resources for living w/ a liar?

[EndoftheRope]

I have posted before about some of the things going on in my marriage. We are now in counseling (now that *H* has decided there's a problem).

 

He has made some concessions; he is showering me with gifts, attention & loving gestures; yet I can't see it accomplishing anything because he still lies on things both big and little. This has been going on for years. He did finally admit yesterday in counseling that he has given me reason "in the past" not to trust him. But even yesterday, he was still lying to me.

 

This particular one is a stupid lie: I sent him an e-mail 10 days ago which has sat unopened at the top of his inbox. I know this because he gave me the password to his account. So there it sat for 9 days, still in boldface, yet he tells me he opened and read it! I have a yahoo account. I'm familiar with how they work. I have tried repeatedly, in various ways, and I can't get in and out of a message fast enough for it not to go plain-text on the subject line. There is no option I can find to keep your messages bold after being read (which is beside the point, because all his other messages go plain, anyway).

 

This is such a STUPID lie, and one he KNOWS I can check up on easily! Yet he continues to insist that somehow it happened.

 

He came home late one morning and told me two directly contradictory stories about where he was. I told him I would not tolerate anymore explanations of how I misheard (I've supposedly been mishearing him for YEARS, although I don't have this problem with anyone else.) So the new answer to everything is, "I don't know." Yesterday in counseling, he blamed the contradictory stories on being on TB medication at the time!

 

I could go on, but if there is anyone out there who lives with this, YOU ALREADY KNOW WHAT I'M GOING THROUGH!!! I feel like I'm blundering in the dark; like the ground is constantly shifting under my feet and upendng me; that I can't trust my own senses anymore.

 

I KNOW he's lying. I KNOW I'm not mishearing and misunderstanding as constantly as he says I am. And yet it makes you question your own sanity to have someone constantly tell you what you know you saw and heard isn't really so.

 

We have a large family. Separation will financially destroy us. I have done a lot of work on detaching already. I'm continuing to do so. I mostly definitely have got a life. But I need more help to stand strong against this.

 

PLEASE-- are there any resources on the web for living with a liar? An AA for chronic liars or something??? I have googled liar and living with a liar and am not finding anything. Is there a label I can stick on this behavior that might at least lead me to a resource that will help me cope with this? Someone here already suggested narcississtic personality disorder-- my first thought is that his real problem is the opposite, that he's so insecure.

 

And yes, I know I should leave him. It's just easier said than done after 17 years of marriage, many children, and a family that thinks the stars shine out of his rear. It is most definitely under consideration, despite that, but I need to know I've done what I can do to keep my children's family intact.

[Pink_Tulip]

I really don't know what to tell you. I seriously stay up at night sometimes feeling sad for you and KHLF.

 

If leaving isn't an option, the only thing I can think of is this. Don't focus on 'how to live with a liar,' focus on, how can *I* be happy with myself? Maybe join a womens group and make new friends, so you can spend weekends with them. Join a bowling league. Go back and take some college classes for fun, like pottery, or whatever interests you. Coach one of your kids' sports teams. Just take your focus OFF of him. That will just continue to drive you crazy, you know? The happier you are with YOUR life, your friends, your interests, the less you will care about his nonsense. Good luck.

[cynthia77]

Hi there. I have a very similar problem with my boyfriend. I'm 4 months pregnant with our first child and just recently found out that he's a compulsive liar. We're also going to counseling.

 

I'll ask my boyfriend what he had for lunch and he'll tell me he made himself peanut butter sandwiches after I left in the morning and that's all he ate. But, then I find a receipt for fast food he purchased that day. It's to the point of ridiculous. He also lied to me and pretended he was caught in a hurricane a few years ago (there was a documentary on TV about that very hurricane and I realized that his dates didn't add up). He would also pressure me to do sexual things I wasn't comfortable with (such as anal sex) and pretended he wanted me to be his 'first' and that he had never tried it before. I later found out by his ex that he did it several times with her and his ex before her. I can't even put into words how much that lie hurt. He admitted everything to me (after I call him out on it of course).

 

EndoftheRope - I have a suggestion for you. This has helped me out somewhat in the last month or so. When you ask your husband a question, stare at him right in the eyes. I can often tell if my boyfriend is lying if he looks away while answering. I can also tell when he's lying if he gets upset about the question and very defensive.

 

Also, ALWAYS call him out on his lies. He'll soon realize that he can't take advantage of you like he used to and will understand that telling the truth will be much easier for him than lying. You must however, make sure he realizes that he has a problem before any progress can be made. My boyfriend has bluntly admitted to our counsellor that he has a problem and has lied most of his life because he could get away with it. He claims that I'm the first person to ever call him out on his lies. So, do exactly that! Soon your husband will realize that the truth is always the best way to go!

 

Good luck!

[MazzyStar]

I could go on, but if there is anyone out there who lives with this, YOU ALREADY KNOW WHAT I'M GOING THROUGH!!! I feel like I'm blundering in the dark; like the ground is constantly shifting under my feet and upendng me; that I can't trust my own senses anymore.

 

I KNOW he's lying. I KNOW I'm not mishearing and misunderstanding as constantly as he says I am. And yet it makes you question your own sanity to have someone constantly tell you what you know you saw and heard isn't really so.

 

I know EXACTLY how you feel! OMG! And isnt it funny how we always misunderstand what he says? "I didnt say that" or "you must have misunderstood me" are the 2 biggest ones I always hear.

 

My H is a chronic, pathological liar. He is SO BAD, the he even believes his lies! We are going to counceling so hr can figure out why he does it. He knows he has a problem, and doesnt know why he does it...ALL THE TIME! But, he doesnt just lie to me, he lies to everyone!

 

IMO, I think they do it because #1 they are doing something wrong, and trying to cover their tracks. #2, they do these things wrong, because they lack self esteem. I just know that my H problem!

 

I have tried to lie to my H, and I cant do it! It just feels so wrong, its not my character. I get this sick twisted feeling in my stmoach, probably called human decency, and I cant just lie, to him or anyone.

 

They definatly need help. BUT, know it is not us! We are not the root of of our H problems. I think this is something that has stemmed from childhood and through 1 on 1 therapy (w/out me), hopefully my H can come to terms with what hos lies do to me, his family, his friends, and ultimatly himself.

 

I have been married for a long time too, I also love my husband VERY much, all though I ask myself why all the time.

 

I know he does not deserve me, I deserve better, (so do You!).

[EndoftheRope]

I really don't know what to tell you. I seriously stay up at night sometimes feeling sad for you and KHLF.

 

If leaving isn't an option, the only thing I can think of is this. Don't focus on 'how to live with a liar,' focus on, how can *I* be happy with myself? Maybe join a womens group and make new friends, so you can spend weekends with them. Join a bowling league. Go back and take some college classes for fun, like pottery, or whatever interests you. Coach one of your kids' sports teams. Just take your focus OFF of him. That will just continue to drive you crazy, you know? The happier you are with YOUR life, your friends, your interests, the less you will care about his nonsense. Good luck.

 

PT-- I sometimes have insomnia, and I hope I haven't shared it with you! I am truly sorry.

 

I told him I'm getting a new job where I work with ADULTS to get some ADULT interaction. The problem is, I currently earn very good money and can hardly afford to switch to anything else. I have wanted to join a fitness club, but we get back to time and money. I have no more interest in college-- I already have a master's degree.

 

I have considered joining a mom's group at church, but (I'm sure this sounds horrible) after his 'friendships' with women I've never heard of and his total denial that there's anything strange about it, I want to get involved in something that includes men. As far as I can tell, my husband has not a single empathetic bone in his body-- not even a smidgen of empathetic cartilege-- and 'doesn't get it' until it's done back to him. I'm certainly not planning on having an affair, but he needs to know, next time he decides to play cyber-footsies with the office tramp, that I have the option of striking up a fariendship, too. A shame his feet need to be held to the fire for him to think about how his actions affect the one he claims to love. I think there are some running clubs around here, and now that spring's coming, maybe I can get going with that.

 

Actually, in most ways, I'm very happy with my life. I guess it wouldn't show here, since this is where I come trying to cope with this aspect. But I already do have interests and keep myself busy with a twins forum, reading, playing harp, dealing with the kids, teaching lessons, writing-- I actually spent November doing NANOWRIMO, which is writing a 50,000 word novel.

 

It has all helped a lot, and maybe I just need to give it more time. But then another lie comes along or another incident with the 'friend,' and it just starts these 'cascading' thoughts all over again. Maybe I just need more practice at tuning him out, so to speak.

 

Believe it or not, just hearing it again is helpful.

 

Mazzy, I wouldn't say my husband is quite a chronic liar. I'd say his is entirely of the CYA variety. But if your husband has realized he has a problem, maybe mine will, too. I guess I do have some hope from the counselor, who, while not going after his lies with lightning bolts like *I* think he should is also getting a bit stern here and there and has insisted on some concessions from him.

 

Cynthia-- yes, I have also noticed that there's always a reason not to look at me when he's answering certain questions. I am starting to call him out on the lies. Take care of yourself and your baby. I had a pathological liar for a boyfriend once, and I have never once looked back about walking away from it.

[Kenyth]

The desire to avoid confrontation, even if you're right in your actions, can be the cause of being less than honest. I used to be a master of "Lying without speaking an untruth", to avoid a fight. Clever phrasing, dicing words, distraction, and omission were my game.

 

I finally realized it for the cowards way out that it was. Now, I'll happily tell you what I did with no intentional dishonesty. If you don't like it, oh well. I'll take that into consideration for the next time. If I feel what I did or how I handled things was the best I could manage, you'll just have to deal with not liking what I do. If I miss a detail now, it's because I simply forgot it or found it irrelavent. I can't say people find my new way of handling things any more pleasant, but they sure can't curse me for it. It may not be what they want to hear, but it's the honest answer.

 

Pissing someone off with the truth is always a better option than placating them with what they want to hear. Constantly placating someone with lies will lead to trust problems when you're eventually caught in discrepancies.

 

The only exception of course, are the questions like "Am I fat?". We all know the proper answer to questions like that!

[ehead]

This is unlikely, and I'm not sure why he would do this really (other than to highlight your message ... possibly), but you CAN mark a message as being "unread" even if you have read it. Marking it as unread will cause it to display in bold again. Just look at the options in the drop down box at the bottom of the main page. You have to check the message in question, then select "unread" from that box, and there you have it.

[EndoftheRope]

ehead, thank you for that information. It's one of the things I need to know. But you're right-- why in the world would he? And if he had, why wouldn't he just tell me so?

 

This is just it-- constant stories that sound a little weird, that could be, but when it takes this much effort to find out HOW his stories could be true, there unfortunately has to be something more going on than fate conspiring to make him look bad.

[Pink_Tulip]

Ya End, I totally get you. There have been so many lies, so what if he is telling the truth about an inocuous email. You'd much rather have heard the truth about the women.

 

And I also get that he could be one of these people who grew up in an abusive or controlling home where he was basically conditioned to lie to protect himself. But at what point do you, as an adult, start taking responsibility for yourself and recognizing the damage you are doing?

 

I really hope counseling works for you, and that some lightbulb goes off for him. But at the same time, just be happy and be prepared to have him let you down.

 

And about the hanging out with 'mixed company' thing. I totally understand where you are coming from. Maybe you know my story, maybe not. But let me tell you from my personal experience... In the state you are now, if you happen to meet a really great guy in this mixed company, even if you don't want or plan to, you could fall in love. And it will feel SO good in the beginning, and become SOOO painful very quickly. Honestly, more pain than you can imagine. Please be careful.

[Ladyjane14]

He's not an Adult Child of an Alcoholic, is he?

I've read that 'adult children' often lie when the truth would suit.

 

Here's a list: http://www.cyberus.ca/~rocksoft/teddysrule/chars/charactr.html

[reena]

I know how you feel- my husband is the exact same way. Tells me I am crazy and paranoid every time I find out he has lied yet again. Big or small,doesn't matter- and there have been some whoppers. For awhile it seemed as if all I was doing was tracking down the facts to prove to myself that I wasn't crazy.

Here's an example- he lies about money alot. A few months ago there was a substantial amount missing, and when pressed for answers he said it went to bills -I said nope, I paid the bills, try another one. after fighting for a few days he finally thought of a great one-he was planning on suprising me with some new applainces,and why did I always have to ruin everything...I told him to prove it,and he told me some story of how he had to put a downpayment on it at a certain store. I went to the store, no downpayments allowed, you pay outright only.. we walked all over that damn store looking for his name on something onhold maybe-nope!

So I talked to him and told him his story didn't check out and he said "oh, I meant this other store" I went there too, no such thing, he isn't on their computer as even holding anything. A few days later we went to that store together, and I walked to ther appliance dept. and he mumbled" why are you doing this to me" and I told him to show me which appliances he was looking at..and he was so lost..turned around a few times,and stuttered, something like this one, but maybe in that color..and when the sales guy came over,I asked him" Do you allow a lay-away plan, where say I could put down $400 down and then pay it offf in a few weeks?" the guy looked at me like I was nuts..and my husband turned beet red.

Seems like alot of trouble to just prove a point to my husband and to embarass him for constantly making me think I am crazy.. and I never did find out what he did with the money.Writing this out sounds so pathetic,and that example was tame compared to some of the other incidents.

why are we wasting our time with these liars?:rolleyes:forgot to add,"When Your Lover Is A Liar"..a book by Susan Forward( I think that's the author)..a good read.

[EndoftheRope]

He's not an Adult Child of an Alcoholic, is he?

I've read that 'adult children' often lie when the truth would suit.

 

Here's a list: http://www.cyberus.ca/~rocksoft/teddysrule/chars/charactr.html

 

 

YES YES YES YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Right down to hiding the whiskey in the toilet tank-- no joke!

 

If that's what I'm dealing with, maybe there's actually hope?? At least it explains how someone with so many good qualities can keep acting like such a complete and utter s***-forgive-my-language but there's just no other word.

 

Reena-- that's exactly it! I spend a lot of energy trying to just reassure myself *I* am not crazy! For years (on and off) I was actually writing down conversations on anything remotely questionable because I KNOW he'll tell me months later that he didn't actually say that. The latest is that he reassured me for months that he 'barely' sees his 'friend' anymore except passing in the hall. Then one day he let it slip that he 'barely sees her except when he stops by her desk to say hi.' Now, to me, 'stopping by her desk to say hi' means STOPPING by her desk TO SAY HI. He later insisted he'd said 'except when he passes her desk' which is unavoidable in his situation and a completely different thing. I recall my response to him word for word, and there's NO WAY I would have said those words in response to 'pass by.'

 

And of course, 'barely' means whatever he wants it to. Years ago, he was routinely quite late coming home from work, always with a trip to Ikea or his aunt or a nap (he worked nights and it was a long commute) to explain it. Only in the last year did it come out that he also had coffee with a female friend. 'Now and again' or 'on the rare occasion,' or whatever phrase he used first led me to believe it was a once every six months sort of deal-- not exactly worth getting upset about. But having learned my lesson, I pushed for a definition, which turned out to be WEEKLY. So there I am at home, dealing with 5, 6, 8 kids (depending on the year) worried out of my mind, literally even cleaning the house for the police's arrival at least once every six weeks, trying to deal with the KIDS constantly asking when he's coming home, and the JERK is enjoying COFFEE with some woman! Yeah, it's not sex by a long shot, but what a crappy thing to do. Like he'd think it was okay if I said, "Hey, stay with the kids while I go out for a beer with this guy you've never heard of."

 

And then of course, when I said that to him (forgive me, I'm blowing up) 'having coffee' changed day by day. To me, that clearly sounds like sitting down and having a coffee together. But the next day it was, "What's the big deal? I just bought a round of coffee, and other days they buy a round and give me one." Then the story changed to, All 'having coffee' means is he flipped the on switch on the coffee maker and as he passed by the nurse's station gave a general mention that the pot's on and you can help yourself!

[EndoftheRope]

But at what point do you, as an adult, start taking responsibility for yourself and recognizing the damage you are doing?

Exactly.

 

I really hope counseling works for you, and that some lightbulb goes off for him. But at the same time, just be happy and be prepared to have him let you down.

He seems in some ways very genuinely willing and yet unable... And I'm trying very hard to put myself in that mindset.

 

And about the hanging out with 'mixed company' thing. I totally understand where you are coming from. Maybe you know my story, maybe not. But let me tell you from my personal experience... In the state you are now, if you happen to meet a really great guy in this mixed company, even if you don't want or plan to, you could fall in love. And it will feel SO good in the beginning, and become SOOO painful very quickly. Honestly, more pain than you can imagine. Please be ca[reful.

 

Thanks for the warning. I'll go look for your posts when he's back to work. I generally don't go on this site when he's home. I'm glad you understand where I'm coming from, and that I'm not just some horrible slut with no morals. I keep telling myself it's only going to make it worse in the end, yet I'm becoming desperate for a normal relationship with a man. It's good to hear from other people to keep doing the right thing.

[Ladyjane14]

Do you feel like he fits the profile described in the link above? Because if so....I think there's probably a good chance that he'll do well in treatment.

 

This isn't a professional opinion, but I have to wonder if just identifying the problem isn't half the battle.

[EndoftheRope]

Do you feel like he fits the profile described in the link above? Because if so....I think there's probably a good chance that he'll do well in treatment.

 

This isn't a professional opinion, but I have to wonder if just identifying the problem isn't half the battle.

 

I haven't had time to go over it thoroughly, but some things really jump out, such as the taking responsibility at a young age. His dad was out at sea sometimes up to 10 months a year (which, since he wasn't living with him fulltime possibly nullified the worst of the effects of children of alcoholics??) but on the other hand, when he was 12, his mother had a nervous breakdown and he ended up pretty much running the family for many months, which, at the time (I'm just putting it together as I type) would have included two younger sisters, one very hard-headed even at that age from what I've heard, and a brand new baby sister just diagnosed with mental handicaps, and possibly his sick grandmother was still living with them. I think she was alive till he was 15 or 16. My gosh, as I put it all together it sounds like some writer going over the edge with the drama, doesn't it!

 

And yes, the need for approval would explain some of his behaviors.

 

I hope you are right that there is hope here. He really does have many good qualities, but this other garbage is really outweighing it.

[EndoftheRope]

Oh, yes, and the loyalty thing, too. It is literally UNREAL to me, the way he doesn't even blink at some of the crap his sister and aunt have done, and in fact DEFENDS them! His other sister (due to my own stupid mistake) found another forum where I was trying to understand this secret women friends issue. She read ALL of this bizarre stuff he's doing, and yet feels that I am the one with 'issues.' HUH?? Because I don't hide male friends and ask questions when my husband has secret female friends??? I feel like I'm living in Wonderland with this family.

[EndoftheRope]

KENYTH-- I meant to ask before, what made you realize the need to start telling the truth?

[Ladyjane14]

Again, this is a non-professional opinion...but I'd say the prognosis is pretty good. It seems to me, that if you can diagnosis the problem in counseling...it's going to open up a whole new world of empathy.

 

You'll be able to sympathize with him a little better. This will free up some of your love, which is bottled up by previous resentment. And he will be able to finally understand why he does what he does. That knowledge should improve his self-esteem, because he won't feel like he's a bad person anymore. He'll have something in front of him that he can "fix".

[Guest]

 

This particular one is a stupid lie: I sent him an e-mail 10 days ago which has sat unopened at the top of his inbox. I know this because he gave me the password to his account. So there it sat for 9 days, still in boldface, yet he tells me he opened and read it! I have a yahoo account. I'm familiar with how they work. I have tried repeatedly, in various ways, and I can't get in and out of a message fast enough for it not to go plain-text on the subject line. There is no option I can find to keep your messages bold after being read (which is beside the point, because all his other messages go plain, anyway).

 

This is such a STUPID lie, and one he KNOWS I can check up on easily! Yet he continues to insist that somehow it happened.

 

There used to be a way to make a read e-mail appear in bold.

I remember a "signal this message as unread" button in Yahoo mailboxes.

I don't know if it's still possible, I'm going to check right now.

But surely it had been possible for an amount of time.

Yahoo mail was the only e-mail boxes provider that I know of that ever offered this option.

 

Do your yahoo e-mail address end in the same way as your H?

I mean, do they both end as "yahoo.com"?

I am asking since I remeber that yahoo.com and yahoo.it mailboxes showed (sometimes) slightly different features.

[Adunaphel]

I just posted as "guest" by mistake.

(I can't visualize the post yet, but I guess it's just a matter of time).

 

I just wanted to let you know that my yahoo mailbox still displays the "signal as not read" option when you open an e-mail.

You click on it, the mail will appear in your mailbox highlighted in bold, as if it has never been read, and you get the Inbox(1) thing, as if it was a new mail.

 

When you open a new e-mail, the "signal as if not read" option is between the row of "delete"-"reply"-"forward"-"spam" boxes and the time and date of the e-mail. It's on yellow background.

[EndoftheRope]

You'll be able to sympathize with him a little better. This will free up some of your love, which is bottled up by previous resentment. And he will be able to finally understand why he does what he does. That knowledge should improve his self-esteem, because he won't feel like he's a bad person anymore. He'll have something in front of him that he can "fix".

 

Oh, yes! You are very perceptive! I can't tell you how much better I felt this morning after reading and thinking about your post and the link. One of the things that has left me so perplexed and half wondering if I AM crazy is that he really IS a decent person and in fact in many ways very kind, generous, and loving, and it's hard to see why a decent, moral, kind human being would lie; it's hard to believe he is, even when I KNOW he is. This would explain it. And this I can begin to forgive, although the behavior will remain between us if he can't change it.

 

Adunaphel, his account doesn't do that. He gave me the password months ago, and it never leaves things unmarked. Honestly, it really doesn't matter at this point. I know that any one or two or three things that I've doubted his word on might actually be true, but after years and years of it, there are just too many things that I need to do mental gymnastics on his behalf, in order to believe he's telling the truth, or continue believing he's the ONE person these odd hard-to-believe flukes just keep happening to.

 

I meant to ask earlier this morning-- are there any sort of forums or resources for spouses of adult children of alcoholics where I might look for more information? My sister said al-anon would cover this. Would that be the place to go?

[Ladyjane14]

I meant to ask earlier this morning-- are there any sort of forums or resources for spouses of adult children of alcoholics where I might look for more information? My sister said al-anon would cover this. Would that be the place to go?

 

I would think Al-Anon would be a good place to look for links.

I saw several different ACoA sites when I googled for the list. This one has forums, but I don't know anything more about it:

 

http://www.adultchildren.org/

[reena]

My sister-in-law also suggested al-anon. A few months ago, I had had enough, and called his family to ask if he always been a pathalogical liar,and the first thing she asked was if he was drinking. Seems alcoholism runs in his family. She suggested I go to a few of the meetings,and to at least deal with that part of the problem- there were other concerns,infidelity for one. Which from your other post, you are also dealing with. I did go to the meeting, and I can't seem to accept that this is a disease, and therefor should be pitied,and to not be accusatory towards him. Maybe I am so filled with anger after so many years of this same bs, that I am not even wanting to work this out with him anymore.. and it sounds like you are still hopeful. The searching for answers to make sense of it all, grasping onto a concept to explain his behavior- that was me also. I hope you and he can work this through this together, and that he realises how much you love him to want to see things from his perspective.

[EndoftheRope]

So the story started with him apparently not reading two e-mails. When I asked why not, he said he had. When I asked why they were still in bold, he said he didn't know. Then he said he went in and out so fast that it didn't change the typeface to 'read.' That's a physical impossibility.

 

He could tell me what the e-mail with the subject line "Reminder" was about, a lucky guess I think, but gave only a vague idea of the other, with no recollection at all that I'd talked about either his 'friend' at work or someone I went to high school with who was a BIG issue with him. Even when I asked him to tell me either of the names I'd mentioned in the e-mail, he had no idea. Given what a big issue these two names have been, I find it just about impossible to believe he couldn't remember either of them being mentioned.

 

Then, lo and behold, someone mentions here that you can mark a message as unread and suddenly yesterday that's his story. Hmmmm.... think somehow or other he's coming here? Everyone say HI ANDREW!!!!

 

I asked why he didn't just tell me to begin with that he marked it as unread. Some vague answer that it would have been insulting to me. I asked why he's never marked any other messages as unread. He asked how I know he doesn't-- well, I know because the top of his inbox is always bold, he checks his mail and they go plaintype. Never once has one remained in his inbox bold after the others have been checked. In addition, why in the world would you go to the effort of marking a one-line e-mail ("remember our counseling appointment tomorrow") as unread? That just doesn't even make sense.

 

I gave the counselor the list of characteristics of ACoA and requested that we start talking about it next week. Maybe I'm seeing what I want to, but I thought I saw a lightbulb moment in his eyes, too. On the way home, I asked if his dad's dad also drank. Apparently yes, quite heavily, and suddenly some of his aunt's (dad's sister) inexplicable behavior makes sense, too, in light of those characteristics of ACoA.

 

The good news is that within half an hour of getting home, he found an al-anon group for himself. I'll be satisfied when he actually goes to a few meetings.

 

And he admitted that he lied, although he said he lied about not knowing how the e-mail was still in bold, and I believe he lied about opening it at all. So do I take an admission that he DID lie (first time he's EVER admitted it) as progress, or was he just so caught in his own web he had no choice? A friend says making the first admission that he DOES lie is a huge step forward. Any opinions on that?

 

To whoever suggested When Your Lover is a Liar, I've seen and read bits of the book before, but on your suggestion I went and bought it yesterday and got quite a bit read. Of the lying Techniques #1-9, at least 8 have been used on me, many frequently. Very enlightening. And almost scary to have an author who's never met my husband have him pegged so perfectly.

 

And me, too-- part of the reason I am struggling for my sanity is because lying is so totally foreign to my character that I just almost literally can't believe someone is doing it to me, even as I watch him do it!

[Ladyjane14]

So do I take an admission that he DID lie (first time he's EVER admitted it) as progress, or was he just so caught in his own web he had no choice? A friend says making the first admission that he DOES lie is a huge step forward. Any opinions on that?

 

Well, Rome wasn't built in a day, right?

 

If he's NEVER admitted a lie before at all, then I'd probably view my cup as half full if I were you. Why not?

 

He's not exactly owning it yet, but maybe he's sneaking up on it...like dangling your toes in the pool in order to check the temperature. I kind of doubt he's ready to 'dive in', but hey...if he's phobic of the water then every little bit counts.