To My MM

[zarathustra]

I hate that I have no desire, at all, to tell your wife about your behavior. I would never want to cause upset in your world, even though you shattered mine.

 

I hate that I am not the only one. But I am the only one that you continue to see. I am the only one you've ever been in love with. I especially hate that.

 

I hate that you can't see how my spirit is literally dying. I am drowning in all of this, but you..you stay afloat.

 

I hate that you told me you loved me first. You did it exactly when I realized that I was feeling this way...the very same week. It made it sooo much easier to fall even farther.

How I felt about my xMM for a long time. Especially the how you would never want to cause upset in his world despite his shattering yours and that my spirit is literally dying.

 

I told my xMM last week that when he told me that he was in love with his wife when we split up last year, that when he said it, I died. I'm physically around, but I'm dead to the world.

[ahotmess]

I feel like I am literally dying. I have never been soo broken. Ever. Been through soo much in life aside from this. But it's never been so bad. I am just going through the motions...and even barely doing that.

[The slayer]

It sounds as if you are in a truly painful and lonely place.

 

I am so very sorry. You communicate how you feel so powerfully.

 

I can see how much in love you are. Ultimately regardless of whether he is married or not feeling this unhappy so much of the time and experiencing only happiness that is tainted by shame, not to mention working yourself into the ground and feeling isolated from everyone around you, is going to have a serious longterm effect on your health and wellbeing. IMHO It kind of needs to change or end.

 

I really can't help thinking that you should show him this thread, rather than hate having to post it here.

 

If he loves you, as you love him, then surely he wouldn't be able bear to contribute to you living this way.

 

If he really loves you in the way you need him to love you, in order to tolerate living with such pain, he couldn't let you feel like this.

Surely he would either have to leave his wife or stop seeing you? Marriages do sometimes end and this isn't always a terrible thing. As the OW, this has to be something that we are prepared to accept as a possible outcome, however distastefull it may be or we walk away the minute we find out as Pink Amulet did.

 

However frightening these possible changes may seem, you can't go on like this for too much longer. It's too damaging for both of you and still potentially his wife.

 

If he is happy to carry on exactly how things are now. I suspect you may have to seriously adjust some of your feelings. You may chose to continue with the relationship, but liberate yourself from some of the hates it brings you, or you may feel the need to leave.

 

I really think you have to at least establish some change or you risking becoming seriously depressed.

 

I really hope you don't think I'm judging you or patronising you. If it does come across that way please accept my apologies., this was very far from my intention, I'm just concerned about you, you articulated your pain so very effectively.

 

xxxxx

[RealityCheck]

Slayer....

 

You are a welcome visitor. Your words ring true.

 

Thank you for your non-judgemental words.

 

You are appreciated.

[ahotmess]

I agree! Slayer please keep posting. The things you say are things that I already know....it is affirming to see them in print.

[zarathustra]

Slayer you've made excellent points. Welcome to the OW forum!

 

ahotmess, I know your pain. I have been there and sometimes I fear I'm setting the stage to get back.

 

One day at a time my friend... one hour at a time if you need it.

 

Many hugs to you and feel free to PM me if you need for my email address.

[Lizzie_D]

I just wanted you to know that you are not alone. I feel this way - all that you've written - every day!!!

 

It makes me so unhappy, so despondent, so wanting to die... sometimes.

 

You really nailed every piece of my thought in this post... but especially the part where I can never, ever hate him!

 

I am for a second feeling strong. I have re read all the posts in here again. The first time i cried, the second I am angry. Why should they make us feel like this. Love, real love, should make us feel so good inside. We go to bed crying, wake up in the night crying, and greet the morning with tears. THIS IS SO WRONG. We deserve better. I don't believe for one second that the MM experience the torment that we do. We only have one life, and we are spending it miserable. Three weeks ago, I wanted to end my life because of it all. I finally agreed to go on antidepressants, and I feel so much better. That is my way of coping, my friend finds comfort in alcohol...I tried that but it made me feel worse the next day.

 

At the end of the day, where are they?...In bed with their wives.

 

What do they give us?....the odd phone call, torment, the odd visit.

What don't they give us?...nights in front of the tv, christmas day together, us being able to speak to them whenever we want, cuddles in bed at night, cooking the evening meal together, walking around in public holding hands, etc etc.

 

And why dont we get any of that...because that is given to the most important person in their life...their wife.

[KnowHowLoveFeels]

IAt the end of the day, where are they?...In bed with their wives.

 

What do they give us?....the odd phone call, torment, the odd visit.

What don't they give us?...nights in front of the tv, christmas day together, us being able to speak to them whenever we want, cuddles in bed at night, cooking the evening meal together, walking around in public holding hands, etc etc.

 

And why dont we get any of that...because that is given to the most important person in their life...their wife.

 

Lizzie,

 

This is not the way I think of my MM. True, he goes to bed with his wife every night - and he may have sex with her every night. But I know that he wants to do all that with ME, really.

 

To my MM, there is no ONE important person. His wife, me, his best friend, his parents, his in-laws, his other friends, his business, his title, and his honor all play important roles in shaping who he is. I know that he loves me, but he cannot be with me - he'd have to lose everything that is important to him. It is not a matter of 'if he loves me, he'd leave his wife'. He has to think about his son, among other things.

 

I don't know if this will help you. But knowing that my MM will always love me more than anything - in fact, he loves me so much - that he cannot disrupt my life, gives me comfort. (I am a MW.) I know that he thinks highly of me, considers me the pilar of a good family structure, and values my opinions. That was enough for me to go on. I used to cry myself to sleep during our earlier days of NC. But understanding all that and wanting to keep the fantasy fresh and lively, have made me a better person.

 

If you love your MM, it doesn't matter that he sleeps with his wife. If you know your MM like you know yourself, you will no longer need to cry. Try it!

[ahotmess]

Lizzie,

I totally agree with you. I wrote these comments or "hates" down in my journal. And when I read them I was sooo pissed....like yeah, why is he so great...? And do I deserve this? Despite what the cowardly "guest" wrote about us...we don't deserve it...and none of us set out to get involved like this. It just happened.

 

But it doesn't change the way I feel. Or how much I will always love him. Or the fact that he is my first true love.

 

You guys are amazing!

 

And here is one other little thought. Say we (OW) get exactly what we want. At least I know this to be the case in my scenario....A cheating husband. Even if he doesn't....the fear will be with us always.

[ahotmess]

I hate that you will not deny your love for me. But that also makes me insanely happy.

 

I hate that our time together is such a hassle for both of us. Moreso you.

 

I hate holding on because I am too afraid of letting go. I hate being afraid to let go.

[Lizzie_D]

My comp playing up, can't get quotes right.

 

Message to To KnowHowLoveFeels...I understand all that you have written. You mentioned that I you know your MM would rather be with you. Not being, s*** its late and I can't get the word in my head, erm not being argumentative (wrong word still), but surely if he would rather be with you, then why isn't he? This is an arguement I have with myself every day.

 

Also, the reason why I am trying to 'get back' into love with my husband is because I can't live two lives. I NEED to feel loved and in love for more of the time than my MM can give me. I went through a few years of not being able to hug my H because I felt guilty to my MM. He has never been an affectionate person to his wife, so his life didn't change. I have to address this problem, because I was very affectionate with my H before MM came along, and I miss it. So I think sod MM now, I am going to do this even if he doesn't like it.

[ahotmess]

"but surely if he would rather be with you, then why isn't he? This is an arguement I have with myself every day."

 

 

I hate that internal argument. If he loved me the way I love him....I would do anything to be with him. The few vague reasons I've received for him staying shouldn't be obstacles.

 

But I know he is genuine. I know he feels trapped. I know I sound pathetic. But I am right about this. I admit he's a coward for not getting out.

[movinon05]

but I will.

 

I hate that you didn't believe enough in the love we had to be strong enough and to realize that we could have had it all.

[KnowHowLoveFeels]

Message to To KnowHowLoveFeels...I understand all that you have written. You mentioned that I you know your MM would rather be with you. Not being, s*** its late and I can't get the word in my head, erm not being argumentative (wrong word still), but surely if he would rather be with you, then why isn't he? This is an arguement I have with myself every day.

 

Also, the reason why I am trying to 'get back' into love with my husband is because I can't live two lives. I NEED to feel loved and in love for more of the time than my MM can give me. I went through a few years of not being able to hug my H because I felt guilty to my MM. He has never been an affectionate person to his wife, so his life didn't change. I have to address this problem, because I was very affectionate with my H before MM came along, and I miss it. So I think sod MM now, I am going to do this even if he doesn't like it.

 

 

Men think very differently from women (duh!). When they weigh in the advantages vs. the disavantages of an action (such as leaving their wives), they do so literally - with number values to each factor. And if you are honest with yourself, you'd agree that him leaving his wife for you is definitely highly 'costly' for him. Now, the 'cost' is not always a monetary value... but it is a real value to men. They all do this.

 

Another thing about men: love is an internal feeling, much like 'respect'. It is undeniable and indestructible (for the most part), and it does not need to be demonstrated if it is understood. It is akin to a feeling you'd have for your closest sibling... you know that what you feel for him/her is unconditional, but you don't feel the need to prove it.

 

So back to your question: 'if he wants to be with you, then why isn't he?'

Well, the simple answer is that being with you presents too many 'disavantages' to him... BUT, that does not mean that he doesn't love you. Being in love with you and being with you physically are two different things. I finally understood this, too.

 

I have been in NC with my MM for the past 7 months, and my understanding of him have grown... just by the memories of his words and actions when we were together.

 

Lizzy, if you are trying to get back in love with your H, you have to get yourself out of this forum! LOL! When I am here, I am not with my H.

[KnowHowLoveFeels]

but I will.

 

I hate that you didn't believe enough in the love we had to be strong enough and to realize that we could have had it all.

 

That's so beautiful, MO.

 

I, too, have struggled with this. To us (strong women), we believe that we can have it all; we'll do whatever it takes, we'll work harder/extra hours, or whatever. But men rarely think this way. They view every move as a business transaction: a little win is always accompanied by a little loss. To them, there's no free lunch. If a move/transaction appears disavantageous to them, they'd not do it. That doesn't mean that what they feel for you is not real. It is, but men can generally separate their feelings from 'rational thinking.'

[Blind Illusion]

Here are a few things you should know:

 

I hate the feeling I have when you leave me, because I am never sure if it will be the last time I see you. I'm not afraid of being alone. I am comfortable with myself. I am afraid of my life without you in it.

 

I hate the fact that my dream come true, would be someones worst nightmare. The thing that would make me happiest, would be so damaging to another soul.

 

I hate the way that I know what you are thinking. Even worse that you know my thoughts. To a " T ".

 

I hate that I can love something that makes me cry every night.

 

I hate the fact that I never had a real chance with you. And that I never will.

 

I hate our honesty. Sometimes things really are better left unsaid.

 

I hate that everything reminds me of you. Every song. Every joke. Every story. Every movie. Every breath. Everything reminds me.

 

I hate that there is no magic pill to rid my heart of you. I really would sell my soul to get you out of my mind. But I would never trade a single moment.

 

I hate that my happiest times, cause me shame.

 

I hate that I waited 24yrs to hear something.....that I can't share with the world.

 

I hate the fact that no one understands.

 

I hate that you have something without me. Yet I am empty handed.

 

I hate that I didn't save my heart for someone who can truly love.

 

But I would never hate you. I can't. I am sure that as long as there is an ounce of life in me, I will love you with all that I have. There is nothing that I would not forsake to have you. But I would give everything I had to hate you, even though I never could.

 

And I hate that you made me even write this dumb s*** down. It sucks to feel like this.

 

And I just thought you should know.

 

This is such a wonderful heart felt post and I can identify with many things. Sometimes, I would add though, that I hate you because I love you so much. And when that would seem insane to me, I would hate myself because I couldn't stop loving you.

[bunset]

but I will.

 

I hate that you didn't believe enough in the love we had to be strong enough and to realize that we could have had it all.

 

Here... let me quote that again, because it deserves it!

[bunset]

Men think very differently from women (duh!). When they weigh in the advantages vs. the disavantages of an action (such as leaving their wives), they do so literally - with number values to each factor. And if you are honest with yourself, you'd agree that him leaving his wife for you is definitely highly 'costly' for him. Now, the 'cost' is not always a monetary value... but it is a real value to men. They all do this.

 

Another thing about men: love is an internal feeling, much like 'respect'. It is undeniable and indestructible (for the most part), and it does not need to be demonstrated if it is understood. It is akin to a feeling you'd have for your closest sibling... you know that what you feel for him/her is unconditional, but you don't feel the need to prove it.

 

So back to your question: 'if he wants to be with you, then why isn't he?'

Well, the simple answer is that being with you presents too many 'disavantages' to him... BUT, that does not mean that he doesn't love you. Being in love with you and being with you physically are two different things. I finally understood this, too.

 

I have been in NC with my MM for the past 7 months, and my understanding of him have grown... just by the memories of his words and actions when we were together.

 

Lizzy, if you are trying to get back in love with your H, you have to get yourself out of this forum! LOL! When I am here, I am not with my H.

 

and again, worth repeating..

Because I actually keep coming back here for support to end my 16yr M, even without my xMM around!

I just know I cannot get back to where I started with my H (even though he doesn't know about the A) Because of everything I became to cause the A and everything that has happened since then.

I am NOT the same woman I was before I opened myself up to the A, and I'll never be the same. Because something was revealed to me that has changed who I am. Now I have to move on and be that new person.

Even if the xMM doesn't.

[Guest]

I hate that I cannot imagine my life without you.

 

I hate that I wake up thinking about you, I go to sleep thinking about you, that I cannot for one second seem to get you out of my head, even when I am sleeping.

 

I hate that you have given me this impression of her, so if I ever meet her, I will believe her to be what you have told me, you took away my chance of getting to know her, you took away the possibility that she could have been a friend to me, and that I will never know.

 

I hate that you know every button of mine, and know what it does to me, when to push it, and how hard.

 

I hate that I say I want out, and I really truly do want an end to this situation, but yet I am not willing, nor do I want to let the end be without you.

 

I hate that you wear the ring no matter what.

 

I hate that I don’t know if you are telling me the truth about anything, and that I have to trust you even though I know you are breaking someone else’s trust whenever we are together.

 

I hate that you are married.

 

I hate that it’s not to me.

 

I hate that this has been the most fulfilling, but yet the most dysfunctional relationship I have ever been in.

 

I hate that I am, and will always be known to you as, the other woman (no matter what happens with us).

 

I hate that I will lose my nerve and not send this to you.

[KnowHowLoveFeels]

and again, worth repeating..

Because I actually keep coming back here for support to end my 16yr M, even without my xMM around!

I just know I cannot get back to where I started with my H (even though he doesn't know about the A) Because of everything I became to cause the A and everything that has happened since then.

I am NOT the same woman I was before I opened myself up to the A, and I'll never be the same. Because something was revealed to me that has changed who I am. Now I have to move on and be that new person.

Even if the xMM doesn't.

 

Thanks, bunset.

 

Being on this forum has taught me so much about the nature of an affair and about my MM. In many ways, they are all the same: they give us hope and passionate love.

 

So many women on this forum attest to being in love like they've never been in love before. I wonder how this can be possible. The affair is wrong and unfair to us, OWs, yet, how can it possibly give us such an elevated sense of 'love'? But it does! I felt it... even before I had a chance to think about the rationality of my affair with this MM. It is not an imaginary feeling based on senseless 'hope'. It was real even before I knew what it was I was feeling. And to explain this feeling to someone who has never felt it before is like describing the colors of the sunset to the blind - it is virtually impossible!

 

I know that our liason is wrong; and we've agreed to not continue.

 

But one thing that the affair did to me was changing me in ways that I could have never anticipated. Since the affair, I've become fearless and so much more confident in myself. I will never go back to where I was before the A. I will never let my H treat me the way he used to treat me before the A. I will never lose my temper because of my H's inconsideration again. All because I have been to the bottom of the pit - and back!

 

Girls. Think about what the affair has done for you!

 

Addendum: I do not condone affairs. No way! I think that it is demeaning to the soul. I had a brief moment of passion with a MM, and I miss him ever since, but it has also taught me alot about life and about myself. For those of you who are in pain because you are an OW, please get the strength to leave the affair, and you will come out so much stronger. That's what happened to me. I had to clarify that.

[bunset]

please re-read ^ what KHLF wrote above.

 

I hate that I have to walk through this fire to burn away the parts of me that need removing.

 

I am astonished, yet comforted by the knowledge that I am changed, some for the good, some for the unpleasant.

 

That is why I do understand the incredible intensity of these feelings. How 'we' have been so overwhelmed by this love, like no other, that is understood as wrong. It is the wrong time and place, but so obviously the right two people.

That is why we are here. we wouldn't have come here if we weren't so powerfully affected.

Hundreds of couples have affairs everyday, but really, so few are so transformed. We need to be here because of that. We have been put in this to learn something, some life lesson. Be open to it.

[bananas]

I hate to sound so unsympathetic towards all of you, but nobody forced any of you to get involved with a MM... It does not matter whether they were honest with you or not, unless they flat out lied about being married or with someone in the first place. YOU chose to get involved with someone who was already with somebody.

 

Stop playing the victim, think about the wife/gf, or husband/bf for that matter. Not to mention YOUR OWN PARTNER if that applies. Think about what they are going through or will be going through.

 

Personally, I think most people who get involved with people who are already involved with someone else have some kind of confidence/esteem issue... Work on yourself and then work on finding someone who can make you feel good who is availible for you and you only.

 

Or would that not be challenging enough? I just want to clear up that im not "hatin'" on anyone, i realize people make mistakes and so have i, but it really annoys me when people play victim and cry "poor little meeeee" when they deep down know what they are getting into. You can tell me how "sweet" and "charming" and "handsome" or "seductive" or whatever you want, but the thing that seperates us from the rest of the animal kingdom is our logic and I think some people need to make better use of that part of the brain.

[Sami_D]

it really annoys me when people play victim and cry "poor little meeeee" when they deep down know what they are getting into.

 

The thing is, that affairs don't affect everyone the same way. Which of us OW or exOW can truly say that they knew what they were getting into? Or they knew what emotions, what difficulties, were ahead? I didn't. You're right that those of us who weren't lied to had a free choice to begin an affair... but that doesn't mean we were prepared for what lay ahead.

 

This thread, I think, shows one aspect of affairs. And I will grant you (AND I believe, a lot of the OW who are posting on it will say the same thing...) that there is a lot of weakness here... a lot of blaming the MM for what happened. I don't know whether a lot of that didn't stem from the initial format of the thread... 'I hate... etc.'

 

But I'll tell you this. I haven't added to this thread because I just don't feel this way about what happened in my affair. I can say yes, I hated the sight of his wedding ring (and I did), but I knew what it symbolised, I knew he was M, and I knew it was my choice to be involved with him. So I don't feel the need to write about it. It was part and parcel of the affair, nothing more. I certainly don't feel the need to blame him for it. Or for anything that happened. I wasn't suckered in, I knew I could walk away, and I have.

 

That doesn't mean I didn't suffer... Oh, I suffered. But (and as you say), I knew that the cure for that suffering was in my own hands. I wasn't a helpless victim. Nor are many millions of other people who have affairs. I also didn't (and still don't) need a man (single or M) to complete my life. I was involved with him because he was someone I loved to talk to, loved to share things with, loved to be with. I truly loved him, and the feelings were mutual. Very simple.

 

I was only ever in the affair because he was sure his R with his W was over. However, we found out, during the course of being together, that while R's with Ws might be over, the ending of a M can be quite a different matter altogether. And having an A, far from hastening the end of a M, can often (as it did in our case) help a MM to stay stuck where he is... the emotional support of an OW will help a failed M to continue.

 

And so we ended it, by mutual agreement. We are now NC, unless and until he finds the strength to leave his M. This (us being together) is what we both want, and what we've both always planned for. There was never any intention for this to be an affair, pure and simple.

 

I am not sure my story has a lot of relevance to this thread as a whole. But I just wanted to reply to this particular post which, though it has a deal of truth to it, only sees one side of affairs, and makes quite a lot of assumptions. The people posting on this thread may sound like they're throwing a pity-party, but they are just expressing one aspect of affairs in general (and probably even of their own affair).

 

I think if there was a similar thread on the positives resulting from affairs you may have a different picture entirely.

 

Or would that not be challenging enough?

 

And yes, I think that people do often go into situations blindly... and they turn out to be experiences which are, as you say, challenging. Each of us needs to make our own mistakes in life in order to grow. Not all of us have reached maturity, full knowledge of ourselves, and full expression of all that we can be. I am sure this also applies to you . Everything each of us write shouts of something we don't know about ourselves or about life. Rather than pointing a finger derisively I think it is always better to ask... what am I missing about my own life? (this is said with the best intentions and is not intended as a flame).

[zarathustra]

I hate to sound so unsympathetic towards all of you, but nobody forced any of you to get involved with a MM... It does not matter whether they were honest with you or not, unless they flat out lied about being married or with someone in the first place. YOU chose to get involved with someone who was already with somebody.

 

Stop playing the victim, think about the wife/gf, or husband/bf for that matter. Not to mention YOUR OWN PARTNER if that applies. Think about what they are going through or will be going through.

 

Personally, I think most people who get involved with people who are already involved with someone else have some kind of confidence/esteem issue... Work on yourself and then work on finding someone who can make you feel good who is availible for you and you only.

 

Or would that not be challenging enough? I just want to clear up that im not "hatin'" on anyone, i realize people make mistakes and so have i, but it really annoys me when people play victim and cry "poor little meeeee" when they deep down know what they are getting into. You can tell me how "sweet" and "charming" and "handsome" or "seductive" or whatever you want, but the thing that seperates us from the rest of the animal kingdom is our logic and I think some people need to make better use of that part of the brain.

This is exactly the attitude that a lot of us are talking about in the past week. We are not here for sympathy or to play the victim game. We are here because finding people in the same situation helps us get through some tough times. It basically comes down to one word: EMPATHY. Empathy does not equate that you feel sorry for someone, that you understand them or that you agree with what they have done.

 

Having gone down this road myself and still on the road to recovery, I can truly say what you are saying is no different than kicking someone when they are already down.

 

Yeah, so what if we have a f***ing pity party?!?? Don't you have one of those sometimes?

[bananas]

Ok, i apologize for sounding a little harsh. I guess I should have a little more empathy, I was the OM for a MW at one point 3 years ago for about 6 months. I was crushed, it took me a long time to get over it. Thing is, is that I needed to hear the truth straight up, and once i did it was very easy for me to see how foolish and silly I was. I think part of the problem is that at the time I sucked horribly with women.... attracting them was easy but keeping them, that's a different story. I was so clingy, so needy and had no sense of independence. This drove women away from me, and i finally found a women who was as crazy about me as i was her, but she happened to be married. I fell for all the bs, to make a long story short, i got played big time. Thankfully I've come to grips with it and came out a strong, self-sufficient, independent man instead of a groveling idiot like i was before. It took alot of soul searching, research, etc but I got there.

Im now in a very serious,very functional and loving relationship because I worked on myself. Once I did that, the love of my life was bound to walk into my life and she has. Once again, i apologize for being a bit brash, but I think people need to "suck it up" and get on with life, you'll be glad you did.