KAPOW!!! The Blow Up

[Touche]

Holy crap! Is that your picture? You're quite attractive!

 

So are you, you litle cute alfalfa you!

[Touche]

So are you, you litle cute alfalfa you!

 

Oh and thank you for the compliment, love. Yes, that's me.

[Loveslacker]

So are you, you litle cute alfalfa you!

 

Ever get to Africa??

[Touche]

Ever get to Africa??

 

Not directly, no. Why do you ask?

[Loveslacker]

Not directly, no. Why do you ask?

Too bad....the Cote d'Ivoire is lovely this time of year, that's all. (but it's no Detroit )

[Touche]

Too bad....the Cote d'Ivoire is lovely this time of year, that's all. (but it's no Detroit )

 

Detroit? Is THAT the standard? Okie, Dokie...

[Pyro]

Too bad....the Cote d'Ivoire is lovely this time of year, that's all. (but it's no Detroit )

 

Is that an actual compliment for the city of Detroit from an outsider?

[a4a]

Maybe it'll turn out that she does indeed have a rare specimen, and hopefully, it'll all work out nicely for her.

He is quite rare, very much so if you compare him to many posting or posted about here.

 

Of course... I don't know her or her husband. All I have to work with is my own experience and a generalized study of men. But I don't personally know a single man that wouldn't have had an objection to the ultimatum a4a gave her husband.

 

Well meet one, come on by ..........the H THANKED ME FOR SHOWING HIM THAT HE COULD STAND UP TO THE "boss". Better yet a huge meeting took place and it looks like him drawing a line in the sand worked for the better for all involved. You see stating us or work was not just about my stupid woman desire to spend time with my H. It was about him and I being pushed too far.

I view M in many respects like a business and you set goals, build for the future, and decide as a partnership where your company is heading. One of our aggreements is for a good balance between work and home. He was allowing that boundary to be violated which would effect both of us..... HE DOES NOT WANT TO WORK ON SAT EITHER........ AND HE DOES NOT HAVE TO.

 

I know quite a few who'd have capitulated... and I know quite a few who wouldn't have. Of the ones who would, to a man... they'd have harbored resentment for 'being told what to do' and each would've felt like the p*ssy he was accused of being at the outset for doing it.

 

Well if a man is that fragile that he cannot handle being told he is acting like a pussy..... maybe he is a pussy indeed. I mean hell is my H supposed to go cry like a woman over it? You hurted my widdle fweewings.....

 

Funny though the guys he works with said they all agree with him and they feel the same way...... again this was not about me getting my way this was about the H getting his way and our way with my help to do so.

 

Beware. That's all I'm saying.

Beware of what that we had a wonderful night last night and discussed this for about 2 hours and that he see's why I raised my voice at him and is glad I did "protect" him from getting sucked into a worse situation. He was never upset with me for saying he was acting like a pussy. (geeze people, the word does not mean jack to us) Nor was he upset about me stating a choice to him...... as his own desire was that he did not want to work. He got a sob story and fell for it. Hell I fell for them too for awhile.

 

 

 

 

I think of men and women working together kind of like jigsaw pieces. There are strengths and weaknesses in each, but where one is weak the other is strong.

 

You are right my H would make a better parent than I ever would. I do better on the business end of things. I suppose we have a gender role reversal and some find that really hard to swallow. Thus their need to keep saying we are never going to make it.

 

Let's face it, how many men do you know that when faced with childbirth or menstruation wouldn't have give up the ghost? Geez... if my husband had to have a monthly period, he'd have died in a mournful puddle by age 13.

 

I actually think an attitude like that is way way more emasculating/disrespectful than saying "your being a pussy about this situation"........ vs " you could never do what I do, no way, because you are a man" I guess I would call that reverse sexism?

 

Still, I think it's innately important for a man to feel like he's capable of protecting his family, and to feel like he's 'in charge' of the chaos which surrounds him in order to feel confident in his abilities. My personal belief is that alot of that is leftover genetic coding, and maybe the "traditional man" is more susceptible to it than some of his counterparts.

 

Maybe I found one that evolved. :lmao:

 

Interesting that men need to "feel like" not that they can but they have to "feel like they can". Maybe for some men they don't need to think they can they like to know they can. So feeding them a line and pampering their ego is not what they want. I think the H would slap me if I pulled some stupid crap by feeding him lies..... maybe he is a realist?

 

Honey I know you can fight the bear you are a big strong man. You can save your family from it. (wow no wonder many men are so crushed when they fail, what huge expectations are put on them)

 

My H would say I think I can out run that bear. That is real logic, he is not stupid enough to take on a bear in some fruitless heroic effort. Nor am I going to fill his head full of crap telling him he should or could take on the bear.

 

 

 

And no I do not see us as man and woman. I see us as a partnership, maybe because I have had LTRs with women and have so many gay male friends that those roles soley assigned by genitals were meaningless. I do not go about my day doing womanly things. I have no desire to do so, and my H would not tolerate one of those in his life.

 

 

And yes Moose we had a superb time, H had a ball. He wanted to go back on Sunday..... and the reason the neg is so highlighted is because you people choose to pick at it. I stated H thanked me, H had probably a better time, maybe more fun than I did. He' never been there, I had.

 

I would like to know why there is such a protest....... I mean really.

H is happy with me. I am happy with him....... yet all these dooms day sayers pop up to protest. Is it really concern about my M? I don't think so. I never asked or posted a question....... not once. My actual concern was the reaction of those at his work...... not our M. Not our M at all.

 

See our M is working for us and is getting better and better because I let go of the notions that I have to make my H "feel like__________", it is not about how I make him feel it is about how he is able to make himself feel like_________. My H needs to be handled gently because his ego may pop. No I will treat him like a real man. Not hide crap, not sugar coat it, and deal with it in the clear and to the point way I deal with other people.

 

But you are right most men are much different and much easier, must thrive on ego feeding. They need it because I think they lack the ability to have real confidence, real self awareness, real ability to see reality........ the ego feed helps them to feel like men and if they lose it they crumble????? If so that is so so so sad.

 

Touche is on the money again. I have seen gay and straight marriages that succeed very well while marching along to a different drum beat.

 

What I do not understand is the need to protest the different desire, values, and expectations of another persons M if it is working for them.

 

H and I both chatted and view this "ultimatum" to have been quite productive.

If you knew your SO was going to end up in a bad situation that would effect you as well would you not too tell them to stop?

 

Oh I guess it is my delivery that has so many upset........ well again that is how we communicate. The key word is there WE....... not you...... not your parents..... WE. This is not your M and believe me I nor my H want your traditional type of M. It serves us no purpose and actually we view our friends which have probably similar M's as "fake" in many cases..... like playing some roles that society says they should play. We just do what we do without that kind of thing dictating our M. We don't need to follow another persons path or ideals, we have our own.

 

I don't understand why that upsets so many people...... I don't get it. It must shake other peoples belief systems is all I can think. I have never been concerned that Moose treats his wife like a 1950s wife.... if she digs it, who cares...... so I just don't get it. Why the concern and need to freak out about a M that is not like yours....... interesting indeed.

 

You know I did not post this to ask for advice on my M or to ask if I was out of line with my H...... I posted because the blow up was not between the H and I but he and his friend /our friend. It is a stressful situation and has been going on for quite sometime...... and yes I get dragged into it when his friend calls and asks "where is retard?"....... joking of course but I don't tolerate that either.

 

So why not stay on topic then?

[Ripples]

Oh I guess it is my delivery that has so many upset........ well again that is how we communicate. The key word is there WE....... not you...... not your parents..... WE.

 

I think you've hit the nail on the head, at least for me. Although the way you communicate works within your marriage, that kind of communication is, at times, difficult to respond to in an empathetic way on here.

[JackJack]

have to admit, I only skimmed the thread... but I just don't understand why Moose and JackJack are catching this kind of grief for offering their opinions.

 

Because LJ, we are about the only 2 men who tell her pretty much what we think on the matter,(not that others haven't) but pretty much on this thread, and probably have hit the nail on the head with a few things, and its not to her liking.

 

a4a,I see where you say you are tired of Mosse harrassing you? WOW so opinons are now harrassements? Just because people don't see eye to eye on things or agree, its now harrassement?

 

You are correct to, saying that you didn't post for advice, more of a vent for whatever is going, if thats the case, you also had to have known that wheather you post seeking advice or just as a vent, people were going to respond with questions or what they thought, so don't act surprised when you get opinons on things you don't care to hear, it happens.

 

"Oh I guess its my delivery that has so many upset."

 

This is probably on the mark. Maybe we just all read you wrong? Just as I'm sure you have read others wrong, or maybe their questions? It comes across as a certain way to you. Well yeah, maybe you come across a certain way to others as well, its not really that different I don't guess.

 

I see where people have asked questions before not IMPLYING anything from their questions, and you answer it pretty nicely. Then there are times where I see people ask you a question, once again nothing was implied, but you rip their heads off? The delivery maybe? Could be, but maybe too, its that you already have it made up in your mind that if certain peole that you don't care for, ask you a question, then you automatically feel threatned so therefore you assume their question/answers were intended to take a jab at you? BTW, no need to rip my head off and use it for a bowling ball, ok.

[a4a]

have to admit, I only skimmed the thread... but I just don't understand why Moose and JackJack are catching this kind of grief for offering their opinions.

 

Because LJ, we are about the only 2 men who tell her pretty much what we think on the matter,(not that others haven't) but pretty much on this thread, and probably have hit the nail on the head with a few things, and its not to her liking.

 

a4a,I see where you say you are tired of Mosse harrassing you? WOW so opinons are now harrassements? Just because people don't see eye to eye on things or agree, its now harrassement?

 

You are correct to, saying that you didn't post for advice, more of a vent for whatever is going, if thats the case, you also had to have known that wheather you post seeking advice or just as a vent, people were going to respond with questions or what they thought, so don't act surprised when you get opinons on things you don't care to hear, it happens.

 

"Oh I guess its my delivery that has so many upset."

 

This is probably on the mark. Maybe we just all read you wrong? Just as I'm sure you have read others wrong, or maybe their questions? It comes across as a certain way to you. Well yeah, maybe you come across a certain way to others as well, its not really that different I don't guess.

 

I see where people have asked questions before not IMPLYING anything from their questions, and you answer it pretty nicely. Then there are times where I see people ask you a question, once again nothing was implied, but you rip their heads off? The delivery maybe? Could be, but maybe too, its that you already have it made up in your mind that if certain peole that you don't care for, ask you a question, then you automatically feel threatned so therefore you assume their question/answers were intended to take a jab at you? BTW, no need to rip my head off and use it for a bowling ball, ok.

 

 

Now honestly when is Moose not taking a jab at me..... really? Pleeze, he does not post to any of my threads for any other reason. He needs to do this to make himself feel ok I guess...... I don't know I don't care. I have kindly asked for him to just not bother to post.

 

As for you I was not ripping your head off, you made a comment about my H I found offense so I presented one to you so you could understand how that made me feel.

 

I don't think you used the best communication either or perhaps I took it wrong.

 

But I was laughing because what you posted about my H -would lie to hang out with his friends is too funny if you really knew him.

 

I know him pretty well and he is not hiding his desires from me. We actually commuicate pretty well. Hell I have said why not go get a beer with your friend. H says he does not want to, would rather hang at home and be with me or work on the house. So it was very funny to me. I guess I should have made it clear that your suggestion of his 'motive' was hilarious to me, but I thought I did.

 

H does not need to hide or sneak. Nor would he, so it is funny that it was thrown in as a possibility for his reason to not confront his boss buddy immediatley.

 

There has been a huge meeting to hash out personal time vs. work time with all employees. They all feel the same way as my H and I. So it is settled for now. If the issue was continued to be pushed I think the entire crew would have left yesterday.

[JackJack]

comment about my H I found offense so I presented one to you so you could understand how that made me feel.

 

I don't think you used the best communication either or perhaps I took it wrong.

 

But I was laughing because what you posted about my H -would lie to hang out with his friends is too funny if you really knew him.

 

 

I understand, and it was not intended to be mean, I was using that as an example. Bad example, perhaps.

 

I wasn't meaning that I knew for sure he must be lying to you about going to work. I was just asking if you thought, it was possible it could have been a reason and I figured maybe his friend was behind it anyway if that had been the case, but you cleared up your H wasn't like that and wouldn't lie about something as that.

 

So its all good.

[a4a]

What was the topic.... oh yeah A4A helped H find his balls and stand up to his nutso boss buddy.

 

Don't you ever get tired of helping your poor hubby find his balls? Seems like he looses them alot. And don't tell me he doesn't, because in most of your posts it seems he doesn't have any or lost them somewhere along with way. Or you are helping him carry those heavy balls he has at least.

 

See Jack I do find this as a jab.

 

I do find it offensive, it is not helpful nor is it positive at all. (In my POV)

 

So reread it and see where perhaps I may have taken it wrong.

 

I don't see it as threatening I see it as a jab not even at me but my H. Now since he is not here I thought I should let you know how it felt to have someone take a jab at their own spouse.

 

So can we come to an understanding on that?

 

Let me tell you this, the man has enough balls to take care of his dying father all by himself, enough balls to spend 2 weeks cleaning up and helping post Katrina, enough balls to go without food so others can eat, and enough balls to stand up to his buddy boss even if it was helped along by my input. No other person stood up for them getting pushed around and being slapped around.

And if I had to carry his balls for that minute or find them for him to do so, well you should be so lucky to have someone in your life willing to do so.

 

And he has enough balls to be able to say I don't mind if my wife helps me if I need it, I take my wifes pov to heart. That is a man with very very large balls indeed.

[JackJack]

So can we come to an understanding on that?

 

 

Yep we sure can. Just remember though, there have been times I have seen you say things to others that might come across as a "jab." Hell, you might be picking but others might not see it like that. I was acutally using that as an example, not as a jab. But because you see it as a jab, I will say to you, that I'm sorry.

[a4a]

So can we come to an understanding on that?

 

 

Yep we sure can. Just remember though, there have been times I have seen you say things to others that might come across as a "jab." Hell, you might be picking but others might not see it like that. I was acutally using that as an example, not as a jab. But because you see it as a jab, I will say to you, that I'm sorry.

 

I thank you Jack. I just came to a conclusion thanks to you!!!

Your apology is accepted and I apologize for any discomfort I may have cause you as well.

 

But the conclusion is I see much of your posts and others as an attack on my H. Not on me. I don't care if some person posts that I am mean or a bad wife because I know that is not true. But when someon attacks my H's character I do get angry. He is not perfect but damn close to what I consider perfect minus a few glitches some that are never going to change and some that already are.

 

See Moose is not taking jabs at me at all, but taking them at my H because my H is not like Moose at all.

 

Wow what an eye opener indeed.

 

I do realize that I vent here about him because there is no need to post

 

"my H is awesome in bed, he is cute, we had a wonderful date last night, he does the dishes, he rubs my back"........... blah blah blah.

 

If I did people would say I was a liar anyway; that no man does dishes!! :lmao: At least not in a real marriage. :p

 

The H is 95% awesome it is just a matter of working on that 5% and I am sure my H would say the same about me as well. Hell I ask him what would make it easier or better for him regarding my behavior with him.

 

Example:

 

* I am no longer going to moon as this makes him upset that other men may see my butt traveling at 60+ mph.

[Moose]

See Moose is not taking jabs at me at all, but taking them at my H because my H is not like Moose at all.

This isn't true at all. And it confuses me how you could come up with such nonsense.

 

You know, if you don't want me to post in your thread, just drop it already, and stop posting about me.

 

Learn how to accept opinions.....

[a4a]

This isn't true at all. And it confuses me how you could come up with such nonsense.

 

You know, if you don't want me to post in your thread, just drop it already, and stop posting about me.

 

Learn how to accept opinions.....

 

Moose I have asked you on numerous occassions to back off.

 

Others have made countless comments on how you do follow me and in so many words harrass me. So I know that it is not only me that sees it. It has become rather obvious.

 

This has nothing to do with accepting opinions this has to do with your continuous need to harrass me in any thread I may start. I never asked for your opinion, as a matter a fact I asked you to kindly stop giving your "opinions" to me personally. Your opinions hold no value to me because we do not hold the same values as individuals. My values will not change nor will yours yet you continue to try to convince me that mine/ ours wrong for me/us.

They are not wrong for me, not at all.

 

So I guess I come up with nonsense because it is sensless that you keep doing the same thing again and again. Why even bother with me since I am so beneath you. I can only think that it must serve you to do so in some way.

I don't know and I don't really care. But for cripes sake just leave me alone.

 

Good Day.

[amaysngrace]

 

Learn how to accept opinions.....

 

 

This sounds like an order, not advice...

[Ladyjane14]

 

You know I did not post this to ask for advice on my M or to ask if I was out of line with my H...... I posted because the blow up was not between the H and I but he and his friend /our friend.

 

Then perhaps the confusion stems from your choice to post in the Marriage forum rather than one of the more appropriate ones.

 

If your marriage is peachy keen, and you don't have any questions or problems, and you aren't interested in general discussion, then what's the purpose of your thread?

 

If it's intended to be some sort of 'Blog', maybe you might point that out for the sake of those amongst us who wouldn't otherwise waste the time.

[Trimmer]

If it's intended to be some sort of 'Blog', maybe you might point that out for the sake of those amongst us who wouldn't otherwise waste the time.

I admit, I had to go back and read the original post carefully and it's not at all clear, as written, that the "the blow up" was strictly between the husband and the friend.

 

Actually, "Rants and Confessions" is a good place for this kind of thing. I specifically avoid that board, because that keeps me out of the classic "male" pattern of trying to give advice or "fix" a situation, when someone just needs to vent about it and be heard and understood, which seems like what a4a was looking for here.

[a4a]

Then perhaps the confusion stems from your choice to post in the Marriage forum rather than one of the more appropriate ones.

 

If your marriage is peachy keen, and you don't have any questions or problems, and you aren't interested in general discussion, then what's the purpose of your thread?

 

If it's intended to be some sort of 'Blog', maybe you might point that out for the sake of those amongst us who wouldn't otherwise waste the time.

 

 

As stated above in one post I am very stressed over this work situation as is the H. So yes it is a vent and a discussion about how to handle this situation with his work....... keeping in mind that I am dragged into it by his friend, and my H wants my input. When his wife gets pissy nobody gets paid and yes that effects my life because guess who has to pay the bills around here? So yes it is a vent and I need to find a way to straighten this crap out so my life is not thrown into the drama. I have asked the H if he wants his refreshed resume thrown out there...... no real answer as of yet, but no pressure on him; as his poor little dog just died last night and he is very upset, so am I.

 

Perhaps it belongs in vents, or business, friends, but the end is his friend and his chicken kitchen wife are effecting our M, our life, and our finances. So I chose this forum. His friend of 30 years appears to be having some sort of breakdown as well....... it is a mess. I apologize if that was an error to place it or talk about it here.

[Ladyjane14]

....as his poor little dog just died last night and he is very upset, so am I.

 

I'm really sorry to hear that. :(

 

Since my husband and I got married, we've always had cats and dogs and all sorts of little animals we've taken in. In fact, we've had a complete turnover in our roster over the past few years.... dear old faces, sorely missed, and new faces we've grown to love.

 

My condolences to you both.

 

 

 

Perhaps it belongs in vents, or business, friends, but the end is his friend and his chicken kitchen wife are effecting our M, our life, and our finances. So I chose this forum. His friend of 30 years appears to be having some sort of breakdown as well....... it is a mess. I apologize if that was an error to place it or talk about it here.

 

Sweetie, I don't think it's all THAT big of a deal... so long as you're not getting put out with people who are trying to "help" you. It's just so easy for people to get frustrated when the parameters of the discussion are blurry.

[a4a]

I'm really sorry to hear that. :(

 

Since my husband and I got married, we've always had cats and dogs and all sorts of little animals we've taken in. In fact, we've had a complete turnover in our roster over the past few years.... dear old faces, sorely missed, and new faces we've grown to love.

 

My condolences to you both.

 

 

 

 

 

Sweetie, I don't think it's all THAT big of a deal... so long as you're not getting put out with people who are trying to "help" you. It's just so easy for people to get frustrated when the parameters of the discussion are blurry.

 

 

Thanks for the kind words....... the death for me is not nearly as bad as witnessing my husbands upset over it. I am accustomed to it but I will never be accustomed to seeing my H shed tears. I believe he went into shock briefly.

 

The whole damn thing is blurry for me as well... .... I feel like I am caught up in a tornado of freakin' drama and I cannot escape until he is willing to do something about it himself. I am sure everyone has had to dump a friend that was not healthy for them, H has a hard time as he is so kind hearted. As a witness I see what is really happening and the sob stories of the friend has no effect on me, but I only have a 3 year history with these people so probably much easier for me to walk away.

 

This is becoming very very unhealthy and I am seeing him being beaten down by his buddy boss. H is loyal as hell, thick and thin kinda guy. But I just wish he would understand that his relationship with these people is having a all around neg effect on both of us and he needs to actually do something about it...... he knows the neg. effect part, but is still not doing anything about it to remove himself. But at least he set some boundaries! Big step.

 

This is not just me or H caught in this, the other people agree, but they do not have the friendship or history my H does with these people....... so a little harder to just tell them to basically F off I guess. I feel guilty and bad for our friend as well. But I know when enough is enough.

[Ladyjane14]

... the death for me is not nearly as bad as witnessing my husbands upset over it. I am accustomed to it but I will never be accustomed to seeing my H shed tears. I believe he went into shock briefly.

 

Yeah... you feel so helpless when the one you love is grieving.

It's a hard thing, particularly when you're a person of action.

 

 

This is becoming very very unhealthy and I am seeing him being beaten down by his buddy boss.

 

Maybe, this isn't too much different? Your sweetie is going through some stuff... and here you are, a "person of action", wanting to help, and not being able to do much to solve it for him.

 

This may sound weirdly Oedipal... but how would you handle it if he was your son? Would you fix it for him, or would you offer him support from the sidelines?

[a4a]

Yeah... you feel so helpless when the one you love is grieving.

It's a hard thing, particularly when you're a person of action.

 

 

 

 

Maybe, this isn't too much different? Your sweetie is going through some stuff... and here you are, a "person of action", wanting to help, and not being able to do much to solve it for him.

 

This may sound weirdly Oedipal... but how would you handle it if he was your son? Would you fix it for him, or would you offer him support from the sidelines?

 

Well see that is the problem I don't want to fix it for him but it is getting to the point where I feel like I don't have a choice. I can find (not excuses) where at each instance of my H messing up in our M can be pinned directly to the boss buddy. Our finances screwed up pinned to the boss buddy and his wife having tantrums. She is still screwing him out of overtime.

 

I have reached my breaking point with this. H has not yet, but on the way. I swear I get this urge to pick up the phone and just let the poo fly. Then I think, not my place to do so. But I also keep my mouth shut when the poo is flung at me and B discusses my H with me which I do not ask to be a part of the work thing at all!!!! I think I am ready to blow up at all of them, never have...... but feel it coming on quick.

 

But again I am a friend as well so seeing that B(boss buddy) is in dire straits himself makes me think we have to stick around to support him regardless of how it effects us. The right thing to do vs. self preservation.

 

For both of us because we try to do the right thing even if it costs us a bit this is becoming a huge problem. I know what needs to be done, and like my H I get suckered back in trying to do the right thing.........then get clubbed again by them.

 

This is too complicated, I think I need to take the day off and play a video game........ Eat some popcorn and just wig out........

 

I got a dead dog in my freezer........ :lmao: It is like life is turning surreal here..... every night when H or I come home I just hold my breath to wait and hear what kinda of crap we have to deal with from them that day.

 

"How was your day?" (I hold my breath and think why do I ask, why why why) He will look at me and I know some BS drama thing happened and I say

"oh, now what happened?" and I just wanna puke.

 

H did smack the nail telling the B "something has to give and it will not be my marriage"....... maybe it is solved, but been here before and it will just start again. I told H I give it 10 days of being peaceful. H cannot just quit, financially and he feels obligated to his B to not leave him high and dry. My H does keep the guys glued together there. So this is a big fruckin' mess.

 

Him and B used to be kinda glued at the hip, then my H got his own life.... I stole him away....... So the wife hates me, the B loves me and hates me, and the w hates me more because B and I do get along..... H is stuck in the middle and I am trying to stay out of it but get dragged in and I have had enough.

 

This is almost daily where some drama pops up caused by one of them that effects H, me, or our M.

 

Some weird ass twisted affair with stalkers and power plays and B is in the middle of a meltdown where ambulances are at his house cuz he thinks he is dying...........

 

and there is a dead dog in my freezer......

 

Sorry for the length of this but I felt the need to explain it before someone jumped on me for meddling in my H's work again. I have gotten angry and told H at one point I don't want to know anything, but then that would just cause a wedge between us more because of this situation.

 

I think I am on the verge of blowing up at both of them. Maybe I just should?