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[Milf629]

Hello Everyone! New here. I regularly post on another Board, but needed a board specified for THIS area of my life.

 

Short re-cap: husband and I having problems since end of march, I mean we had problems before then but it was considerably stepped up then. Thought he was cheating (still do but unsure of myself), he insists its a platonic relationship. We have been living apart since mid to late April, we have been seeing a therapist together since mid-may.

 

Here's my problem, he is still talking to this person whom he says he has a platonic relationship with. He has always had a lot of "girl" friends. I have never had a problem with it. But I always knew who they were, had met them, was exposed to them, it was never a problem. but not this girl. he works with her, shes 8 years younger then him (not that that matters but a point of reference) shes married (newly) no kids. We have been married for almost 7 years, 2 children (3 1/2 and 9 months). he insists insists insists it is platonic (despite middle of the night phone calls, that are not happening anymore, to my knowledge) relationship, but they still talk, it still bothers me, I still am not comfortable. i asked him to end it, he doesn't want to end the "friendship", I dont know what to do, or how to approach it. The only piece of anything I have is his cell phone records (that he isn't hiding from me) so I know how often they talk. I just cant seem to let it go completely. all the while we are trying to work on our marriage and I am doing all that I can to help it, and we (I think) are doing well on fixing things thus far, but he wont let this go.

 

I just dont know what to do. I am afraid of being a fool. but at the same time if I obsess about it, it makes me completely dysfunctional.

[tonyp56]

Sit down with him and discuss how you really feel. Tell him how it makes you uncomfortable, and ask him wouldn't he feel that way if the shoe was on the other foot. Don't tell him to end the relationship during this conversation, just tell him you want to talk about how it makes you feel. Don't pressure him into telling you that the relationship is anything but friendly only.

 

Start with the obvious, they talk a lot on the phone, so that would be the first thing I would bring up. Say it in a way that is non-confrontational, tell him he can tell you anything and that you won't get mad no matter what he tells you, just that you want the truth, and nothing but the truth. Ask him if he is attracted to her, tell him he won't get in trouble for saying yes. More or less remove yourself and ask him on neutral ground.

 

The reason why I say to do this way is because instead of going at it as if he is guilty--like it sounds like you are--you need to talk to him and approach him as if he is not guilty of cheating on you. It could be that he isn't, and because the way you approach him, he feels like why should he do anything different, it is your fault that you don't trust him.

 

Be prepared to hear that he is cheating, but don't think he is before he says that he is cheating. I know that is hard, but if you want him to open up, you are going to have to make the enviroment peaceful and open so that instead of him feeling like he has to tell you, he wants to tell you.

 

In the end, you don't know, but if you want to find out you are going to have to ask him nicely. Now of course, if he is cheating on you, you will have to decide what course of action to take next, but at least you will know the truth. It could be an over-reaction on your part, and because of that over-reaction he has withdrawn from you, and won't tell you what is going on and/or won't end it.

 

If you asking him the way that you have hasn't worked, why not change your tactics. Be nice, and at least act like he isn't guilty of cheating. But remember, you've more or less treated him as if he is guilty since March-April, it may take you some time to open him up and tell you. And you might find out he wasn't guilty, and you've fought him over nothing. If that is the case learn from that, and don't mistrust him so easily next time. On the other hand, you could be right. However, you've got to find out first.

 

Good luck

[iron_m]

It may be both:

he thinks it is only platonic

 

AND it is not. they are falling in love (already are?).

 

he may have not realized yet, but if he realizes he'll deny it, first to himself and then to you...

 

Thing is that you are having problems and then this friend appears (order uninportant now) and becomes the confident he needs. then it is a vicious circle: the more problems among you, the more he trusts her and that causes more problems in your marriage.

You will never know from here on if the relationship among them is cause or effect of the breaking in your marriage.

 

Good thing is that you are going to counseling. try to get help from them.

 

asking him to STOP the "friendship" will not help, on the contrary will make things worst (been there done that). why? because you will be the "bad gal": the friend is not having any problem with you being his spouse, you are having the problem with her being his friend... (it is so obvious to him and so outrageous unfair to you, I know, but it is the way he is seeing it now!)

 

while he thinks it is only friendship, you can do nothing... you have to make him realize the contrary and that has to happen BEFORE they fall completely in love with each other. now that's hard to do and almost impossible for you alone.

 

get help ASAP!

 

good luck with that!

[Milf629]

Well I will tell you, we have had several lengthy conversations about this.

 

In the begginning he wouldn't even tell me when he was going out with his new friends (they were just friends, as in a bunch of people, no names, I didn't know who they were, which in itself was unusual because I always know who his friends are, not because I demand it, but just because I do.)

 

so he went out with this new bunch of people several times before the s*** hit the fan, BUT one night he was out till 4:30 am, (hugely unusual) I called once at 3am, again at 3:30am, no answer on his cell (panic sets in because I am actually WORRIED about his well being), and he calls me back around 4am, tells me he had too much to drink and was sleeping it off in HIS car. My gut wouldn't let me rest, I sensed something else, sensed that he was lying, so a week goes by before he tells me that when I initially called he was in HER car (he claims she was dropping people off before bringing him back to his car) then the second time I called he was in HIS car, this was the first tip off. then about a month - month and a half after we really started having problems (and were living apart) I started some snooping, MY GUT told me to do so, and found his cell phone bill, over 200+ calls to this girl (and thats only with one phone number, that doesn't include times he may have called her at work, or times he may have called her at home or another cell phone, shes originally from MI, living now in CT therefore has 2 cell phones, one from MI one from here) lots and lots of middle of the night calls which was what REALLY bothered me.

 

we have an initial conversation, which was me all out accusing him, then another one where I say hey look if its platonic fine, but it still bothers me, he knows how i feel on a very real level, without taking into consideration the anger, I have made it ok to tell me (no anger) on several occassions, but still nothing. BUT my gut still wont let me rest. and I dont know why.

 

I at one point and even right now, resolved to just accept what he tells me as truth, and try to move forward with fixing our marriage, but my gut will not let me rest completely. I still look occassionally at the cell phone, but he doesn't deny talking to her, I guess I just dont understand it, and he is still protecting this relationship which makes it 100X worse, it has taken ALL of my self control not to call her myself.

 

I installed a keylogger yesterday on my home computer (we are living apart but he is there with the kids while I am at work) and hopefully that will give me some much needed answers. I just can't stand it anymore. And I dont know how to undo it.

[Niceguyin IL]

MILF, first if you're a MILF then your hot so he will be crawling back very soon...I am going through a very similar thing with my GF...she is a big time MILF and it's very upsetting when men try and get her attention...Some how you need to end this situation, either by altumatum (sp) or divorce! You are going to drive yourself crazy, I imagine this is all you think about and now he's gone you all of the sudden realize how in "love" you are with him...

 

I think you may be in denial, hunny there is nothing plutonic about there relationship and you need to know now...Being Kojack isn't going to save your marrage in fact it may drive you insane... Question, do other woman find him attractive? are you an attractive person?

[iron_m]

Well I will tell you, we have had several lengthy conversations about this.

 

In the begginning he wouldn't even tell me when he was going out with his new friends (they were just friends, as in a bunch of people, no names, I didn't know who they were, which in itself was unusual because I always know who his friends are, not because I demand it, but just because I do.)

 

so he went out with this new bunch of people several times before the s*** hit the fan, BUT one night he was out till 4:30 am, (hugely unusual) I called once at 3am, again at 3:30am, no answer on his cell (panic sets in because I am actually WORRIED about his well being), and he calls me back around 4am, tells me he had too much to drink and was sleeping it off in HIS car. My gut wouldn't let me rest, I sensed something else, sensed that he was lying, so a week goes by before he tells me that when I initially called he was in HER car (he claims she was dropping people off before bringing him back to his car) then the second time I called he was in HIS car, this was the first tip off. then about a month - month and a half after we really started having problems (and were living apart) I started some snooping, MY GUT told me to do so, and found his cell phone bill, over 200+ calls to this girl (and thats only with one phone number, that doesn't include times he may have called her at work, or times he may have called her at home or another cell phone, shes originally from MI, living now in CT therefore has 2 cell phones, one from MI one from here) lots and lots of middle of the night calls which was what REALLY bothered me.

 

we have an initial conversation, which was me all out accusing him, then another one where I say hey look if its platonic fine, but it still bothers me, he knows how i feel on a very real level, without taking into consideration the anger, I have made it ok to tell me (no anger) on several occassions, but still nothing. BUT my gut still wont let me rest. and I dont know why.

 

I at one point and even right now, resolved to just accept what he tells me as truth, and try to move forward with fixing our marriage, but my gut will not let me rest completely. I still look occassionally at the cell phone, but he doesn't deny talking to her, I guess I just dont understand it, and he is still protecting this relationship which makes it 100X worse, it has taken ALL of my self control not to call her myself.

 

I installed a keylogger yesterday on my home computer (we are living apart but he is there with the kids while I am at work) and hopefully that will give me some much needed answers. I just can't stand it anymore. And I dont know how to undo it.

well, they may already be into the thing up to their ears. So I have some questions:

 

why do you want to save this relationship? I mean: you are positive that he is cheating on you and he lies to you.

is that you really really love him? is it the so called "sunk cost" from your relationship? or what?

 

if the MILF theory from niceguy is correct... what would you do/how would you feel? I mean: if he comes back to you?

 

and the keylogger: how would that change the way that you feel? I mean if you find that proof that there is an affair going on OR if you do not find any evidence. in each case what would you do different?

[Milf629]

eh. its his word against the evidence. I cannot decide who or what I beleive. I am positive that I am suspicious for a reason and I need to know. plain and simple I need to know. Need to know the truth. I cannot go forward with anything until I do, and I cannot end it until I do. I love him. up until a couple of months ago things were good. not great always room for improvement but I was happy. and he actually said he was too. would I be throwing it all away for nothing thats my real fear.

[Milf629]

oh and I so am a milf striving more and more everyday so he can really eat his heart out

[iron_m]

eh. its his word against the evidence. I cannot decide who or what I beleive. I am positive that I am suspicious for a reason and I need to know. plain and simple I need to know. Need to know the truth. I cannot go forward with anything until I do, and I cannot end it until I do. I love him. up until a couple of months ago things were good. not great always room for improvement but I was happy. and he actually said he was too. would I be throwing it all away for nothing thats my real fear.

 

I get your point. hope you find out and can do something about it.

 

oh and I so am a milf striving more and more everyday so he can really eat his heart out

 

all the best!

[norajane]

...found his cell phone bill, over 200+ calls to this girl (and thats only with one phone number, that doesn't include times he may have called her at work, or times he may have called her at home or another cell phone, shes originally from MI, living now in CT therefore has 2 cell phones, one from MI one from here) lots and lots of middle of the night calls which was what REALLY bothered me.

I'm sorry, sweets, but there is nothing innocent about 200 phone calls over a month or two, and there is nothing innocent about the lots and lots of middle of the night calls. I have platonic male friends, and I've never done this, and I'm willing to bet a vast majority of platonic friends don't call each other that often, nor in the middle of the night. Do you have any friends, male or female, that you call that often? Your sister? Your mother? No one calls someone that often unless there's something going on.

 

He can spin it however he might, and it's even possible they haven't f***ed yet, but he certainly isn't being honest and faithful to you. Stick to your guns. If this were platonic and he knew it was eroding your marriage, he would stop calling her. That he can't stop is all the information you need about his attachment.

 

Talk to a counselor, talk to a lawyer, and talk to your husband. Be firm - "Your relationship with your 'friend' is destroying our marriage. If this doesn't stop immediately, please find another place to live immediately, and you can speak to me through my lawyer from now on."

[crazy_grl]

Even if he's not having an affair (which at this point, I'd say conclusively that he's having an EA) he's putting his friendship with another person, worst of all another woman, ahead of your feelings and his commitment to his marriage. I doubt that there's any person who could read this thread and say that they think his relationship with this woman is totally platonic. It's obviously not, and you know that. You just wish it were so you're letting him convince you that you're paranoid and out of line.

 

I could understand his position if this were a case of him having had this female as a friend for years and if you were a new gf, but that's not the case. You're his wife and this is a new woman in his life. What he's trying to get away with is *not* acceptable.

 

I say don't bother with the key logger. You've already got more than enough evidence that he's cheating, and if you do find anything, he'll just rationalize it like he's done everything else.

 

How long are you going to let him keep disrespecing you?

[Guest]

Even if he's not having an affair (which at this point, I'd say conclusively that he's having an EA) he's putting his friendship with another person, worst of all another woman, ahead of your feelings and his commitment to his marriage. I doubt that there's any person who could read this thread and say that they think his relationship with this woman is totally platonic. It's obviously not, and you know that. You just wish it were so you're letting him convince you that you're paranoid and out of line.

 

I could understand his position if this were a case of him having had this female as a friend for years and if you were a new gf, but that's not the case. You're his wife and this is a new woman in his life. What he's trying to get away with is *not* acceptable.

 

I say don't bother with the key logger. You've already got more than enough evidence that he's cheating, and if you do find anything, he'll just rationalize it like he's done everything else.

 

How long are you going to let him keep disrespecing you?

 

you know I dont know. I really want to slam him. I mean he is up to his ears in s*** as is, his own family is disgusted with him. I guess yeah....I have alot of fear who wouldn't, I have two young children and have never been so worried about them, about me, about everything. I guess I needed to come here and here some of these things. I still want to slam him though. we have a therapy session next week, I will give myself till then to collect what I can. and yet again I am questioning myself as I type. its scary what this s*** does to a person. i cannot stand it. i keep asking myself is it me? am I the crazy one? is he telling the truth and I just refuse to beleive it? I am SURE I am not the only person to ever have had these thoughts, and then later found out the "truth" but it sure does feel lonely.

[ronehog]

It is platonic now but this is how a relationship starts. For what ever reason he feels a need to talk to her instead of you. Ask him about what she is providing him that you are not. Do this with your counselor. He may find out that he is just as confused as you are.

[Guest]

 

I ended up on this site because of wondering about the "rules" (funny, I know) of separation.

 

YOU are writing about MY life right now. Almost scary reading it from someone who's going thru the same thing, almost word for word. Difference is, I didn't count the calls, just the minutes 800+ in one month. That was back in Aug of '05. Trust me, it may not be physical but he's emotionally having an affair with her.

 

It eats you up. You can't sleep. You can't concentrate. You feel helpless because of having NO control over your own life anymore. You want to trust him but you can't anymore. HE can't decide what he wants; ie marriage to you, freedom to be with her--even though she's married, should he try, shouldn't he? Her husband and your feelings are secondary.

 

Want my advice? Call her. It took me months before I got up the nerve to call his and I've talked to her twice since then. Oh and the first time it was so NOT pretty!! Is she telling you the truth that there's nothing there? Who knows. And you won't know right now. You have the right to call her. Do not call her husband. Tell her how you feel--if nothing else it makes you feel better. He's not listening and he won't.

 

I could tell you my whole story.....the mental breakdown, the depression and the meds, the heartache, the begging on my knees, the drinking, the stress, the 2 day crying binges, the loss of everything you once thought was real, the moving out, the male friends who hit on you when you're vulnerable, one day he's "there" with you, in your marriage, then the next he's gone again, the damn waiting game for him to decide on your future....

 

But the one thing I will say and you need to hear me from someone who is going thru the same scenario: don't give up on yourself. If the marriage doesn't work, don't blame yourself. Don't beat yourself up over the things you should have, could have done. Find a reason to keep going and it has to be more than for the kids, it has to be for you.

 

I tried the counsellor route and that was a joke. Hopefully yours is helping more than mine. And heaven knows, I found my true friends are the ones who won't talk about it unless you bring it up, and even then they don't offer any personal advice, just practical.

 

Funny, I was coming on this site to see if I was right in feeling like I might want to start going out with other men. I'm really scared to and don't know if I'm ready but I am so tired of waiting, so tired of having my life put on hold for him to decide whether he wants to have a life with me anymore. I'm getting very lonely. But I want to be alone. If that makes sense?

[VegasFan]

But the one thing I will say and you need to hear me from someone who is going thru the same scenario: don't give up on yourself. If the marriage doesn't work, don't blame yourself. Don't beat yourself up over the things you should have, could have done. Find a reason to keep going and it has to be more than for the kids, it has to be for you.

 

...

 

Funny, I was coming on this site to see if I was right in feeling like I might want to start going out with other men. I'm really scared to and don't know if I'm ready but I am so tired of waiting, so tired of having my life put on hold for him to decide whether he wants to have a life with me anymore. I'm getting very lonely. But I want to be alone. If that makes sense?

Milf & "Guest": I agree that you shouldn't beat yourself up over it. Some people just cheat, due to personal psychological issues. Don't blame yourself.

I'm a guy, but I went through the same thing as both of y'all about fifteen years ago in my previous relationship. My girl cheated and denied it even to the end when the evidence was crystal clear. It's amazing how pathological people become when they're cheating; they lie to the point where it would almost be funny if it didn't hurt so much. My advice is this: there is no need to wait for the "evidence", just leave. He has already disrespected you and your marriage to the point where getting a divorce is reasonable and perfectly justified IMO. It is not right for someone to disrespect their spouse repeatedly like that. And yes, I would advise you to move on and date other men. I don't think you'll have any problem finding someone milf!

[Guest]

I've been updating (its milf, didn't sign in) in the "JUST the facts" thread under infidelity, if you are interested in a longer more drawn out more detailed version and of course whats been happening since I posted here.

[Lor]

VegasFan,

 

Thanks from "guest". After all the emotional hurtful rollercoaster ride, I did leave for my own piece of mind. And, haven't cried all that much anymore. The funny thing is, the "platonic" emotional relationships that a spouse can have can tear you apart just as badly as a physical affair can. Milf, my husband wouldn't hear of not talking to her anymore either. Couldn't and still can't see the harm in it. And I had never been jealous of anyone in our 11 years together.......till her. Why they ignore how much they hurt us, I won't ever know.

 

Trust me, talk to her. Ask her all the questions you don't understand; Why is she talking to your husband all the time? Why won't she leave him alone? Can't she see what this is doing to your marriage? What about her own marriage? Does she care?

 

I've been there, done that. The first phone call from me was in a rage, filled with 4 letter words. Although I regretted the tone of it, I've never regretted calling. The next 2 were more civilized. I'm not friends with the woman--matter of fact I hate her--but I'm not afraid to call her and ask her something he's thrown in my face when we fight. And I usually find out he's made it up to get under my skin. Childish? Oh yeah. Who in a fight doesn't get childish?