seperated for 9 months... do I observe the anniversary

[mlchris2]

Its been 9 months since the wife and I split, its back and forth... one day its the BIG D and the other is stay seperated. I believe she is really uncertain what she really wants, but wont admit it.

 

She justs asks that I leave her alone... I will admit I have failed miserably at this, in an attempt to get her back after several months of realizing some of the mistakes I've made.....so my question

 

our 8 wedding anniversary is comming up... do I do something for her as I've always done or do I let this one pass? I did get her a christmas present (she didnt)... I got her a mothers day present this year( I probably wont see a Fathers day gift from her).

 

I was thinking a Day at the Spa or some clothes... nothing to personal or intimate, becuase god knows we arent on those terms right now.

 

I dont want to screw up the one chance I believe I have left by doing something for her.

 

your opinions please

 

Mark

[Trimmer]

How about no gift, but a nice card with a few heartfelt sentences - not too pleading or whiny. Our anniversary was around D-Day, and I set all the crap aside to tell her how I felt about my recollections of our marriage and our wedding day (which was positive, incidentally.) It was one of the only times she let her guard down and I could see that it genuinely moved her. In the long run, it didn't change the outcome (divorce) but it certainly didn't hurt anything. I don't think we were on such a high-wire that an anniversary gift or card would have swung things one way or the other....

[dgiirl]

I observed it quietly crying in my bathroom. I did not email him or anything. (it was about 7 months after d-bomb)

 

His birthday was about 4 months after d-bomb, i ignored that too. Funny thing is, he had to IM me for something stupid the following Monday. (I did however remind all his friends that it was his birthday, but I refused to tell him that, and I refused to acknowledge it myself). He sent me a one-liner email for my bday 2 months after, but I have a feeling the only reason he did that was because we talked a few days earlier. His birthday is coming up once again, and I'm really undecided if I should acknowledge it or not. We have been getting along civilally the last month, but only because he's coming to do yard work. It's hard to know what's the right thing to do. Since he was the one who abandoned me, and since we have no kids, I'm not going to stick around in hopes he changes his mind. So me not acknowledging it, kinda shows him what life without me is going to feel like. I dont believe in this friends crap. I dont know, I'm still undecided. The other side could also backfire on you, if you constantly show attention, she could get sick of it. Try and do something she WOULDNT expect.

[Mz. Pixie]

ML-

 

Cannot believe she's still sitting on the fence. How long are you going to allow her to do that??

 

Trimmer is right. A nice card with a few sentences- no begging her to come back home etc.

 

Is she still involved with the other guy? What have you done to end that relationship?

[SoleMate]

...and the thought struck me again that I just can't take much more of the pain I hear about on LS. Apparently, you were a porn user against your wife's wishes...you both struggled ineffectually with it for four years...and then she started backing out of the marriage. There is so much that is sad here. The same Internet that entertains us, informs us, and makes life so much more convenient, also provides the fodder for porn users to drive their spouses over the edge. There may have been marriages that broke up over Playboy magazine, but I never heard of it. And you two never found or took advantage of any effective counselling to help with this. Granted, such counselling is not easy to find or afford.

 

In one post, you said something like, "Why did she stay for four years and only then give up?" Meaning, I guess, that if she proved she could take it for that amount of time, she could (or should be able to) take it for the rest of her life. Not so! In the Love Bank model, she had "love deposits" from you that were enough to handle four years of your porn use and the problems it caused. Then the love account became empty. Jesus is capable of infinite love, but very few non-Jesus humans are.

 

I spent a similar or greater amount of time dealing with a different (and in my eyes, more painful) problem that affected my husband. I am a tenacious person who just does not quit and does not give up. My loyalty and faithfulness lasted for many years, through his stonewalling, insincere promises, hurtful behavior, etc. They even outlasted love. I rode the waves of hope, and good days, and promises to get help, over and over again. Then I crashed into despair - or just dull loneliness and grief - when the promises were inevitably not kept to. He turned away again and again from any true discussion. The ride made me sick to my stomach and at last I couldn't take it. I felt like my better qualities had been taken advantage of.

 

He was deeply shocked that my loyalty would ever end. He thought, like you, that since I'd lived with it so long, I would continue doing so for the next 40-50 years. But I couldn't...I was feeling my personality getting twisted by all the bitterness and anger.

 

Apologies for my story...and back to your question. Believe it or not, I am responding to what you asked. My response is that it matters very little what you do or don't do. The mountain that is your marriage and its problems won't be much changed either way. Sorry, but that is the reality. Don't torture yourself by thinking that if you could find just the right Hallmark card, or just the most tasteful, well-chosen gift, wrap it charmingly, and present it with a single red rose, that her heart would be softened - or that her Love Bank account would go back in the black.

 

In crude quantitative terms, Dr. Harley says the most perfect, loving act will earn you at most 4 LB points. Similarly, the deficits you built up amount to (4 points) * (days or episodes where your wife felt the pain of your porn use). You've been married 8 years. If you has 1 porn episode per month, that's 8*12*4 = -384 points. (Of course, this is only rough estimate, and I am sure you also made deposits and probably other withdrawals over this time.)

 

-384 + 4 = -380, and -384 ~ -380. That's my point.

[cranium]

Mark,

 

Do what you want to do. If you want to give her a gift, do so. Do it with no attachment to the outcome though; you can't have any expectations that she "should" react a certain way. Let go of that.

[Mz. Pixie]

Soulmate-

 

Gosh, I'm sorry for your pain as well but ML's wife is also conducting an affair- all under the guise of blaming it on his porn etc. Her actions are not right either.

[Ladyjane14]

I spent a similar or greater amount of time dealing with a different (and in my eyes, more painful) problem that affected my husband. I am a tenacious person who just does not quit and does not give up. My loyalty and faithfulness lasted for many years, through his stonewalling, insincere promises, hurtful behavior, etc. They even outlasted love. I rode the waves of hope, and good days, and promises to get help, over and over again. Then I crashed into despair - or just dull loneliness and grief - when the promises were inevitably not kept to. He turned away again and again from any true discussion. The ride made me sick to my stomach and at last I couldn't take it. I felt like my better qualities had been taken advantage of.

 

He was deeply shocked that my loyalty would ever end. He thought, like you, that since I'd lived with it so long, I would continue doing so for the next 40-50 years. But I couldn't...I was feeling my personality getting twisted by all the bitterness and anger.

 

Wow Solemate. Awesome post.

 

Not to hijack MLChris's thread, but....you know, I don't think we really spend enough time talking about what happens when your partner 'runs out of gas', Or why it happens. Or what can be done about it.

 

I was following this one thread on another site, and this guy had REALLY screwed up his marriage. Now his wife is in an EA, has separated, and shows ZERO indication of wanting to go back. Honestly, I think her lovebank isn't just empty...I think her givadamn is probably busted beyond repair.

 

Not to be compared really to MLChris's situation, even though it sounds similar...because this other guy screwed it up in a way that I would consider unforgivable if I were in this woman's shoes. And this other guy is getting lots of encouragement to lean on his now wayward wife, but I can't imagine how it'll do much good. Because he's NOT really dealing with what he did. And he's not dealing with the fact that he pretty much deserves to be summarily divorced for it. He's not made any sort of retribution or any attempt at repayment. And while you can't pay somebody back for the pain you've caused them...you can damn sure do whatever is in your power to try.

 

I don't know how things will work out for you, MLChris, but if I were to give you any advice.... it would be to own whatever deficits you brought to the marriage table. You can't go wrong with that, because if it doesn't help you in this relationship, it's gonna serve you well in the next.

 

And I agree with Trimmer on the gift, btw. If you give her anything, make it something small that she won't feel beholden in taking. A book or a movie, or a gift certificate for one of her favorite stores. No big romantic gestures. It would only make her uncomfortable, and a TRUE gift from the heart probably shouldn't induce discomfort.

[Mz. Pixie]

WOW. LJ- great post!

 

And yet another thing to remember- you can't fix everything that went wrong in years in a couple of days. That is what my exhusband thought he could do. He went from not ever touching me besides sexual to calling me 20 times a day to ask where I was and being all over me etc.

 

Because he had told me many times he would change, and he would for a couple of days- then his words had no meaning at the time he needed them to mean the most. All I heard was "Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah".

 

It takes long term change that can be measured and owning up to what you did wrong- not just what they did wrong.

[mlchris2]

Trimmer - I like your ideas. I've been thinking of what to do and what not to do. But your right... I'll make the final decision.

 

Pixie - me neither, however... I dont think she's seing the "other man" anymore. she put a stop to it shortly after Christmas. (Thats a story for another post, we wont get into it now). Ultimately, I dont want to end the relationship between her and I. I've fessed up to my what-used to be porn addiction. I went to some PAA classes, have been seeing a therapist and have been "sober" for 7 months now. There have been a few times, where I've told her I cant keep hanging on the fence with her. I need to know what her intensions are. Then the tug-o-war games start up again... Divorce one day, stay seperated the next.

 

SoleMate - I want to first thank you for seeing the things which I've done. I know the mistakes I've made... have stood up like a man and took 110% blame...have done everything in my power to change my ways and am trying so desperately to get my wife back. One thing I dont understand is she feels she's done nothing wrong, has never wanted to go to a therapist for some help.. it was alway me..myself and I. Well how do you resolve the issue between a husband and wife if the wife wont do her part? At first I thought I could deal with the problems at hand, but then came to realize that I couldnt do it on my own. My response from her when I asked her to go with me to therapist was "I'm not going... therapists are quacks". This told me she really didnt want to fix things, so things continued to spiral downward. Well it took the eye-opening event of losing everthing that was good in my life. So I went to counseling as she wanted me to do, but to this day, she still thinks she had nothing to do with anything or any of our marital issues.

 

I do like your LoveBank story... it makes alot of sense. I've tried to place myself in her shoes and I have SOME idea of how she may have felt, no way could I experience what she went through, unless I went through it myself. When I found her fooling around with another man, this killed me, worse than when she told me it was over. I went through a suicidal stage for about a month. I one day told her that I would forgive her for anything she might have done and willing to take the steps towards resolving, becuase of the love I have for her. Some people think I am nuts, becuase "once a cheater, always a cheater"... well the only thing I can tell you is the love I have for my wife will get me through this.

 

I am trying to just give her space as she suggests and try to build up her LB as I can without crossing the line. It might just take a little more time to see just how commited I am to her and the kids. I do have alot of things to change, but I have seem the error in my ways and am doing all i can to change for the better.

 

Pixie - I do agree with you.. I first thought I could change things right away. Boy was I wrong. I did have hard time with that. I did ask my wife is she really knew how I felt and what I wanted. She said yes and I left it at that. Now that I really truly know that she know, then I can work at doing what she requesting of me and that is giving her space, even though she is back and forth on her decision.

 

thanks all for the advice and concern.

 

Mark