Another Love but not IN Love Story

[Mz. Pixie]

As always, LJ, great post!

 

I certainly do not want DD to get in the position of walking on eggshells afraid to do any little thing that might push his wife away. Because in all reality- she really can't go anywhere at this time.

[DesperateDad]

Thanks again, LJ and Mz. P. I AM really thinking about things now. Actually, I'm thinking but putting off any decision making for a while.

 

I've gotten conciliatory signals lately from my wife. Last night she kept touching me and just looking in my eyes. I asked her a couple of times if everything was okay and she said, yes, and do I mind (if she put her hand on my arm or shoulder). I don't know.

 

It keeps sticking in my mind that I have to be able to trust that she's not going to run off (or attempt to give me the boot again) if she becomes disenchanted with our relationship again or if someone else comes along that she's attracted to. She's mentioned that the reason why she hasn't lost weight was that she was afraid she would just leave me when she did. I think that's fogtalk, but still, how do I know?

 

I honestly don't know what she's thinking right now, but I'm beginning to get some ideas of what I can and can't live with. I absolutely won't live with any competition at all in terms of affection. I'm sure there are plenty of intelligent, passionate, beautiful women out there who wouldn't put 'friendships' above their relationship with me.

 

At the same time, I'm thinking about how I miss having romance, having dates and having someone around who loves to talk to me and is adventurous. I miss dreaming together. I'm confused about what I want now, too.

 

Yes, I love my wife and I know that it's better for the children for us to work things out. I'll do that, but I can't help but wonder now after all that's happened. What if...

[Mz. Pixie]

She's mentioned that the reason why she hasn't lost weight was that she was afraid she would just leave me when she did.

.

 

WHAT? So in other words- you love me even when I'm fat so I can stay fat and be with you??

 

Gee, that must make your spouse feel good to hear that!

 

DD- be VERY CAREFUL about how vulnerable you are right now. That kind of thinking will get you in nothing but trouble. Your love bank is at zero right now because of what she's been doing, and that's the very thing that can get you into trouble!

[DesperateDad]

You're right, Mz. P. Maybe it just irks me that she doesn't seem to have cared much about herself for several years and now that she's started to care again (new clothes, hairdo, etc), I've felt like she was doing it for everybody but me. Yeah, it pisses me off and there's no way I'm going to hang out here for her to get herself in shape just to find some other guy.

 

My attraction to other women has mostly been just a physical attraction until the last year or so. That's when I started really feeling a lack of emotional and mental intimacy, I guess. That's also when I had my affair.

 

I know I'm in a precarious position here. I'm trying to be cool, but sometimes I'm split between 36 and 26, too. I guess MLC's are contagious!

[Gunny376]

MP is absolutely correct, I went through a very similar situation that you describe in this thread ~ (except I never had an affair ~ it was "Ms Thang" doing her thang!") and I came stumbling and fumbling out of at 12 yerar marraige ~ after a year long separation.

 

At the time I was thinking ~ "Cool! I've done all I could do ~ did all I knew to do ~ gave it 150% ~ that's over ~ time to move on ~ move forward. Man ~ ! Was that every a mistake ~ I was emotionally bankruput ~ and didn't recognize it at the time ~ and re-bounded with another woman who was coming out of her marriage of 10 years. Chirs Rock said it best ~ "Relationships? Easy to get into ~ hard to maintain ~ hard to get out of!"

 

One of the phenomenome that I and a buddy of mine are runnning into ~ is that he and I want to go out, make friends, etc. and we're upfront about the fact that we're not looking for relationships, a steady girlfriend, etc ~ but it seems the women we're taking (from all middle to upper social economic class ~ so its not that they're looking for a meal ticket?) by the second date they're laying claims on us as being their stedy boy firends! What's up with that ~! I mean we're literarlly telling them up front ~ we just want to be friends ~ and we've got other things we're into ~ and we really don't have the time for a "relationship". But these women act as though we never told them that up-front.

 

The thing that you've got to be careful about coming out of a long term relationship ~ that you don't always recognize is that old Mr. Ego took quite a beating ~ much worse than you realized until you get to the otherside of it all. You've spent some time ~ for some of us years ~ with the ex telling us and feeding us a line of BS, and we tend to want to go out and find someone that will re-validate ourselves as human beings and as men ~ and I'm talking across the spectrum ~ not just in matters of physical intimacy. Its the emotional equvalent of experiencing a "near-death" experiece and you walk away not believing that you walked away from it and survived it! You just stand around in freaking awe! Dropped jaw and all ~ but it takes not months, but years to get there ~ (a little post traumatic stress syndrone kicking in there I suspect)

 

The thing that threw me under the bus ~ and really put an azz whopping on my self esteem ~ aside from the love of my life ~ my wife ~ cheating on me with much younger men ~ was that ~ well lets just say its like one of those multipile choice tests, where "D" covers "all of the above!" I mean it wasn't like I was some couch potato ~ out of shape ~ I was a United States Marine and had just came off my second tour of the Drill Field at Parris Island. I was 6'1" and weighed in at a lean 190 tp 195 and ran six miles every day ~ and went to the gym a minimum of four times a week. I ran a first class Marine Corps Physical Fitness Test ~ with a run time of about 19 to 20 minutes for three miles. Maxed the pulls ups and sit ups, had the six pack and then some.

 

In hindsight ~ she was putting me down ~ running me down ~ to justify her issues and her shortcomings ~ because she couldn't admitt her own. Granted, in hindsight I married in the pit of passion ~ and post adolescent lust ~ and two more incompatable people perhaps there never were. Me? I'm a scholar ~ I pursue knowledge for knowledge sake. She was an 8th grade high school drop out. She told me that, I would go to school, class, college for the rest of my life ~ and she's right. There's ALWAYS something to learn ~ to grow from ~ and that's what I'm doing with my life now ~ now that I have the freedom to do it and pursue it!.

 

When I was married ~ and had her and a family ~ I was in "provider" mode, and I fully subscribed to one of the 14 basic leadership traits ~ "Identify your weakness ~ and seek self improvement!" Constantly ~ perpetually/! Me? I'm a good friend, a good man, a good person ~ with values, morals, and ethics ~ my honor means all to me! My integrity is just more than being honorable ~ it is my honor. I am also your worse enemy! I am one ~ that will NOT stand idly by and watch someone abuse someone less fortunate, less skilled, less abled, weak by birth, elder, female!

 

I tell you this ~ because you need to hear this ~ despite a momement of weakness ~ you ARE a good and honorable man! You are fighting the good fight! You are RIGHTEOUS in staying there for your wife and for your children. As hard as that is ~ and man, I know your pain ~ I truly do ~ been there, done that ~ got the scars upon my heart and mind to prove it!

 

I realize that some of my posts, previously seem to the contrary ~ but you've got to understand ~ that there are about sixteen years between where you're at ~ and where I'm at! I WAY the otherside ~ of where your at ~ but where your at is familiar ground, I've been there ~ and its not pretty ~ and its not fun! Its not a good place to be! Its HARD, all day HARD, picking cotton for .50 a bagfull hard! And that bag strecthes from Alabama to the Rio Grande!

 

Word Up! Don't get emotionally involved ~ and I don't give a flying goats azz how lonely, hard up, deperate you are ~ with ANYONE for at least one year after the ink is dried on the dotted line ~ preferablly two years~!

 

What you're going through is the emotional equivalent of hitting a semi head on! You're going to need some heart monitors ~ and some Iv's and some blood transfussions! You're in emotional ICU, and the prognoiss ain't looking too pretty!

 

God bless, Bro!

 

Gunny

[CryingCanuck]

Originally I read a few of your post and to be frank if I may, I thought you were bitter and somewhat of a redneck inyour attitude towards the other sex, but this last post made by you changes that perspective of you.

 

I'm in the same situation as many here, trying to heal and move on. It's so damn hard, especially when it was the very last thing you ever wanted.

I have to eventually accept totally, that my W has moved on, I'm not in her heart and I'll never be again.

 

We had 23 years, all in all pretty good in my estimation but the scars that have been left right now are so damn painful and they are there for everyone to see.

 

You're bang on about taking a very long time to recover, I wonder if I ever will. Somedays I wake with my W on my mind and I'm exausted,

 

I knew that the best thing for me was to try to take better care of myself, get a lot of exercise and make my body tired and sore and it would help relieve a lot of the stress that I'm feeling but I ignored it. I thought I was letting go but in reality I was simply expressing my anger and not really letting go.

 

Now I have to totally let go, let go to the point that I no longer think about my W, no longer think about the marriage that failed and no longer wish for something different.

 

It's going to be years Man I know it and have to face up to it.

I liked your last post very much, gave me a lot to think about.

[DesperateDad]

Gunny, thanks for the heartfelt advice. I really appreciate it. My own military experience has served me well in life, too (army weekend warrior, 90-95).

 

It blows me away that I'm in good shape and look ten years younger than I am and yet that doesn't seem to count for anything, either. I'm not saying that physical appearance should be the only factor in a relationship, but it counts that we care about ourselves.

 

I think there IS an element of projection in my situation, too. She has found fault in just about everything I do at one time or another and I've just been stumped by the whole thing. Can't I do anything right?

 

You are SO right about the ego thing. I've felt beaten down for a long time. When I had my affair (I have to keep saying we didn't actually have sex), it was with a passionate, sexy 21yo. It was a huge boost to my ego and in a way it made me more bitter and puzzled about things with my wife. Why couldn't she see the same things in me that this young woman did?

 

The funniest thing was that she reminded me of how my wife used to be when we were dating and first married! God, I miss that passion. Not just for sex, but for life. She had so much joy in talking about hopes and dreams and ideas. It was awesome.

 

I know I have to steer clear of any kind of emotional entanglements now and until things have been fully resolved. This limbo sucks. I know you guys all know what I'm going through. It's pretty stable right now, but not a good place to be.

 

Thanks again for validating that I'm doing the right thing here. I really do want to give it a try for the kids' sake especially, but also for all of the good times we've had. I think it will end up being a terrible mistake for my wife, but I know I can't stop her.

[dgiirl]

DD, what you wrote reminded me of an Ophra episode. She once had a show on married men and why they cheat. She made a point that a lot of them cheated because of the way the other woman made them FEEL. It really didnt have anything to do with the other woman herself, but because she made him feel good, attractive, sexy, it boosted his ego and he became infatuated with her. I think 90% of the time, this is why people (irregardless of gender) cheat. They're in a relationship and their needs are not being met. Both partners are starting to feel disconnected from one another and start to become lonely. Then, all of a sudden, this new person walks into their life and gives them the attention they so long forgot about. It wakes that person up and they realize how sad and lonely they were in their relationship. It is a moment of weakness and one thing leads to another. I completely empathize how it can happen, and one can learn to recognize the signs before you go down that road. Since you've had an affair, you now know where those giddy feelings towards someone else will take you, and you now know how much pain that will cause your SO, so you can now prevent anything like that happening again. Making mistakes doesnt make us a bad person, it's what we do with those mistakes that determines if we're good or not. By your honesty and the way you write, I think you know what you did was wrong and you've probably made a promise to yourself to never walk that road again? You cannot keep beating yourself up because of one mistake, but be proud of yourself for how you're resolving those mistakes.

 

Right now, it seems your wife might be slowly coming out of the fog. You need to pay attention to how remorseful she is once she realizes the things she's done. If it doesnt hit her, if she doesnt realize that what she did was wrong, if she doesnt promise to you and herself to never let herself become that weak again, then I would get out of the relationship.

 

I believe there are two types of cheaters, the one time offender, and the repeat offender. The one time offender will be truely remorseful and will learn and pay attention to those warning signs and never walk down that road again. The repeat offender simply doesnt care. It's hard to know which person you're dealing with because they both say they're sorry and it'll never happen again, so you have to pay attention to your gut feeling and their actions.

[Gunny376]

Originally I read a few of your post and to be frank if I may, I thought you were bitter and somewhat of a redneck inyour attitude towards the other sex, but this last post made by you changes that perspective of you.

 

I'm in the same situation as many here, trying to heal and move on. It's so damn hard, especially when it was the very last thing you ever wanted.

I have to eventually accept totally, that my W has moved on, I'm not in her heart and I'll never be again.

 

We had 23 years, all in all pretty good in my estimation but the scars that have been left right now are so damn painful and they are there for everyone to see.

 

You're bang on about taking a very long time to recover, I wonder if I ever will. Somedays I wake with my W on my mind and I'm exausted,

 

I knew that the best thing for me was to try to take better care of myself, get a lot of exercise and make my body tired and sore and it would help relieve a lot of the stress that I'm feeling but I ignored it. I thought I was letting go but in reality I was simply expressing my anger and not really letting go.

 

Now I have to totally let go, let go to the point that I no longer think about my W, no longer think about the marriage that failed and no longer wish for something different.

 

It's going to be years Man I know it and have to face up to it.

I liked your last post very much, gave me a lot to think about.

 

Hey Bro! Been thinking about what you posted all day ~ while at work. And, to tell the truth ~ well I get this thread hit a raw nerve, and then got a little alcohol and sea salt rubbed in for good measure. And, if you go back to my original post ~ I was bitter ~ and had a staunch attitude toward the oppossite sex ~ gender. And, I guess I got back on that old emotional roller coaster ~ that I SWORE I'd never get back on and ride again ~ and for me? Its been sixteen long damn years.

 

When Prince Albert died ~ back in the 1800's ~ Queen Elizabeth wore mouring clothes (black) and mourned his death for 30 years. I'm not mourning my marriage ~ I'm not ~ I'm very much moving on, and literally workling on myself, my attitude, my perspective, etc every single day. But, your right ~ it does take years ~ I read where it takes a minimum of three years ~ and speaking from hindsight ~ experience ~ the last thing any divorce person needs to do is start dating again until they've got it together ~ mentally, spiritually, emotiionally, and most definately financailly.

 

Me? I re-bound ~ and as I said I thought it was cool at the time ~ because the exW and I had been separated (literally on different parts of the planet) for a year. But, I look back on it ~ and I missed out on one Hell of a great opportunity ` and it was very much a window of opportunity ~ it was during my last four years of my carrer in the Marines ~ and what I should have done ~ and wished that I had of done was to move back into the barracks, ate in the chowhall (meals $1.50 to $3.00 a piece) and took off every three months , and spent all of my leave (vacation) coming down to Bama to spend time and see my kids ~ but I didn't because I just had to have me a GF.

 

But, its hard, ( I know ~ I'm preaching to the choir here) coming from a wife and family for 12 years to living in a barracks ~ even if it a single room with a bath on the side. Its all day ~ hard.

 

And, so the delimia is either that ~ or get back out there in it ~ the trouble is ~ most aren't ready to get back out there in it? You just don't walk away from that massive train wreck like you fell off of your bike.

 

I've done a lot of reading and research on the subject of men, women, marriage, relationship ~ an I'm by far the duty expert ~ in as a matter of fact ~ I'm still going over ~ trying to find the answers to the questions and the solutions to the problems. Answers and solutions that in all honesty, I probally will never find.

 

I belong to a couple of other sites ~ and I've done a lot of reading ~ and I feel that the number #1 deal breaker ~ is just the day to day. We're all vicitims of modern day life, advertisting, the consumer credit industry, etc.

 

 

It use to be back in the day that before a man could even think about going out and finding a wife, he had to finish his education as far as he could take it, go out and find a trade, apprentice himself in it, become good at it (minimum of two to three years) and then master it (about 10 years), and put money back to provide for a house, furnish it, etc, prove himself to be a man of characther, substance, etc, that he had morals, values, ethics, that he wasn't a drunk, a gambler, a womanizer ~ and then he had to go and find a woman that he was interested in ~ who was interested in him ~ court her ~ ask her to marry her ~ and then he had to ask the father for permission to marry her ~ not because as many do it today ~ out of respect ~ but because if the marriage didn't work out ~ the daughter along with any children were going to come back to his house ~ AND became his responsibility to house, clothe, feed, and educate.

 

Nowdays, a lot of couples start out with nothing ~ have nothing ~ and then the DH busts his back trying to climb the socail ~ economic ladder, trying to be a good provider to his DW and children ~maybe go back to school to learn a new trade ~ or earn a degee. That's what I was trying t do ~ with a wife and three children ~ in the Marine Corps trying to make Warrant Officer, ~ Commissioned officer ~ (hard enough to do single ~ let alone married with children) , while providing the modern day conviences of life ~ aka "trying to have something" Before you know it, you get caught up in the day to day ~ the stress from work starts piling up, the wife is up to her neck in laundry, cleaning, children, school, etc. Well,...............as they say in the Corps, "When your up to your ass in alligators and snakes its Hell trying to remmeber that when you first started out your goal was to drain the damn sawmp!"

 

Then comes along ~ "easy credit" and before you can say don't do it ~ you've got yourself a drawerfull of bills, and people you don't even know calling you on the phone and sending you mail.

 

Then you're sitting around one day, the wife is gone ~ took the kids ~ the movers have come and gone ~ and you're sitting in an empty house with an Elvis decanter of Jim Beam listening to George Jones ~ and that's the only three left to talk with ~ and that understands. It doesn't take long to figure out if you keep going that route ~ it won't be long before you're choking down on a Smith and Wesson 9mm. Me? I allowed myself ~ one week ~ I actually circled a date on the calendar with a red marker ~ took off for a week and got stupid drunk. Then I got busy ~ finding ways to cope and manage in more positive ways. Mainly running and going to the gym. Sure, it was subsistution ~ but it was a positive form of it!

 

Thing is ~ little did ~ I know that I hadn't seen nothing yet. I went into the Marine Corps 18 days out of HS, and did my "20". Got, out went to college ~ and actually thought that would add up to something ~ ended up doing a job that I could have gotten without a college degree. And, know a lot of folks in the same position. When I retired from the Corps ~ I was living the Bruce Springstein song "Born In The USA" went a couple of rounds more with the liquour bottle. I didn't realize, didn't comprehend, didn't have it explained to me that I had been heavily institutionalized ~ just like someone who had been shipped off to prison for 20 years, ~ except I had gone into the military. I was a "Gunny" in the Marines ~ an E7 ~ and that's is NOT the same as being an E7 in the Air Force or Army.

I won't get into all of that ~ but overnight ~ I went from being a hero to a zero ~ in civilian life.

 

But, I digresss. DD ~ truth is ~ even with my wife cheating ~ I would have hung in there for my children. I would have probally been the one that walked out ~ filed for divorce ~ but I would have hung in there for my children. And, you've got six of them! Man! I've been there! It ain't fun! And, it ain't pretty! I use to wake up at night ~ when I was going through it ~ and just sit in the darkness of my living room, no tv, no radio, no nothing, and just stare at the wall and generally think ~ WTF! Un-fE#GRTGG beliveable!"

 

I got to where I could get by on six hours sleep a night ~ and then go in and catch grief from my superiors ~ and their standards were simple ~ perfection. No "ifs" no "butts" No, "ands" No "Yea, butts"

 

I'm not going to parade all of what I went through in the MC, but that marriage ~ that divorce ~ was a Mother_____________! I've read that the man comes out on top ~ financially! Well that's not been my experience. I've also read where a man that has to pay child support and alimony can expect to have half of his earning go toward such ~ and that's after ~ tax ~ not pre-tax.

 

There IS life after divorce!

 

To DD, I sense that a lot of your problems are just the day to day of being married with six children, bills, expenses, stresses. etc thus I guide you for your consideration this link: http://cheapskatemonthly.com/

[Mz. Pixie]

Why couldn't she see the same things in me that this young woman did?

 

Wow, the answer is pretty simple, DD. The reason this young woman saw these things- everything was brand new with her. There was no history. She never had to see you unshaven in the morning with stanky morning breath in your underwear scratching your pubes! She never had to nurse you to wellness when you had the stomach flu or a more serious illness. She never had to sit down over a stack of bills that cannot be paid and wonder which ones you can skip this month. She never sat up with sick kids with you. She never had to see you act embarrassing or have a horrible fight with you over something stupid. She only got to see the GOOD, none of the bad- which is why it was so easy for her to be "fresh and exciting and passionate" That, and her age.

 

You're frustated and I understand. But these kind of thoughts will only lead you down that path again. Instead, focus on your children right now and your marriage- however hard that may be right now.

[Ladyjane14]

Lovely post, Pix.

 

'Coulda, shoulda, woulda'....just sap a person's positive energy. The best bet is to deal with the problem in front of you.

[DesperateDad]

Thanks to everyone for their advice. I've been reading, but haven't had a chance to post a reply for a bit.

 

We're still holding steady and avoided a potential argument over the weekend. Things seem to be improving in terms of avoiding the same arguments that we've been having. I'm thinking a lot about what you have all been saying and I'm still going to keep working on my marriage and myself and avoiding temptation. I'll try to post more later.

[Love Hurts]

Life has a way of swallowing us up. Kids, job, education, bills, house, repairs, and all the stuff each of us requires as well as the stuff we think we need to be happier.

 

You two lost each other along time ago..... you with work and school and getting that dollar to fullfill dreams for all. Your wife lost you to that world and took on the new life of mom. Mom with all that entails, so many children. So much responsibility. The two of you have lived in seperate worlds for a very long time.

 

The gulf widened each year. Until you can't seem to relate to each other for the distance is to great.

 

You two almost have to restart from square one. Impossible as it sounds. You need to date her. Romance her.... do all the things you did to win her love from the begining. Re marrie her. Take a honeymoon. Just start all over....

 

I do believe you two have a chance.... life did this.... life can turn around and make things right and new.

 

When the relationship was new. You would make time for her. You would find a way. The things each of you did in the state of newness of relationship are missing.

 

Conversation, phone calls from work. Send flowers. Come home unexpected.

Arrange for a sitter for the kids take a weekend get away.

Fall in love with her first all over again and she will respond..

( just m opinion) .

 

These things will cost money too.... there are ways to do things on a budget. Cut the cost of something you do each day in your travels to and from. A few dollars a day every day add up at the end of the month.

Redirect the money into your new plight in life.

Clip coupons from the entertainment books and get a second entr'ee free or half off. Bed and breakfast are cute cozy little weekend get aways.

 

When is the last time you two went shopping together? Go to rummage sales and flea markets. They are fun, you are together and one mans junk is another mans gold.

 

The one I like best is a home prodject. Somethng the entire family can get involved in. Build a new deck or put a pool in or a fish pond. The wife and kids can help with digging arranging rocks and flowers, buying fish for it and you can all sit back and enjoy a family prodject.

 

Getting it together again will take some work and effort..... I do belive you both can work this out..

 

This is a new day and you will have to put yourself last for a while.

Until you have won her heart and then she will put you first.

 

Is it worth it?

 

Cause it's alot of work from here.... love worth having is love worth saving and working for.

 

God Bless

[DesperateDad]

Life has a way of swallowing us up. Kids, job, education, bills, house, repairs, and all the stuff each of us requires as well as the stuff we think we need to be happier.

 

This is so true. It's been on my mind the most lately and I'm frankly just getting tired. I'm still hanging in there and trying to not do any harm to our relationship, but it's so hard to be loving when you're not loved.

 

I'm tired of the little offensive comments all the time that I just have to accept. I'm tired of being in a limbo. I know it's only been about two months now, but it feels like forever.

 

I know I need to focus more on myself, but it's hard because we don't have much money to spare and I seem to be spending all of my time outside of work taking care of the kids so she can have a break and do her own things. It's almost like she's working first shift and I'm working second.

 

She may not realize it but I DO know how she feels about losing her identity. I feel like I'm burying myself under the 'work' me and the 'dad' me. Maybe that's why I haven't had much time or energy for the 'husband' me. I love my kids more than anything, but I feel like I need a break, too.

[Ladyjane14]

.....and I'm frankly just getting tired. I'm still hanging in there and trying to not do any harm to our relationship, but it's so hard to be loving when you're not loved.

 

I'm tired of the little offensive comments all the time that I just have to accept. I'm tired of being in a limbo. I know it's only been about two months now, but it feels like forever.

 

That's your LoveBank going into the 'red'.

If your wife isn't making contributions, you've got to take extra good care of yourself.

 

You might not have alot of money to get out and do things.... but it's still important that you take some time for YOU. An hour of solitude soaking in the bathtub and reading a book, isn't just for Mom. Dad needs some quiet time too.

 

So, don't take on ALL the childrearing duties when you get home. Half is fair. If you need to set some boundaries, set them. You'll run out of gas if you don't.

[DesperateDad]

Yes, it feels like my life is imploding in slow motion. I'm heading into a disciplinary meeting at work over my poor performance lately. I can't find much energy to really give a s***, though. I'm cool with my boss and he knows what I'm going through right now, but feels like he has to do something because it's his job. I understand, but I'm getting awfully tired of understanding everything.

 

I did go to individual counseling yesterday for the first time and came out feeling at least a little better. Nothing much yet but me telling my story, but it's nice to tell it to a professional who's there just to help ME. Yes, dammit, I need some attention! LOL.

 

I had an interesting chat with my W yesterday and some things kind of struck me. She has always doubted that I felt the same way about her as she felt about me. She says that when she suspected my affair it only confirmed things for her. I did explain that I'd been drinking a lot and getting virtually no attention from her. That's not an excuse, BTW. I know it was wrong.

 

Anyway, this all boils down to her being hurt by me and not trusting me any more. She doesn't believe that I really love her. I've been thinking a lot about what she said and what she has said over the years and there is a thread of truth to it. I wasn't as madly in love with her as she was with me.

 

It's true that I loved her then and still do now, in fact, more than I did when we got married. I knew that she wasn't 100% of everything I wanted, but I don't think that anybody COULD be 100% perfect. She was my best friend and lover and someone I could tell anything to, someone I had fun with and who made me feel good every time I was with her. This was enough for me.

 

I still don't know where things are going. I'm willing to make a go of it if she decides to, but she's still adamant about not wanting to even try to reconcile. I'm sticking with Plan A for now and trying to get my own act cleaned up.

[dgiirl]

DD, I think this is a very good thing. Once you understand why people act the way they are, it's easier to work on the problem. You can start to have empathy for the other person. I would continue doing what you are doing. Give her some time to breath and reflect, but at the same time, make sure she continues to respect you (ie no flaunting om in your face). Keep going to therapy and dont pressure her into reconciling. Let her watch you, let her see the changes, and let her decide if she wants to come back or not.

[DesperateDad]

Thanks, dgiirl. My problems at work really have been an eye-opener, too. I know I've got lingering issues with depression that have never gone away completely. I do pretty well when things are going well, but it usually doesn't take much at all to put me down in the dumps. I'm actually amazed I've gotten through the last couple of months so well.

 

I really have to think about what makes me happy and what kind of satisfaction I'm getting out of life.

[Ladyjane14]

I haven't gone too far in my summer plans. I managed to pinch a nerve in my neck or something, so I've been lurking and posting occasionally on a current events thread. I'm starting to feel better but it's the second time in the last six weeks that I've been laid up with it.

 

Anyway, it looks like you're really feeling the strain. So, I thought maybe I'd pop in and remind you to keep your eye on the prize. It takes a good long while to heal a marriage, most often it takes about two years. And since you're still not getting a whole lot of effort from your wife, your situation is particularly draining.

 

You can't afford to indulge in any stinkin' thinkin' though. You've got the welfare of SIX children to think about. I can tell you from experience, that the internal struggle for optimism is always difficult when you're under pressure. But difficult or no.... you've got to address your inner doubt with alacrity. It's akin to having two different voices inside, one is a pessimist, one an optimist. Those two voices are in conflict. You can't ignore the pessimist, but you can't indulge him either. Better to allow your inner optimist to defeat him in debate.

 

So.... feel free to talk to yourself. It doesn't make you crazy.

 

You've got alot on your plate, and you need to take your time. It's great to Plan A, and really.... I think you should give it at least 6 months. But that doesn't mean that you should become a servant to the marriage either. So, set some reasonable boundaries if you need to, lest you wear yourself completely out.

[DesperateDad]

Good to hear from you, LJ. I'm sorry to hear about the injury. I know that sucks!

 

Part of the problem with my marriage has been my depression and anxiety over the years. I realize now that it was really hard for my wife to be happy for both of us. She did almost all of the relationship work for years and then gave up, gradually, about 3 years ago. Unfortunately, she didn't tell me that.

 

It really is a day to day battle to keep my spirits up and to keep focused on what I have to do. I'm in survival mode just like I've been for most of my adult life and actually, most of my teen years!

 

The funny thing is that I had been improving steadily over the past couple of years. Now I feel like I'm back-tracking. I'm hoping the counseling will help me get my act together. I'm still on the roller coaster.

 

The work problems I'm having are also driving me nuts. I've wanted to leave my job for years, but have felt trapped because of money. I know it's not a good time to make that change, but I can't do this much longer.

[DesperateDad]

Something that has also struck me is that I don't have much of a personal life, that is, a life of my own as an individual. I do have a lot of friends, but most of them aren't really like me. Many of my relationships just lie there dormant until I pick them up again. I want to work on building more of a social structure that is just my own and not related to my family life. I think this is one of the biggest gaps in my life.

[uksurfer]

Something that has also struck me is that I don't have much of a personal life, that is, a life of my own as an individual. I do have a lot of friends, but most of them aren't really like me. Many of my relationships just lie there dormant until I pick them up again. I want to work on building more of a social structure that is just my own and not related to my family life. I think this is one of the biggest gaps in my life.

 

Yeah, I had that gap, too, to some extent. But so did my wife. Having said that, when you marry, buy a big house, have a big mortgage, and have 2 young kids, your social life will always slide a little. Again, life gets in the way.

 

But, as a couple, you get through that together. You *can't* let that be one of the reasons for all this.

 

I think I'm in the same position as you now. I'm starting to get back in touch with a lot of my old friends who I've lost contact with - mainly because we moved away from them all 2 years ago.

 

I should never have lost contact in the first place, but then again, getting out and seeing some old friends will do me a lot of good.

[DesperateDad]

Yep. I'm waking up now and realizing I don't really have a life of my own. My wife makes friends pretty easily and has more friends, though. I don't know what that's worth, though, because most of the closest ones are very clingy and so obviously needy and high maintenance. Personally, I've never been able to handle needy friends. I want to be around friends who don't need me, but just like being around me and having a good time.

[DesperateDad]

It's been a difficult weekend, although not too bad considering. My wife got me some very nice things and we had a pretty good time. They gave me cards that were very sweet except my wife gave me a card that was strange. It started out something like, 'you could have left, but you decided to stay and be a father...' I think it was intended to be for a dad who never married the mother.

 

I actually found this to be very insulting and downright painful to read. It really hurt to get something like that after nine years of marriage and all that I've been through as a husband and father throughout that time. I deserve a hell of a lot more than just a thanks for not leaving them high and dry.

 

Other than that, we had no fights and had a few nice chats. I had a good time with the kids. They are great kids and I love them more than anything. I'd do anything for them not to go through the pain and suffering of a divorce. For now, I guess that means being patient.

 

I'm still having trouble with the OM. I still don't think he sees himself that way, but in my mind he is. I think my wife still believes that she and I can break up when she's financially ready and he can be her friend through it all and then when I'm gone she will see if they can be a couple. I'm thinking about having another talk with him and just being as honest as I can about my feelings.

 

Guys, you're going to tell me I'm a pussy, but I'm really trying to suppress all of my anger and aggression. My short fuse is part of the reason my wife wants to leave me now. I've been pretty good about not getting angry (avoiding 'Love Busters') lately and I want to keep it that way. I'm certain it won't help my cause at this point.

 

I'm still trying to play it cool and be patient. I've had a hell of a time sleeping the last few nights and I'm going to try Gunny's suggestion of taking some melatonin. I'm hoping that will help with the waking up in the middle of the night and having anxiety attacks. It's really wearing me down.

 

My overall strategy for now is still Plan A. I want to get myself in order and try to somehow ease the OM out of the picture at the same time as I show my wife every single day that I've changed. I still think the root of all of this is her being over-stressed, depressed, fed-up and angry with me for all of the above. Things are getting easier as the kids get older and if I can just outlast this phase, I think we'll eventually be cool.

[DesperateDad]

I've been thinking about what's been going on and I'm going nuts. I mentioned that I'm not sleeping at night and this has been especially true since Thursday. I haven't posted about this yet but it's really been bothering me.

 

Thursday my wife and family (minus ME) accepted an invitation from the OM to go with him and his family (minus HIS wife) to go swimming at his friend's place. I expressed my discomfort about this with my wife, but I guess I was wishy-washy enough that it didn't faze her, so she went ahead with it.

 

I was supposed to go do something after work that evening, but decided not to mess with traffic so I came home early. When I got on my street, I passed the OM and then my wife's car going out. They had all of his kids and my kids and I called my wife to ask what was up. She seemed really surprised to see me.

 

She told me they were going back to go swimming for a while. She didn't invite me, but later mentioned that he had called her and asked if they should ask me to come along. She told him no. My kids also asked why I wasn't there and I said I hadn't been invited. My wife said immediately that I had been, but this wasn't true.

 

I was extremely upset, hurt and insulted by this behavior. I know it may not seem that bad, but I told her that my fear was that she was positioning him to take my place. She has never given any response to that other than that they would always be my kids.

 

I don't think I can live with this situation as it is much longer. Yes, I haven't been firm enough and now I hope it's not too late. I feel like things are now completely out of my control and she feels no need to even respect my wishes or feelings any more. Somehow I have to get the upper hand and regain control of things.

 

I'm worried because I'm not thinking completely clearly due to lack of sleep and extreme stress. I'm not sure what to do. I know I need to lay down the law in some fashion here. I want to keep trying with Plan A, but I've only shown the carrot instead of the stick. Every time I've tried to get firm about the OM, she's gotten upset and I've relented.

 

She STILL insists that they are only good 'friends.' She's said things like she should just go ahead and f*** him because that's the way I'm treating her and what does it matter what she does now that I know the marriage is over and she won't change her mind. UGH!

 

Mz. P said once that I've got the power here because she can't leave, but what if the OM decides to 'help' her out? This just completely sucks. I'm confused and not sure what to do. I need a plan.

 

Somehow I've got to convince the OM that he has to stay out of our lives for good and I've got to tell this to her too, so that I can establish this as the most important boundary. This is just getting to be way too hard for me to bear.

 

She has been different since Thursday, too. She's almost acting more certain about things and it worries me. Did something happen? I doubt it, but I DO get the feeling that she feels like she is in control now. She's planning on starting a business that has some income potential and she's also getting to do whatever she wants. Maybe that's just it; she thinks she's in complete control now. This is killing me.

 

If she's in control, then our marriage is doomed. If I can get control, there might be a small chance. I'm hating myself for still loving her after all this. She's never been like this before and has never cheated on me before.

 

It's funny that she's being very polite and nice, but distant. I think she's withdrawing more into her fantasy bubble. She's living in her fantasy and on my dime! I need to pop that bubble, but I also don't want to disrupt my whole family life. This completely freaking sucks.

 

Any ideas on how to proceed at this point? Would a conversation with the OM and also with my wife be the best/right thing to do?

 

How about exposure? Just what exactly would I be exposing? I don't think there's been anything physical since I caught them kissing that once, but they do speak on the phone and text every day. Is that enough? Will people understand how wrong this is?

 

I don't want to fight with her, but I feel like I can't go on like this. Help!