looking for answers

[idontunderstandwhy]

Hi all,

 

I have been happily married for 12 years, or so I thought, together for 16 years. Today my wife told me that she loves me, but is not "IN" love with me. She expressed her desire to be on her own. Our kids are 18 and 22 and living with us. She has asked me to move out to see if she misses me. She had a recent affair that her lover ended because he is in a committed relationship and felt guilty. He broke it off 2 days ago. They had been physically intimate twice in the past 2 months. They have had very frequent intimate phone calls though. She told me she likes the way he makes her feel. Yet our sex life is and has been great. Now that her affair has ended, she says she isn't in love with me anymore. She says she doesnt know what she wants. I asked her if she wanted a divorce, and she said she didn't know. I do not drink or do drugs, I am not abusive and I have put her on a pedestal our whole marriage. She had an affair 14 years ago that lasted 6 months. It happened to be with the same man she recently saw, they worked together. We moved to a new city recently, and he turned up. He moved out of town this weekend. I am at my wits end. I can forgive her infidelity, but telling me she is not IN love with me is so hard to bear. To say I was blindsided would be an understatement. I have no idea what to think or what to do. I am madly in love with this woman and I do not want to think of a life without her. What is one to do?

[idontunderstandwhy]

I did want to mention that the only financially viable separation would be for me to move out. Our kids would stay with her to help with the bills. I asked her if she would go to counseling with me and she said no. She said she didn't care enough to go. She says she doesn't know if she wants to work things out. She is 40 also and has recently regained her incredible figure. She has hot flashes. I was wondering if pre menopausal women do the types of things she is doing. Could this be a mid life crisis?

 

Thanks for the help.

[norajane]

Talk to a lawyer. Why can't you stay in the house and she move out? SHE's the one who doesn't want to be in the marriage, so why should YOU have to turn your world upside down?

 

If she wants out, tell her to get a job and get an apartment. If she won't do that, her other option is to work on your marriage and go to counseling.

 

And see a lawyer immediately.

[idontunderstandwhy]

thanks for the reply. She has a very good job now. She did say she would give our relationship a fair shake by not dating during our separation. Financially, if we are to separate then me getting a studio apt. would just be easier.

[Gunny376]

Visit often and post oftern.

 

Next, is there some other "handle" that we can refer to you as, something short, simple, and easy to type? LOL!

 

Norajane is right! Why should you move out your home, away from your childrern, and leave everything you own and worked for all of these years, and why should you be the one to go down to WalMart or whereever and buy all that stuff all over again that you've already bought and own? Just because the DW (Dear Wife) is having issues in life.

 

You've not the one that had the affairs, and you're not the one that is having doubts and issues about the marriage. She want to go and find herself ~ have at it! There's the front door. The children are old enough now to fend for themselves, and so they don't need "Mommy" She's the one that want out of the marriage, so let it be her to leave the martial home. Not you, my friend.

 

She can't afford to move out on her own ~ tough. Life is tough! Get use to it and get over it. If that's the case, it seems to me that she's the one that needs to get her act together quick, fast, and in a hurry!

 

You hear a lot of women like your DW say virtually the same exact workd, such as "I love you, but I'm not in love with you." or "I'm not feeling.............................

 

Feeling are a paradox in that feelings are facts, while at the same exact time they are not facts. We all feel what we feel, and it doesn't have to be reasonable, justified, nor what other people feel. Feeling do not have brains. They are not logical. Part of this is learning what you do feel, so that you can can take care of yourself. Trying to take care of yourself without knowing how you feel, is like trying to budget without knowing what your income is.

 

Emotional reasoning is a distorted way of thinking that is common in Western society. "I feel therefore it is true!" I feel hurt therefore he/she meant to hurt me. I feel guilty therefore I am guilty. Many of us tend to feel hurt or guilt about everything. It comes with our culture, but we can choose not to believe in it.

 

Its OK to feel more than one countradictory emotion at the same time. We shouild all respect our emotions, but not necessarly belive them and act on them in old ways.

 

People can change by acting in new ways until new feelings come ~ and oftentimes, the action must and often does precede the feeling. Waiting till the feel like changing is a dead end for most people.

 

My take on this is that you've got yourself with a WWW, who's going through a MLC, and menopause ~ a very difficult time in a woman's life.

 

WTF? You say?

 

Checkout the following links:

 

http://www.divorcenet.com/considering/states/nationwide/the_walkaway_wife_syndrome

 

http://www.pathpartners.com/book.html

 

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/

 

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8501_fft.html

 

I would recommend your throughly research each of these sites

[Ladyjane14]

"I love you but I'm not IN LOVE with you"... is right out of the Cheater's Handbook. Your wife is either still embroiled in her affair, or in withdrawal. Odds are better that she's still in contact with the OM though.

 

I'm with Norajane. There's no reason for you to give up YOUR home. Tell her if she wants to separate not to let the door hit her in the ass on the way out.

 

Marriage counseling isn't really effective when the affair is ongoing anyway, so don't worry about that. Your better bet is to see an attorney and introduce some reality to the situation. She can't keep her lifestyle and run around like she's single.

 

You can check online for a state by state overview of 'grounds for divorce' on sites like http://divorcenet.com. If you can sue her for grounds... why not? There's no reason for you to work hard all your life and end up living out of your suitcase at the Motel Six while your wife moves her boyfriend into the master suite of YOUR home.

 

All that sounds kind of bitter, but really... it's not meant to be. The bottom line is that romantic affairs cease to be appealing once they lose some of their glamour. Introducing reality pokes holes in the fantasy bubble.

 

Probables are that your wife is maneuvering you out of your home on the pretense of needing "space". I doubt she has much intention of working on the marital problems regardless of her words to the contrary. You wouldn't be the first guy to fall prey to that particular tactic. Fact is... I'd have used it myself if I was bent on divorce.

 

Your wife's actions don't indicate that she's serious about reconcilliation. She's taken no action to support her words to you.

 

Words + Actions = The Truth

Words - Actions = Bullsh*t

 

Why did the OM break it off with her, btw? Could it be because she hasn't moved forward with ending her marriage?

 

 

p.s. If the OM is married, inform his wife of the affair. Don't discuss it with your WW or negotiate for terms either. Just do it. She'll be mad as hell, and she'll swear to never forgive you. But if you ever DO reconcile... she will.

 

Bottom line though is that you won't recover your marriage until the affair ends, and when the OM is himself married... his betrayed wife will begin to exert pressure from her end.

 

Again.... we take the "glamour" out of the adultery.

[Gunny376]

Again.... we take the "glamour" out of the adultery.

 

By Jove old girl, I think you've just found your latest signature!

[Gunny376]

"Wife meet Mr. Reality! Mr. Reality meet wife!" Then leave the room.

 

Its time for you to "man-up" and quit rolling over. Who says the WW gets to make all the calls, and call all the shots? Its your life to. You maynot be able to control what she says and does, but you by God can call the shots about you, your wants, your needs, your children, your life.

 

The thing about me that you need to understand is that I'm sixteen years the otherside of where your at. My XW said I was a workaholic, etc. and that I had to change. Well I changed alirght, but not in the way that she wanted me to. Today, if my wife was pulling this stuff your wife is pulling on me ~ she'd get tossed to the curb by her ear.

 

If I ever do get married again, she'll know what my boundaries are going in. She'll have a clear pretty picture of what I consider minor, major, and intollerable offenses are. Adultry in intollerable. And, she will know that I'm not weak minded, nor lacking in self discipline and that I will place myself being reproach and question ~ and that I expect her to do the same.

 

Me, personally? I go and rent her a one bedroom efficency apartment, and while she was at work, pack her up her clothes, and a bed and few other things, change the locks on the doors, move her into her new "space" and tell her "root hog or die" (Southern expression for hard times ~ aka your own your own )

 

When Cortez landed in Mexico with less than 200 men in Mexico, he burned his ships. There wasn't any going back to Cuba. To say that they were very postively motivated to succed in their quest or die trying ~ would be an understatement!

[towcritter]

thanks Gunny and lady.

 

Former Marine myself Gunny.

 

As for her affair, he is gone. 400 miles away. He broke it off because he felt guilty. She told me this. I could tell it bothered her. She said it was only for the sex, nothing more. She cant talk to him or I would know because of the cell phone bills. (we only have cell phones)

 

 

kids are both from previuos relationships. 1 each, both boys.

 

I also felt that if I was the one to move out, it would be easier to reconcile. Instead of asking her to move back. How wrong am I about that.

[norajane]

I also felt that if I was the one to move out, it would be easier to reconcile. Instead of asking her to move back. How wrong am I about that.

 

The easier you make it on her to carry on in the style to which she has become accustomed...in your home...the less likely she will be to want to reconcile. Why should she? She already has everything, and now she's got her husband out of the house too!

 

She needs to understand that being without you means a drastic change in her life, not just you out of the house. Once she faces the reality of leaving everything behind, her 'new' life might seem less appealing.

 

Tell her she's right. If she's not in love with you and needs space, tell her she'll need to leave the house and find her 'space' somewhere else.

[Gunny376]

Former Marine myself Gunny.

 

Well you shouldn't have told me that ~ because I'm really taking off the gloves.

 

She's disrespected you twice (that you know of). She's disrespected you, your home, everything that you've worked for, done for her, everything that you've worked for all these years.

 

Affairs are like cockroaches, for everyone you see, there's fifty that you don't see, or know about. Think about it.

 

Move out? Hell no! HELL NO!

 

You've got it all wrong! She's the one that got to work her way back into the relationship and marriage. Not you! She's the one that's screwed the pooch ~ not you.

 

Somewhere along the line you've become a "nice guy" or the Hollyweird version of what men are suppose to be. Get off the Lifetime channel, and get back on the "Spike" channel. "Man-up" You wouldn't take this off of any other woman. If this was a GF, you'd kick her butt to the curb. Quick, fast and in a hurry like.

 

I'm not saying be a "complete" azzhole about it ~ but I'd be introducing some realilty into her life. This BS about it being more financially sound for you to move out isn't anything but crap. If its going to be hard ~ let it be hard on her. She's the one out scroggin around with other guys. If you think you're going to get her back with a box of chocolates and some love-sick love letters ~ you're in for a rude awakening my friend.

 

You need to read Lady Jane's post again ~ this woman is setting you up! You need to wake up quick, fast, and in a hurry like. She's feeding you som many lines, its un-freaking real. Everything you're going through ~ I've been through! Everything the WW is telling you ~ I've heard! And its all BS!

 

Read Devil Dogs post and what he went through. You think your situation is bad now ~ keep traveling down the road you're traveling. Your going to find yourself in a world of hurt! And, I'm not just talking about emotionally either.

 

This is your life! This is real! And its really happening to you! The time to get "real" about your life is right here and right now!

 

Reconcile? No, no, no my man! You've got it azz backwards. She's not the one with the supply and you the demand. Its the other way around.

 

Trust me when I tell you, your DW hasn't got a damn thing what the other 3.5 billion women on the planet have to offer. Nothing, zilich, nada! What one woman will abuse ~ another could certainly use. You're not in high school or college anymore where women outnumber the men. You're not at Camp Hansen or Camp Schwab anymore where the ratio of men to women is 5000:250. There isn't any shortage of women.

 

But I will tell you what there is a shortage of? Good men! One's that aren't child molestors, sexual deviants, rapist, druggies, drunks, mental, emotional, and physical abusers, without OCD, without bi-polar and personality disorders, who can and can hold down a good job, who aren't out chasing everything in a skirt, who can be faithful to one woman.

[Gunny376]

The easier you make it on her to carry on in the style to which she has become accustomed...in your home...the less likely she will be to want to reconcile. Why should she? She already has everything, and now she's got her husband out of the house too!

 

She needs to understand that being without you means a drastic change in her life, not just you out of the house. Once she faces the reality of leaving everything behind, her 'new' life might seem less appealing.

 

Tell her she's right. If she's not in love with you and needs space, tell her she'll need to leave the house and find her 'space' somewhere else.

 

Thank you! Nail + Hammer!

[Ladyjane14]

Well you shouldn't have told me that ~ because I'm really taking off the gloves.

 

Geez Gunny.... "Root Hog or Die" is you with the gloves ON???? :lmao:

I'm laughin' so hard my ribs hurt! THAT's gonna be my new signature line.

 

Anyway Towcritter, he's made a good point. The Alabama Flair is just a bonus.

It's a tough old world out there. And as Norajane has said, you're just making it easier for her to keep her lifestyle and have YOU pay the bill for her.

 

It's possible that your wife is out of contact with OM, but after just 2 measely days, it's not something you can count on. The modus operandi for adultery partners who have been busted is often to buy a secret cell phone. That way, the BS (betrayed spouse) doesn't see the phone charges.

 

Whether she's 'in contact' or 'out of contact'.... she's not going to be willing to work on the marriage as long as she's on the fence about it. She's just giving you lip service to keep you calm and out of her hair. It's perfectly okay to act like you're 'buying in' to it. It's okay to be emotionally supportive even. What's not okay is for YOU to fund her poor decisions in any form or fashion.

 

I'm not saying be a "complete" azzhole about it ~ but I'd be introducing some realilty into her life.

 

So, you're not going to be an a*hole about it, far from it. Your better bet is actually to be as pleasant and ATTRACTIVE as possible. All the while keeping in mind you can't budge on your stance when it comes to making HER responsible for her choices. Don't help her to leave you.

 

Meantime, you didn't answer my question as to whether the OM is married or not. If he is.... OUT HIM to his wife, even if he's separated or in the process of divorce.

 

The master plan for married cheaters who want to get together is usually to dump the spouses while the affair is on the down-low. That way they feel like they're improving their odds for better settlements as well as not avoiding condemnation from friends and family members.

 

If YOU were still in the dark, wouldn't you want the OM's betrayed spouse to tell you?

I think I would if it were me. But more importantly, a BS on the other side introduces REALITY to the OM.

[Ladyjane14]

Here's Devildog's thread... http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t49359/

[InaPanic]

I'm not sure I can be any help in this situation but a lot of what you & your wife are going through sounds similar to my situation. I am a 38 year old woman who has been married 18 years & just recently had a very short affair for the first time in my married life. We had super frequent intimate phone calls which is how I got so emotionally attatched. We also only met up twice for 5 days total & it was physical. I have not told my husband yet & have not decided if I am. My H has also always been the ideal husband, treated me very well & put me on a pedestal. And like your wife I also just lost a lot of weight & have regained a nice figure. I do think midlife crisis has something to do with mine & from marrying as young as i did maybe.

I am feeling very addicted to this OM & am suffering withdrawal from him. I can tell you it's painful & it's completely thought consuming. When I am around my husband it is not the same as it used to be. When he touches me it's not the same as it used to be. And it scares the hell out of me. But I keep trying to tell myself it's because of what I'm going through & once I get this affair behind me & OM out of my life for some time that all the feelings that I had will come back to me. OM put ideas in my head that something had to be wrong with my marriage & to be honest those ideas are still in my head. I'm not sure if there was or not but I am very, very confused. Your wife may be going through these same feelings right now. Just very confused about her life. I can't stand the thought of being in a marriage where I am best friends with my husband & love him like that but do not love him like a lover/husband. That's what I keep worrying about.

I don't know what to suggest. I hate to say give her time because I may get flamed on here for saying that but i think she may just be going through a confusing time in her life. But I do know from experience if OM is still in her life she isn't going to be able to concentrate on you. For a solid month my A was on rocky ground & all I have been able to focus on was the A & trying to save it which is crazy but what I was doing. I'm not even saying I'm over the OM yet because I am far from it. But I do know by being in contact it is like being in limbo & nothing moves.

Best of luck.

[towcritter]

ladyjane, OM is not married....just in a committed relationship. I would have no way of contacting his significant other. Although, I can see why I should if I could. Thanks for all the replies on here.

 

I honestly think my DW is going through something that is clouding her judgement. I think counseling would help her, but she is against it. Be it menopause, mid-life crisis or whatever, something is making her an emotional wreck.

[towcritter]

Again, I am hoping to find tid bits on here to help me cope, but I am also looking for things that will help my marriage.

 

One thing I asked her when she told me she wasn't in love with me anymore, was "Are you sick of me?" She said yes. That can't bode well for me can it?

[Ladyjane14]

Again, I am hoping to find tid bits on here to help me cope, but I am also looking for things that will help my marriage.

 

I know it doesn't really seem like it, TC... but standing up for yourself and introducing REALITY into the situation does help the marriage.

 

Conflict is not an unnatural state in marriage. Withdrawal is. It's okay to disagree. It's not okay to FIGHT in an abusive way, that's true. But "conflict" isn't always about fighting.

 

Type into your browser, "The Three States of Mind in Marriage, marriagebuilders" and read the article you find there. Read the Basic Concepts and the Infidelity sections too, but just between you and me.... stay off of the forums over there. You've already got enough to be paranoid about.

[idontunderstandwhy]

Well, I had a long conversation with my wife yesterday. She told me that she loves me but doesn't feel like she is IN love with me. She told me that she had romantic feelings for OM. Even though the A is over, she feels that because she felt that way, she must not be IN love with me. She feels that we need to spend some time apart to see if she even wants to try to work on our marriage. She wants to see if she will miss me and maybe the feelings will come flooding back. She says she isnt sure what she wants. We talked about divorce and she said no. She said what if we get divorced and its a mistake. We still have great sex. Very passionate and fulfilling. I dont know what she wants and neither does she. What am I supposed to do?

[Ladyjane14]

She says she isnt sure what she wants. We talked about divorce and she said no. She said what if we get divorced and its a mistake.

 

Why is your wife dictating terms here? Where do YOUR "wants" come into play? Are you just an afterthought in this woman's life? ... some kind of safety net in case she's making a mistake?

 

You can stand by and allow her to decide what's right for you, or you can make your own decisions. You can't make her choices for her, but she can't make yours either unless you allow her to.

 

She's only left you with two options. One, continue on in limbo, waiting to see if your own wife wants to be with you. Or two, get an attorney and sue for divorce.

[Gunny376]

Well almost, but I did really learn a lot of good stuff, that has gotten me this far in life.

 

This is one of those "Lead, follow, or get the Hell out the way" type situations. And, you're not leading, and you need to be the one that does the leading.

 

You need to "man-up" and instead of her dictating what goes to happen here, and what's going to happen, you need to become a hard negoitator from your side of the table. Write now the DW is calling the shots, and saying what's what and what's not. BS!

 

Don't be buying off on this line of "I've got to move out, and need time and space to see if I still have feelings for you" crap. And, that's what it is ~ crap. She moves out ~ its virtually over. While reconcilations do occur ~ statistically they're almost non-exsistent.

 

If your still having sex, there hope, if your still living in the same house, there's still a chance. But once the sex stops, and she or you move out of the house ~ the only difference between you and the Titantic is the Titantic had a band as she went down.

 

While its true, that UK, (ref: his thread) and his wife are moving closer and closer toward reconciliation, and he and his wife appear at this point seem to be headed back togther ~ it was pretty shaky for awhile. As I said, statistically the chances of a successful reconciliation are almost non-exsistent.

 

Your only real reconcilation chance lies in acheiving a balance. A balance between the "John Wayne" aprroach ~ "You're my woman, and I'm your man, and this is the way its going to be from here on out!" and the "emacnipated~castrated" male. "Yes Dear, anything you say Dear" Somewhere in between you're going to find the solution. Either extreme will drive most women out the door.

 

Firm, fair, and friendly ~ where have you heard those words before, I wonder.

 

I'd would be telling her azz!

 

 

I'm not moving anywhere! You've got a home, and a husband, and a family with a long history. If you won't this marriage ~ you're going to have to keep it the old fashion way ~ you're going to have to work for it, same as I!

 

I understand you went outside of the marraige looking for something that I wasn't giving you. But my crystal ball is in the shop, so your going to have to sit down with me and lets figure out what it is that you're needing that I'm not aware of that I'm not giving you.

 

I would let her know as well, "If this goes to divorce court ~ its not going to be fun, its not going to be pretty, and I'm not going to roll over and beg like some dog!"

 

I would be letting her know, "I'm here, I want you, and need you, but I can live without you if I have to! I've got a lot to offer, and a lot to give, and a lot of love to give the right woman! I'd like that woman to be you! But, if not, I'll just have to learn how to live with that! And I can!"

 

I know you love this woman, and you want to save this marriage, but being needy, desperate, comes off as being a wuss, and being a wuss isn't attractive to most women. Survey, after survey after survey, the single word that comes up time and time and yet time again about what women find most attractive about men is the word confidence.

 

Me? Myself personally? I took one of the 14 Leadership traits an applied it seriously when it comes to women, dating and mating, etc.

 

"Identify your weaknesses, and strive to overcome them"

 

There's not a woman on the planet I can't live without! There's not a woman on the planet I can't walk away from! The best thing that ever happened to me (I say this 16 years after the fact) was my XW walking out on me! It changed me, BIG TIME!And it put some serious changes on me. To be honest? It brought me to my knees crying like a child time and time and time again. But, it made me stronger, more determined. I sought out answers and solutions to the questions and to the problems. I learned, and I'm still learning.

 

Where I'm at now? If I were you (THIS ISN'T A RECOMMENDATION TO YOU! THIS IS ME TALKING ABOUT WHERE I'M AT NOW ~ and its taken 16 years to get there) I'd toss her out by her ear! She doesn't want to be with me? Not a problem! She wants to be on her own? Not a problem! I'd make her wish a cold, hard reality. Mr. Reality? He doesn't freaking play. I know! He's done whipped my azz a time or two.

[Gunny376]

Why is your wife dictating terms here? Where do YOUR "wants" come into play? Are you just an afterthought in this woman's life? ... some kind of safety net in case she's making a mistake?

 

You can stand by and allow her to decide what's right for you, or you can make your own decisions. You can't make her choices for her, but she can't make yours either unless you allow her to.

 

She's only left you with two options. One, continue on in limbo, waiting to see if your own wife wants to be with you. Or two, get an attorney and sue for divorce.

 

 

Man the **** up!

[Gunny376]

ladyjane, OM is not married....just in a committed relationship. I would have no way of contacting his significant other. Although, I can see why I should if I could. Thanks for all the replies on here.

 

I honestly think my DW is going through something that is clouding her judgement. I think counseling would help her, but she is against it. Be it menopause, mid-life crisis or whatever, something is making her an emotional wreck.

 

Adapt and overcome! Why shouldn't his SO join the party of misery! He has no problem making your life miserable and Hell, why shouldn't you go out of your way to return the favor?

 

Your wife gets PO? Oh, well! Such is life! Why should you be the only miserable SOB in all of this?

[idontunderstandwhy]

Well, I know I need to man the **** up. As for contacting his SO, I have no way of finding out who she even is. I could call OM though. But my DW would probably have a **** hemmorage. She said if I did, it was over between us. She said that it is not OM's fault, it is hers. As for my DW and me, things are actually very good, we have very frequent sex, civil conversation and all seems OK. But I know she feels she wants to be on her own, not sure what she wants with me. I want to stand up without causing her to bolt.

[ilmw]

Well, I know I need to man the **** up. As for contacting his SO, I have no way of finding out who she even is. I could call OM though. But my DW would probably have a **** hemmorage. She said if I did, it was over between us. She said that it is not OM's fault, it is hers. As for my DW and me, things are actually very good, we have very frequent sex, civil conversation and all seems OK. But I know she feels she wants to be on her own, not sure what she wants with me. I want to stand up without causing her to bolt.

 

Just read the rest of your thread..

I'm not going to say much.... (been drinking) but keep up your chin.... be strong.... I don't envy your stitch... but I do feel your pain...

 

Your life is upside down and it is unknown where it is going.. Limbo sucks... Does it not feel like you are on a life boat at sea in a storm and you are holding on for dear life....??

 

That is what life seems to have become....

 

Keep posting...the others here will give you good advise... and compasion.

 

Be strong..

 

ilmw