How Do Wives Do It?

[BUTAFLY]

Ladyjane, thanxs for the repost. It is humbling to read that. I sat around analyzing, rationalizing, questioning my own questions over and over- where did I go wrong? how could he do this if he loves me or loves her for that fact? I have come to the same simple conclusion ManAlive, StoopidGuy and Bullhunter have. Its just good to hear it confirmed-it feels like closure.

 

I am apauld that a man can tell such things just to get laid...I think it soo cruel and the damage is emense, and the fact that he can go home and not think twice about the OW is sicking.

 

But My question to the men...Expectally ManAlive, if your reading this please help me understand if there are no lengths a man will go through, no lie too big to tell, then how is a women suppose to know when a real man is sincere?

[Ladyjane14]

If from day one, she's required to share (and we're assuming here that she knows he's married) it seems she's willing to put more into the relationship than the SO. She loves him despite the fact that he's married. Maybe because he's willing to take a greater risk to be with her?

 

I think this might be wishful thinking on your part, SG.

 

More frequently than not, OWs are initially moved by sympathy for whatever story the MM shares with them. Only the MM knows which bits of his "story" are true and which parts are false by virtue of factual omissions.

 

Sympathy then opens the door for a more intensely emotional friendship. First thing you know.... hope for a continuation and evolution of the relationship blossoms. Some OWs go in hoping for an extended EMR, some hope for exclusivity. Only a RARE handful will tolerate an arrangement based singularly on casual sex, despite whatever their previous intentions to the contrary are at start-up.

 

So, the OW throws her hat into the ring based on whatever story she's been told. And even if she initially decides that she's going to keep the relationship casual.... that doesn't always pan out. More often than not, she'll end up emotionally engaged.

 

Then the game begins in earnest, because she doesn't know if "the story" is the truth, a lie, or a bundle of both.

 

Unfortunately, too many swallow the bait.... hook, line, and sinker like some kind of big-mouthed bass. And they won't find out where they stand until much further on down the line.

 

No... I don't think that OWs intentionally risk MORE. I think they're often misled on the extent of the emotional risk they're making. MM says... "My marriage is dead." OW believes him. Simple as that.

 

The path is strewn with cowpats though. There are too many variables at work. Is the MM honest? Is he lying to get her panties down? Is he simply angry with his wife and frustrated with his marriage? Will he REALLY leave? And then there's the wife, herself, a wildcard... unpredictable.

 

Nope.... I don't buy that the OW is "willing to put more" into it. I think maybe she doesn't fully appreciate the emotional risks of dipping her toes in the water until it's too late and she's in up to her neck.

 

The smart money is to NEVER involve yourself romantically with married people. Failing that... the best thing a girl can do is to believe what she sees and not what she hears. Actions speak louder than words, right.

 

Back on topic though... the murky set of variables provided to the OW is a wholly different thing from what the wife knows in making her decision to forgive. The OW might be privy to knowledge of the affair, but the wife has knowledge of the man himself.

 

If he's a good man, and if his heart is generally in the right place, the behavior may have been an aberration.... something out of character and indicative of solvable problems. A good man might get some latitude.

 

If he's a bad man, the wife might still take him back. Sometimes she's not quite ready to strike out on her own, so she'll smoothe things out... then burn his ass later when she's got her ducks in a row.

 

Unfortunately, some wives aren't really sure if they've got a good man or a bad one. If the marriage is in it's infancy, it's difficult to tell.

These kind of wives might give the 'tie to the runner' and provide him with another chance to prove himself, simply because she's unsure and hasn't fully guaged his character yet.

[Ladyjane14]

But My question to the men...Expectally ManAlive, if your reading this please help me understand if there are no lengths a man will go through, no lie too big to tell, then how is a women suppose to know when a real man is sincere?

 

It's an interesting perspective that we've seen from some of these guys so far. I don't think that any ONE view is going to hold true for every MM, but I do believe that the sexual drive can provide powerful impetus for some of these guys.

 

I'm with you Butafly, I'd like to hear more about this. I'm thinking some might be worried about offending people, and hey... they might indeed get flamed by a few for their stance. But I hope they won't be put off by it.

 

 

(Thanks for the kind words btw, Silk. )

[ManAlive]

ok, you wanted to know if a man really is into you?

 

I know that MM do leave their wives. A colleague of mine had two affairs during his marriage. The first one was like mine, he kept telling her to be patient but he had no intention of leaving his wife. The second one he fell hard for and within weeks he left his wife. Suddenly the problems of the kids and the house didn't matter because he loved this woman and they are now married.

 

So simple as that sounds, to know whether a MM loves you is whether he leaves. The second he gives you any kind of excuse why he cannot do it right NOW, he is lying.

 

My sister had a book, can't remember the name of it now, about how to tell if a guy really likes you. Never read it myself, but she would read snippets of it over Sunday lunch at my parents, aimed mainly at my casanova brother and we both agreed with a lot of the sentiments. Although to be honest, I think it gave bro even more ideas...

[newbby]

I think some of you are giving more credit for 'deep thinking' to some of these guys than they truly deserve. Not every MM is moved by his feelings. It's a difficult thing to accept, but some of these guys view sex simply as a commodity and they're willing to do what they have to do in order to get it. I refer you to this earlier post by ManAlive:

 

 

 

This is the truth for some of these guys. It's not something that most women can wrap their minds around..... but it is what it is. Men are both simpler and more complicated than we give them credit for.

 

You know how sometimes when you ask a man... "Honey, what are you thinking about?", and he says "Nothing.".....

 

You know what he's really thinking about???

 

Nothing.

 

:laugh: :laugh:

 

Hello LJ ,

thanks for posting this, i had not seen it the first time around. i think we women often underestimate how important sex is to a man. this is why we cant wrap our heads around it.

i think the difficult thing for most ow, is when they know this on some level, but then really, really cannot get to grips with dealing with the fact that they have been misled, made a fool of, had their emotions run through the ringer, all so they could be somebodys plaything.

[newbby]

ya know, I dont think I ever really believed his original story. It always seemed more like it's what he wanted to believe - or wanted his wife to believe. Though I've gotta admit that I did enjoy the way he told it.

 

It's kinda changed a little with time, though, don't ya think?

 

hey silk ,

i agree. i didnt actually believe his original story either, but if he is going to come out with it, then i will react to it, i have a thing for getting people to admit the truth , maybe thats why i went for a mm

i think from reading this, it has changed, though i havent been around for a few months.

[newbby]

ok, you wanted to know if a man really is into you?

 

I know that MM do leave their wives. A colleague of mine had two affairs during his marriage. The first one was like mine, he kept telling her to be patient but he had no intention of leaving his wife. The second one he fell hard for and within weeks he left his wife. Suddenly the problems of the kids and the house didn't matter because he loved this woman and they are now married.

 

So simple as that sounds, to know whether a MM loves you is whether he leaves. The second he gives you any kind of excuse why he cannot do it right NOW, he is lying.

 

My sister had a book, can't remember the name of it now, about how to tell if a guy really likes you. Never read it myself, but she would read snippets of it over Sunday lunch at my parents, aimed mainly at my casanova brother and we both agreed with a lot of the sentiments. Although to be honest, I think it gave bro even more ideas...

 

thanks again man alive for an honest post,

i think this is the kind of thing which is hard to swallow for ow. in dealing with the reality of the affair, and the fact that mm swindled them, the only thing ow has to hang on to is this kind of mantra "dont take it personally, dont take it personally...". then this kind of story brings it right back to a personal thing. so she was only good enough to be tricked for sex, and it was nothing to do with where mm's head was at the time.

i wish there was a way to make ow, and ex ow feel better about the whole thing, but i cannot think of one.

[newbby]

actually, man alive, perhaps you could help here...

as a small way of making it up to otherwomankind

what advice would you give to the ow, on getting out of the relationship, on what to say to mm as a final word, if anything? just something to make ow feel slightly better on their way out of the door?

i think alot of ow at this point tell the wife in a moment of understandable anger, and though it would not be a personal choice of move for me, for various reasons, i can certainly understand it. after all mm has tricked everyone, and gotten away with it. w and ow are both distraught. it seems so unfair really.

 

i would also like to thank you for your original post. it has angered me so much that ow are unable to tell the truth of the affair on this board without being flamed. ow say they were tricked, and heavily pursued by a conniving mm, and are often told this could not be the case. told that they convinced themselves of this, etc. i think this only adds further confusion to the ow's poor head.

 

it is a fact that alot of mm lie and trick ow into bed, and it is a fact that the ow, is usually incredibly vulnerable when she becomes involved.

[BUTAFLY]

ok, you wanted to know if a man really is into you?

 

ManAliveThanx for responding But, I want to know about a single men in general. I'm guessing a lot of women in here are ex-ow getting over or wanting to get over a mm. I don't think any of us will go back in the situtation w/another mm.

 

I was swindled, used, a plaything for one man who told me he was single when he was not. I thought I did everything right. He chased ME for months at work- making it blatanly obvious he was interested in me. He finally gave me his number and we talked for hours every night until I accepted a date.

 

We had dated for 3 months when I met his siblings, over time i've slept at his apartment, went out drinking w/ him and his friends. This man was soooo good at lying and even had his siblings and friends lying for him. I was on cloud nine thinking my new boyfriend is great, telling my friends I met this new great guy ...YADA YADA YADA five months later he confesses he's getting married in a week, but was so kind to say things between us didnt have to change . You want to talk depressed...I was so distraught. For a day or two I actually considered his offer. Anything to keep him in my life, but by the grace of God, I walked away.

 

So how is a women suppose to know if a man- single man is sincere? This guy put in some real time, played the part but wasn't real.

BTW-ps.

I know that MM do leave their wives. A colleague of mine had two affairs during his marriage.... The second one he fell hard for and within weeks he left his wife.

The women he was marrying was his 2nd OW from his first marriage also. (wife kicked him out he didn't leave)

 

pss:

to potential flame throwers: Pls save the flames. I know my situation is different from yours. But getting info from reformed players is invaluable to me right now. Thank you

[stoopid_guy]

I think this might be wishful thinking on your part, SG.

 

More frequently than not, OWs are initially moved by sympathy for whatever story the MM shares with them. Only the MM knows which bits of his "story" are true and which parts are false by virtue of factual omissions.

 

It's definately wishful thinking, LJ. But wishing for something doesn't make it impossible, or mean you should stop wishing. (How many of us buy lottery tickets?)

 

It's also very possible for a MM to mistake sympathy for something more, especially a MM who's lonely and frustrated. (Thanks much for pointing that out.)

[Ladyjane14]

i think we women often underestimate how important sex is to a man. this is why we cant wrap our heads around it.

i think the difficult thing for most ow, is when they know this on some level, but then really, really cannot get to grips with dealing with the fact that they have been misled, made a fool of, had their emotions run through the ringer, all so they could be somebodys plaything.

 

We're not men. We're just left guessing on what it is to be marinating in testosterone day after day.

 

For those women who are paying attention, we might notice a slight elevation in testosterone levels about twice a month... but it's marginal in comparison to what a man is dealing with EVERY DAY. Even so, during those brief times before ovulation and menstruation the raise in libido is often a perceptible one.

 

I'm sure I posted this before, but I remember watching a program on TV several years ago about a guy who was getting a sex change operation. As the female hormones kicked in and the testosterone levels dropped, he likened the lack of constant drive to almost a white noise, something that you don't really hear until it stops.

 

Well, this really opened my eyes. I couldn't imagine living with something like that on a daily basis. So, I have to wonder if maybe this influence can be causal in a guy making poor choices. I think maybe it can negatively affect a man's judgement in some cases, causing rationalizations and justifications that don't necessarily coincide with his higher reasoning.

 

If that's the case... then some of these MM won't realize that they're rationalizing until the bill comes due. The wife finds out, and suddenly the MM realizes that there was a flaw in his judgement. His contrition is usually the basis for his wife's forgiveness decision.

 

While I don't discount 'The Player', I think maybe the majority of MM who commit adultery and then recant probably fit the 'momentary poor judgement' profile. The Player, of course, feels consistantly justified in his actions. His view is a narcissistic one, and he feels entitled.

 

Again, it's the difference between being a pretty good guy at heart and being a bad guy, selfish to his core.

[Ladyjane14]

It's also very possible for a MM to mistake sympathy for something more, especially a MM who's lonely and frustrated.

 

I agree with you on that, SG. I think it can definitely work both ways. But I hope you'll bear in mind the suffering of some of these ladies here in the OW forum before you commit yourself to developing your current friendship in a romantic way.

 

You take all these feelings of friendship and sympathy and then put them in a nice warm petrie dish.... next thing you know stuff is GROWING.

Before long, you realize that things have grown out of control.

 

This is why it's so important for you to resolve your primary relationship before starting another. People are likely to get their feelings hurt if you don't. You, yourself, might be one of them.

[stoopid_guy]

I hope you'll bear in mind the suffering of some of these ladies here in the OW forum before you commit yourself to developing your current friendship in a romantic way.

 

I will, been reading a lot lately. This lady is the best friend I've had in a long time, I don't want to hurt her.

 

This is why it's so important for you to resolve your primary relationship before starting another.

 

Talking to a lawyer next week... Life is very much "up in the air" right now...

[newbby]

We're not men. We're just left guessing on what it is to be marinating in testosterone day after day.

 

For those women who are paying attention, we might notice a slight elevation in testosterone levels about twice a month... but it's marginal in comparison to what a man is dealing with EVERY DAY. Even so, during those brief times before ovulation and menstruation the raise in libido is often a perceptible one.

 

I'm sure I posted this before, but I remember watching a program on TV several years ago about a guy who was getting a sex change operation. As the female hormones kicked in and the testosterone levels dropped, he likened the lack of constant drive to almost a white noise, something that you don't really hear until it stops.

 

Well, this really opened my eyes. I couldn't imagine living with something like that on a daily basis. So, I have to wonder if maybe this influence can be causal in a guy making poor choices. I think maybe it can negatively affect a man's judgement in some cases, causing rationalizations and justifications that don't necessarily coincide with his higher reasoning.

 

If that's the case... then some of these MM won't realize that they're rationalizing until the bill comes due. The wife finds out, and suddenly the MM realizes that there was a flaw in his judgement. His contrition is usually the basis for his wife's forgiveness decision.

 

While I don't discount 'The Player', I think maybe the majority of MM who commit adultery and then recant probably fit the 'momentary poor judgement' profile. The Player, of course, feels consistantly justified in his actions. His view is a narcissistic one, and he feels entitled.

 

Again, it's the difference between being a pretty good guy at heart and being a bad guy, selfish to his core.

 

yes, i notice this around ovulation, for about a day.

interesting lj, i will have to keep this in mind during every encounter with the os.

[Guest]

 

 

When I met the OW, she at first wasn’t interested but we got to talking about the little problems I was having in my marriage. I never told her about the good stuff, because when you are upset about something you’re not thinking about that. I noticed that the more I exaggerated what my wife was like, the more affectionate she became, so I carried on. I said some really awful things about my W, things I am ashamed to repeat here. Eventually we started an affair. Finally I was getting the amount of sex I wanted, and I didn’t want that to end.

 

After a while, she went from being cool about everything to getting more and more upset whenever I mentioned my W, kids etc. Over a period of about six months, she went from only being in it for fun like I was, to seeming more intense. To get to the sex, we had to go through a lot of talking about our feelings etc.

 

And frankly, I wanted to get to the sex part, so I told her stuff I shouldn’t have. She would get upset and wonder if I had feelings for her, so I told her that I loved her. She wondered how I could love two people, so I told her that my marriage was over, it was just a loveless arrangement now for the sake of the kids. She asked me if I still slept with my wife. Hell, I may be dumb, but I know the answer to that one.

 

And when I had held her and stroked her hair, told her how much she meant to me, she had sex with me. Mission accomplished. Not necessarily the same day, sometimes she just wanted to know I wanted her for herself. But sex was a big part of our relationship because otherwise what’s the point?

 

As time went on, I got the feeling that she would stop seeing me if I didn’t leave my wife. See my point above – no man wants to lose the sex he’s getting and will do pretty much anything to hang onto it. So I told her what she wanted to hear, and pretty convincingly too. I discovered that most women will think you are amazing for saying you can’t do that to your kids. They will tell you that they couldn’t be with someone who didn’t care that much for the kids anyway. Oh, and the major thing I told her was when she asked me who I would choose if I had to make a choice – of course I told OW that I would choose her.

 

So anyway, a few white lies and she’s agreeing to wait a few years (by which time I hoped I’d have thought of something else), and we’re back to having sex.

 

Eventually, through a mutual “friend”, my W finds out and is distraught. She knew we were going through a not so good time, but unlike me she also knew we would get through it and was prepared to grit her teeth through the not so good times.

 

When my W found out, my world crumbled. I had to face things I hadn’t wanted to face. I had told myself that what my W didn’t know wouldn’t hurt her and didn’t let myself think about the fact I might lose her. Suddenly, all the problems we had been having disappeared, and I saw only the woman who had pledged her life to me, borne my children, held my head when I was sick, made me my favourite sandwiches for lunch. And I had hurt her desperately. And all for someone who was little more than a regular lay for me. Sure I was fond of the OW, but what I felt for her was nothing compared to what my W and our history meant. It took the shock of my W finding out for me to realise that fully.

 

There was no way I was going to leave my W for someone who knew me so little. OW thought she knew me, but that knowledge was based on all the hair-stroking gentle kisses sweet-talk. It was false, to stop her breaking up with me.

 

When I told the OW I was staying with my W, the crap hit the fan and she went hysterical for a while. I’d told my W what I now knew to be the truth – that the OW was just sex and affection. But the OW was threatening to spill the beans on what I had told her. And I had told her those things, but I didn’t want my W to believe they were true, because they weren’t. I did not want to hurt the OW by saying they were all lies, because I didn’t want to mess her up for life. OK, so this is where I become a real bastard. So I met up with the OW one final time, and yes we had sex. I’m not proud of that, but it was a part of convincing her what I told her. I cried and said how much I loved her and wanted her and that my W was holding the kids and the house over my head. I said that I had decided to sacrifice our happiness together and hoped she would understand. Of course she did, because I piled on the flattery tearfully. I held her and buried my face in her neck and she even said I was shaking at one point. She told me she understood and that she would always love me if I changed my mind.

 

I drove away, breathed a huge sigh of relief and went back to my beautiful wife. I cannot now believe my stupidity – that I was willing to risk it all for some woman who I had never spent long periods of time with. The occasional night, one weekend, but apart from that just snatches of time here and there. That isn’t a real relationship. My OW believed we were soulmates, and I used to tell her I agreed. She wasn’t my soulmate. My soulmate is the woman who is there waiting for me every night. The OW and I never got over that honeymoon period (how can you when you don’t share all your life with someone) and as I now know, it’s once that period is over that the real love starts.

 

So why do wives take back cheating partners? I don’t know, but thank god they do. Because otherwise I’d be stuck with someone I’d started off lying to, trying to find a way to get my wife back.

 

Sorry if this all makes me sound cold, I just wanted to state a few hard facts. Because I was that man who whispered love and devotion and promises. I don’t kid myself that anyone is going to apply this to their situation (you’ll tell yourself that your MM is different and he means what he says), but hopefully it might hit home with someone and you’ll stop yourself being hurt before he does it for you. If I could turn back time, I would. Three hurting people would not now be in pain.

 

 

ManAlive, I feel sorry for your wife because after all of that lying and manipulating, you cannot convince me that you're a totally different person now.

 

I think what Cassoria said rocks. We women need to ban together---not attack each other.

[bullhunter]

Why is it that when discussion turns to the men, it's always the "lying and manipulating" man. But when I say that the woman lied and manipulated me, nobody, but nobody believes me? It Is The Truth.

 

What I did with it was shameful. What I did was shameful. I will carry that shame for the rest of my life. I will carry regret for the pain I caused my wife the rest of my life. There is no excuse for what I did, and I take full responsibility for what I did.

 

I would have liked to see the OW take responsibility for what SHE did. I started reading and writing on this forum, hoping against hope that somewhere, sometime I'd see at least one woman admit to the manipulation that went on on her side, because I doubt that the woman who manipulated me was the ONLY ONE out there to do that.

[stoopid_guy]

I started reading and writing on this forum, hoping against hope that somewhere, sometime I'd see at least one woman admit to the manipulation that went on on her side, because I doubt that the woman who manipulated me was the ONLY ONE out there to do that.

 

BH, I don't think you get the types of ladies in this forum that you're talking about. By the same token, I haven't seen any men who are "players." To be honest, I suspect that type's just too shallow to be interested in participating.

 

(And if anyone's wondering, consider that a sincere compliment to the participants here.)

[mopar crazy]

Why is it that when discussion turns to the men, it's always the "lying and manipulating" man. But when I say that the woman lied and manipulated me, nobody, but nobody believes me? It Is The Truth.

 

What I did with it was shameful. What I did was shameful. I will carry that shame for the rest of my life. I will carry regret for the pain I caused my wife the rest of my life. There is no excuse for what I did, and I take full responsibility for what I did.

 

I would have liked to see the OW take responsibility for what SHE did. I started reading and writing on this forum, hoping against hope that somewhere, sometime I'd see at least one woman admit to the manipulation that went on on her side, because I doubt that the woman who manipulated me was the ONLY ONE out there to do that.

 

BH, my H could of wrote your post. His xOW lied to him too. And I know he feels the same way you do b/c he tells me time and time again...even 3 years later.

 

The xOW was the one that persued my H shortly after he started working where she worked. I wont get into the whole story unless you want. But I knew she lied to my H b/c she told me things and her own H told me things that weren't what she told my H.

 

I knew the xOW, thought we were friends, until she started persuing my H and that was the end of that. I tried so hard to avoid her when I went to go see H at work but as soon as I walked in the door she was right there wanting to talk. She even gave me a hug once. She was a HUGE manipulater, even her own MIL said she was.

 

To the OP: You asked how W do it...go back to a cheating H. I know you have tons of answers and I don't have the time to read them all but my ? for you is....Why did you get involved w/ someone who is M?

[Guest]

I don't consider you offensive at all. I still have to wonder why wives take these men back?

 

My answer: Love a little bit. Low self esteem- a lot. They do not want anyone else to have him. Finding out that their man has cheated makes them threatened and competitive and they would rather keep him than let him go and be with someone else. It's a control thing and an attempt to prove that they are the better woman. Also, if women are getting older they have less opportunity to find a man that will be attracted to them.

 

But you should befriend the woman and let him go. If men suffered consequences of being LONELY themselves or being held accountable, then perhaps they would stop. It just seems that this place is filled with broken women (on both sides) and I haven't seen too many men on this board that represent the husbands that broke hearts and commitments. Where are they? I imagine still doing what they do. But it's wives attacking the other women and the other women trying to deal with their confusion and justify their choices.

 

To the wives, believe me when I tell you, I would trade this for anything if I could. I believed him. Surely you believed him too when he gave vows and said that he would honor you forever. What person can really keep that promise? Yet you actually believed it. Even if he never cheated he probably has not always honored you. And you expect him to honor you when you don't honor yourself by honoring yourself!

 

If he is believable enough for you to marry him then why would I not believe him when he said that he didn't love you anymore, he's there for the kids, the house, and it's all a faccade? If I am expected to see what's going on, then why didn't you BEFORE he cheated? But you believed him because he kissed you on the cheek every morning before leaving for work and he finally fixed the leaking faucet.

 

Women would do better if we formed alliances rather than blame each other.

 

All these problems begin with WOMEN IN GENERAL. No matter who we are. It starts with us. The catty fights, the jealousy, the competiveness, the titles, the who's the prettiest, the comparisons, etc. start in grade school. The first few weeks of school, my 8 year old daughter had a girl come after her because this girls "crush" sat next to my child. She was hated on everyday. He was "cheating" because in 3rd grade, you are not supposed to get caught TALKING TO GIRLS. She came home crying one day because he let her use his pencil sharpener!

 

But rather than the girl go after the boy, she spent her time wreaking havoc in my daughter's life. And the boy told my daughter that he though the other girl was ugly. The girl's value was placed on the fact that she was supposed to be the only girl that had permission to use his sharpener or even say hello!

 

If girls were taught to get along and continue those relationships in adulthood, we would all be better for it. So yes, men have their problems...but we as women have to come together and place blame where it truly belongs (ourselves as a collective). Then we need to hold our men accountable and stop allowing them to have their cake and eat it too.

 

There's more to life than being some cheating husbands wife or mistress. Being a woman who loves herself is a great place to start (with or without a man).

We take them back because we really do love them,we have given our whole lives to this cause, as for my self, yes I am out to prove that I AM THE BETTER woman the one that was there through all of the hard times,and I will be damed if I will not fight for what is mine, and it"s certainly not because I'm old and can't get anybody elese, it's becaue I don't want anybody elese. and of course the men lie to the wives but don't fool yourself they lie just as much to you. as for me I truly do wish that my husbands other woman will find peace and joy and be happy in her life, she made a mistake as did my husband, I don't wish her ill. what would that help? don't get me wrong I don't trust her either, and I am going to have to deal with her for the next 18 years because we just found out that she is going to have a baby,and that it is hubbys. what joy for me! lol

[Guest]

This makes some sense. I know that I wouldn't be working on a divorce if my H and I could be friends enough to discuss what's in our hearts with each other without fear of anger or derision.

When a marriage or any relationship cannot be filled with acceptance for the partner's thoughts, or the willingness to share your deepest, darkest thoughts, then it is vulnerable to intrusion and 'contamination' by almost anything at all.

We all need friendship and safe harbor from even our own self-doubts. When you can provide that to someone, and they know it, you will have the key to their heart, always.

 

I'm recovering from an EA. Like it was stated earlier in this thread, the majority of folks who've ever experienced an A of any kind, didn't mean to go out of their way to get themselves involved in one. In my case, I figured, it was a matter of possible misunderstanding on my part. I guess I saw something in that relationship that just wasn't there. I still have my doubts as whether he wasn't playing around with me as well, but I can't blame anybody but myself for my probable misunderstanding and poor choice to act upon it.

 

I ended the ordeal with a respectful apology to the guy. Never expressed any anger towards him, even though my feelings were truly hurt. I'm a peacemeker by nature, and always prefer to part with folks remembering me as someone who geniunely forgives. Nobody likes to go through this life feeling hated and dispised, including all those unfaithful MM or MW. Just swallow your pride and tell them that you forgive them. It takes the gut to do that, but wouldn't it make everybody's life so much easier?

[veronese]

I can only speak for myself in answering the posters original question. Why did I take my cheating H back?

 

I was too shocked when I found out to look after our children properly so needed my H to stay (temporarily as I thought) to care for them while I physically couldn’t.

 

Having been so in love with him for 17 years and never having suspected a thing I couldn’t switch off my feelings for him overnight, despite simultaneously loathing the very air he breathed!

 

I didn’t know if I could ever get over his betrayal, forgive him enough or trust him again. I didn’t know if there was any point in trying to work things out but I soon realised that giving up on our marriage and family when it had been so good would be foolish. I also knew that my state of mind was so unstable any decisions I made should be put off until my sanity returned.

 

He wouldn’t leave, didn’t want to leave as it turned out, and God knows I told him to go enough times!

 

I didn’t think it was fair on our children to replace a world they had always been so secure and happy in with an alternative one which held no benefits for them.

 

I gradually understood the reality of our situation and saw his affairs in a more objective light. I could see where I was failing in the marriage too. My H had screwed up spectacularly but I grew to accept his mistakes as only human, albeit unpleasant, hurtful ones

 

The way he coped with everything after DDay really impressed me. He held me in his arms while I cried and wailed. He was quiet and patient while I screamed in face. He endured my madness and obsessive checking daily. I questioned and interrogated him endlessly. I insulted everything I could about him. He knew I hated him but knew also my love for him was real.

 

He didn’t walk away even when I told him to. He lived through two years of hell with me when if the tables were turned I seriously doubt I would have been able to last a month in his shoes.

 

We were friends, we loved each other, we had hurt each other, him way more than me admittedly but neither one of us could imagine a future without the other

 

I never thought I would have stayed married in this situation but as so many have said before, until you walk in my shoes……

 

It’s his only chance though. If he lies like this again I won’t have any choice but to leave, no matter how hard it is and how much I’d hate doing it. I know to accept this again would seal my coffin…I would be choosing a miserable existence with someone who really isn’t so special after all.

 

Also I thought it worth mentioning that in my case my H said that he pursued these women. That he was genuinely very fond of them and cared about them. He never intended to hurt them and felt guilty having done so. He enjoyed their company for many reasons, it was fun, exciting, dangerous, secretive and made him feel young and important.

 

Like many other BWs I apportioned most of the blame on my H, but nevertheless believed the OW were not blameless as they were aware of his marital status yet had become attached to him as he did they and played their part in the whole episode.

 

I realise that if it hadn’t been them, it would have been someone else and the problem was between my H and I fundamentally, however it wasn’t someone else so I still think they shared some responsibility for their behaviour.

 

Why do we stay? I guess for the same reasons as OW do.

 

veronese

[silktricks]

Why is it that when discussion turns to the men, it's always the "lying and manipulating" man. But when I say that the woman lied and manipulated me, nobody, but nobody believes me? It Is The Truth.

 

BH, I'm sorry, I didn't mean that the woman didn't lie and manipulate you. I believe that she did, in fact your story has many similarities to my husband's, and the woman also did in fact manipulate him.

 

I did think, however, that your story of the EA being primarily due to your anger was glossing over other probabilities. You and your wife were having problems, I believe that you said that. I truly think that the EA gave you something that you wanted and wanted badly enough to not care that you were hurting both your wife and the ow.

 

I also think that you are lucky that your wife forgave you. I think you need to forgive yourself now, as I would bet that the ow will never forgive you (if you are looking for that). She didn't get what she wanted. To be hurt on top of that by a lot of lies is not going to promote a forgiving attitude. If you can, just let it go now.

[whichwayisup]

All in all, what matters his what his wife thinks and feels. Getting forgiveness from his wife is much more important than what the OW feels, or doesn't feel. And I mean no offense to any OW here, it's just that when a marriage is back on track, the past has to stay in the past...

 

I agree with ST, you have to forgive yourself. You've been given a second chance, so treasure that, and don't ever let anybody or anything get in the way of your marriage and love for your wife.

[bullhunter]

BH, I'm sorry, I didn't mean that the woman didn't lie and manipulate you. I believe that she did, in fact your story has many similarities to my husband's, and the woman also did in fact manipulate him.

Thank-you

 

I did think, however, that your story of the EA being primarily due to your anger was glossing over other probabilities. You and your wife were having problems, I believe that you said that. I truly think that the EA gave you something that you wanted and wanted badly enough to not care that you were hurting both your wife and the ow.

This is true. The problem was with me. I was incredibly depressed and looking to feel good. The OW was always telling me how wonderful I was, and I wanted that feeling to go on. Though my wife was saying good things to me, she was also saying some not so good things (rightfully so, but I didn't want to hear them.) And I had a harder time taking in good things from my wife BECAUSE I was deceiving her.

 

I also think that you are lucky that your wife forgave you. I think you need to forgive yourself now, as I would bet that the ow will never forgive you (if you are looking for that). She didn't get what she wanted. To be hurt on top of that by a lot of lies is not going to promote a forgiving attitude. If you can, just let it go now.

I am very lucky my wife forgave me. I'm working on forgiving myself.

 

I honestly don't care about the ow's forgiveness. She can hate me or not, I just don't care. As I said, I never think about her.

[Last Mohegan]

Forgive me if you have already addressed this in a previous thread. I went back and read your original story bullhunter. I will keep my opinion to myself but am curious to know if this was your only affair or whatever it was or if your "anger" has surfaced in this manner before?

 

I honestly don't care about the ow's forgiveness. She can hate me or not, I just don't care. As I said, I never think about her.