in the ofice. You giving these guys the wrong signs. That its ok 2 hit on you.

Just don't do it to others if it can't be done to you.

 

Okay, to clarify some things, I didn't "allow" him to feed me. I was on the phone, my back was turned to him, and he snuck up behind me and shoved it in my mouth when it was open; there wasn't much that I could do, seeing as how I I was in the middle of a conversation with an important customer. Also, I never meant to imply that it was wrong for an employee to make a pass at me; I meant that it is wrong for any married man to hit on any woman. I have never hit on my boss, and I won't until he is divorced.

 

I appreciate all of your replys, and I do thank you all for your candidness. It is just a difficult transisiton: college to life. I guess I am just a little confused right now, and I need people with more experience to talk to. I mean, has anyone actually had a relationship with his/her superior that actually worked out?

[Guest]

Okay, since a number of people have stated that they didn't understand what it was about Curmudgeon's comment that I found offensive, allow me to clarify:

 

Don't get your career aspirations, if you really have any

 

If I really have any. Of course I have career aspirations; just not at this particular job. Just because I am 20, not horrific looking, and nice, doesn't mean I am an ignorant flirt with no goals. Prehapes I just misunderstood; I completely appreciate and agree with the rest of the comment though.

 

I just have to say, I am really impressed with this site; people here seem as though they are actually interested in being helpful, rather than hurtful; I should sign up for an account. Again, thanks to everyone who has posted.

[Guest]

Hey girl. I know what you are going through...when I started my job I got hit on constently, by men AND women. Just ignore it...if you are a smiley and nice person, don't change yourself because you are affriad that you are giving off the wrong vibes; that is who you are. If they get too friendly, however, report them! You shouldn't have to change who you are to avoid getting harrassed.

 

Your boss fed you? Sounds like he may have a crush on you as well :-) I had a relationship with one of my co-workers (not my boss, I don't know if I would suggest having a relationship with your employer, as if things go badly, he could fire you). Anyway, we are married now (10 years), and quite happy. We even still work together. Despite what some of these other posters have said, 40% of Americans have had relationships with people they work with, and work is the #1 place to meet your significant other. And though it may not coinside with "work ethics," you need to consider your personal happiness too. You are only 20, and this is not a job that you intend on keeping, so I say go for it. I mean, even if it doesn't work out, at least you lived a little and gave it a go. You may find your lifes happiness being with this man, you may not. At least you will learn from this experience.

[ImWithHer]

Okay, since a number of people have stated that they didn't understand what it was about Curmudgeon's comment that I found offensive, allow me to clarify:

 

 

 

If I really have any. Of course I have career aspirations; just not at this particular job. Just because I am 20, not horrific looking, and nice, doesn't mean I am an ignorant flirt with no goals. Prehapes I just misunderstood; I completely appreciate and agree with the rest of the comment though.

 

I just have to say, I am really impressed with this site; people here seem as though they are actually interested in being helpful, rather than hurtful; I should sign up for an account. Again, thanks to everyone who has posted.

I don't think he was trying to imply that you were an "ignorant flirt with no goals". I think he just wanted to avoid assuming that you HAVE career aspirations at this particular job. You don't, so he was correct in saying that.

 

Having said that, I have to agree that dating your boss is not such a good idea. Even if the relationship works out, you WILL be know as "That girl who sleeps with the boss", and that will bring a lot of jealousy (and bad juju) down on you. No matter what you do from that point, nothing you earn will be deserved, your reputation will be trashed, and if the relationship goes bad, kiss your job goodbye. This will be good practice for when you land a job that your career aspirations are in, and believe me - you will be in this situation again (unless your careeer aspirations are to be a nun).

 

Good luck!

[Curmudgeon]

It doesn't matter what your future aspirations are and whether or not this position is integral to them. If it's a professional venue then you're getting off on the wrong foot.

 

By the way, you can't tell me you appreciate my candor out of one side of your mouth than tell me it's offensive out of the other.

 

You asked the question. I answered honestly and based upon decades of experience as a professional. If you didn't want to know or hear honest opinions you shouldn't have asked in the first place.

 

I'd hate to see you establish an unfortunate and self-destructive pattern, both personally and professionally.

 

That's all!

[No Stress Lady]

Okay, though I am naive, I have never intentionally flirted with anyone. Are you referring to my being kind and smiling at people as being flirty, or if I were to hit on my boss? I don't act any differently than any other woman that works there, other than the fact that I am the youngest person there, and I am usually pretty quite. They all know that I am far from "flake-y;" I am actually pretty intellectual, or so I am told. I just don't have much experience working or dating; I have spent the majority of my life engrossed in intellectual pursuits. Oh, and I am in college, I am just working full time to pay for college. I am getting my degree in philosophy, and all reason tells me that a relationship with my superior would be wrong, but I can't help liking him anyway.

 

I'm sure you've checked out the Other Man/Woman forum here - I'd be VERY careful about playing the game with your boss - you would be amazed how quickly word gets out and you will find yourself in an extremely awkward position if you get involved and your co-workers find out (and they will). Wat till you've left your job if he's so important and make VERY certain of what exactly his marital status really is!!!!

 

I understand how hard it is making that move from college to work - I had a similar problem with guys hitting on me all the time in my first job after university - the best way to deal with it is to ignore it - if it becomes a real problem make a formal complaint to your manager - most guys will back off if you tell them to and you're serious about it.

 

You've had some extremely good advice from all the people who have posted on this thread but maybe you'll just need to work things through in your own way - you'll learn good lessons whatever you do !!!!!!

[Guest]

It doesn't matter what your future aspirations are and whether or not this position is integral to them. If it's a professional venue then you're getting off on the wrong foot.

 

By the way, you can't tell me you appreciate my candor out of one side of your mouth than tell me it's offensive out of the other.

 

You asked the question. I answered honestly and based upon decades of experience as a professional. If you didn't want to know or hear honest opinions you shouldn't have asked in the first place.

 

I'd hate to see you establish an unfortunate and self-destructive pattern, both personally and professionally.

 

That's all!

 

Um, I do appreciate your candor; I just misunderstood one aspect of your comment, that's all.