Staying for the kids

[herenow]

Recently I had lunch with a few girlfriends and the subject of affairs came up because one of my friends is getting a divorce. Another one of my friends is a family therapist, so the conversation was insightful. The question of why MM say they are staying for the kids came up.

 

I start by saying that every situation is different and I'm not making blank statements.

 

Some men say that they are staying for the kids to avoid conflict. No one will argue with a MM who says he is staying for the sake of his kids. When a MM says this to his OW, it makes him look honorable. He doesn't have to talk about why he would stay in his marriage and have the affair. It's the perfect way for a MM to continue an affair without the OW pressuring him for more.

 

The staying for the kids line also works to end an affair. There are no questions about why he would go back to his wife, or why he had the affair or why he lied. Again, the MM looks like the victim and he is doing the right thing by putting his kids above his happiness.

 

My therapist friend said that in most cases, if a man wants to leave a marriage, he will. Especially a man who has an affair. This type of MM really only cares about himself and his needs. To say that he would put anyone above his happiness, even his kids, doesn't fit with his personality.

 

This is just a bit of new info I got that I wanted to share. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing, I just found it interesting. I hope all of you had a great Thanksgiving and are doing well.

[quankanne]

makes perfect sense to me – how much easier is it to shift the blame (so to speak) to some other source, rather than take responsibility or be honest with ourselves? Especially in a situation like an affair?

[Jane Doe]

My therapist friend said that in most cases, if a man wants to leave a marriage, he will. Especially a man who has an affair. This type of MM really only cares about himself and his needs. To say that he would put anyone above his happiness, even his kids, doesn't fit with his personality.

 

Exactly. It's merely an excuse, just like all the other lines they use. If they were really so concerned about their kids they'd be spending time with them rather than the OW. It's all about the MM.

[herenow]

I'll be back later. I have a lot of work to do today, so I can't be here that much. Hope you all have a great day.

[IfWishesWereHorses]

This one really hits home with me. I've written and rewritten a reply 5 times but I can't get one that isn't full of anger and bitterness. Here goes number 6. Simply stated, one wonders how someone could believe a man who cheats, blames the wife, and claims to be so noble as to actually sacrifice his happiness for his kids! I wonder if they ever figure out (in my case) that he stays with the wife because if he didn't have her for an excuse that he couldn't juggle them (OW) all! If he cared about his kids he would not lie and cheat on their mother. He would care how is actions affected their family unit and dynamics. On the other hand, I feel truly sorry for his victims (I am no longer one of them). I do pity him, but he is so delusional that luckily he will never have to face the reality of who he is. His oldest knows as do many people and I dread the day his young son figures it out. It has been painful enough explaining this all to one teenager and watch her have to deal with finding out that her dad isn't the man she believed him to be for so long. Her reaction was similar to the pain expressed by so many MOW (misled other woman) and BS's on the board. I will state myself before someone reminds me of it, that my situation is different I'm sure, and my reaction comes from what I have endured.

[pureinheart]

True Herenow....many men use the kids as a tool to get what they want, it's sick and perverted....there are many different ways this happens....sick is all I can say....

[Chapter2]

I agree completely. While I am not minimizing divorce at all, I do believe that if a marriage is as sick as some MM say it is, even children will not keep him from leaving. I mean lets face it, if "dying to self" were one of a MM's traits then they wouldn't be unfaithful would they? I believed it for a while and stuck to no contact. It was him that continued to break it even after she found out and I finally thought, wait a minute, if your kids are so very important, important enough to live in such a prison (as he called it) then why on earth are you still pursuing me? Well, duh! It just didn't add up.

 

My xMM is "staying for his kids" but I also know full well that the main reason he is staying is because HE WANTS TO STAY. This is the same reason I have never believed the "I got sucked in" theory. These MM are about as dumb as a fox. They're not stupid at all but they are definitely counting on the OW and the BS being stupid IMHO.

 

The rub will come in when he doesn't make any changes in himself. There isn't a doubt in my mind that he will cheat again because his history indicates he doesn't do the work necessary to have a healthy marriage. Thus, the cycle will repeat. There is one person in his marriage that is working on the marriage...but its not him. He seems to think "showing up" each day is adequate. Too bad for him that a healthy marriage isn't graded on attendance alone.

 

My therapist friend said that in most cases, if a man wants to leave a marriage, he will. Especially a man who has an affair. This type of MM really only cares about himself and his needs. To say that he would put anyone above his happiness, even his kids, doesn't fit with his personality.

[Meaplus3]

This one really hits home with me. I've written and rewritten a reply 5 times but I can't get one that isn't full of anger and bitterness. Here goes number 6. Simply stated, one wonders how someone could believe a man who cheats, blames the wife, and claims to be so noble as to actually sacrifice his happiness for his kids! I wonder if they ever figure out (in my case) that he stays with the wife because if he didn't have her for an excuse that he couldn't juggle them (OW) all! If he cared about his kids he would not lie and cheat on their mother. He would care how is actions affected their family unit and dynamics. On the other hand, I feel truly sorry for his victims (I am no longer one of them). I do pity him, but he is so delusional that luckily he will never have to face the reality of who he is. His oldest knows as do many people and I dread the day his young son figures it out. It has been painful enough explaining this all to one teenager and watch her have to deal with finding out that her dad isn't the man she believed him to be for so long. Her reaction was similar to the pain expressed by so many MOW (misled other woman) and BS's on the board. I will state myself before someone reminds me of it, that my situation is different I'm sure, and my reaction comes from what I have endured.

 

I am glad that you took the time to re-write your reply's here cause what you said is VERY WELL SAID! " If he cared about his kid's then why would he lie and CHEAT on their mother, case in point he wouldn't He's a Womanizing ******!

 

AP

[sarme]

....many men use the kids as a tool to get what they want, it's sick and perverted....

 

 

Well I don't know about it being sick and perverted!!?!?! It's definitely cowardly and selfrighteous but would not agree that it's "perverted"

 

Funny because in a lot of cases these very same men, the ones who crumble under pressure and avoid conflict are the ones that very agressively initiate the affair.

[puddleofmud]

"He seems to think "showing up" each day is adequate. Too bad for him that a healthy marriage isn't graded on attendance alone."

 

Just wonderful to read but not just about MM, OW, BS, a parental relationship etc. but about any relationship. Ideally, a truly healthy relationship isn't about just "showing up" but about giving all of one's self before expecting to receive.

 

Frankly, I am going to do my best to apply that to myself.

[herenow]

Something else to add. The staying for the kids excuse also helps the OW deal with the fact that the MM has not left the marriage. It gives her a reason to believe that MM would be with the OW if it weren't for the kids. It's part of the denial that all parties involved in an affair go through including the MM, BW and OW.

 

Again, this is not a blanket statement. There are exceptions to every rule.

[Chapter2]

Its funny because when I read that I think the OW might ask herself "is he really staying only for the kids or is it for her?" and the BW may ask herself "is he really only staying for the kids or is it for me?"... Each one could be filled with doubt and asking virtually the same question since they're both dealing with the same man who has shown himself to be so incredibly deceitful.

 

I have to say that in some but not all cases the MM is so enthralled in status, his perceived reputation, his children, job, approval from family, etc. that he continues to stay in a situation that should have ended a long time ago. He may not have the balls to leave which does indeed make him a coward, but I think many MM fantasize about walking straight out the door and never looking back as do many MW's.

 

The divorce rate wouldn't be nearly so high if all cheating MM stayed with their wives and all cheating MW stayed with their husbands. One thing that has been pointed out in divorce statistics is the number of people that actually go through with it. That doesn't include the number of people that stay married and miserable. The estimate of the number of marriages that are in tact but miserable is half of the 50% of people that stay married. Sadly, the number of happily married couples is small.

[herenow]

Its funny because when I read that I think the OW might ask herself "is he really staying only for the kids or is it for her?" and the BW may ask herself "is he really only staying for the kids or is it for me?"... Each one could be filled with doubt and asking virtually the same question since they're both dealing with the same man who has shown himself to be so incredibly deceitful.

 

I have to say that in some but not all cases the MM is so enthralled in status, his perceived reputation, his children, job, approval from family, etc. that he continues to stay in a situation that should have ended a long time ago. He may not have the balls to leave which does indeed make him a coward, but I think many MM fantasize about walking straight out the door and never looking back as do many MW's.

 

The divorce rate wouldn't be nearly so high if all cheating MM stayed with their wives and all cheating MW stayed with their husbands. One thing that has been pointed out in divorce statistics is the number of people that actually go through with it. That doesn't include the number of people that stay married and miserable. The estimate of the number of marriages that are in tact but miserable is half of the 50% of people that stay married. Sadly, the number of happily married couples is small.

 

You are right. It goes both ways. That's why I say it's part of the denial of all parties including the MM or MW, BW or BH, and OW or OM. There is so much trust lost on all sides.

 

There is no quick fix for anyone who's life has been touched by an affair. There needs to be real change, not just words and it takes time to make sure that the change is real.

[yousaveme]

You are right. It goes both ways. That's why I say it's part of the denial of all parties including the MM or MW, BW or BH, and OW or OM. There is so much trust lost on all sides.

 

There is no quick fix for anyone who's life has been touched by an affair. There needs to be real change, not just words and it takes time to make sure that the change is real.

 

 

My MM , wife has actually said that and admitted it... That he is there not for her but the kids... But they feel that right now they need to put the kids needs first at the moment and then its over. Not a long way away... Its a sad statement on both ends...

[ByMyRules]

Recently I had lunch with a few girlfriends and the subject of affairs came up because one of my friends is getting a divorce. Another one of my friends is a family therapist, so the conversation was insightful. The question of why MM say they are staying for the kids came up.

 

I start by saying that every situation is different and I'm not making blank statements.

 

Some men say that they are staying for the kids to avoid conflict. No one will argue with a MM who says he is staying for the sake of his kids. When a MM says this to his OW, it makes him look honorable. He doesn't have to talk about why he would stay in his marriage and have the affair. It's the perfect way for a MM to continue an affair without the OW pressuring him for more.

 

The staying for the kids line also works to end an affair. There are no questions about why he would go back to his wife, or why he had the affair or why he lied. Again, the MM looks like the victim and he is doing the right thing by putting his kids above his happiness.

 

My therapist friend said that in most cases, if a man wants to leave a marriage, he will. Especially a man who has an affair. This type of MM really only cares about himself and his needs. To say that he would put anyone above his happiness, even his kids, doesn't fit with his personality.

 

This is just a bit of new info I got that I wanted to share. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing, I just found it interesting. I hope all of you had a great Thanksgiving and are doing well.

 

You can always pay your therapist friend to help you thru troubled times with your husband. Oh, maybe you wouldn't have to pay since it's a friend. Right?

[IfWishesWereHorses]

" have to say that in some but not all cases the MM is so enthralled in status, his perceived reputation, his children, job, approval from family, etc. that he continues to stay in a situation that should have ended a long time ago. He may not have the balls to leave which does indeed make him a coward, but I think many MM fantasize about walking straight out the door and never looking back as do many MW's."

 

Chapter 2, I think that you could add many BS's and plenty of OW, as having that just walk out the door fantasy! I'm sure my WH has them (and I would love to help him make them a reality ) but you're right, the issues with what he believes others think of him, status, and GOOD GOD, having to split HIS things in half keep him here.

[herenow]

You can always pay your therapist friend to help you thru troubled times with your husband. Oh, maybe you wouldn't have to pay since it's a friend. Right?

 

My husband and I have been in MC for over 8 months and it's worth every penny. I wouldn't want to bring a friend into the mix because I think it would be hard for her to be unbiased.

 

The therapist that we have now is very good at taking both sides of the story into account and helping us both equally.

 

I come here to get the OW point of view because we spend every minute of therapy on our marriage. It would be a waste of money to spend it on the OW. Love Shack is my free OW therapy.

[PoshPrincess]

I don't agree that a man who cheats on his wife obviously doesn't love his kids but then I guess I have to say that. I cheated on my ex and father of my son and I love my son more than anything else in the world. No, I shouldn't have cheated - I should've been honest with my partner that things weren't working out, I can see that now, but unfortunately these things happen! Not something I'm proud of.

 

Something else to add. The staying for the kids excuse also helps the OW deal with the fact that the MM has not left the marriage. It gives her a reason to believe that MM would be with the OW if it weren't for the kids. It's part of the denial that all parties involved in an affair go through including the MM, BW and OW.

This is SO true. It certainly helped with the way I dealt with the split with my now ex-MM. And, yes, saying he was staying for the sake of his kids, "I can't be with you but it's the sacrifice I have to make...." blah blah blah, did make him appear honourable. I don't think even think the case was that he didn't want to leave, more that he couldn't be bothered. He likes an easy life (although how someone can call rarely going out and socialising with friends, W or whatever 'easy' I don't know). He couldn't deal with the hassle, the financial implications, the grief he would have got from his kids, the stories his wife would tell the kids about him (as she did when she found out), etc. I basically just think he's a coward. I know for a fact he is as miserable as hell but I also know he will never do anything about it. I think he actually enjoys playing the martyr.

 

But, yeah, basically, kids are used as an excuse IMO. End of.

[herenow]

I don't agree that a man who cheats on his wife obviously doesn't love his kids but then I guess I have to say that. I cheated on my ex and father of my son and I love my son more than anything else in the world. No, I shouldn't have cheated - I should've been honest with my partner that things weren't working out, I can see that now, but unfortunately these things happen! Not something I'm proud of.

 

I would never say that a parent doesn't love his or her kids because they cheated. I don't think anyone else said that either.

[Guest]

I would never say that a parent doesn't love his or her kids because they cheated. I don't think anyone else said that either.

 

You are assuming that MM who cheat even know what love is.

[IfWishesWereHorses]

Guest, I agree the many do not. I'm probably the one who insinuated that if they actually cared about their kids then they would have handled things much differently. I believe that if you love someone then you do what is in their best interest. Distroying a family and teaching your children that mariage isn't sacred and that it's ok to lie and cheat and lie some more if you want to doesn't sound like love to me (self love maybe) but not love of them. I don't however believe that in their own crazy way that they don't love their children, but we are talking about people who can justify most anything.

[herenow]

Guest, I agree the many do not. I'm probably the one who insinuated that if they actually cared about their kids then they would have handled things much differently. I believe that if you love someone then you do what is in their best interest. Distroying a family and teaching your children that mariage isn't sacred and that it's ok to lie and cheat and lie some more if you want to doesn't sound like love to me (self love maybe) but not love of them. I don't however believe that in their own crazy way that they don't love their children, but we are talking about people who can justify most anything.

 

I agree we are talking about people who can justify most anything.

[puddleofmud]

I wouldn't say that a MM/MW who has and affair doesn't love their children, but I would say that they may not be doing what is in the best interests for their children (this is also what a court of law will take in to consideration, which is a scary thought!).

Children need a united front regarding their parents, even when the parents do not live in the same household. Their parents provide their emotional security base. That foundation affects them for eternity.

Any outside activity which takes time from the family relationship whether it be workaholism, drug use, gambling, affairs, etc. will negatively impact the family as a whole.

An affair could be a form of emotional neglect. A broken marriage about which one does not take responsibilty could be considered emotional neglect.

Children are relentless observers and they do "pick up" on things we never expect they will. They know us so well that they see every nuance because they constantly need to know that things are OK and when they feel things are not; it is internalized and becomes about themselves which may lead them to feel that THEY are not OK.

Having children is about a comittment to parenting, not just loving.

[Chapter2]

I have to agree on this one. I can tell you that my child is the single greatest blessing I have ever had in my life. I love her so, so much. I also know that being an other woman, no matter how briefly, was NOT in her best interest.

 

It doesn't matter that she had no idea there even was a MM. She still watched her mom ride one of the most self destructive roller coasters imaginable without a clue as to why. That definitely affected her.

 

Children may not know the details but they know when mom or dad isn't "okay". It didn't matter how many times I'd be crying my heart out assuring her it had nothing to do with her...I know she still wondered if I was going to be okay. It sickens me to think about it.

 

My biggest regret is having put her through that and I wish I could take it back, but I can't. Hopefully she'll have a stronger, more stable mom on the other side of all this and one that accepts her no matter what good or bad choices she makes in this life. She already has one that's off the roller coaster so at least there is progress.

 

I wouldn't say that a MM/MW who has and affair doesn't love their children, but I would say that they may not be doing what is in the best interests for their children (this is also what a court of law will take in to consideration, which is a scary thought!).

Children need a united front regarding their parents, even when the parents do not live in the same household. Their parents provide their emotional security base. That foundation affects them for eternity.

Any outside activity which takes time from the family relationship whether it be workaholism, drug use, gambling, affairs, etc. will negatively impact the family as a whole.

An affair could be a form of emotional neglect. A broken marriage about which one does not take responsibilty could be considered emotional neglect.

Children are relentless observers and they do "pick up" on things we never expect they will. They know us so well that they see every nuance because they constantly need to know that things are OK and when they feel things are not; it is internalized and becomes about themselves which may lead them to feel that THEY are not OK.

Having children is about a comittment to parenting, not just loving.

[PoshPrincess]

I would never say that a parent doesn't love his or her kids because they cheated. I don't think anyone else said that either.

 

Apologies HereNow, I stand corrected. This was the quote I was referring to:-

 

I am glad that you took the time to re-write your reply's here cause what you said is VERY WELL SAID! " If he cared about his kid's then why would he lie and CHEAT on their mother, case in point he wouldn't He's a Womanizing ******!

I don't think a man or woman lying and cheating means they don't CARE about their kids either. They just aren't necessarily CONSIDERING their kids and the implications an affair might have on them, and I hold my hand up to that one! It's only when my ex-MM realised the hurt it would cause his kids (and that was only once they found out - through their mother) that he decided things had to stop. And even then it took him months of calling me, wanting to be with me, then changing his mind again. Whatever his reasons, I think he's done the 'right thing' or, as he said, the 'only thing' he could do, whether right or not.