doe absence make the heart grow fonder?

[mutts]

Hi:

I was with my ex for 3 years, and up until recently I never expected that to change.

Sure we'd argue here and there, ussually about stupid petty things, but we were very similar in personality, and could entertain each other and interest each other in ways I've never experienced even with my closest friends.

However, a month ago she broke it off, saying that I have changed recently and am no longer the guy she fell in love with.

I feel I need to explain that earlier in the year she fell pregnant and due to our circumstances we decided to have an abortion. Undfortunatly it wasn't that simple and 2 weeks later she misscaried what the doctors called retained product, which in all honesty was half a baby.

As I'm sure you can appreciate this messed us up and she pushed me away and we took a break. After a few weeks we got back together and things were great until I became a little possesive and started to get a little funny about her going out with one particular friend. (this is not the guy I am or want to be). think as a result to the abortion/misscaraige.

So she called it off saying that she didn't want to be in a relationship anymore and she wanted her freedom and have no one else to consider.

I embraced this until we bumped into each other on a night out and had a blazing row. She ended up coming round to my place at 4 am and staying over. We had a whirlwind week together and it really looked like we were getting back together, she told me I was being the way I was when we first met and this was the person she was in love with. until all of a sudden again she said no, I dont want this. A complete U-turn, one minute we're disscusing how to move forward and to what extent, then nothing.

Since then I haven't played it too cool, I guess I've bugged her and hounded her, (all of which I know will drive her away) I just cant seem to help myself when I'm around her, I feel like I cant be without her and I know it's pissing her off that we keep having the same conversation.

Today we had to meet up in order to sort out past bills and to collect our respective things from each others houses, and she was very cold and mean to me. I tried hard to nice and leave her on a high after seeing me, but she made it immposible.

She's told me she no longer loves me and that she doesn't think we'll ever get back together, but this wan't what she was saying last week!

My head is a mess.

She told me she thinks I should see other people, yet when she heard I went out on a date she withdrew and has been off with me since then.

Why does she get mad if she doesn't love me?

I know I'm rambling but I guess I want to know how I can get her to feel for me again and whether people think that if you break up with someone, no matter what circumstances there will come a time when you look back at it and wonder if you made the right decision.

I mean there was never any infidelity and I guess I've always thought that there was nothing between us that couldn't be fixed.

I'm going to enforce some real time apart but does absence really make the heart grow fonder??

Will she want me back?

[mutts]

Sorry to bump this but I really need an answer

[Gunny376]

No. More often than not, once a separation takes place ~ there are few reconcilations that are successful. While it may make the heart grow fonder ~ it and of itself is inssufficent to address the under-lying problems (which may or may not be stated ~ or may or may not be known). which caused the initial separation.

 

You should give the following consideration:

 

This is from Michelle Weiner Davis' book Divorcebusting:

 

Quote:

 

 

 

1. Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or

implore!

2. No frequent phone calls

3. Do not point out good points in marriage

4. Do not follow him around the house

5. Do not encourage talk about the future

6. Do not ask for help from family members

7. Do not ask for reassurances

8. Do not buy gifts

9. Do not schedule dates together

10. Do not spy on spouse

11. Do not say "I Love You"

12. Act as if you are moving on with your life

13. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive

14. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get

busy, do things, go to church, go out with friends,

etc.

15. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start

the conversation) be scarce or short on words

16. If you are in the habit of asking your spouse his

whereabouts, ASK NOTHING

17. You need to make your partner think that you have

had an awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you

are going to move on with your life, with or without

your spouse

18. Do not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull

back and wait to see if spouse notices and, more

important, realize what he will be missing

19. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show

your spouse happiness and contentment. Show him

someone he would want to be around.

20. All questions about marriage should be put on

hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which

may be a while)

21. Never lose your cool

22. Don't be overly enthusiiastic

23. Do not argue about how he feels (it only makes

their feelings stronger)

24. Be patient

25. Listen carefully to what your spouse is really

saying to you

26. Learn to back off, shut up and walk away when you

want to speak out

27. Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh &

focus on all the other parts of your life that are not

in turmoil)

28. Be strong and confident and learn to speak softly

29. Know that if you can do 180, your smallest

CONSISTENT actions will be noticed much more than any

words you can say or write

30. Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you

are hurting more than ever and are desperate and needy

31. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with

your spouse

32. Do not believe any of what you hear and less than

50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in

absolute negatives because he is hurting and scared

33. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad

you feel

34. Do not backslide from your hardearned changes

 

 

 

I would also recommend reading ilmw's', Devil Dog's and UK's thread, as all of them have elements that are very similar to your thread. Develop and more in depth Plan A and Plan B from this. (Ref: Marriagebuilders Plan A and Plan B)

 

Link To Devil Dog http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t49359/

Link To ilmw http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t90264/?highlight=ilmw

Link To UKSurfer http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t88277/?highlight=uksurfer and http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t90840/?highlight=uksurfer

 

The key elements seem to be:

 

Patience

Balance

Working on your own personal issues

[almostthere]

I was the one in my divorce to leave to take some time to see how i really felt.

 

After a few weeks i started mending old friendships and having fun. Absence in my experience did not make my heart grow fonder. All it did was show me that there is life after my exh. it was reassuring.

[Rooster_DAR]

She's no good!

 

Drama queen!

[Gunny376]

"She told me she thinks I should see other people, yet when she heard I went out on a date she withdrew and has been off with me since then."

 

This very topic appeared in the comic strip "Zits"

 

"She told me she thinks we should see other people.......... means,...........we = me! Not you there Bud!

[Lor]

She has got issues--don't we all? How supportive of her losing the baby were you? Very? or luke-warm since you "both" decided on an abortion? Let me tell you something that guys don't understand....unless a woman is a real b*tch, when she becomes pregnant she has a bond with her unborn child that is beyond comprehension, that a man won't have until he's held the child in his arms, if even then. Take a hint from this comment you said she made:

 

So she called it off saying that she didn't want to be in a relationship anymore and she wanted her freedom and have no one else to consider

 

Send off any dinging bells, anyone? She lost a child and is still grieving, whether she actually wanted the child or not, and then to find out that the child was not whole....oh man, do I feel for her. Have you asked her how she's doing, what fears she has on the subject? Could be she's afraid to ever try and have another child after this--my SIL had a miscarriage and was deathly afraid after that, but now has 2 wonderful, healthy boys.

 

How did she say you've changed? I'm going to assume you weren't married? IMO, you don't need to have the certificate to be considered "married". I'm betting that since the miscarriage, she's the one who's really changed, isn't she? Did she ever get counselling afterwards? Did you grieve with her? If not, she's feeling betrayed by someone she considers her best friend, who's shoulder was supposed to be there and comfort her in the loss of your child. Hopefully your actions weren't screaming "hey, what's the big deal? We didn't want a child anyway, right?"

[mutts]

To be honest I tried to be a suportive as possible after the misscaraige, but she wouldn't talk to me about it.

 

We both have a tendency to withdraw, but I made a concious effort to be there even when she told me to go.

 

I'm very aware of my faults but I honestly feel I did all I could in that situation.

 

She has never been to counseling, even though a close family member of hers is a counciler, and recomended it.

 

She has told me that this breakup in no way relates to the abortion, and that she has never really been torn as to whether it was the right decision because she is certain we were right.

 

I was supportive during the decision making and would have gone along with any decision she made. But I also wanted to make it clear she didn't have to make the decision on her own.

 

She collected the last of her stuff the other day, and it was on bad terms. She really seems to be angry with me at the moment, maybe because I had tried to get her back, unsucesfully or maybe cos' I've been on a date?

 

I left her a note at my house, short, friendly. When I got home she had ripped it in half and written BYE on it.

 

Doesn't sound good huh??

 

It's been 3 days with no contact and Im torn because on the one hand theres no reason for us to tak now so I can get on with my life, however on the other hand, theres no reason for us to talk now.

[Lor]

Nope, doesn't sound good. Sounds like when she said for you to date she didn't really mean it. You gotta read between the lines...when she told you to date she didn't actually want you to, she wanted you to pine away for her. Or at least wait a while? How long had you been separated before you went on this date? Doesn't sound like very long.......I'd have ripped up the note, too, cuz of that.

 

You have to learn to "hear" what she's saying when she isn't saying it--look at the body language. She's not very good at communicating what she wants either and she's testing you to see what you'll do. Don't make assumptions that what she says is actually what she means. Sounds like a hassle? Then don't bother and move on with your life.

 

If you do talk to her about the problems you two are having, you need to let her know that you don't always know what she's saying and would she make it clearer to you, and to be blunt about it. Hedging is not a good thing in a relationship.

 

She's closed up. I'm betting she has more problems with the miscarriage than she's letting on, trying to pretend that it doesn't bother her when actually it did and does. Maybe wrong but somehow don't think so. That was a very traumatic time in her life, and yours. You say you handled the situation and were there for her......if you aren't very good at communicating, I have to wonder how you handled it. did you go to the doctor with her? take care of her, hold her while she cried and cried with her? did she cry? if not--big bad sign. Inside you probably understand but if you didn't communicate to her that you were there for her, she's gonna have built up a wall that'll take a Mac truck to break down.

 

I honestly could be way off base here but if you aren't in touch with her feelings and only think you understand, you've got a problem. And I'm not trying to pick on you, just make you see.

[mutts]

I really appreciate your advice.

 

I did hold her when she cried and I did cry with her. I tried to get her to open up and I really made the point of making sure she could always come to me and she did.

 

I'm probably wrong but I dont think that the abortion is the big issue here, I think for the most part we're past it. We did our grieving.

 

I might not open up that often, but I ussually say what I mean. I was hoping she was trying to test me, but sometimes she is so cold, her body language really does suggest she doesn't give a *****.

 

we were seperated about a 6 weeks when I went on this date, which i only did to try and take my mind off her (I was bored beyond belief all night.)

 

I tried to make it clear I want her but she kept telling me she doesn't want me, so how is that a test. i stuck around up to the point where she got angry with me.

 

I really want to be with her, but I cant contact her for a while can I.

 

I think I have to wait for her to contact me, whenever that may be?

 

I have to fight the urge to call her, but I f i do, im not respecting her wishes and probably only making it worse, you think??

[Gunny376]

 

Send off any dinging bells, anyone? She lost a child and is still grieving, whether she actually wanted the child or not, and then to find out that the child was not whole....oh man, do I feel for her.

 

 

Yea it did, big time but I didn't feel as though I was the more qualified to comment on it, and so held back in doing so.

 

With that said, even though I'm quoating this post, I've read the subsequent post, and agree with Thor that the miscarriage and failure you handle it ~ is the central issue here. Everything else is just adding insult to injury.

 

You might want to check out Devil Dog's thread ~ as he and his wife went through a similar issue.

 

To be completely honest with you, only about 5% of couples come out of this.

[mutts]

What i dont get is that we patched things up. We took time apart (albiet not long) after the abortion and things were fine until recently.

 

Maybe it's because she'd be due about now and thats playing with her subconcious?

 

But she has assured me it's not about this.

 

As for me going on that date, she turned cold when i told her and made some sarky comments but at the same time said she was fine with it.

 

Why cant women (sorry for the generalisation) just say what they mean.

 

Or maybe she is saying what she means and I just dont want to believe it.

 

Help me my head is a mess.

[mutts]

Havent spoken or seen her for a week now. Last time we spoke she had come to collect the last of her belongings and if you've read the rest of my post you'll know that we weren't on the best of terms at the time.

 

I really want to call her, because I want to be fresh in her mind but, if she wanted to hear from me wouldn't she call me?

 

What would I say other than Hi, just called to see how you are?

 

I'm not going to get the result Im looking for which is her back so I guess I'd just be resetting the clock, huh.

 

How long do i leave the NC for though, please advise.

x

[Plato1969]

Havent spoken or seen her for a week now. Last time we spoke she had come to collect the last of her belongings and if you've read the rest of my post you'll know that we weren't on the best of terms at the time.

 

I really want to call her, because I want to be fresh in her mind but, if she wanted to hear from me wouldn't she call me?

 

What would I say other than Hi, just called to see how you are?

 

I'm not going to get the result Im looking for which is her back so I guess I'd just be resetting the clock, huh.

 

How long do i leave the NC for though, please advise.

x

 

If I understand NC right (and I guarantee not from practicing it myself) it's like a game of "chicken". You want to be the last one to veer off. Or in a stare down contest, you want to be the last to blink.

 

What you're finding out is that if she makes first contact with you, then you are in her head. You want to exude a happy, go lucky, "even without you" type of attitude. Not mean, but nice and carefree. If she doesn't contact you, well that pretty much spells it out for you...she doesn't care. Of course, the hard part is determining how long you need to do it for. I'm not sure of guidelines, but I think that a week is not nearly enough. Go for a month (and if someone has a better strategy, by all means, pipe in.)

 

Good luck.

[Lor]

Why cant women (sorry for the generalisation) just say what they mean.

 

Why should we? That wouldn't be any fun.

 

Some women can't say what they mean, even when they know exactly what they want and what they want to say. Sounds crazy, I know. She told you to date, so you did and she got mad. Why? Cuz you weren't supposed to date anyone and when you did, it told her that you don't mean it when you say you love her cuz look at how easy she is replaced. But, hindsight is 20/20 and you can't change the past. You can say "look, you told me to date!" and she's gonna come back with "yeah, but I didn't think you would!"

 

You've had no contact with her in a week? Nothing at all? To test the waters, you could call and simply ask how she's doing. If she says fine, then keep yours just as simple and then hang up. If she responds with more than a one word answer, you're doing good. Don't get into anything personal, don't start babbling with the I love you's, and don't ask when or if she thinks you'll be able to get back together. Keep it light, very light. then, if it goes good, give her another week, then do the same thing. But not every day!

 

Its more than possible that since her due date is coming up that she may be having a very hard time with it, regardless of what she says. You can't base everything on her words, you really need to examine her actions. You can't trust her words at all, and she'll probably say a lot of hurtful things that she doesn't mean. Believe only 10% of what you hear and 90% of what you see, friends, family, her, you name it.

[mutts]

Bumped into her friend today, had a brief chat. I still haven't called her, but I asked her friend how she was. Her friend said she was fine, and that they had been out a lot recently. I asked if she'd mentioned me and her friend said she said last night, 'Its funny I havent thought about him since we broke up.'

 

That hurts. I mean I can understand that she doesn't want to be with me, but how can you just stop thinking about someone you've been so close to for so long???????

[Rooster_DAR]

That just plain sucks ba**s!

 

Sorry man

[Plato1969]

Bumped into her friend today, had a brief chat. I still haven't called her, but I asked her friend how she was. Her friend said she was fine, and that they had been out a lot recently. I asked if she'd mentioned me and her friend said she said last night, 'Its funny I havent thought about him since we broke up.'

 

That hurts. I mean I can understand that she doesn't want to be with me, but how can you just stop thinking about someone you've been so close to for so long???????

 

Well, I think that means one of two things. Either she wants herself to believe that (to make the break up easier to deal with) or that's how she really feels. If it's the latter, screw her, you wouldn't want her anyway. But I suspect she's just saying that, trying to convince herself that's what she really feels. If she has any heart at all, she's missing the good times, the familiarity of your companionship and the comfort of having a relationship for the last 3 years. I know this is a tough time, but keep doing what you're doing, and if you need to vent or ask questions, this is the best place to do it.

 

Hang in there...

[mutts]

So i wake up on Friday and theres a bag outside my front door. Inside are some things she's returned to me, but in all honesty there was nothing in there she really needed to bother giving me back. An old t-shirt and some letters that were dated over a year ago. There was a photo of us in there that I guess she doesn't want to keep, but to be fair there was no need to go out of her way to return the stuff. A brief note simply said call me about outstanding bill.

we have one outstanding bill to be paid, but she knows that there is nothing further to do, now that we have filled out the relevent forms and posted them off.

 

I didn't call her.

 

Saturday she called 3 times and i didn't answer or call her back. If she really wants us over, I guess i want her used to the fact that im not availible to speak to anymore and that i really am gone.

 

I'm sure it's wishfull thinking but i guess i dont want to answer cos' I know she wont say what i want to hear and I'll be left gutted.

 

Am I doing the right thing??

[Lor]

No, don't avoid her phone calls. You're trying to put off the inevitable by not responding to her. She probably wants to talk about the bill and that is all. You don't want to hear that that's the only reason she's calling you for but procrastination is going to get you nowhere.

 

What are you doing for yourself?

[mutts]

Yeah your right.

 

I took her call when she phoned today and we had a brief chat which was pleasent, if not a little awkward. Her call about the bill was completely un neccesary as she well knows. There was nothing really to discuss in that respect.

I was polite, but gave no inclination as to my feelings, because I know that has bugged before. However she made no effort to make plans to see me either.

 

She told me that she was doing well and had been going out every night.

 

Funny, her friend called me this sfternoon to ask me if I wanted to go out for a drink with her and her boyfriend.

 

I said I hear you've seen a lot of my ex recently, and she said no, not at all, infact we've only been out twice in the last few weeks. Infact my ex called her at the weekend and asked if she wanted to go out. She couldn't and my ex said, ive been so bored recently I havent been out in days.

 

I guess she's trying to save face, but it's kind of sad that she's that bored and still doesn't want to see me.

[Lor]

Believe 10% of what you hear from anyone and 90% of what you see.

[mutts]

This might be a long one - sorry.

 

The last time we saw each other (2 weeks ago) things didn't go too well as I've previously said. She got a bit narky about me going on a date and told me that she'd slept with this guy. This was sposed to have happened before we reconciled a month ago, albiet briefly.

I knew she had kissed this guy, it was a drunken mistake and she was embarrased about it, as she had told me, but she had maintained that they hadn't slept together.

So when she later claimed they had, the same night they kissed, I felt that it was just a stinging dig at me for dating someone else.

 

Thing is, I've always maintained that the only thing i couldn't forgive would be if she cheated, or once we'd broken up, if she slept with someone else, I wouldn't be able to shake that off.

 

So if this is true and she has slept with someone else, why didn't she tell me that months ago, when I was bugging her everyday to get back together. She knew that would have made me walk away.

 

I didn't really believe her as she's not that kind of girl anyway. I asked her friend, who is the friend she would discuss sex with if she knew about this. She said no, she's not said a word to me.

 

Now this friend who although she's a mutual friend, her loyalties must lie with my ex, has said she wouldn't tell my ex about any conversations we've had. But i guess if she tells me things my ex says, Im sure the same goes the other way.

 

Speaking to the friend last night I said so did you find out whether there was any truth in what she said, and she said yeah, I asked her why she told you she slept with someone and she replied, because I did sleep with him.

 

My mind is a mess. Im angry because if this is true, then she could have saved me a whole load of pain and been straight up with me. Or maybe. as the friend has obviously told her that I asked if she had really slept with this guy, she has told her to confirm it, as not to lose face. And to keep me away.

 

I guess I'll never really know. One thing I do know is that the night she 'slept' with him, I saw her earlier in the evening in a bar and she was crying over me. Maybe she did have sex with someone to feel better?

 

I saw her the next day and she said that her mate had left her in the bar to go off with another guy and she was really p**sed off because she had to get a taxi home on her own.

 

Where's the truth in all this? Why do i care? I wish I could forget about it, cos' even if it's true this happened over a month ago. I feel cheated though. I want to wash my hands of her, but whilst I'm feeling much better about the breakup, and I'm moving on, I want to phone her up and have a go at her for treating me like a prat.

But that would do no good, other than burn any bridges there are left if any. Having said that if their are any I not sure I want to cross them. (I do, i just dont want to want to.)

[joriel]

Hey Mutts,

 

If what you say is true and you wouldn't want anything to do with her if she slept with someone right after the break-up, then you have your answer. Let it go. If at all possible go and find one of YOUR friends to vent to. If nothing else you need someone right now who will listen to your anger/frustration and be on your side (and support you), even if only for a night and in the comfort of your own home. Go and find a "yes man" of sorts...

 

And after you've vented out to your hearts content, get back on the horse and start letting go...

[mutts]

I know i should talk to MY mates, but I guess Im hoping that she's told her friend something differant to what she's told me.

 

Guess not. And by talking to her friend, at least i know how she is and what she's up to.

 

Will stop that now though. Although I feel it would be harder now to get back together than stay apart, and I've really made progress, been on dates and stuff, deep down I still expect her to come back, but she is showing no signs of a change of mind. I've got to be honest my main feeling in all this is shock. I cant belive we're still apart, it's like playing a game, that Im bored of and I want things to go back to normal.