quankanne Posted October 6, 2006 Share Posted October 6, 2006 maybe...but the computer you use every day was created by science, not by faith. it doesn't stop me from fervently believing the sucker will start up every day, rather than go bonkers on me! :D The fact of the matter is that whether there is a god or not, it shouldn't mean much to anyone. All you can do is try to live your life and be as much as a good person as is possible in this wicked world. but where does this believe come from? Not that I disagree – I believe it's important to be good to others while you're on this planet, but my belief is based in what was taught me at my mother's knee, and that was faith-based. If I learned that goodness is a reflection of our love of God and from him, then how is a non-believer able to arrive at the same conclusion without knowing the "parameters" introduced by knowlege of God? this isn't meant to be a snarky question – I'm honestly curious as to how a non-believer arrives at the same conclusion. Link to post Share on other sites
alphamale Posted October 6, 2006 Share Posted October 6, 2006 The Big Bang was an act of God, So then where did God live before he/she/it invented the Universe? Was God living in some parallel universe? Or is God = Time? Maybe that's it, God is time. That would explain everything. My equation: G=tc(squared) G=god t=age of universe c=speed of light Link to post Share on other sites
Craig Posted October 7, 2006 Share Posted October 7, 2006 The difference between science and religion BT is that science doesn't pretend it can answer that question. To pretend is unscientific. and i'm sure you are much more privvy to the "nature" of God than everyone else, BT.... So then where did God live before he/she/it invented the Universe? Was God living in some parallel universe? Or is God = Time? Maybe that's it, God is time. That would explain everything. My equation: G=tc(squared) G=god t=age of universe c=speed of light Alpha, so what you are saying is that God is measured in meters? G = seconds * meters / second = meters I left the punch line for you.... Link to post Share on other sites
Author burning 4 revenge Posted October 7, 2006 Author Share Posted October 7, 2006 Or is God = Time? Maybe that's it, God is time. Excellent question and probably the only substantive one. What is God to you? How do you define God? If one defines God as time, or God as cause and effect, or mathematics....those answers I can accept and say that I too believe in God and therefore am not an atheist. It's when people start pressuposing a conscious God with a personality that I start to have a profound disagreement. So...maybe this warants a whole new thread, but I'll leave it up here for now....could you guys tell me what God means to you? Define God for me? I'm not challenging you, I'm truly curious. Link to post Share on other sites
Author burning 4 revenge Posted October 7, 2006 Author Share Posted October 7, 2006 And one more thing, I think what most people think of as God has it's origins in Egypt. The pharoah Akehnaten suscribed to the practices of the solar cult of Aten and introduced monotheism to Egypt. This in turn may have influenced Hebrew slaves who transfigured the figure of Aten into one of their semitic gods, the one with the unspeakable name YHWH. The other powerful semitic god Baal became the angel Beelzebub. After the Israelites were invaded by the Babylonians and later by the Persians they adopted some of their beliefs such as light and darkness/ good and evil. Beelzebub became Satan, not just one of the angels, but now the dark angel. All of sudden the concept of an afterlife crept into their belief system and many of them now believed in Heaven and Hell. This belief in Heaven and Hell was Persian, not part of their faith before that. So you see what is happening...our modern comprehension of God and all it implies came as a result of cultural interplay in the ancient world. It's fascinating if you read the ancient history of religions and you find all of these dissparate beliefs melding into the beliefs of the Israelites and in turn passed down to us who have been shaped by them since birth. Link to post Share on other sites
Author burning 4 revenge Posted October 7, 2006 Author Share Posted October 7, 2006 maybe...but the computer you use every day was created by science, not by faith. it doesn't stop me from fervently believing the sucker will start up every day, rather than go bonkers on me! :D The fact of the matter is that whether there is a god or not, it shouldn't mean much to anyone. All you can do is try to live your life and be as much as a good person as is possible in this wicked world. but where does this believe come from? Not that I disagree – I believe it's important to be good to others while you're on this planet, but my belief is based in what was taught me at my mother's knee, and that was faith-based. If I learned that goodness is a reflection of our love of God and from him, then how is a non-believer able to arrive at the same conclusion without knowing the "parameters" introduced by knowlege of God? this isn't meant to be a snarky question – I'm honestly curious as to how a non-believer arrives at the same conclusion. Good question. The French novelist and philosopher (and my favourite writer of all time) Albert Camus argued that morality should be derived from empathy. And isn't that more beautiful than fear of punishment anyway. Link to post Share on other sites
lindya Posted October 7, 2006 Share Posted October 7, 2006 It's when people start pressuposing a conscious God with a personality that I start to have a profound disagreement. So...maybe this warants a whole new thread, but I'll leave it up here for now....could you guys tell me what God means to you? Define God for me? I'm not challenging you, I'm truly curious. Most of us are pretty regularly exposed to the notion of there being an almighty deity as we grow up. Some people make a conscious decision to reject that notion as irrational and unscientific. Others hold onto aspects of it in order to form their own personal set of ethics. When I was at school we had a short religious assembly every morning at school. I was a typical child who is comforted by hearing the same stories (especially about good defeating evil) over and over again, so I didn't mind it. If I thought a parable conveyed a good message, I'd accept and internalise it. If I disagreed with the message of a parable - eg the prodigal son one, - I'd respond by forming some oppositional principle. Either way, those lessons had some sort of impact on me. I see "God" as a word that conveys peace, ethics and wisdom. If the notion has to take some tangible form, it would be a vague amalgamation of people I respect and trust. As for the version presented by organised religion and outlined in the bible, my view is that (like Santa Claus) it's a useful aid to disciplining children and instilling them with a conscience that will hopefully remain even when the belief that nurtured it is outgrown. Link to post Share on other sites
bluetuesday Posted October 7, 2006 Share Posted October 7, 2006 ...could you guys tell me what God means to you? Define God for me? I'm not challenging you, I'm truly curious. god is... pure, formless consciousness out of which everything that was made, was made. god is... the energy and fabric of the universe. god is... both personal and impersonal. god is... neither rewarding nor vengeful. god is... that which expresses itself through creation. god is... that which constantly transcends itself. god is... that which IS. god is... mostly totally misunderstood. i cannot say what god means to me. same as i cannot say what being alive means to me. because i have never experienced the opposite. there is no opposite to god. god simply is and i know nothing else. defining god is a really tough question. it implies we have words for everything when in reality our language is so limited. it's like describing what an apple tastes like to someone who's never eaten one. you can give a vague proximation but you really have to experience an apple to be able to differentiate it from a pear. Link to post Share on other sites
maoserr Posted October 10, 2006 Share Posted October 10, 2006 Science is a way of thinking. Religion is a way of feeling. Chose your poison, but either way, I don't think you can know "The Truth". Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted October 10, 2006 Share Posted October 10, 2006 Some people make a conscious decision to reject that notion as irrational and unscientific. Other people understand that 'scientific' is not the ultimate test of the worthiness of knowledge. Fortunately, actual scientists such as our friend above, are aware of, as he (she?) put it 'the constraints of the scientific method'. That is because they are eminently aware that all of humanity, themselves included, accepts the verity of concepts which can never be proved empirically in any way, shape, or form. You know, silly things like 'truth', 'beauty', 'wisdom', etc. Things which are impossible to measure or verify. I guess, because those things are unquantifiable by the 'rational, scientific' mind, they must not exist either. In fact, thought itself cannot be quantified. Nor, really, can the term 'to be'. So 'I think, therefore I am', is a MOST unscientific and irrational statement. Link to post Share on other sites
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