what about the issue of suicide?

[radiation7740]

Why the hell post something' date=' if you don't want responses? The only person here condeming anyone is you! You have said thrice now that I serve Satan! You say that I am neither understanding, nor merciful, when I have tried to help you! You are not the only person who has problems. I am not condeming you; I am trying to enlighten you. I have quoted things for you, I have tried to educate you concerning your misunderstanding of Catholicism, as well as many other things, but after reading your other posts, I have concluded why you are here: You want [b']ATTENTION.[/b] You want to have your beliefs confirmed, and YOU condem the majority of us who disagree with you. I don't give a damn about how you live your life, but when you post that you want to commit suicide, you obviously want attention which I (as well as numerous others) unfortunatly gave you; so you got what you wanted...congradulations. I didn't give up on you; if you are at the point of suicide, you have obviously given up on yourself. Go seek help from God, Jesus, priests, doctors, the homeless guy on the street, whoever. Maybe that's your problem: too much time waiting for others to help you, rather than getting off your ass and trying to help yourself.

 

Now, I am tired of putting my time and energy into trying to disway your views concerning suicide. I have done all I could, and have wasted enough of my energy on this ignorant bulls***. You know what, you are absolutely right; the bible definately suggests that suicide is permissable. Hell, it's the only way to go! God doesn't want to waste his energy trying to determine how he should kill you off, he would much rather you do the work for him. I mean, he is so busy trying to get ready for the apocalypse, that I am sure he would really appreciate your killing yourself, so he doesn't have to worry about what to do with you anymore. s***, before you go, you should have sex with married women, eat until you puke, and rob a bank before you kill yourself too! If, just because you are Christain, you have a free pass to heaven without worring about how you conduct your life, why the hell not?

 

Now there is only one thing left to do: laugh .

 

 

Nobody asked you to try to disway my views. Here you are accusing me of the same thing. You tell me that my views are wrong and yours are right. You are no better than me.

[Spank'n'Rationality]

Nobody asked you to try to disway my views. Here you are accusing me of the same thing. You tell me that my views are wrong and yours are right. You are no better than me.

 

Dude, did you read my last paragraph? I just told you that you were right! You posted that you wanted to commit suicide! What am I supposed to do? Congradulate you? Why the hell do you post on here then, if you don't want advice? Do you just want to shock people? What the hell am I accusing you of? I am making assertions based on your posts. That is not accusing you, that is observing you.

[radiation7740]

Dude' date=' did you read my last paragraph? I just told you that you were right! You posted that you wanted to commit suicide! What am I supposed to do? Congradulate you? Why the hell do you post on here then, if you don't want advice? Do you just want to shock people? What the hell am I accusing you of? I am making assertions based on your posts. That is not accusing you, that is observing you.[/quote']

 

 

Why the hell do you get upset just because I don't want to take your advice? Sounds to me like you have a serious ego problem. Your only motivation for posting was not to help but to try to win an argument. You are quick to give up on me just because I don't want to do things your way. Your motivation for posting has become obvious. It's not to help but to win an argument.

[Spank'n'Rationality]

Your only motivation for posting was not to help but to try to win an argument. You are quick to give up on me just because I don't want to do things your way.

Like I posted eariler, you gave up on yourself. You are the one who wants to commit suicide; that, sir, is giving up. I never said I wanted you to die; I don't want you to die. However, I have given up trying to help you, because you obviously don't want to help yourself; and it is futile to try to help someone who isn't interested in being helped.

[radiation7740]

Like I posted eariler' date=' you gave up on yourself. You are the one who wants to commit suicide; that, sir, is giving up. I never said I wanted you to die; I don't want you to die. However, I have given up trying to help you, because you obviously don't want to help yourself; and it is futile to try to help someone who isn't interested in being helped.[/quote']

 

 

You never tried to help in the first place. You were critical and only tried to win an argument. The only thing you've given up now is trying to win an argument. That's a wise move on your part. I actually like myself in spite of you or anyone else who doesn't like me. I'm more of a balanced guy than I've ever been before. I love myself.

[Sand&Water]

I believe that a born again christian who commits suicide goes to heaven.

 

 

What are you talkig about?

 

I think you've tinted the whole idea of suicide, and the gospel in general.

 

You can't expect to do the most sinful crimes, and come back to God every time for forgiveness. That's not right, and it's not the christian way of life.

 

What about those serial killers, or sex predators? If they ask for forgiveness, and come to God, they too will go to Heaven?

 

Suicide, whether it be from one extreme to another, is a big No-No in Christianity. Period.

[radiation7740]

What are you talkig about?

 

I think you've tinted the whole idea of suicide, and the gospel in general.

 

You can't expect to do the most sinful crimes, and come back to God every time for forgiveness. That's not right, and it's not the christian way of life.

 

What about those serial killers, or sex predators? If they ask for forgiveness, and come to God, they too will go to Heaven?

 

Suicide, whether it be from one extreme to another, is a big No-No in Christianity. Period.

 

 

Statistics show that the ones who commit suicide are usually the most compassionate sympathetic people that have alot to offer this world. Most of the ones who commit suicide are too good for this world anyway. It seems like all the sympathetic people die early while too many people who have a hard time cutting me slack live too long.

[Spank'n'Rationality]

You never tried to help in the first place. You were critical and only tried to win an argument. The only thing you've given up now is trying to win an argument. That's a wise move on your part. I actually like myself in spite of you or anyone else who doesn't like me. I'm more of a balanced guy than I've ever been before. I love myself.

 

Haha, I didn't give up because you out-wit me. I gave up, because I have better things to do than to try to reason with someone who obviously doesn't have the ability to rationalize; trying to communicate with you has been like trying to reason with a brick wall: useless. I am glad you love yourself. I never said I disliked you, I don't know you, and frankly I don't want to know you. And yeah, a balanced guy, I'm sure. Any guy who posts that they want to commit suicide, has problems masterbating, and is preaching on the street sounds really balanced to me; if you are balanced now, I am so glad that you didn't post when you were "not" balanced. Though I am sure it would have been amusing.

[radiation7740]

Haha' date=' I didn't give up because you out-wit me. I gave up, because I have better things to do than to try to reason with someone who obviously doesn't have the ability to rationalize; trying to communicate with you has been like trying to reason with a brick wall: [b']useless[/b]. I am glad you love yourself. I never said I disliked you, I don't know you, and frankly I don't want to know you. And yeah, a balanced guy, I'm sure. Any guy who posts that they want to commit suicide, has problems masterbating, and is preaching on the street sounds really balanced to me; if you are balanced now, I am so glad that you didn't post when you were "not" balanced. Though I am sure it would have been amusing.

 

Once again you have proven that you never really cared about me all along. You only cared about winning an argument and trying to make me look like a fool.

[Spank'n'Rationality]

Statistics show that the ones who commit suicide are usually the most compassionate sympathetic people that have alot to offer this world. Most of the ones who commit suicide are too good for this world anyway. It seems like all the sympathetic people die early while too many people who have a hard time cutting me slack live too long.

 

Yeah, and statistics show that the people who actually commit suicide aren't the ones talking/writting about doing it. Those people are usually just looking for attention, where as the people who actually go through with it are those who keep their issues contained within themselves, not posted in cyber-space for all to see and dwell upon.

[radiation7740]

There's always someone who will do a better job of tolerating me than you ever will. I'll go elsewhere and find someone who will cut me some slack. I have no desire to better myself into what you expect from me

[Sand&Water]

Statistics show that the ones who commit suicide are usually the most compassionate sympathetic people that have alot to offer this world. Most of the ones who commit suicide are too good for this world anyway. It seems like all the sympathetic people die early while too many people who have a hard time cutting me slack live too long.

 

That's too bad. Because, if they think by commiting suicide is the way to get into heaven, along with their wonderful personalities is pathetic. So instead they've given up on trying to achieve solitude in their own life, and the only way out is by commiting suicide.

 

That's bulls***.

[bluetuesday]

I can't afford to get professional help because I don't have medical insurance. Besides the professionals cannot relate to what I'm going through because there is spiritual warfare going on with me. Mental health professionals cannot be of help to someone who is going through spiritual warfare simply because the professionals don't believe it exists. They don't believe in the God of the bible. They don't believe that satan is a real being. I do. Maybe you don't believe in spiritual warfare but I do. The only people who understand where I'm coming from are christian leaders. They are the only ones I want to talk to.

 

of course i believe in spiritual warfare. i take very powerful daily steps to protect myself from it.

 

listen radiation, i am not belittling what you are going through - i have great compassion for your situation and problems - but you really need to evaluate objectively what you are doing to help your situation.

 

god (or suicide for that matter) will not wipe away your problems. a soul which tries to kill itself will take the problems it carries in this world with it to the next. trust me, you don't want that. the only way to overcome whatever it is, is to overcome it IN THIS WORLD. you are going through s*** because the s*** is trying to teach you something. the question you have to ask yourself is, are you learning?

 

because, you know, if you are being spiritually attacked and it is working, you MUST ask yourself why. if the devil or his minions are able to affect you this badly, you are letting them. something in your life is allowing that to happen.

 

perhaps it is a wrong belief about god. perhaps it is the belief that god will take this away from you. he won't. he CAN'T take it away and remain true to his promise not to interfere in your free will.

 

i too am spritually attacked. to some extent we all are. it can be a frightening experience and you can feel powerless. but the weapons you use must be the right ones. it's no good fighting a war armed with a bunch of flowers. wise up, man. you need to sharpen your spiritual tools. a man who is armed in love and light gives the devil no inroads into his psyche.

 

take a good look and then tell me HONESTLY if you are taking every step you can to protect yourself. because i promise you, when the devil comes and finds nothing in you he can work with, no fears he can play on, no temptations that can turn your head, no offers of earthly reward to veer you from the right path, he WILL leave you alone.

[Bogun]

Statistics show that the ones who commit suicide are usually the most compassionate sympathetic people that have alot to offer this world. Most of the ones who commit suicide are too good for this world anyway. It seems like all the sympathetic people die early while too many people who have a hard time cutting me slack live too long.

Where did you find these statistics radiation?

 

At bulls***.com maybe?

[KnowHowLoveFeels]

Suicide is the coward's way out. What's there to debate about?

[Outcast]

Suicide is the coward's way out. What's there to debate about?

 

Now that's not fair. People who commit suicide are not thinking rationally. They aren't 'cowards'. They are, however, seriously messed up - to the extent that they are unable to see the fundamental flaws in their thinking.

[quankanne]

People who commit suicide are not thinking rationally.

 

which is the Church's take on it now – because there's more things involved than just the act itself, and only God knows the suicide's mind at the time of the act.

 

however, to promote it because it looks like the best deal so and so took because that person didn't want to deal with X or Y or Z? Again, onlookers do not know the mind of the person committing suicide, so for a so-called Christian to promote it as a viable option flies right smack of their belief ...

 

now, back to the earlier discussion about the anti-Christ – did I read correctly that he'll be known by the cut of the three-piece suit he wears? :bunny:

[seven]

Originally posted by radiation7740:

While I believe that committing suicide doesn't send a person to hell, the people whom he leaves behind will go through a far greater hell. Usually it's the living that suffer and not the dead.

 

The gamut of emotions in the aftermath of a loved one’s suicide is unbelievable. Shock, pain, confusion, hurt, helplessness, anger, embarrassment. Having to deal with others’ opinions of suicide can be frustrating and unwelcomed when you’re trying to figure it yourself.

 

 

Originally posted by radiation7740:

My brother died by his own hand and to be real honest I envy him. He's not suffering anymore. He has no more worries and no more responsibilities. He's free forever from trials & tribulations. I look forward to being reuinted with him one day wherever he is. I believe he's in heaven now but if I'm wrong then I still want to be reunited with him wherever he is. I can't imagine spending eternity in heaven if my entire family is not there with me.

 

Radiation -- I feel for you and can tell your brother’s loss still stings, understandably so. But it sounds like you are romanticizing suicide.

 

Question: Are you angry at all at your brother for committing suicide? Just wondered because when a relative of mine took his life, I was angry about it, amongst a host of other emotions. If I were to miraculously see him again, I would give him the biggest hug ever, tell him how much I miss and love him, and then kick his ass!!! Then I’d hug him again. lol. I am well aware that imbalanced thinking/brain chemistry and environmental factors (depression) are at the root of it. But I also felt like there was spite involved to a certain extent. It’s like … hey everybody, you couldn’t help me feel better (or won’t even give you the chance to), so here you go -- you can all take my pain and distribute it amongst yourselves.

 

Do I believe he is in heaven? Yes, and I am not going to cite biblical references of any sort. He was a loving soul — his thoughts were not right for a period of time. The God I believe in understands that. Period. Ultimately, your truth is what you believe.

 

 

Originally posted by radiation7740:

I can't afford to get professional help because I don't have medical insurance. Besides the professionals cannot relate to what I'm going through because there is spiritual warfare going on with me. Mental health professionals cannot be of help to someone who is going through spiritual warfare simply because the professionals don't believe it exists. They don't believe in the God of the bible. They don't believe that satan is a real being. I do. Maybe you don't believe in spiritual warfare but I do. The only people who understand where I'm coming from are christian leaders. They are the only ones I want to talk to.

 

Perhaps you have things you want to say to your brother (and God too) -- to get it out of your system. I’ll share this with you (though part of me would rather not). One winter’s day, I has the strongest feeling to go the ocean. No one was around and I just let it out … said my peace to God and my nephew and sent a rose into the ocean. I kid you not … I literally started to feel better afterwards. The visual of the rose drifting off helped me—it was like a release of negative emotions were floating off with it. And instead of picturing him lying in his coffin, I began picturing the rose/ocean. I’m not suggesting you do the same thing, but if you have a spiritual/reflective place, something along those lines may be of help.

 

Originally posted by radiation7740:

Statistics show that the ones who commit suicide are usually the most compassionate sympathetic people that have alot to offer this world. Most of the ones who commit suicide are too good for this world anyway. It seems like all the sympathetic people die early while too many people who have a hard time cutting me slack live too long.

 

You’re romanticizing again. Learn from your brother … envying and copying him will get you nowhere. It wouldn’t even be original—he already did it. Perhaps you can find a means to help other people that would be healing to you as well.

 

And if you don’t have insurance to speak with a counselor, you can also dial a suicide hotline to just talk with someone. You don’t even have to be suicidal to do so. I was in such a state of shock (though not suicidal) when I got the news of my nephew’s death … was pacing, couldn’t sit still, my mind was racing, etc. So I called a hotline just to have someone who had experience with it to talk to. Was the best decision I could have made. The counselor let me vent, cry, helped me feel “normal” in the emotions I was experiencing. She also told me about support groups for surviving family members/friends. Have you considered a support group? Hearing other people’s stories and sharing your own may help you work through this too. That hotline counselor was a perfect stranger to whom I will be forever grateful. And note Radiation, she was one of the most compassionate human beings I have ever encountered … and she was not suicidal.

[flavius]

Suicide does not by itself determine eternal destiny. God is the judge of all, no matter how their life begins, develops, or ends.

[bluetuesday]

i see you've stopped believing in god then. that's a real shame.

 

sigh. look radiation, you're not thinking straight. get help from someone real. it's out there. call someone and tell them you're going through this. there must be a parent, a teacher, someone at the end of a crisis helpline who can speak to you and get you through this.

 

i don't want to see you this depressed. i do care what happens to you and i don't want you to hurt yourself. i gave you some great advice earlier on this thread. did you just ignore it? because if what you're looking for is a platform to rant and wallow in self pity without taking any responsibility for your situation, you got it. but that's not going to help you.

 

PM me if you have the balls. i won't give you a reason to kill yourself, but i will give you a bollocking for thinking it's acceptable to ask a bunch of strangers to encourage you to die.

 

i don't care how bad you think your life is. the reason you're depressed is that you refuse to do anything about it. you think your problems are big but there are people out there with terrible stories. there are people right now having their children ripped from their arms and slaughtered. there are people starving to death. there are mothers being brutally raped, fathers being beheaded, children being tortured, right this second.

 

during the war in yugoslavia, i went out there on an aid mission. i met countless people with real problems. no food for days on end, their families butchered, having to flee their homes, only having the clothes they stood up in, being herded into camps, that sort of thing.

 

one man i spoke to (through a translator) told of seeing his young daughter - eight years old she was - being gang raped by a group of soldiers who had stormed into his house. when they'd finished taking turns with this little girl, they executed her by cutting her throat with a broken beer bottle and she died in front of him. the soldiers who were holding him back laughed at the man's struggle to reach his daughter's body in a vain attempt to help her.

 

whatever it is you're going through, i'm truly sorry. but it is not an insurmountable problem. it's a test, and at the moment, you're failing it.

 

and as it happens i don't think the world would be better off without you. a unique soul would be lost that could never be replaced and you would have missed an opportunity to fulfil your purpose in life. i assure you, as soon as you'd done it you'd regret it just as your brother has regretted it.

 

your problems seem big to you, but you can get through them. and the only person who can take them away, is you. by choosing to seek help. by choosing to make different choices.

[burning 4 revenge]

Suicide is the coward's way out. What's there to debate about?

 

Jesus commited suicide. Was he a coward? Jesus commited suicide and it's the only thing i admire about that megalomaniac primma donna

[magichands]

Jesus commited suicide. Was he a coward? Jesus commited suicide and it's the only thing i admire about that megalomaniac primma donna

 

Dude... I think you might have your facts wrong. He faced up to reality.

 

But I kind of agree with you on the cowardly thing. I feel that if you don't want to be living - then what's the point? But the trouble is that hardly anyone could shuffle off without leaving a ripple or three.

 

I mean, I'm a loser and there are still people that care about me! That's enough of a reason not to.

 

What about living the rest of your life selflessly? Maybe not taking that option is what would make the act cowardly. Be brave, forget about yourself, and do something to make the world better - no matter how small. Repeat.

 

And then there is the small matter of how to cease living without pain (preferred), and without asking someone to clean up afterwards (necessary).

 

A sense of humour can really come in handy sometimes.

[burning 4 revenge]

Dude... I think you might have your facts wrong. He faced up to reality.

 

But I kind of agree with you on the cowardly thing. I feel that if you don't want to be living - then what's the point? But the trouble is that hardly anyone could shuffle off without leaving a ripple or three.

 

I mean, I'm a loser and there are still people that care about me! That's enough of a reason not to.

 

What about living the rest of your life selflessly? Maybe not taking that option is what would make the act cowardly. Be brave, forget about yourself, and do something to make the world better - no matter how small. Repeat.

 

And then there is the small matter of how to cease living without pain (preferred), and without asking someone to clean up afterwards (necessary).

 

A sense of humour can really come in handy sometimes.

 

i would'nt want to hurt my mother, but i could give three s***s about making the world better. i don't have any intention of making it any worse, but there's too much emphasis on the societal and not enough on individual existential dilemnas. thanks for the kind words

[magichands]

i would'nt want to hurt my mother, but i could give three s***s about making the world better. i don't have any intention of making it any worse, but there's too much emphasis on the societal and not enough on individual existential dilemnas.

 

Maybe I am super dumb, but I always thought it was the other way around!

 

thanks for the kind words

 

Are youse being sarcastic? Anyway, I didn't mean any harm. When my life gets unbearable, it's "forgetting myself" that seems to be the only thing that can bring some relief.

 

Take your mother out for coffee sometime. And make sure you pay.

[burning 4 revenge]

i wasn't being sarcastic. i thought your words were well chosen and heartfelt