selfless love is just an illusion

[CarryingOn123]

And yes, nothing is carved in stone...Don't close the door tightly yet, things could change in time. I mean, when you consider the time frame of all this, it's really not a long time and you're still recovering, needing to get better. And for her, she's now understanding more and more what she's done to you, as you shut her out, she's seeing the aftershocks and consquences of her actions from when you were in your coma. Obviously, she is regretting it... Yet, her words now from afew days ago are changing too. It seems she isn't as willing to "side" with the OM ...

 

now she says she will do whatever I want, but she didn't do it when I asked her. Now I feel she is saying that because her back is to the wall. I didn't want her to put my needs first because she was coerced, I wanted her to do it because she wanted to...

 

About me shutting her out-... I dont know how many here can identify with this feeling.. But I dont feel as if I am in the same team as her anymore... I see her as sitting on the opposite side of the table, and not on my side.. Dont know if that will change anytime soon, or at all

[CarryingOn123]

Though, if you two DO end up finalizing a divorce, could she do this alone...have the baby and not be with him after all said and done?

 

Well thats what she had told me... She said that she was not in love with the other guy, and realised that she shouldn't be with him just because of the baby. so going by what she says... she is done with him in that way.

[LakesideDream]

I wasn't recommending he martyr himself.. only that when making a decision to include the child that he forget about his wants/needs for a moment and think ONLY about what the kid needs. Then add that knowledge back into the equation.

 

Say the guy did want to recouncil with the wife, and he couldn't handle having the child in his life? So he puts his wants and needs above a child?

 

All I'm saying is humans have a tendency to say "I need" when in reality we really just want it. And want can be an evil thing sometimes. It can cause us to do things that hurt others, but we cover it by saying we had good intentions.. or we didn't think it would hurt anyone else. (take his wife for example..) So instead of only thinking about what you specifically want/need in life.. take other people into consideration before making a decision. Our decisions have multiple repercussions and these repercussions can be cloaked by our desire to have what we want. If you throw out what you want and need, sometimes it gives a clearer picture of all possible repercussions. Does it mean you'll actually take in orphans and devote your life to them? No. But will you understand better how your decision will affect those kids? Probably.

 

In defense of CarryingOn123 (not that he needs it) why in the world should he give a tinkers damn about the unborn child to be born to his wife, implanted by another man when he was unconsious and totally helpless.

 

He has no connection to that unborn child whatsoever. Not blood, not fondness, nothing. To him it's nothing but a physical and emotional reminder of what a weak willed woman his wife is.

 

Asking him to consider "the child" is horrendious.

[CarryingOn123]

This is ac2ally pretty interesting. you've found a lawyer willing 2 take an AOA case on? This might be the first I've heard of directly.

 

I had posted this sometime back (around 2 weeks I think). Its a friend who is a lawyer and a partner in his firm specialises in family law. They are taking it probono (25%) plus a reasonable upfront fee

 

What will be interesting is what position your W takes during the proceedings. It would be nice 2 learn, for example, that her statements that she'll do whatever you want are sincere (as sincere as she can be at this stage, that is), and not motivated by her feeling like she's losing control of the si2ation (meaning keeping both you and the OM waiting in the wings for her).

 

I had already asked to be a supporting witness, and she disagreed. Now she says she will do it if I want- it really doesnt matter whether she cooperates or not as she can be called up to testify anyway. It was just that gesture that would have been nice.

 

I would imagine that the OM will have 2 decide, soon, whether he really wants 2 be in the baby's life after all, particularly if he's forced 2 pay you for interfering with your marriage.

 

Filing an AOA doesn't mean you have to win, but my lawyers are hopefule, and thats why they are taking this probono.

 

At the same time, I feel a little envy for you. In the 4 and a half years since d-day, I have yet 2 hear my W say what nearly all BSs hope 2 hear "I will do whatever it takes 2 save our marriage."

 

I really do hope it's sincere, whether you do stay married or not. Because even if you don't, it'll show that she's truly remorseful for what she's done.

 

-ol' 2long

 

Dont be envious. Because I think her words have no bearing on her actions. What is the use of saying all the correct things and behaving in a different manner.

 

We are going to talk this weekend and I am going to call her on all this.

[Sup]

???? what could happen? we are just meeting for a talk....

 

I'm just saying be careful about this, she could get vindictive somehow.......

[Walk]

In defense of CarryingOn123 (not that he needs it) why in the world should he give a tinkers damn about the unborn child to be born to his wife, implanted by another man when he was unconsious and totally helpless.

 

He has no connection to that unborn child whatsoever. Not blood, not fondness, nothing. To him it's nothing but a physical and emotional reminder of what a weak willed woman his wife is.

 

Asking him to consider "the child" is horrendious.

 

Jesus H Christ.. I SAID... IF he were to recouncil with teh wife he should!!!!!!!!!!

 

Drop it already. Damn. He already said he doesn't plan on recounciling with the wife.

 

Plus.. you non-caring, couldn't give a rats ass about another human being.. Maybe killing that child would've been better than bringing it into this ****ed up world of people who constantly say "NOT MY PROBLEM!!" **** the kid. its someone elses. we owe no one anything, and we should all live to please ourselves. screw everyone else! It's ALL about ME, memememememememememe and what *I* WANT!!!! Damn cold ****ing world out there. Bunch of people who believe they are the center of the universe. go you!

[HAG (Guestess )]

You made me snort from a big laugh there.

 

Hey you HAGS, get yer ass back on CO's thread.

 

There, they'll come back now cuz I said so. hehe..

 

Oh okay then.

I hope you are feeling clearer CO. I think Walk has made some very good points about the fact that you need to base decisions solely for the good of the child. Although this could be rather complex, becuase obviously what is ALWAYS best for the child is a happy mother.

Didnt the mathematician John Nash come up with a theory that any decision should be made based on what is best for the majority? In this way, everything actually comes back to benefit you, because how could it not?

Anyway, I am obviously not too up on the theory, but I remember it being very interesting at the time I was reading it. This was before I became a hag of course.

I hope that you really fight hard against developing a victim identity here, and this is not meant to imply that I think you are. It is just that sometimes when bad things happen, it can seem more like a personal attack than it really was intended, and then to cope with events the person develops a new identity as a victim. This can be difficult to shift and can become a self fulfilling role, aswell as keeping anger at others alive, and make it difficult to get close to people.

This is the only advice I can give at the moment. I came back by request of course!

[CarryingOn123]

I'm just saying be careful about this, she could get vindictive somehow.......

Will keep that in mind... but dont think she is going to do something like that... anyway....

[CarryingOn123]

Walk,

Have taken your advice and started writing what I want to say to her... Definitely got the ball rolling. If I finish I'll try and post a jist here.

 

And geez.. that was a strong reaction that you had back there... Its only a post :-) so dont stress about it.. deep breaths :-)

[CarryingOn123]

What I want to convey to her was

 

How deeply I was(am) hurt by

 

1. Her taking up another man

2. Her replacing me in our house with him

3. Her getting pregnant to him, when we were very excited about do that ourselves

4. How she wanted to seperate from me and marry him and start a family with him

5. How she refused to stand by me when I asked her for help/Cooperation

6. the images etched in my head of her and the other guy that I saw in the video tape

7. That she made a video tape at all

8. How her first child has nothing to do with me, when we wanted to make the journey together.

9. How she decided to celebrate her seperation from me/engagement by going on a cruise, as if it is a happy event that she is moving on from me.

10. How she removed all my stuff and put it in boxes in the garage

11. How she replaced all photographs of us with photos of both of them (though in smaller number)

 

 

My doubts/apprehensions about the future if we reconcile

 

1. Whether she will stay true to me if something like this happens again

2. whether I will ever regain the trust and security in the relationship

3. If I can raise her child as mine

4. Even if I cant, can I live with her while the other guy is a part of the kids lives, and hence in ours

5. Even if we manage to cut off the OM now, once the kid grows up, what if he/she wants to bring the real father into its life.

6. How he will always be a part of her life now.

7. Now that she has had an affair, and crossed the line/mental barrier, will she tend to have more later on

 

My anger at her for

1. All of the above

2. trying to defend him against me

3. Not being there for what I wanted, even though she said she sould do "whatever" for me

4. Her trying to control my life/situations (with Situation with D as an example)

 

my questions on

1. their relationship and beginning etc

2. Feelings for eachother

3. All the gory details wrto their relationship, sex life, etc.

 

 

That is what I think I should try and cover..

What do you guys think.. Obviously you guys have seen more of these situations here than I have.. so any suggestions, comments etc?

[whichwayisup]

WWIU, I am not a person who will physically abuse my wife, or any other woman for that matter. Haven't done it before, wont do it again. Last time I got into a physical fight with a girl was when I was 6 when I pulled my friend pigtails in a fight . So dont worry abi=out it getting out of hand. About the emotional part, I think it will get out of hand.. It has to..someday

 

I am so sorry, my words may have jumped out the wrong way...Last thing on my mind was anything physical, I meant emotional, as in both of you getting upset and saying things that you can't take back, out of control, not what you thought..Sorry if I implied that in my wording CO.

 

But on the other hand, when I say something difficult for her to hear, then she should take it as me expressing my feelings, without worrying how it will look to the third party.. That was just a thougt.. but like I said there are both pros and cons..

 

Yup, pros/cons...and you are right, she needs to hear and see firsthand your reactions and what you think/feel. She's an adult and hopefully can handle it.

 

now she says she will do whatever I want, but she didn't do it when I asked her. Now I feel she is saying that because her back is to the wall. I didn't want her to put my needs first because she was coerced, I wanted her to do it because she wanted to...

 

About me shutting her out-... I dont know how many here can identify with this feeling.. But I dont feel as if I am in the same team as her anymore... I see her as sitting on the opposite side of the table, and not on my side.. Dont know if that will change anytime soon, or at all

 

I understand. And again, you have every right to feel this way. Her actions have made you feel this way. Words are one thing, things can easily be said but it's the action at times that really counts.

 

She does need to back off, because your trust for her isn't there anymore, anything she does isnt' going to come off as sincere to you. That's something she has to 'get' in her head. As much as it sucks for her, she has to accept that.

 

Well thats what she had told me... She said that she was not in love with the other guy, and realised that she shouldn't be with him just because of the baby. so going by what she says... she is done with him in that way.

 

I hope she's being honest with herself and not trying to convince you, let alone herself about this. Yet, I'm sure the guilt of everything has ruined what life could have been for her with the OM.

 

What I want to convey to her was

 

How deeply I was(am) hurt by

 

1. Her taking up another man

2. Her replacing me in our house with him

3. Her getting pregnant to him, when we were very excited about do that ourselves

4. How she wanted to seperate from me and marry him and start a family with him

5. How she refused to stand by me when I asked her for help/Cooperation

6. the images etched in my head of her and the other guy that I saw in the video tape

7. That she made a video tape at all

8. How her first child has nothing to do with me, when we wanted to make the journey together.

9. How she decided to celebrate her seperation from me/engagement by going on a cruise, as if it is a happy event that she is moving on from me.

10. How she removed all my stuff and put it in boxes in the garage

11. How she replaced all photographs of us with photos of both of them (though in smaller number)

 

 

My doubts/apprehensions about the future if we reconcile

 

1. Whether she will stay true to me if something like this happens again

2. whether I will ever regain the trust and security in the relationship

3. If I can raise her child as mine

4. Even if I cant, can I live with her while the other guy is a part of the kids lives, and hence in ours

5. Even if we manage to cut off the OM now, once the kid grows up, what if he/she wants to bring the real father into its life.

6. How he will always be a part of her life now.

7. Now that she has had an affair, and crossed the line/mental barrier, will she tend to have more later on

 

My anger at her for

1. All of the above

2. trying to defend him against me

3. Not being there for what I wanted, even though she said she sould do "whatever" for me

4. Her trying to control my life/situations (with Situation with D as an example)

 

my questions on

1. their relationship and beginning etc

2. Feelings for eachother

3. All the gory details wrto their relationship, sex life, etc.

 

 

That is what I think I should try and cover..

What do you guys think.. Obviously you guys have seen more of these situations here than I have.. so any suggestions, comments etc?

 

You deserve to know everything, and I hope she opens up to you, even if it hurts, it is best to know. She owes you that.

 

I think what you've put down so far is perfect.

[Walk]

And geez.. that was a strong reaction that you had back there... Its only a post :-) so dont stress about it.. deep breaths :-)

 

Sorry CarryingOn, didn't meant to get so upset, or get off tangent in your thread.

 

Knee jerk reaction.. never a good thing.

[Walk]

I'm not sure I'd ask about all the gory details of their relationship.. I wouldn't be able to handle that information. But totally your decision.

 

If I were you:

 

I think I'd ask what she believes life would be like if you two did get back together? Like best case scenario, what does she see happening in her life. I guess I would want to see what kind of mentality she has toward everythign.. does she believe that everythign will go back to like it was if she can just convince you to take her back? Or is she taking a realistic view of this and understanding that she will have to continually prove herself over and over throughout the years if you two did recouncil. Does she see fairly land? Or reality? If she doesn't understand fully how much work it will be for her, then there isn't much use even trying...

 

I'd also ask what she plans on doing (or is doing) to prove she isn't the same person who ditched you in your time of need. But I also believe this is a question poised to entice the other person to do some soul searching on their own. What is she doing to grow into a strong enough person who could actually "be" there for you if you needed her to carry the relationship for a while? She's proven she wasn't strong enough earlier... has it changed? And can she point to how and when it changed?

 

Those were just suggestions.. obviously you don't need to take them. I was just trying to think of stuff I would want to know if I were in your shoes.

[princessa]

To tell you the truth I am angry at her

 

1. trying to defend him to me. It is a different matter that she would have feelings to help a case against him, as she was more than an equal offender in this case. But for her to try and make it out as if he didn't do anything. That made me angry, and hence my curtness to her.

 

2. How she is still trying to control my life and me. This is say because of how she tried all that drama with D. I want her to realise that she is not in control of my life, and for her to stop trying to do that. She doesn't have any right to do that (she is after all still defending the other guy against me...she is not worried about how much hurt he caused me, she is worried about how it will hurt him)

 

Hi,

 

I've been reading your posts for a while.. I am really touched by your story, and my heart goes out to you and your SW, equally. I haven't had the chance to read all of what you wrote this past month, so perhaps this is going to sound redundant, but I'd still like to express my opinion about what you've stated above.

 

You seem to be expecting that your SW proves herself to you before reconsidering your divorce, which is perfectly normal after such betrayal. It seems to me as though you think that she OWES you big time for what she did. Maybe she owes you, maybe she doesn't deserve your trust until she proves to be worthy of it again... But whatever you do to "test" her trust has to be fair.

 

Here is a quote from an article on self-fulflling prophecy:

In a 1957 work called 'Social Theory and Social Structure', Merton said the phenomenon occurs when "a false definition of the situation evokes a new behavior which makes the original false conception come true." In other words, once an expectation is set, even if it isn't accurate, we tend to act in ways that are consistent with that expectation. Surprisingly often, the result is that the expectation, as if by magic, comes true.

 

http://www.accel-team.com/pygmalion/index.html

 

 

 

What I'm getting at here is that since you've already established in your head that you don't trust her, you ask her to do the impossible to prove you otherwise. You deliberately put her in awkward and miserable situations just to see how she would react. Because you already decided that she's not trust-worthy, you end up testing her in such ways, that make you feel as though you're giving her a new chance to prove herself, and yet the test has been tricked in advance so that there's no way she can pass.

 

 

 

You cannot expect this woman to just turn her back on the OM, who, granted was inconsiderate towards your marriage, but nevertheless was there to support her. I think she's done enough damage as it is, so I understand how she doesn't want to inflict any more pain upon your or his life. You're basically asking her to give up her integrity for you.

 

 

You have a lot of unresolved emotional issues, although you might think you're calm and rational about everything. It's especially hard for men to deal with their emotions, and if you don't take the time to express these emotions of giref and anger properly, often these hidden emotions end up sabotaging many aspects of your life under the guise of rational actions.

[Ladyjane14]

.... but I wonder if that is the reason a lot of other people have stoped posting:D

 

Hey... I'm a regular here on this thread, but I've just been flat out running lately..... in the immortal words of Charlie Daniels, 'like my head was on fire and my ass was catching'

Didn't want you to think I'd stopped posting to you though.

 

I've got some reading to do, since I've missed quite a few posts. Just gave 'er a skim, and I want you to know that even though I'm not in strict approval of the AOA... I do respect that you're doing what you feel you need to do right now. As such, I wish you the best in it.

[CarryingOn123]

Oh okay then.

I hope you are feeling clearer CO.

 

not really:) .. but am ok though!

 

I think Walk has made some very good points about the fact that you need to base decisions solely for the good of the child. Although this could be rather complex' date=' becuase obviously what is ALWAYS best for the child is a happy mother.[/quote']

 

I also think Walk has made some good points, but I agree to the extent that the welfare of the child also has to be considered. Which means, that I agree that if I dont think I can make it work, I shouldn't reconcile amd make life hell for both of them (her & the child).

 

But by your statement "what is always best for the child is a happy mother"- to make the mother happy and thus the child, I need to reconcile; that is something I dont agree.

 

The way I see it. I will consider reconciliation based solely upon my needs, but if I am considering reconciliation, then the needs of the child need to be taken into account.

 

Didnt the mathematician John Nash come up with a theory that any decision should be made based on what is best for the majority? In this way, everything actually comes back to benefit you, because how could it not?

 

Are you talking about Nash-equillibrium & non-cooperative games?

 

I dont think thats really how it goes, but what you have said is very similar to Socialism. But you yourself can see the success/truth of that philosophy wrto countries that have followed that path.

 

Anyway' date=' I am obviously not too up on the theory, but I remember it being very interesting at the time I was reading it. This was before I became a hag of course.[/quote']

 

 

I hope that you really fight hard against developing a victim identity here, and this is not meant to imply that I think you are. It is just that sometimes when bad things happen, it can seem more like a personal attack than it really was intended, and then to cope with events the person develops a new identity as a victim. This can be difficult to shift and can become a self fulfilling role, aswell as keeping anger at others alive, and make it difficult to get close to people.

 

It is hard not to feel like the victim here, but am trying for it not to form a set frame of mind for me. That is one of the reasons why I thought of the AOA suit, even though most people dont agree with me, because I want to feel that I have taken action and am no longer a victim... If you get what I mean

 

This is the only advice I can give at the moment. I came back by request of course!

 

thanks for the advice.... Of course! ...and your advice (as everybody else's) is always welcome

[CarryingOn123]

A good list. Really, though, except for the parts centered around the baby and the OM's role in it's life, the rest of it is pretty "normal" surviving infidelity stuff. That's not saying it'll be easy, it won't. But recovery and a better marriage afterward is certainly a strong possibility with work and desire for that goal.

 

All this is still pretty abnormal to me

 

 

I'm not sure I'd ask about all the gory details of their relationship.. I wouldn't be able to handle that information. But totally your decision..

 

I pretty much saw it all in the tape, so it is not really blissful ignorance now..

 

If I were you:

 

I think I'd ask what she believes life would be like if you two did get back together? Like best case scenario, what does she see happening in her life. I guess I would want to see what kind of mentality she has toward everythign.. does she believe that everythign will go back to like it was if she can just convince you to take her back? Or is she taking a realistic view of this and understanding that she will have to continually prove herself over and over throughout the years if you two did recouncil. Does she see fairly land? Or reality? If she doesn't understand fully how much work it will be for her, then there isn't much use even trying...

 

I'd also ask what she plans on doing (or is doing) to prove she isn't the same person who ditched you in your time of need. But I also believe this is a question poised to entice the other person to do some soul searching on their own. What is she doing to grow into a strong enough person who could actually "be" there for you if you needed her to carry the relationship for a while? She's proven she wasn't strong enough earlier... has it changed? And can she point to how and when it changed?

 

Those were just suggestions.. obviously you don't need to take them. I was just trying to think of stuff I would want to know if I were in your shoes.

 

Those are very good suggestions, I will include that as well.. I had thought about similar lines as well, but failed to put it in my draft... Thats why I posted it here and asked for opinions.. thanks

[scaredinlove]

I was (still am- technically) married to my wife for 4 years and had been together for 2 years prior to that. We were very much in love and believed to be soul mates. I know it is incredibly rare to find the connection and love that we had. We were both successful professionals with promising futures. We were getting settled into life and had talked with excitement of having a child (making a baby, as we called it). Well at that time we took a holiday at a seaside resort. Life was good…. till an unfortunate incident occurred.

 

While walking back to our rooms, a concrete figurine from the façade of the hotel building broke off and fell above us. As I was walking a few paces behind my wife I saw it falling about to hit my wife on the head. I lurched and shoved her forward to move her out of the way. I pushed her forward but I was wearing rubber thongs and tripped on them and couldn’t get out of the way myself. It hit me on the head and I blacked out. The last thing I remember before that is seeing my wife start to turn back to look at me.

 

The next thing I remember is feeling drowsy and this dull thudding in my head an opening my eyes; bleary eyed. I heard a lot of commotion around me and blacked out again. I woke up again and realized I was in a hospital but still couldn’t see anything clearly, but a while later my vision started becoming clearer till I could see the doctors and nurses around me. One doctor smiled at me and conducted a quick vision test and asking me my name and other details to check on my mental capability.

 

He welcomed me back and said that he will get in touch with my family to let them know that I had woken up. I nodded, but as I was still drowsy was drifting on and off into sleep/consciousness. When I woke up again, I found my Sis-in-Law there (my brother’s wife). She was holding my hand seated on the side of the bed. She was crying but she smiled at me and gave me a long kiss on the forehead and said that they are all so happy that I was back. She said that she came over as soon as the hospital called. My brother was taking the day off from his work and would be with us very soon.

 

When I asked about my wife, she told me that she was not in town but will be back soon to see me, but I felt that she was trying to evade the question. But I was too tired to think about it or anything else. I continued to doze off and wake up. When I woke up again, my brother was sitting on the other side of the bed looking at me and I could see he was very emotional but was trying to remain composed. He said mom and dad are on their way (they live 3 hours from us) and that my wife had gone on a work related trip abroad and that he was trying to contact her.

 

Well, I found out that I had been in a coma for 17 months and that they hadn’t known whether I would awake at all. After a lot of checks and examinations I was checked out from the hospital after another 6 days, but was supposed to be under constant monitoring. Since my wife was not yet back (because they couldn’t contact her), they took me to my brother’s house so they could be there to monitor me.

 

I was feeling much better from the second day onwards, and by the time I got back to my brother’s house I was feeling fine, except a bit tired and a bit weak in the muscles. I had some problems with coordination as well, but it was getting better. I. was just frustrated that they hadn’t been able to reach my wife as I was looking forward to being with her. They told me that I had probably saved her life and that she wasn’t injured except for a cut palm and bruised knees when she fell forward.

 

About 3 days after I reached home, my Sis-in-law (sis) who was always with me started talking more philosophically to me. She said that I should expect a lot of changes, that I had been away a long time and should not expect things to be the same way that they were when I had the accident. She didn’t go deeper into it and when I was asking her about it, she said she was talking about life in general but “there is nothing that can’t be weathered”.

 

By this time I had stated taking walks in the nearby park along with my sis and when I asked her more and asked her if it was related to my wife, she slowly started giving me details. She said it was related to my wife, but she would prefer it we all sat down together (bro, mom & dad) before talking about it. She told me that my wife was seeing someone else now, and that they had left on a month long cruise just a couple of days before I woke up.

 

She said my wife used to come to see me at the hospital regularly etc. well, over the next couple of days they told me that they didn’t know if I was ever going to recover, and that I was put in the special facility to take care of me and they were all there with me regularly holding my hand even when I was in the coma. My wife apparently told my sis about 4 months back that she was seeing someone. And that about a month back had announced that she was pregnant and that they were engaged. She and my brother discussed about how to proceed with everything and it was decided that our assets would be split and my share would be put in a trust account in my name.

 

There was also the substantial amount of money that I got as compensation from the resort (they chose to settle). This was already in the trust account being used for my ongoing care. She was taking the house as I couldn’t have any use for it. Also that my brother took over as my legal representative on all my affairs, but that my wife still wanted to remain a secondary trustee in my affairs. She had put in an application to annul/end our marriage so that they could marry. She was currently on a cruise with him, after which they would be visiting his family who were living abroad, before returning back.

 

This was why that they didn’t contact her. Well they said that they can still contact her in the middle of the cruise by getting in touch with the cruise company and paging the ship, but they wanted to prepare me first. I told them not to call her and that I needed time. The next day I went over to my (old) house and found that the new guy’s stuff has virtually replaced mine in the house. I found my clothes and a lot of stuff in suitcases and boxes in on the storage racks in the garage. They were using our old bedroom and my cupboard full of his stuff. I walked into her wardrobe and saw her clothes hung up and just stood there holding a shawl to my knows and inhaling her smell, and it was then I started crying for the first time since I heard all this, till then I was in shock.

 

When I opened the bedside drawer I found a tape. We had filmed ourselves in bed, just for fun, but this tape looked a lot newer. Even though I realized what it was, I slid it into the VCR and played it. It was both of them being intimate in bed, I thing I just saw the first 5 minutes clearly, after that it was all through tears or in a daze. I replaced the tape, picked all my stuff and left. Over the next 2 days I met with our solicitor (who was already handling her application for separation/annulment), and I told him to draw papers to submit the application as a joint petition to divorce with the same terms that she had agreed with my brother, and I signed my parts and left it with him so that she can sign it when she gets back. I left instructions empowering my brother to handle everything on my behalf. I decided to move on, and concentrate on becoming totally well again.

 

It was decided that I should take time off and getaway for a while. So we decided to go to my Sis’s parent’s house. They have a country house by the lake, and I could do with some fishing and the fresh air would be good for me. My Sis would come with me and stay with her parents for a month or so and my bro would visit us every weekend. And thus we moved.

 

Well now my wife/ex is back in town. Someone apparently informed her of my status. And she is persistently trying to get in touch with me. Except my family no one knows where I am, so she has been calling my sis asking her to help her to get in touch with me. She says she doesn’t want a divorce, and that she only started seeing him because she felt that I was not going to wake up. My sis told her that I cannot be put through this stress now, but my sis will convey what my wife/ex had to tell me.

 

I told her to tell my ex that she should stick with her current man and they are going to have a baby together. When she was told this, she was pleading that that’s not what she wants and that she will have an abortion for me, she said she wants a chance to see me and talk to me face to face. I told my sis to tell her not to do anything for me. My sis told her that it is not advisable to put me to such stress after a major trauma, and not to pressurize me. She still calls my sis every day to ask about how I am. I told my sis to ask her to stop doing this and let me move on with my life as she has with hers. But she still calls everyday.

 

How do I handle this situation? Should I change the joint petition for divorce and appeal on my own behalf? Or is there a better way.

 

 

 

At least talk to her, she is willing to give everything even her baby to have you again.At least talk to her.

[CarryingOn123]

2Long

 

Both the cases that you've mentioned are very different to my situation, and you have to consider their motivation for this decision as well.

 

As you have seen, this is possible. I forgot that I know a poster on MB who's been raising the OM's child for 15 or so years now, and loves him as his own son. He didn't know he wasn't his bio son until he was already a few years old, though. But their bond is stronger than the one between his son and his mom, even. In that case, the OM didn't want anything 2 do with the kid's life, which makes a giant difference.

 

 

You see the difference here- He had thought that the child was his and bonded with and raised the child as his for a couple of years. Once that relationship is estabilished, you would feel that bond and parental love for the child. whereas I know beforehand that the kid is not mine.

 

 

There was another poster, Usedlongago, on MB about 3 or 4 years ago. Man in his 60s, who discovered his W had been having a long term affair when the OM died. 2rned out that their 28 yr old son was the OM's. He'd never kwown his bio dad, though, and wouldn't have wanted anything 2 do with him. In fact, for a while, he didn't want anything 2 do with his mom for what she'd done. Believe it or not, ULA's marriage recovered and they were doing well, last I heard.

 

 

I really feel for this guy...Living his entire life in a lie.. its so painful for me to read it, I can only imagine what it must have been for him...

 

To consider his decision, let us see his situation again... He is in his 60's, already a grandfather (I guess, or atleast prepard to be one)...Almost finished with the troubles of life... looking forward to retirement (if not already).. and looking to enjoy the golden years of his life...

 

He wouldn't wnat to leave the marriage and look for a new partner, because he is finished with tryinh to make a good life.. he is at a stage where he wants to enjoy the one that he has got... He must have settled to this decision based on these factors.

 

It is not the same case when it is a young couple just starting to make their family life, and who have their whole life to forge ahead of them..

[CarryingOn123]

At least talk to her, she is willing to give everything even her baby to have you again.At least talk to her.

 

Scaredinlove, A lot has happened after that post that I made.... I have talked to her, and am going to have another talk this weekend. We are just discussing what needs to be talked, and how it is supposed to happen. So dont worry about it- I am talking to her:)

[CarryingOn123]

Hi,

 

I've been reading your posts for a while.. I am really touched by your story, and my heart goes out to you and your SW, equally.

 

Hi PrincessA, and thank you

 

You seem to be expecting that your SW proves herself to you before reconsidering your divorce, which is perfectly normal after such betrayal. It seems to me as though you think that she OWES you big time for what she did. Maybe she owes you, maybe she doesn't deserve your trust until she proves to be worthy of it again... But whatever you do to "test" her trust has to be fair.

 

Here is a quote from an article on self-fulflling prophecy:

 

In a 1957 work called 'Social Theory and Social Structure', Merton said the phenomenon occurs when "a false definition of the situation evokes a new behavior which makes the original false conception come true." In other words, once an expectation is set, even if it isn't accurate, we tend to act in ways that are consistent with that expectation. Surprisingly often, the result is that the expectation, as if by magic, comes true.

 

http://www.accel-team.com/pygmalion/index.html

 

 

 

What I'm getting at here is that since you've already established in your head that you don't trust her, you ask her to do the impossible to prove you otherwise. You deliberately put her in awkward and miserable situations just to see how she would react. Because you already decided that she's not trust-worthy, you end up testing her in such ways, that make you feel as though you're giving her a new chance to prove herself, and yet the test has been tricked in advance so that there's no way she can pass.

 

.

 

The test has not been tricked in advance, and of course she can pass the test(even if she loses someother place for that).

 

 

You cannot expect this woman to just turn her back on the OM, who, granted was inconsiderate towards your marriage, but nevertheless was there to support her.

 

A lot of OM/OW will come out as supportive towards the WS, that is how most affairs start. Does that mean that it is right that the WS should be supportive of the OM/OW- reciprocate the support? and how is the spouse supposed to feel at this time, and what chance does their relationship have in this case of continued feeling of loyalty/support/soft corner towards the affair partner

 

You're basically asking her to give up her integrity for you.

 

where was this integrity of hers when she took on a lover, and invited another man to bed.

 

So she was willing to give up her integrity for him, so why not for me?- if she loves me like she says she does.

 

You have a lot of unresolved emotional issues, although you might think you're calm and rational about everything. It's especially hard for men to deal with their emotions, and if you don't take the time to express these emotions of giref and anger properly, often these hidden emotions end up sabotaging many aspects of your life under the guise of rational actions.

 

You are right there- I have a lot of unresolved emotions... but I am trying to deal with them the best way I can... even coming here, and being honest about my feelings, and not hesitating to write what I really feel is a step on my part towards this direction

[CarryingOn123]

Hi,

 

Oh.. and btw.. thats a nice picture that you've got there ..

[CarryingOn123]

I am so sorry, my words may have jumped out the wrong way...Last thing on my mind was anything physical, I meant emotional, as in both of you getting upset and saying things that you can't take back, out of control, not what you thought..Sorry if I implied that in my wording CO.

 

 

 

Yup, pros/cons...and you are right, she needs to hear and see firsthand your reactions and what you think/feel. She's an adult and hopefully can handle it.

 

 

 

I understand. And again, you have every right to feel this way. Her actions have made you feel this way. Words are one thing, things can easily be said but it's the action at times that really counts.

 

She does need to back off, because your trust for her isn't there anymore, anything she does isnt' going to come off as sincere to you. That's something she has to 'get' in her head. As much as it sucks for her, she has to accept that.

 

 

 

I hope she's being honest with herself and not trying to convince you, let alone herself about this. Yet, I'm sure the guilt of everything has ruined what life could have been for her with the OM.

 

 

 

You deserve to know everything, and I hope she opens up to you, even if it hurts, it is best to know. She owes you that.

 

I think what you've put down so far is perfect.

 

thanks WWIU, & I will try and not get it get too emotional, at least at the beginning, so that we will be able to cover some distance..

[CarryingOn123]

Hey... I'm a regular here on this thread, but I've just been flat out running lately..... in the immortal words of Charlie Daniels, 'like my head was on fire and my ass was catching'

 

In my immortal word- it doesn't matter that your head is on fire, but take care that your ass doesnt catch it- especially if you are a lady! . you dont want to ruin it for your hubby, he he

 

Didn't want you to think I'd stopped posting to you though.

 

Didn't think that.. Mised you though . ((((.))))

 

 

I've got some reading to do, since I've missed quite a few posts. Just gave 'er a skim, and I want you to know that even though I'm not in strict approval of the AOA... I do respect that you're doing what you feel you need to do right now. As such, I wish you the best in it.

 

I think that is what I need to do to have a feeling that I have taken action, and that I dont accept being a victim

[CarryingOn123]

And guys,

 

I dont expect to iron out any issues in this meeting. I do not expect that this meeting is going to resolve all the issues. I dont think we will get all the answers in this meeting..

 

My goal for this meeting is to try and effectively communicate to her how I really feel about everything.