My GF had a guy-friend over for a drink

[Guest]

My GF and I have been together for 3 years. We have mostly had a very good relationship, and have alternated between living together and doing long distance due to school, jobs, etc. We often talk of marriage in the near future. I'm 27, she's 24. We have just gone from living together to semi-long distance - I still rent an apartment with her and will be seeing her every two weeks. When I'm away my living is paid for by work. She is at school, and her main social group is the college swim team she is a member of. Yesterday afternoon she said she was going to be going out with people from the team to celebrate a guy on the team's birthday. We call and message regularly.

 

She called after dinner yesterday, and we had been talking for a bit when she said she had to go because a guy from the team was coming over for a glass of wine after which they were going to head out to the bar to meet up with the group. I think she could sense a change in tone on my part - I definitely felt immediately uncomfortable - and she said she had ZERO (her emphasis) attraction to this guy.

 

This guy broke up with his GF in July. I know that he initially contacted - by phone or email, I'm not sure which - my GF, who he already knew somewhat from the team, to ask if she wanted to meet up for lunch on campus around that time. At the time she would tell me about it, they met a couple of times a week because she said he wanted someone to talk to about his breakup, and was feeling really badly about it. I know that since then they have maintained email contact, all according to her about him needing advice and help with getting over his breakup. They are apparently quite good friends now, and I no longer hear it being due to his needing relationship advice.

 

Anyway, am I unreasonable for thinking that having somebody over like this, when I'm away, to our apartment, for a glass of wine is a bit odd??????????? I have zero concern that something is going on, I just think that this was really inappropriate. And after she told me she had to go because this guy was coming over, I didn't hear from her again for another 5 hours, at which time she sent me a text message. When she sensed my discomfort she said "Why is this any different than a female friend coming over for a drink."

 

The difference is that she would have called me when they left OUR apartment to head to the bar, which she didn't here - why? Anyway, she called when she got home, about 1am, saying they had gone to the bar, and then some people, including her, went to a different club afterward to go dancing. She said that a female friend from the team, and this guy, both walked her home.

 

The thing too is that they will be seeing each other regularly at practices for the next 2 years, and travel to many meets with the team throughout the year where they go away for the weekend, and often there are drinking/party situations after, and so for whatever reason that adds to my discomfort with this guy. She was completely loving and normal sounding when she called me after getting in, but I messed it up a bit by getting mad that she hadn't called the entire night (she said "I've done nothing wrong, you need to stop worrying"), particulary after having told me about this guy coming over for a drink, which I don't necessarily think should be a problem, I don't know, but was a new situation for us and so I thought she would have called, knowing that I might need some reassurance....... basically that glass of wine messed my whole night up.

 

To top it off, 2 years into our relationship she had an emotional affair with a different guy on this team (who is still around), which made for a crappy couple of months, the only glitch in our entire relationship, from which we came out of stronger than ever - but still adds to my overall jealousy and insecurities.

[Guest]

Look some people are going to tell you don't worry, others will say you are overreacting, but I think the opposite friend situation should be addressed pretty clearly at this point in your relationship because you do not sound like the type to be at ease with this (and why should you be) so don't go along with it you will be resentful and hurt.

 

It is better to define it now. Some good rules for opposite sex friendships:

-no going to eachothers places alone for ANY reason unless the SO is with them

-no dinner/bars alone

-if you feel uncomfortable and have enough signs this guy is trying to poach on her (this can be hard to prove, but a lot of phone conversations + emailing + alone time + your growing discomfort = enough signs) it is within both your best interests that she cool off on this friendship if it is making you uncomfortable. You have a right to expect her to do that, and it can be done very easily if she chooses to.

 

The hardest thing is trying to figure out what you will and won't put up with. Some partners will disagree because they do not FEEL the way you do. If she feels these agreements on friends are showing jealousy or distrust (sounds like she will say that ) on your part , calmly explain you feel he is interfering with your relationship. Remember this is not good for you if you are going along with what is good for only her.

 

This is what people mean by compatability. Sadly, she may feel you are trying to control her. But opposite sex friends are tricky and without those basic rules this will come up again and again. Better to find out now if you are on the same page than when you are married and she is arguing with you that you don't trust her for going on a swim team trip where she will be sharing a room with him and some other male friends and what is wrong with that? Not to put bad thoughts in your head, I just mean to say their has to be some sort of understanding and parameters or this will always happen if the situation presents itself.

 

If you cannot agree I would strongly urge you to leave because it will continue and it is disrespectful to you to let some nobody show where her alliances really lie if she is not in agreement. It is up to you to draw the boundaries and hopefully she can do the same going forward.

[Guest]

Thanks for your comments, fellow Guest. After reading my own post above I felt I overreacted somewhat. But I am definitely still uncomfortable with the idea of what happened. This is my home too in to which she invited this to occur, I pay half the rent there. It creeps me out knowing he was there, and it is true, it is almost purely due to the fact this is an opposite-sex friend. When I get home I can picture myself sitting on our couch and wondering "Is this where they had their drink?"

 

Even had she mentioned this earlier in the week (surely this was planned ahead, minimally before the 10 minute warning I was given on the phone) and asked if it was okay, but I don't know, that question might have weirded me out too, and I don't know how I would have felt/reacted.

 

Today she apologized for not having called earlier in the night in question, she said she thought today about the reverse situation and understood that she would have needed the same.

 

I'm still not sure if I'll just drop it, or express my discomfort again when my thoughts are more collected than they were on the spot. She and I have both had opposite-sex friends in the past, her more than me I would say, and it has never really been an issue. But this was a situation that has never happened before.

[Bryanp]

I think this is a huge red flag. Let this guy get advise from another male friend. Now it has nothing to do with advise.

 

Look at it this way. Say the situation was reversed. A while ago you had an emotional relationship with another woman who was on your sports team. It almost ended the relationship with your girlfriend. You now tell your girlfriend that you have been seeing this other girl who broke up with her boyfriend and you have been giving her advise for a while and now you are good friends. Your girlfriend calls and you now tell her that this female friend is coming over to your apartment for a class of wine and later you will all meet up with some other friends and go dancing. Do you honestly think that your girlfriend would put up with such crap from you?

 

I am sorry my friend but this is very serious. She has already had an emotional affair with another male teammate that is still on the team and it almost broke you up. In short, she has a past history of getting emotional involved with someone else while involved with you. Now this other guy is a "good friend" that she feels comfortable inviting him over for drinks in her apartment and going out with other friends and going dancing. I think you need a wake up call. This is inappropriate for a person who is in a relationship and thinking of getting married. The fact that she did this previously to you by getting involved with another guy should have taught her a lesson in that she was lucky you did not dump her.

 

Again if the roles were reversed I am sure she would be very uphappy especially if you had gotten emotionally involved with someone else previously like she did. If you are thinking about getting married I would be very very concerned. Just reading your letter gives me a gut feeling this is going end badly for you if you do not establish clear boundaries. I wish you luck.

[Guest]

BryanP, I want to tell her I am not satisfied that she understands my belief that having this guy over was inappropriate, I imagine myself telling her everything you have written. How could she not agree with that. But I know she will respond with "There is nothing there" "You need to stop worrying" "I'm allowed to have friends"

 

I honestly believe there is nothing there, I really do, and don't want to magnify it into something it's not... and it's not even in the same universe as this emotional stray she had with someone a year and a half ago. Because we dealt with and put the emotional stray behind us, I think it is unfair to resurface it. That is a challenge for me, of course, because he is constantly present and will be for the near future. Our lives are heading toward marriage... and it is what we both want, I have no doubts about her loyalties... we are very much in love and we are best friends. But it pisses me off that she thinks that this drink was okay... I think it was a damaging thing to do one week into some long distance time. I just don't know how or if I should tell her that yet.

[Spectre]

I see a common thing on this board that people dont think its ok to tell their s/o not to hang out with the opposite sex. As if they're wrong, when they usually aren't. Guys/Gals- recognize when you get into a relationship, the one thing you lose will be the chance to freely hang around members of the opposite sex, bottom line. No solo dinners with guys, no having drinks with guys, no having guys over to your apartment, I dont care if its a *study* buddy even, do your stuff at the library. Also recognize you have nothing to feel bad about calling someone on inappropriate behavior.

 

OP-you say you have zero concern but I dont think thats the case. She's cheated on you before, yeah it was "emotional" but thats still cheating. I also dont wanna go into how slim the chance is that she had a strictly "emotional" affair with a guy on her own swim team. Plus, by letting her get away with that, it's opened the doors to what she is doing now. You claim she said you have trust issues? But, if youre having to find out the truth from this guy rather than her, isnt that her fault? She's lied and left out things about this man, who she has the balls to have over for drinks while you arent there?

 

She seems to have done a nice job on you since you keep saying you dont think there is anything going on, I think we both know that probably is not the case. She has a past history of cheating on you before, now she has been not so honest about a guy who still has the hots for her after they reportedly stopped talking for months. Do you not see where this is going? let me spell it out to you. This whole "he's there for me when you and I have arguments" is bad bad news my friend. first its just conversation, him being there for her, offering her kind words(which btw, more than a few guys use to get into someones pants) Eventually, it's gonna lead to you guys having an argument, him being there, and something unfortunate happening. I mean, what was the reason she had the emotional affair? what were her excuses for that sh*t? I mean, isnt it possible this other dude began the same way this is? by "being there for her"? It doesnt sound like this is heading towards marriage

 

See, this chick really screwed you over. She got to have her little emotional affair, shes got her other guy on the side who has a crush on her who she has drinks with, both men are on her swim team. Which means she will be seeing them a lot. She will be seeing them when you're doing good and when you're arguing, which isnt good. It really isnt fair, is it? Now, until she finishes school, you're never gonna be comfortable when she goes to a swim practice, and now when you goto watch her? Youre gonna see these other two douchebags as well. I mean, I think you need to either setup some heavy boundaries, or drop this chick. Unfortunately, i do not think this will be possibly without either getting her off the swim team or on a different swim team. Boundaries will never be established as long as she is seeing these two other men even 2-3 times a week, think to yourself: how in gods name could they be? This is why it sucks for you, because unless she drops the swim team, I dont see this working.

 

I think you've deluded yourself into a lot of things. One- that youre heading towards marriage? She had an emotional fair, and possibly might start one again. You say you have no reasont o be worried, but she has lied about him, thats a red flag. You think its unfair to resurface the affair? why? if someones being charged for a crime, doesnt it make sense to see whether they've commited it before or not, to see if the yre prone to it? The fact that shes prone to affairs(emotional or not) combined with the fact shes lied and had inappropriate behavior with this man plus it being LDR? it doesnt bode well.

 

Dont settle for this girl, dont let her con you either, which is honestly what it sounds like. You said "i dont think shes cheating" waaaay to many times in this thread, which tells me deep down you think its possible, and youre worried because it happened before, which you should be. Talk to her about it, tell her shes put you in a difficult position. Shes had inappropriate behavior with two men, both on her swim team. One atleast turned into an affair, another she recently had drinks with. Tell her its unfair because she will now see these men everytime she practices, which if she's serious about swimming, is a lot. I mean, she dug this hole for herself. She messed around with two guys from her own swim team, so how could you be ok with her continuing to be on it? I mean, as far as I see it, if she doesnt leave this swim team and change your behavior, you either wont get married or end up regretting it down the line. But it sounds like you wont do something like that, so good like..I truly hope I am wrong, but honestly dont think I am

[Cecelius]

I can go 50/50 on this. I can see why she would think this incident was okay -- surely he knows she has a b/f, etc.

 

Dudes take a different view. My g/f knows that, for example, on a business trip there's no acceptable reason on the planet for a male to cross the thresshold of her room. I would never tell her that, of course, she just knows right and wrong, and what happens when wrong occurs.

 

Really the problem is that this dude is too close day to day to her. She should have put some limits up on this relationship where it is clear that he is interested in her (her interest in him, no offense, is not relevant where she continues to hang with him, and has introduced booze into the mix -- if he tries to kiss her sometime, how much sympathy should she get?).

 

I think this whole thing was doomed after the initial emotional affair, and you are just seeing the dividend from that. From her young, selfish and immature perspective, she knows you will put up with stuff that other guys won't. So you being away, here's this guy and she's not doing anything wrong, so what's the problem?

 

Since I think it was doomed and you are likely to have lost moral authority for all time, I think the only solution is just to end it here -- no talks, no explanations, just kick her out or leave yourself.

[Rooster_DAR]

Guest and Spectre are right on the money. Dude, you (if I were to guess) are a nice guy and she knows it, and she expects that you will believe her that there is nothing going on or will go on. Now true, we don't know if there is for sure or not, but I'm telling you and you need to listen to me, this is going down the wrong path for sure and has the potential for disaster.

 

There are concrete rules that should be set when a couple commit, and going out anywhere casually with a member of the opposite sex (without you) is a big no-no (even more so when alchohol is involved). The following state you made is a HUGE!!!!! red flag:

 

This guy broke up with his GF in July. I know that he initially contacted - by phone or email, I'm not sure which - my GF, who he already knew somewhat from the team, to ask if she wanted to meet up for lunch on campus around that time. At the time she would tell me about it, they met a couple of times a week because she said he wanted someone to talk to about his breakup, and was feeling really badly about it. I know that since then they have maintained email contact, all according to her about him needing advice and help with getting over his breakup. They are apparently quite good friends now, and I no longer hear it being due to his needing relationship advice.

 

This has emotional affair written all over it, and you need to be really careful with this woman. Affairs (emotional), if you don't know already are all about sharing personal experience and issues in the O/P's life. Once the personal experiences and emotional outpouring begins, this is where the feeling of two people begin to bond.

 

On another note, people will defend their encounters with things like "You are being too suspicious" "I don't see why I can't have male/female friends" "You are being too possessive" and etc.... This is a bunch of crap, and don't feel like you are the one with the problem when it's her that's the issue.

 

The following thread shows exactly what happens in this situation, and it happens all the time.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t98630/

 

 

Your are not wrong for feeling the way you do, and you need to take some kind of action now.

 

roost

[nicki]

She's not really getting the point if she keeps repeating over and over again that "it's nothing."

 

Tell her that you appreciate her saying "it's nothing." Then tell her how this situation affects you. Tell her what thoughts go through your head. And how it makes you feel. And what the ultimate outcome will be if this kind of stuff continues.

 

The poster was right who said it interferes with your relationship. Your girlfriend should understand that to mean that you are only looking out for your relationship.

 

It may be innocent on her part, but not on his. And she shouldn't do anything that will encourage him, even accidentally. Tell her you don't want her to be put into a bad situation down the road.

 

As a good girlfriend would do, she will back this other guy off and be friendly, yet stand-off-ish.

 

One trick I always use to back a guy off, is to talk about my boyfriend. No dude wants to hear how great another guy is ALL the time.

 

It seems to send a strong message of "I'm very happy with someone else." I usually throw up a strong physical barrier, too. Like minimal or no touching when greeting/saying good bye.

 

Anyway, she just may not yet understand how to do this yet. That's why you should tell her what you need her her behavior to look like.

 

Good luck! If she tries, then that's a good sign. If she doesn't, well, you deserve better.

[Rooster_DAR]

One trick I always use to back a guy off, is to talk about my boyfriend. No dude wants to hear how great another guy is ALL the time.

 

The above quote is great advice, and both couples in a relationship should do this anyway providing they are a happy couple. Whenever I'm around women who I feel are hitting on me, I use my G/F in the context of our conversion due to the fact I do love my S/O.

 

roost

[mental_traveller]

I agree with Cecilius and Bryanp. This is *highly* inappropriate behaviour, and what's more is that she isn't making any attempts to make you feel better about it. Her view seems to be that it's no big deal. That's a big red flag. If it was just naivety and she *genuinely* didn't know it was such a deal for you, then she should be all over you apologising and saying she didn't realise. But no, she's outright trying to say it was perfectly ok. That smells of "cover up".

 

Given her past history, and the timing of meeting this guy, I would say it doesn't look good. Also, forget about your trust of her etc, what you think she did or didn't do. The fact is, you DON'T KNOW what she did or didn't do. And *that* is why it's such a bad idea to ever get in a situation where your SO might wonder and not know.

[Guest]

UPDATE (long): We are broken up.

 

My girlfriend of 3.5 years broke up with me two weeks ago. I have lost her, and the apartment and life and city we shared. I have a long road of rebuilding ahead. We lived together. She did it over the phone when I was away for work. We were great together, but we were not perfect. I moved with her to another city where she was attending school. I looked for work, and being unsuccessful, eventually took a job back in our home city, sending us into a LDR. That worked for several months, until I found an opportunity where she was and pursued it for several months. But eventually that didn't work out, and again I was back working in our home city, 2000 miles away. A lot of this job hopping presented stress to myself and to our relationship.

 

Two weeks after I returned she was away for the weekend. We had a shared cel phone plan and called each other regularly -- but that particular weekend I was feeling jealous and insecure and wasn't very receptive any time she called me.

 

Eventually we had an argument about nothing, really, and I pushed and pushed and pushed on the issue of a guy she had been spending time with--the same guy who I talked about previously in this thread. I pushed so hard that she eventually admitted that she had a "crush" on him, that she only discovered the week before, and that had been reinforced by this weekend away where they saw each other (in a group setting). I asked what she wanted to do about it, and she said "I don't know." I was floored. Over the next two days she cried and said she missed and loved me more than anyone, and that everything would work out.

 

On the end of the second day she broke up with me on the phone. I did not take it well at first. I cried and begged for an hour. The next few days I broke down a few times and called her, asking if this was really happening. Of course, this also served to puff her up and lead her to say things that just made me feel worse, like "I want more" "We could never be happy" "I wasn't always happy". A little late, I realized my weak response to the breakup, toughened up, and initiated NC.

 

We had it all in terms of intimacy, comfort with each other, laughter between us, families that loved us and loved us together, and we had lots of fun. But she had a tendency to develop very intense relationships with anybody she spent lots of time with, and I had a tendency to act insecure and jealous. This problem surfaced every couple of weeks, then would disappear. But it was painful when it surfaced. It is ultimately what broke us up. I know that if I had just shown more trust in her that we would still be together. A healthy relationship must be one where it is simply enough to know that the other person is alive and well.

 

An additional, unhealthy, aspect is having to know what the other person is doing and where. This second one we had present at various times, and it was painful for both of us. When this wasn't there, when it was simply enough to know that the other person existed somewhere and was loving us, it felt great: we had the comfort of intimacy and love and care, but we also felt free. She never did anything wrong--I was just jealous of her close friendships with guys.

 

However, although my jealously broke us up after 3.5 years, it could have been that her flirtations and intense connections with guys might have led to a problem in the future, maybe 8 years down the road when we'd been married and with 2 kids. So it is perhaps--no it is certainly--for the best. Of course although I KNOW that, I don't at all FEEL it yet. I am 27 and she is 25. After 3.5 years... I really really really miss her. And certainly love her dearly. And certainly find it hard to imagine someone else with whom I could be so compatible. But I must believe that I will. And when I do, hopefully I can apply everything I have learned from this relationship.

 

Jealousy and insecurity do nothing but make you feel bad and drive your partner away. That is what I have done, and I cannot take it back. On the weekend I moved all of my stuff out of our apartment and said goodbye to her for good. I asked her not to call or email me. She asked me to send her a message saying I'd arrived safely home (it is a multi-day drive), but haven't done so.

 

I don't see any point in maintaining contact with her. I could never be with her again, after she dumped me and said many hurtful things about our past and what I thought was a very fulfilling and wonderful relationship.

 

To top it off--when I arrived to move my stuff out, she had packed my stuff!! Taken my coats out of the closet and piled them on the couch. Sorted out my shoes. Taken my books and CDs off the shelf and piled them neatly on the floor. Taken my stuff out of the bathroom. Put out my pots and pans and even dishes and mugs on the kitchen table. I packed it all in a couple of hours with her watching; I only took what was most important and abandoned a lot of the superficial stupid c*ap--like mugs and dishes--she had so callously taken out. She said she didn't like doing it, but wanted to help. This from someone who a week and a half earlier talked about marrying me. Unlike my pathetic performance on the phone last week, in person I maintained my cool, while she broke down and sobbed and hugged/kissed me several times. I haven't talked to her since (about 4 days).

 

I did not want to let go. Indeed my knuckles where white, and I was gripping her and us with full strength. I loved the relationship so much, loved being with her, loved the comfort. But it was too comfortable, and I fell into old habits of insecurity and jealousy. I really think we were both at fault for these negative emotions--I have discovered I have a tendency to feel them, and her behaviours served to exacerbate them.

 

Now, however, no contact is the best way to go. When she calls or writes to say 'I never wanted to hurt you' and 'Please don't hate me' she is only acting to make herself feel better. It is OVER, there is nothing she can say to make me feel better. There can be no further hurt and no further source of heartache if there is no further contact. Intially it is very difficult; a form of cold turkey applied to a highly addictive drug. But it is the only way to go: each indulgence only precipates several steps backwards, and delays the healing. I do not want to know anything about her, this new potential guy, her life, NOTHING.

[amerikajin]

UPDATE (long): We are broken up.

 

My girlfriend of 3.5 years broke up with me two weeks ago. I have lost her, and the apartment and life and city we shared. I have a long road of rebuilding ahead. We lived together. She did it over the phone when I was away for work. We were great together, but we were not perfect. I moved with her to another city where she was attending school. I looked for work, and being unsuccessful, eventually took a job back in our home city, sending us into a LDR. That worked for several months, until I found an opportunity where she was and pursued it for several months. But eventually that didn't work out, and again I was back working in our home city, 2000 miles away. A lot of this job hopping presented stress to myself and to our relationship.

 

Two weeks after I returned she was away for the weekend. We had a shared cel phone plan and called each other regularly -- but that particular weekend I was feeling jealous and insecure and wasn't very receptive any time she called me.

 

Eventually we had an argument about nothing, really, and I pushed and pushed and pushed on the issue of a guy she had been spending time with--the same guy who I talked about previously in this thread. I pushed so hard that she eventually admitted that she had a "crush" on him, that she only discovered the week before, and that had been reinforced by this weekend away where they saw each other (in a group setting). I asked what she wanted to do about it, and she said "I don't know." I was floored. Over the next two days she cried and said she missed and loved me more than anyone, and that everything would work out.

 

On the end of the second day she broke up with me on the phone. I did not take it well at first. I cried and begged for an hour. The next few days I broke down a few times and called her, asking if this was really happening. Of course, this also served to puff her up and lead her to say things that just made me feel worse, like "I want more" "We could never be happy" "I wasn't always happy". A little late, I realized my weak response to the breakup, toughened up, and initiated NC.

 

We had it all in terms of intimacy, comfort with each other, laughter between us, families that loved us and loved us together, and we had lots of fun. But she had a tendency to develop very intense relationships with anybody she spent lots of time with, and I had a tendency to act insecure and jealous. This problem surfaced every couple of weeks, then would disappear. But it was painful when it surfaced. It is ultimately what broke us up. I know that if I had just shown more trust in her that we would still be together. A healthy relationship must be one where it is simply enough to know that the other person is alive and well.

 

An additional, unhealthy, aspect is having to know what the other person is doing and where. This second one we had present at various times, and it was painful for both of us. When this wasn't there, when it was simply enough to know that the other person existed somewhere and was loving us, it felt great: we had the comfort of intimacy and love and care, but we also felt free. She never did anything wrong--I was just jealous of her close friendships with guys.

 

However, although my jealously broke us up after 3.5 years, it could have been that her flirtations and intense connections with guys might have led to a problem in the future, maybe 8 years down the road when we'd been married and with 2 kids. So it is perhaps--no it is certainly--for the best. Of course although I KNOW that, I don't at all FEEL it yet. I am 27 and she is 25. After 3.5 years... I really really really miss her. And certainly love her dearly. And certainly find it hard to imagine someone else with whom I could be so compatible. But I must believe that I will. And when I do, hopefully I can apply everything I have learned from this relationship.

 

Jealousy and insecurity do nothing but make you feel bad and drive your partner away. That is what I have done, and I cannot take it back. On the weekend I moved all of my stuff out of our apartment and said goodbye to her for good. I asked her not to call or email me. She asked me to send her a message saying I'd arrived safely home (it is a multi-day drive), but haven't done so.

 

I don't see any point in maintaining contact with her. I could never be with her again, after she dumped me and said many hurtful things about our past and what I thought was a very fulfilling and wonderful relationship.

 

To top it off--when I arrived to move my stuff out, she had packed my stuff!! Taken my coats out of the closet and piled them on the couch. Sorted out my shoes. Taken my books and CDs off the shelf and piled them neatly on the floor. Taken my stuff out of the bathroom. Put out my pots and pans and even dishes and mugs on the kitchen table. I packed it all in a couple of hours with her watching; I only took what was most important and abandoned a lot of the superficial stupid c*ap--like mugs and dishes--she had so callously taken out. She said she didn't like doing it, but wanted to help. This from someone who a week and a half earlier talked about marrying me. Unlike my pathetic performance on the phone last week, in person I maintained my cool, while she broke down and sobbed and hugged/kissed me several times. I haven't talked to her since (about 4 days).

 

I did not want to let go. Indeed my knuckles where white, and I was gripping her and us with full strength. I loved the relationship so much, loved being with her, loved the comfort. But it was too comfortable, and I fell into old habits of insecurity and jealousy. I really think we were both at fault for these negative emotions--I have discovered I have a tendency to feel them, and her behaviours served to exacerbate them.

 

Now, however, no contact is the best way to go. When she calls or writes to say 'I never wanted to hurt you' and 'Please don't hate me' she is only acting to make herself feel better. It is OVER, there is nothing she can say to make me feel better. There can be no further hurt and no further source of heartache if there is no further contact. Intially it is very difficult; a form of cold turkey applied to a highly addictive drug. But it is the only way to go: each indulgence only precipates several steps backwards, and delays the healing. I do not want to know anything about her, this new potential guy, her life, NOTHING.

 

I don't know a damn thing about the opposite sex, but I know this much: men are men, women are women, and the two will never, ever be the same.

 

I don't know, bud...3 1/2 years of marriage and nothing ever really happened. Maybe you two were never as 'meant to be' as much as you'd like to think. I know that's not an easy pill to swallow and it's certainly not what you want to read at this time (my sympathies by the way), but yeah, I think she saved you a date with divorce court a few years down the road.

 

Learn from the experience and find a better match.

[Bryanp]

I am sorry for you but I have to tell you that I really did think there was a lot more going on with this guy than she let on. What a bunch a bull she told you when she said it was only recently that she knew she had a crush on this other guy. When she invited him over for drinks and going to bars with him indicated a great deal more. My guess is that you still do not have the full story. You made a great point that if she constantly is flirtatious and gets attached to men she has to be around; you were asking for real trouble if you ever did marry her. Time to move on and find someone else who can respect you and the value of a committed relationship.

[Touche]

First you say this:

 

But she had a tendency to develop very intense relationships with anybody she spent lots of time with, and I had a tendency to act insecure and jealous. This problem surfaced every couple of weeks, then would disappear. But it was painful when it surfaced. It is ultimately what broke us up.

 

Then you say this:

 

However, although my jealously broke us up after 3.5 years,

 

Do you see a problem with these two statements? The first statement says it ALL. Her actions are what brought this relationship to an end...NOT your reactions to her actions. Do you not see that? Place the blame where it should be. On HER. She was NOT ready for a marriage or any long-term relationship. Consider yourself lucky that it ended.

 

Eventually you will find the right woman. But please don't think that your reaction to her having intense relaltionships with other men was inappropriate. It wasn't.

 

What if if you had been married? I'm married. Do you, or anyone in their right mind, think it would be appropriate for me to have a man over for drinks while my husband was away on a business trip? Of COURSE not. And if I ever did such a thing my husband would be RIGHT to be upset, jealous, angry, etc. etc. about it.

 

So please place the blame for the failure of this relationship squarely on HER shoulders because that's where it belongs. You did nothing wrong.

 

You'll be thankful one day, when you meet the RIGHT woman for you, that this ended.

 

Good luck as you heal from all of this and stay STRONG!

[Fun2BMe]

She's the one who was cheating on you and feeling so cocky that she not only brought men to the apartment you shared but even told you about it. Yet you wanted to believe it was friends-only. Then why didn't the rest of the friends come to the apartment and only meet up afterwards? She was cheating on you with one man after another and in fact two at the same time if you think about it, yet throughout your last post you do nothing but blame yourself and your insecurities for the break up? It should've been you who broke up with her and she felt it was so wrong for you to tollerate her that she did it for you so stop blaming yourself.

[amerikajin]

This is an example of how guys can easily misread things that may be obvious to other women, but to the guy.

 

When a girl invites a guy over to her house for a drink, and then goes and tells her boyfriend what's up, a guy might just think 'Okay, she's just giving me disclosure.' In reality, it was probably her way of hoping you two would get into a fight so she could have some excuse to break off the relationship, or better yet, hoping you'd break it off so she doesn't have to be the 'bad guy'.

 

Nine times out of ten, it's the woman who ends up having to break the bad news and not the other way around. If a guy is comfortable in a relationship, he'll stay there. We might shag extras on the side, but men are typically creatures who favor stability over all else. Women need that constant emotional high in a relationship.

[Rooster_DAR]

This is an example of how guys can easily misread things that may be obvious to other women, but to the guy.

 

When a girl invites a guy over to her house for a drink, and then goes and tells her boyfriend what's up, a guy might just think 'Okay, she's just giving me disclosure.' In reality, it was probably her way of hoping you two would get into a fight so she could have some excuse to break off the relationship, or better yet, hoping you'd break it off so she doesn't have to be the 'bad guy'.

 

Nine times out of ten, it's the woman who ends up having to break the bad news and not the other way around. If a guy is comfortable in a relationship, he'll stay there. We might shag extras on the side, but men are typically creatures who favor stability over all else. Women need that constant emotional high in a relationship.

 

Unfortunately, this is quite true.

[Guest]

Thanks all for your supportive--and honest--replies.

 

It is just over two weeks ago that she broke up with me. At the time I went online and read about breakups--this was my first long term relationship--and how it can take weeks and even months to recover if you are the dumpee. I really thought that would be me; I thought it was the end of the world. But the weird thing is, I'm fine now. I eat fine, sleep fine, go to work fine, exercise, go out with friends... it's all fine. A little spiritually weak, but completely functional, and really quite happy.

 

I have 3.5 years of good memories, and I miss all of our happy times together... but I honestly don't think I miss her. Not her today. Two weeks ago I was devastated. I said things like "She was my whole life," and "I can't live without her." I was a wreck for a week. I really couldn't see how things would get better. But they have, fast. After 3.5 years of living with someone I'm sure I must have healing left to do. But I don't think I care if I ever see her again.

 

In some ways she seemed to almost enjoy the drama of the breakup, saying immature things like "Your family must hate me" and "I feel like a monster"... and "I want to see you when you come to move out but I'd understand if you don't want to see me since you must be so mad". All of these dramatic statements, I recognized, were really only attempts to make herself feel better in some way. I myself couldn't benefit from a single word she uttered. My only regret is that when she initially delivered the words "I think I need to break up with you" I didn't just say "Okay, sounds good" and hung up and shut up. Man I would have loved that. I did do that, but about 5 days delayed.

 

Anyway, I loved, lost, and learned. And bounced back. And maybe, grudgingly, I am thanking her for doing this. Because I wouldn't have. I would have slugged it out, tried to make things work, blah, blah, blah.

 

OK, enough rambling. I really just wanted to pat my own back and write about how stunned I am at my recovery. Thanks to those who read and commented on the end of my first long term relationship with the first girl I ever loved.

 

But now I am free. And happy about being so.

[Cecelius]

I think you have learned the most valuable lesson there is -- your pride (in yourself, and how you conduct yourself) is the most important thing you can have -- and beats out any girl, especially one who dumped you.She figured you'd see the writing on the wall and just go away.

 

Also your post will confirm, for all time, that there is no good, and no good reason, for an attached young lady to be inviting another man to her place for drinks.

[Rooster_DAR]

I think you have learned the most valuable lesson there is -- your pride (in yourself, and how you conduct yourself) is the most important thing you can have -- and beats out any girl, especially one who dumped you.She figured you'd see the writing on the wall and just go away.

 

Also your post will confirm, for all time, that there is no good, and no good reason, for an attached young lady to be inviting another man to her place for drinks.

 

 

My thoughts exactly!

 

Excellent!

[crazy_grl]

My thoughts exactly!

 

Excellent!

 

Ditto. I've lost count of how many threads I've seen that prove that point.

 

Guest, I just want to reiterate that it was your ex's behavior that was the reason for the break up. Unless you have major issues with jealousy and insecurity (which you don't if you were ok with her other male friends), then your gf should not be doing things to make you feel that way. Don't be afraid to express your disapproval of these types of things in your next relationship.

 

Glad you're feeling well. You should be.

 

Take care.

[Guest]

She emailed me today. So she broke NC, but it was about some administrative thing to do with our old apartment that I need to do for her, which is necessary. But she also said she hopes I'm "doing okay", and to tell me about some other things that have gone well with her including a couple of swim meets these past few weeks. She also said she knows I wanted some "space right now" (actually I told her to not call or write me ever, she either doesn't remember or is downplaying the strong language I used) but that she'd been dying to tell me about how well her meet went, and she "had to write about the apartment thing anyway".

 

SO. I'm going to do the administrative thing for her - I have to mail a letter - and will reply telling her I have done so. Other than that, I might say Congrats on her meet, since she wrote a paragraph on it, but that's it.

 

I am severely tempted to hint that I'm doing much better than "okay", and that I've been really busy and enjoying life these past few weeks (when she first broke up with me I was a devastated wreck, and since I've cut off communication with her completely she might think I still am). But, I think I won't bother. Why would I -- it would only be to try and look good to her, and I don't need that recognition. The hell with it.

 

Some days I definitely miss her, in various ways, but I just remind myself of why I could never ever be with her, even if I still feel like I'd want to, or if she came crawling back: she broke up with me twice... and I read somewhere else on LS that true love doesn't need breaks, let alone break-ups, I'm a big believer in that.

 

I'm also a non-believer in being friends with exes, especially with an ex I have no intentions of taking back, and especially at my age and with no kids, friends with exes is BS. I don't think my ex of almost 4 weeks now knows how strongly and how long (how about forever?) I intend to pursue NC. At least these emails telling me about herself, and asking how I'm doing, indicate she doesn't. But she'll get no information from me. Zero.

 

From a purely selfish perspective, Is that a good approach? What good can I possibly get from replying to her in any detail?

[shakenandstirred]

Keep doing what you're doing. You seem to be doing well. Don't let her wreck your progress because she might be feeling guilty now.

 

Good luck

[Cecelius]

I wouldn't take any affirmative act with respect to her at all, other than the apartment related letter.

 

She needs to fade in your mind into a non-event. Treat her like someone you bumped into on the elevator, or someone you'd see in a line at the store -- no ill will, no anger, no need for approval from her or any emotional reaction from.

 

The opposite of love isn't hate; it is complete disinterest.

 

You learned your lesson from her, there's no need to let a girl like that occupy any more space in your head.